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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by Fractured.Facade
reply to post by chr0naut
 


I can't figure out why they haven't been doing this all along, or at least pumping in loads of boron.... Hell try anything, once they are fairly sure there isn't going to be a catastrophic meltdown... bury the core in it, with sand and rock, and top it off with thousands of tons of concrete.

Anything like this would be better than just spraying water at it and venting radioactive gas and steam continuously.

Thing is, I don't believe that they believe the containment bowl will hold a catastrophic meltdown and that could be why they haven't already done this and entombed them... Especially in reactor #3 with the MOX fuel.


They used Boron at the beginning and exhausted their supply. More was said to be coming from S Korea. The US also has some ready to be shipped or already shipped. That close up footage of spraying operations showed some containers that were either something being mixed with the water, or maybe just giving the driver air ..but they focused in on it for some time and talked about it (but I have no audio)

So they are doing a lot more than many people have noticed. In fact they are probably doing everything possible. Most suggestions you see on these boards are probably in the works, or they just arn't possible at the moment (ie. concrete and such)

Thats why I keep saying I don't think there is any coverup, most of the information is out there, most of it is also within this thread for that matter.




posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:44 PM
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reply to post by EnhancedInterrogator
 


Okay so they have power... Very good news
, but the pumps are not yet running, very bad news, the crews have abandoned the site because of smoke and radiation, even worse news.

Oh, heck, I'll take any good news, and wish them well... But damn, it isn't looking all that good now.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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reply to post by Fractured.Facade
 


They don't have power, sadly.

They have a power cable.

And the chances are now extremely high no human being can get anywhere near the "pumps" which don't work anymore anyway.
edit on 21-3-2011 by sepermeru because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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Originally posted by iWokeUp
If there is a risk of the nuclear materials melting through the core if not kept cool, how come the one at Chernobyl still has 95% of it and its been entombed....And as it blew up it wouldn't have any means of continuous cooling via pumps and hoses ect?


The Nuclear fuel at Chernobyl mixed with sand (from the protective layer of sand around the reactor) The heat of the fuel melted the sand and turned it to glass. The fuel mixed with the glass and thus was trapped in that glass. However the glass is breaking down and may again release the fuel. Watch the video in my Chernobyl thread (bottom of the page the NOVA one)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:50 PM
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If i remember correctly, per Redneck's earlier explanation, the pumps are inside the containment structure. There is NO way they can enter that building to replace these pumps. So how exactly do they plan on doing this?



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:52 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 


Im comparing the epa numbers to the epa numbers, . .denver and slightly NE compared to seattle cali etc, ...a an average of all the data sites on the same map,. . .I also just recently googled (USA jetstrean forecast) and within the first dew links (The first i think) I saw a pic of the current stream heading north from the nevada area, which ould also explain vegas numbers, (Am i correct in assuming the sierra lie west of vegas, as well?) not enough time tonight, imtired, ..i was just thinking currents and heavy metals in dust form would explain east of denver, . .night



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:55 PM
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reply to post by sepermeru
 

I don't know of any "daily maximum dose". There are industrial standards but those are based on annual exposures.
When I was undergoing radiation therapy I received 250 rads (2500 μSv) daily (except on weekends) for 8 weeks.

edit on 3/21/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:56 PM
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reply to post by thevolunteerwino
 


sorry about the bad spelling but i am really tired, . .i just thought it made sense, that a sluice effect would work on heavy metals in a jetstream across mountain ranges, . .and also that fine particles could rise that far up from the rising heat, . .peace



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:59 PM
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Does anyone else find it concerning that the response now is to rethink...

Not how to control the disaster...

But rather, how to control the information?

Rethink playbook for nuclear accidents

(CNN) -- International regulators need to rethink their procedures for handling nuclear accidents in the wake of the crisis in Japan, the head of the U.N. atomic watchdog agency said Monday. The current framework for responding to emergencies dates back to the aftermath of the Chernobyl accident in 1986 and "reflects the realities of the 1980s, not of the 21st century," International Atomic Energy Agency chief Yukiya Amano said. "The speed at which information now travels and the huge volume of information in public circulation are among the most significant changes since then," Amano said. "Live television and the internet provide constant updates on a crisis situation -- not always accurately -- to a global audience. The responsibility of the IAEA is to provide authoritative and validated information as quickly as possible, but doing this under the current arrangements inevitably takes time and has limitations."


