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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:39 PM
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reply to post by DancedWithWolves
 


There was a shot of the barge static getting tied up to the quay and there was another full 1.5' left of draft before maximum displacement was reached.

Still trying to find it again- should have saved it.




posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:40 PM
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Originally posted by TheRedneck
Cherekov radiation is something fairly new to me, although I believe I have grasped the physics behind it. I was wondering if this phenomenon could occur with sufficiently saturated high-temperature updrafts as I believe are happening?


Not Cherenkov...


Originally posted by mendel101
Night spot is gone tonight:
I pinpointed the exact spot it radiates from, the red dot in the zoom below:

Can anybody guess where exactly that is?


Found THIS


Ethereal Blue Flash


‘Ethereal Blue Flash’

Nuclear experts call such reactions “localized criticality.” They consist of a burst of heat, radiation and sometimes an “ethereal blue flash,” according to the U.S. Energy Department’s Los Alamos National Laboratory website. Twenty-one workers worldwide have been killed by criticality accidents since 1945, the site said.

The IAEA acknowledged “they don’t have clear signs that show such a phenomenon is happening,” Edano said.


www.businessweek.com...

Well it seems maybe YOU have that 'clear evidence' of blue flash



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:41 PM
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Originally posted by SFA437
A couple of guys have asked me to clarify the hole in #3 turbine room coming from a prior blast debris impact.



Red arrow indicates large part of #3 skidding across roof (assuming a chunk of concrete). Note dark reddish coloration on the far side of hole in direction of travel. Whatever skidded across caught the far side of the hole. It would not be possible for something traveling in this direction to catch on the near side.

Teal circle shows lightweight debris from #3 laying on top of the skid mark in no particular pattern indicating these items fell to the roof after the chunk of #3 did it's skipping stone routine on the roof.

Hope this clarifies my analysis

unless you had multiple "expansions" at different timings
edit on 1-4-2011 by Silverlok because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:42 PM
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reply to post by SFA437
 





There was a shot of the barge static getting tied up to the quay and there was another full 1.5' left of draft before maximum displacement was reached. Still trying to find it again- should have saved it.


are those the photos on page 473 you are refering to then?



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:43 PM
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Dup post
edit on 1-4-2011 by elouina because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:43 PM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


er, what ?? o hehahahahahaha nice
edit on 1-4-2011 by Silverlok because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:50 PM
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Originally posted by Silverlok

Originally posted by SFA437
A couple of guys have asked me to clarify the hole in #3 turbine room coming from a prior blast debris impact.



Red arrow indicates large part of #3 skidding across roof (assuming a chunk of concrete). Note dark reddish coloration on the far side of hole in direction of travel. Whatever skidded across caught the far side of the hole. It would not be possible for something traveling in this direction to catch on the near side.

Teal circle shows lightweight debris from #3 laying on top of the skid mark in no particular pattern indicating these items fell to the roof after the chunk of #3 did it's skipping stone routine on the roof.

Hope this clarifies my analysis

unless you had multiple "expansions" at different timings
edit on 1-4-2011 by Silverlok because: (no reason given)


True but if you check out the hole you can see it is almost "cut" straight down with the exception of the piece of concrete hanging by rebar. This is indicative of an almost vertical entry meaning the object came down from height. It takes time for things to reach apogee and return to ground which leads me to my next conclusion.

The skid marks would have happened almost instantaneously- that piece was moving in excess of 3000 m/s.

The lightweight pieces would have come down after the chunk skidded across the roof.

The only part that doesn't fit and that I cannot identify is the white "pipe" with the square appendage. That is driving me NUTS!!

reply to post by okiecowboy
 


BINGO!

I got too much math going on in my head at the moment to think straight



posted on Apr, 1 2011 @ 11:55 PM
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I think someone posted the text, here is the translated video:



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:05 AM
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Photos released today inside #4 from March 24




An overview shows water being sprayed into reactor No. 4 at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant complex in this still image taken from a March 24, 2011 handout video released


And




An overview shows the damage in the interior of reactor No. 4 at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant complex in this still image taken from a March 24, 2011 handout video released to Reuters on April 1, 2011.


