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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by TheLastStand
 


Oh yes, my bad...

Common Cryogenic Liquids: Nitrogen and Helium

All gases, when cooled, condense. Two gases often used in their liquid forms are nitrogen and helium.

Nitrogen gas, when cooled, condenses at -195.8 Celsius (77.36 Kelvin) and freezes at -209.86 Celsius (63.17 Kelvin.) Or, to reverse the order, solid nitrogen melts to form liquid nitrogen at 63.17 Kelvin, which boils at 77.36 Kelvin. Liquid nitrogen is used in many cryogenic cooling systems.

See the temperature scales page for a review of Celsius, Kelvin, and other scales, along with formulas to convert from one to the other.

Liquid helium boils at -268.93 Centigrade (4.2 Kelvin). Helium does not freeze at atmospheric pressure. Only at pressures above 20 times atmospheric will solid helium form. Liquid helium, because of its low boiling point, is used in many cryogenic systems when temperatures below the boiling point of nitrogen are needed.

A convenient way to cool many kinds of apparatus is to submerge them in liquid helium or liquid nitrogen. Liquid helium and nitrogen are usually stored in vacuum insulated flasks, called Dewars, after their inventor, Sir James Dewar. (Dewars are familiar to most of us under the brand name "Thermos".)




posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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And of course:


HPA said that levels of radioactive iodine "may rise in the coming days and weeks" but these would be "significantly below any level that could cause harm to public health".


BBC

So we can "expect" it to rise. But of course it will rise as stuff* is still being released by the reactors no need to worry folks, as said stuff* will have little effect.

*exact content to be confirmed at future date.

Just noticed after days of clear skies it has started raining (no stuff* in there - move along now).
edit on 29/3/2011 by YarlanZey because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:17 PM
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reply to post by TheLastStand
 



- HUH!!! only vegetables have seed?? I am assuming you have not heard of the TimeWave Theory ??



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by Himal
Why o Why???? Why is it still treated as a company-wide (TEPCO) problem? Why is the Japanese govt. not stepping in and taking charge? Why are the world leaders not having a G8 or a G20 emergency meeting over this?
Why do I feel like only the people on ATS have a true sense of what is at stake?

At what point in the disaster does it become a national problem?
At what point does it become an international problem?


Someone has to take the blame. Will you step in and take it?
It's in my opinion also a problem of false pride.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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Originally posted by Destinyone
IMO...it's going to take thinking outside the box, to come up with a viable solution...and, time is running out.


Ya think!!!! ... the radiation is already outside the reactor box ...
I think a controlled man-made tsunami to drown the whole plant and push it deep down into the sea is the only viable solution.
This is like an ugly and unbeatable monster who is taking its time to rear its ugly head ... is it a few days, months or a year ??? who knows??



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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Originally posted by TheRemedial
Rockets with Liquid Helium 3 payloads.



Helium 3 is a rare and expensive FUSION fuel... You trying to blow up Japan in one hit?

:shk:



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:26 PM
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reply to post by Himal
 


It feels like the dragon is being awakened from its slumber.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:27 PM
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Here is Catherine Lin-Hendel's scientific explanation:

1. Use Liquid Nitrogen to instantly cool nuclear feul rods. 2. Use Boron powder mixed in Liquid Nitrogen to slow/stop nuclear reaction.

Liquid Nitrogen is available in large quantities in Japan, should be used to flood and cool the fuel rods first. It very cold--Minus 198 C, innert, and highly pressurized. It is injected into the Reactor dome by pressure , thus needing no electricity. The cooling is extremely fast. The vapor produced is also very cold and innert.

If stopping the nuclear reaction is desired: mix boron powder with liquid nitrogen. You put boron powder in the LN dewar (the thermally insulated container) before you fill the dewar with liquid nitrogen. Then you bring the dewar upside down to connect the outlet of liquid nitrogen to the fluid intake of the nuclear reactor chamber. The pressurized liquid nitrogen during its injection into the reaction chamber would mix the boron with liquid nitrogen evenly, and inject into the nuclear reaction chamber.

Source

edit on 29-3-2011 by TheRemedial because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:27 PM
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Originally posted by Regenstorm
Someone has to take the blame. Will you step in and take it?
It's in my opinion also a problem of false pride.


I believe the world is clear on what happened at the plant and who was in charge and who is handling the mitigation upto this point. They can keep pointing the fingers at TEPCO but take charge of the mission now... isn't it obvious that TEPCO doesnot have the capacity to control this monstor.

If things gets worst the TPTB will get blamed anyways ... atleast give it a shot.

OTOH if blaming me would even solve half the problem, I will definitely take the blame.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by onequestion
It feels like the dragon is being awakened from its slumber.


Not the dragon... Godzilla... and you know what happens to Tokyo every time he wakes up


Missed this one earlier in the week

Gov't asks people within 30 km of Fukushima nuclear plant to voluntarily leave
Friday 25th March, 02:40 PM JST
www.japantoday.com...

Today on NHK it was strongly suggested that they leave, but I missed the screen capture and it hasn't repeated yet... maybe tonight



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:37 PM
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Its really odd how many of the so called "solutions" from some of our fellow members call for some sort of "drastic" solution of either:

A)Entombing it, bury it or the like and forget about it, somehow making go away in the process

and

B) Explode it, or bomb it , and somehow make it all go away...

If it were so simple, we have been doing those same things up until now everywhere, we either burn it or forget it, but taking responsibility and holding accountable those who created this mess seems to be utterly ignored.

How civilized of us, how "westernly".