There are a few more photos too here

ETA: Another of #4 that appears to be the spent fuel pool - dry? I am basing this assumption on early posts by ATS members of similar images.



It's interesting that the photos added to this slide show today are of reactor #4 other than those about the PM, barge and evacuation centers. See additional photos at link. The concern about #4 may be shared by TEPCO.


edit on 2-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: fix "stuff" in post

edit on 2-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:07 AM
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Russia on alert to evacuate islands:



Greenpeace in Japan taking readings:




posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:11 AM
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Originally posted by SFA437
A couple of guys have asked me to clarify the hole in #3 turbine room coming from a prior blast debris impact.



Red arrow indicates large part of #3 skidding across roof (assuming a chunk of concrete). Note dark reddish coloration on the far side of hole in direction of travel. Whatever skidded across caught the far side of the hole. It would not be possible for something traveling in this direction to catch on the near side.

Teal circle shows lightweight debris from #3 laying on top of the skid mark in no particular pattern indicating these items fell to the roof after the chunk of #3 did it's skipping stone routine on the roof.

Hope this clarifies my analysis

expert? a steel tie rod from the roof is Light weight, and bent, describe the force of the explosion then in your opinion , from the begining



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:14 AM
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I think I got it!

I have been thinking this whole thing over, including bouncing ideas off of some friends, and I think I may have at least a partial idea of what is happening...

Firstly, I stand by my previous assessment that the oceanic leak is coming from a bedrock crack created by the March 11th quake, a crack that started under Unit #4 and has expended underneath Unit #3. The MOX corium from Unit #3 is already inside the bedrock, but was exposed to seawater in the aforementioned crack around March 14th when the explosion occurred.

Now, the Japanese are not dumb people; technologically, they are some of the brightest minds on the planet. I find it inconceivable that they actually have no idea what is going on. They know, at least those in position to know, know, but they are not releasing the information. Why?

Instead, they are talking about injecting liquid nitrogen (a HUGE mistake!) into the cores which they cannot even get close to, and rumoring about encasing the cores in concrete while they are still too hot for the concrete to work. They are talking about needing fresh water to prevent meltdowns that have obviously already occurred. They are playing down disastrous health effects among their own population. Why? Why? Why?

What do they know that they are not telling the world?

This is what they know:

The oceanside city of Shizuoka, 100 miles down the coast from the plant, said Friday that it had agreed to lease plant operator Tokyo Electric Power Co. its 450-foot-long so-called mega-barge, which the town uses as a platform for fishing and taking in views of Mount Fuji.

The barge's flat steel structure allows it to hold 10,000 tons of water, and its shallow draft will let it dock close to the plant, unlike an oil tanker, said Hidehiko Nishiyama, a senior regulator at Japan's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency.
Source: online.wsj.com...
One of the largest barges in the world.


One of the world's largest concrete pumps is being readied to get on a massive cargo plane and head to Japan, all part of the effort to address the crisis at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant.

The 190,000-pound truck pump was moved off a job on the Savannah River on Wednesday and, two days later, was in Hanahan, South Carolina. Once preparations are complete, it will head about 7,000 miles toward Asia aboard a Russian Antonov 225 cargo plane, which is considered among the world's biggest aircrafts.
Source: edition.cnn.com...
One of the largest concrete pumping trucks in the world.

Mix the two together with a barge full of fresh water... water that could be transported overland easier and faster. But the fresh water is not needed overland... it is needed in the ocean. Imagine that corium in the crack again... it is the cause of the massive increases in seawater contamination, contamination that every physical law in the universe says will continue to increase to massive unprecedented proportions if not stopped. Now realize that there is no possible way to make the corium stop producing both heat and radiation. But is there a way to repair that crack? Yes, there is!

The answer is concrete. The only drawback to using concrete at this point to entomb the corium is the heat from the corium... but if the corium is in seawater and not producing a steam plume, then it has to be at or below 100°C. Is that even possible? Yes. The plume form March 14th had another effect... it did cool the corium. It still produces heat and radiation just like when it was hot, but as long as it is immersed in seawater, it will transfer enough heat to the water to remain cool. What needs to be done is to plug the leak to the sea to stop contamination from spreading.

I believe all this is being done to prepare to seal the crack in the bedrock.

Concrete will cure underwater, slower than in air, but it will also cure harder. They are planning on pumping this crack full of concrete using that barge and that pump truck. Then they may well use fresh water around the concrete while it cures to minimize the amount of salt that seeps into the concrete. Finally, they will have the ability to replace any water that boils off as steam from the now-trapped corium, if they choose to do so.

But the attempt will have to be made from the sea, not from the coast. And it will take a massive amount of concrete. Thus, the barge and the truck.

The silence is probably in place because this is something that has never been tried before. No one knows for sure if it will succeed. But it does, at least IMO, have a decent chance of success.

Now, this could also explain the military forces around the area. The pumping operations around the crack would be suicide missions, obviously. But could the US military have equipment that could operate underwater to hold and aim hoses remotely? Or could they be supplying radiation protection that could work in an underwater application? I need input from the military experts in this thread on this aspect.

As I said before, when things the authorities do stop making sense, look for them to be doing something you hadn't thought of. This all makes perfect sense now.

Good luck Japan.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:16 AM
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Originally posted by 00nunya00
Okay, this smack is just downright Keystone Cops now:

My reply:

So, if this is all true, then what happened to Milk Sample number 1? They now number Sample 0, and Sample 2. Surely there was a Sample 1?


And the response? Get your Depends out, because you're going to pee your pants:

Submitted by dchivers on Fri, 2011-04-01 04:04.
OK, I can respond to that, ..., kind of a funny story. We normally do a reduction in our liquid measurements by drying out the liquid in a drying oven. I came in over the weekend to find that we began "drying" out some milk in the drying oven at a low enough temperature to culture some pretty nasty stuff at the top. Since I was not going to place this stuff in the pristine beakers and I was worried I could not calculate bacterial fractional uptake of the iodine, I decided to dump that sample. This was a mess, as you can imagine. We now do not reduce milk from higher volumes. Science is not always glorious.


And:

Submitted by dchivers on Fri, 2011-04-01 04:07.
Also, Sample 1 used the entire half gallon before the reduction, so I don't think we will ever see a sample 1 in our results. Since we always maintain a log of all of our samples, we just moved on to Sample 2. Sorry again for the confusion.


Now here's where it gets hilarious (this is a direct reply to my "where's sample 1" question:

Submitted by bandstra on Fri, 2011-04-01 04:02.
I believe there is a sample 1 we haven't counted yet.


And the scrambled response?

Submitted by dchivers on Fri, 2011-04-01 04:05.
answered above, Mark. I don't think you were around to see this one.


Berkeley hilarity

ETA: and I'm so done with that thread. I'm not fond of being lied to.
edit on 31-3-2011 by 00nunya00 because: (no reason given)


I found this from the Journal of the AOAC (Association of Official Agricultural Chemists):

Determination of Iodine-131 at Low Levels in Milk: Collaborative
Study
BARATTA & EASTERLY: JOURNAL OF AOAC INTERNATIONAL VOL. 84, NO. 2, 2001 507
Submitted for publication July 2000.

www.atypon-link.com...



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:18 AM
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Originally posted by DancedWithWolves
Photos released today inside #4 from March 24

It's interesting that the photos added to this slide show today are of reactor #4 other than those about the PM, barge and evacuation centers. See additional photos at link. The concern about #4 may be shared by TEPCO.


edit on 2-4-2011 by DancedWithWolves because: fix "stuff" in post


They also didn't show the image of the body.... guess they didn't want to upset anyone.




posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:19 AM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 


This reminds me of BP trying to plug the oil with injecting materials into the pipe. It could work, or it could fail. The same applies to injecting concrete into a seabed crack. If it's under the water table the concrete may not set. They need to get the water out first and then fill the crack. Also, I have no idea where the crack is, and if it's under the watertable taking in seawater.