The real problem is us rationalizing that either ignorance or destruction can save the day miraculously.
I´ve never seen problems get solved by anything other than balls of steel, and the drive to transcend the idiotic ideals that made us screw it up in the first place.

And its happening again, no one is pressuring the government for the truth, no one in the international community is daring to show its privately gathered results, we are just sitting and waiting, while the rest nap away our lives, this is the same hand we are always dealt, half truths, lies, and the upholding of the corporate powerhouses through deceit and semantic engineering.

If our dear brothers in Japan would just stand up and say: We aren't having any more of this, we demand the truth, we demand to be handed back our future! then I´m sure many more would join that struggle, but we seem to be blindfolded, we seem not be reacting as we should in the midst of the storm...



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by TheRemedial
 


That would create such an immense explosion! Flashing that in air is bad enough, but in a hot nuclear plant with exposed rods and corium leaking around, that would just be nuts. High pressures would blow dust and particulate all over the place, bigger dispersion than merely using water to do the cooling. Oh it would go cold pretty quick, but the corium would solidify and likely get shattered into an unimaginable amount of pieces and get removed as dust. Water would likely form an explosive, icy mist. Explosion plus any of that material is bad -->ergo the bigger the temperature differentials we are dealing with, the more explosive using those two materials together is.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:41 PM
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reply to post by TheOneEyedProphet
 


Let me re-iterate what I stated:
C)Remove it to boron slurry pits and come up with a way to deal with one isolated rod at a time in this way.

right now all of the eggs are in one basket. If it goes, it all goes. Compartamentalizing the problem and isolating it into smaller more manageable sections is the only strategy that can achieve any further improvement in this situation, aside from trying to slow down the inevitable explosion that will come when that corium does it's thing.
edit on 29-3-2011 by TheLastStand because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:44 PM
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reply to post by TheRemedial
 


yes, but she doesn't say, deliver it using a rocket. My god dude, her process is in a specially designed containment vessel and this -- well this quite simply isn't. Even the containment designed for it for other processes has failed. This requires a special injection system for both compounds. It also doesn't mention what it will do to the cladding on the rods (probably cause it to warp, shatter and peel off the rod in a fairly violent release of mechanical energy). This is a very dangerous idea, sounds quite suicidal.



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:48 PM
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reply to post by TheRemedial
 

That is sure a lateral-thinking way of approaching the problem. Doubtless there would be some serious practical difficulties but at this point, I think it's far better for people to post potential solutions than to say nothing. At the very least, there might be something that can be gleaned from any ideas put forward, and as there are doubtless quite a lot of people following this thread and other discussions like it, then they might be able to take such ideas further.

Thanks for referencing that concept.


Mike



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:50 PM
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reply to post by TheOneEyedProphet
 


Uhhhhh....It's already started...and building through social networks.

Video at link: www.bbc.co.uk...

Two weeks after an earthquake and tsunami hit Japan, the country's prime minister, Naoto Kan, has said the situation at the Fukushima nuclear plant remains ''grave and serious''.

Fukushima's operators have said water at one reactor was 10,000 times more radioactive than normal, raising fears that its core is damaged.

Anti-nuclear protests have been taking place in Tokyo as an investigation is under way to establish the source of the radiation leak.

The BBC's Rupert Wingfield Hayes reports.


edit on 03/28/2011 by Destinyone because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:53 PM
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reply to post by JustMike
 


Thank you. I just will not accept that nothing can be done or thought up to help the situation!


I was just thinking how about entombing it in molten Tungsten. I believe Tungsten has a higher melting point than that of the reaction. Could the Tungsten solidify around the cores? Or perhaps there is another cheaper metal?

1750 Thorium Th 90
1772 Platinum Pt 78
1852 Zirconium Zr 40
1857 Chromium Cr 24
1890 Vanadium V 23
1966 Rhodium Rh 45
2150 Hafnium Hf 72
2200 Technetium Tc 43
2250 Ruthenium Ru 44
2300 Boron B 5
2410 Iridium Ir 77
2468 Niobium Nb 41
2617 Molybdenum Mo 42
2996 Tantalum Ta 73
3045 Osmium Os 76
3180 Rhenium Re 75
3410 Tungsten W 74
3500 Carbon C 6


Melting points on periodic table Source



In the early 1980s, Toyota researched production of an adiabatic ceramic engine which can run at a temperature of over 6000 °F (3300 °C). Ceramic engines are made of lighter materials and do not require a cooling system and hence allow a major weight reduction

Sources


edit on 29-3-2011 by TheRemedial because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 03:54 PM
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Ugh. I am so mad at TEPCO for bringing us into this uncontrollable mess. The US offered Japan cooling chemicals or something immediately after the tsunami. Why couldn't they have just accepted foreign help?



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by TheRemedial
 

Besides the immense problems in setting up an electric furnace on-site and then pouring the molten material accurately (and not hitting any water anywhere), I don't think it would work because the tungsten wouldn't flow under the corium. It would only coat the outside of its upper surfaces, not the lower side which would still be burning downwards through concrete or whatever is still beneath it.

But actually, I suspect that corium while still molten might be even hotter than tungsten could stand and so it might not do the job anyway. Does anyone have a handy reference for the heat generated by a melting core?

Best regards,

Mike

edit on 29/3/11 by JustMike because: I don't remember. Okay?



posted on Mar, 29 2011 @ 04:10 PM
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reply to post by JustMike
 


I don't have any references but nuclear reactions can get as hot as, well, the surface of the sun. It all depends on the mass and the isotopes used in the corium, it is not a very static definition for the object it is trying to describe.

5800 K ?
edit on 29-3-2011 by TheLastStand because: (no reason given)



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