I think you are right, they are looking to seal leaks right now. However, we really have no idea what that really means.

It's a damn mess really. The lack of information and lies make it almost unbearable to follow. What a nightmare scenario for Japan and the planet.



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:20 AM
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Originally posted by Silverlok

Originally posted by SFA437
A couple of guys have asked me to clarify the hole in #3 turbine room coming from a prior blast debris impact.



Red arrow indicates large part of #3 skidding across roof (assuming a chunk of concrete). Note dark reddish coloration on the far side of hole in direction of travel. Whatever skidded across caught the far side of the hole. It would not be possible for something traveling in this direction to catch on the near side.

Teal circle shows lightweight debris from #3 laying on top of the skid mark in no particular pattern indicating these items fell to the roof after the chunk of #3 did it's skipping stone routine on the roof.

Hope this clarifies my analysis

expert? a steel tie rod from the roof is Light weight, and bent, describe the force of the explosion then in your opinion , from the begining

whom were the couple of guys



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:22 AM
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reply to post by apacheman

There are no rest rooms in a reactor building. While ours was under construction, we used ye olde porta-pottys.

There are probably a couple around the control rooms, but that's about it. No one normally has to work in a functioning reactor building enough to justify them.

TheRedneck



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:24 AM
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reply to post by YouAreDreaming

I have seen quite a few house foundations poured underwater. Concrete will cure in water, like I said, slower, but harder. When I poured the foundation for my house, I actually was happy to see the footing trenches full of water on pouring day.

Concrete does not require air to cure. It is a chemical reaction, not a 'drying' process.

ETA: and with that, this redneck is calling it a night. See you guys tomorrow.

TheRedneck

edit on 4/2/2011 by TheRedneck because: I'm tired



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:30 AM
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reply to post by TheRedneck
 


True, they need specialized seawater concrete mixture and they can certainly apply it to seal a crack. I had to do a bit of research but normal concrete won't work due to the salt corroding normal concrete hence the specialized formula.

I was just reading up on it because it's certainly a concern when dealing with how they can plug any leaks or cracks under the water table. That does give me a nice sense of relief. This whole mess needs to come to an end and get contained fast.
edit on 2-4-2011 by YouAreDreaming because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 2 2011 @ 12:32 AM
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Originally posted by Silverlok

Originally posted by SFA437
A couple of guys have asked me to clarify the hole in #3 turbine room coming from a prior blast debris impact.



Red arrow indicates large part of #3 skidding across roof (assuming a chunk of concrete). Note dark reddish coloration on the far side of hole in direction of travel. Whatever skidded across caught the far side of the hole. It would not be possible for something traveling in this direction to catch on the near side.

Teal circle shows lightweight debris from #3 laying on top of the skid mark in no particular pattern indicating these items fell to the roof after the chunk of #3 did it's skipping stone routine on the roof.

Hope this clarifies my analysis

expert? a steel tie rod from the roof is Light weight, and bent, describe the force of the explosion then in your opinion , from the begining


Sequence of events leading to this particular hole IMO:

1: #4 blows and piece of debris, most likely concrete pierces roof of #3 turbine building leaving hole as seen in photo. White pipe w/ box possibly flexible conduit. Possibility of debris being smaller and roof crumbled around white pipe w/ box with primary impact being at top of photo.

2: #3 blows. In video I see primary and secondary explosive events.

A: Primary acts as initiator- most likely hydrogen in nature. Hydrogen explosion is high order / non directional (over 3000m/s). This ejects the piece of debris from #3 reactor building laterally which makes contact with turbine roof, breaks through low roof wall, makes contact with far edge of hole scraping to substrate and exits far low roof wall.

B: Secondary is of unknown nature. This explosion is high order / linear-directed (well over 3000m/s). This ejects various parts of the #3 reactor building primarily upwards with the various bits & pieces coming to a rest as seen in the photograph on top of the skid marks.

Again this is photo analysis- it is not definitive but a critical look at imagery. If an analyst was right 100% of the time they would be called psychics. The sequence of events I have laid out is logical and a natural progression based on observable data (video of explosions and photos of damage).



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