I can think of a thing or two I would rather the IAEA focus on controlling before they work on controlling information...

like radiation leaks and the oh maybe we better get new pumps and generators brought in stat...(stat meaning long before now.) It does not take an expert to predict and see a nuclear plant could go way wrong and figure out a better response. I just do not understand how we continue to miss the mark when it really matters, but hit the mark when it does not matter to anyone except the pockets of a few.

Sigh.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 08:59 PM
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reply to post by thevolunteerwino
 


Well, I think someone needs to start a thread explaining how these maps work, and what Denver is all about.

Have you taken into account the vast difference between the altitude of Colorado and that of those low-lying area in Cali? That's one of the biggest factors. The closer you get to space, the more radiation you naturally get----from space.

I promise you, if someone who has been following these numbers since BEFORE the earthquake sees a rise, they will post on ATS right away with past data numbers, graphs showing the rise in overall levels, etc.

Can you tell me what Denver was at 2 weeks ago? Or any of the other places you mentioned? Can you tell me what they were a month ago?

Without that data, you're just watching numbers naturally rise and fall. Watch another two weeks, and they will come back down again. Another two weeks, they'll go back up. Ad infinitum.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:01 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 

There are a couple of threads.
And it doesn't take weeks for the values to change it happens hour to hour and day to day. None are outside of historical levels for their locations.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:02 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by sepermeru
 

I don't know of any "daily maximum dose". There are industrial standards but those are based on annual exposures.
When I was undergoing radiation therapy I received 250 rads (2500 μSv) daily (except on weekends) for 8 weeks.

edit on 3/21/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)


So this means many of those people within the 20-30 km range who have not evacuated yet could theoretically be receiving at least 3840 μSv every 24 hours. Sounds high to me. But probably much lower for many due to staying indoors. But who knows.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:05 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
160 μSv for prolonged periods would be considered dangerous. 18 hours exposure would be about equivalent to a mammogram.


That is the one thing in all the news reports I see... they keep saying we are all exposed to radiation all the time, like cosmic rays, x-rays etc so the levels are no worse...

Only difference is that this radiation is CONTINUOUS, something they seem to neglect to stress.

160 μSv huh?

Well then... they are in trouble, aren't they? This is 1 km away


edit on 21-3-2011 by zorgon because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:05 PM
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Here's the latest JAIF release ...

Reactor Status and Major Events Update 23 - NPPs in Fukushima as of 10:00 March 22

... this is the one with the (relatively) easy-to-read color-coded spreadsheet.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PS: Have we learned nothing, since 1971 ...

'Godzilla vs. Hedorah' (aka 'Godzilla vs. the Smog Monster')


[...]The army swiftly constructs two gigantic electrodes for this purpose[...]


[...]Godzilla drags Hedorah back to the electrodes and continues to dehydrate it until Hedorah dies. Godzilla tears apart Hedorah's dried-out body and dehydrates the remains until nothing remains but dust[...]


Maybe TEPCO connecting power-line's the plant is in preperation for something 'big'?



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:06 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 


I already posted about this on another thread. Cosmic radiation increases with elevation. Its because at higher altitudes there is less atmosphere to absorb the cosmic radiation. I dont know actual amounts of differences but form the minimal levels that are being measured on the maps it makes plenty of sense. Denver is about 4-6K feet. I live at 9K feet so i am sure its even higher here. I was looking for some readings fro the observatory on top of MT Evans. Its 13K feet but could not find anything.



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:06 PM
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reply to post by Phage
 


I was recalling from memory one of the graphs you posted about 10 pages back, that showed the curves rising in increments of about two weeks. IIRC, there was a spike right before the quake, then it fell over the week after it, and has started to come back up. Might be over-simplifying it, but I think the point got across.

(Man, you can't let anything slide, eh?)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:10 PM
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reply to post by MedievalGhost
 

That's correct, it is high. But 160 μSv was the highest level found. The range was 2 - 160.
edit on 3/21/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:10 PM
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# NEWS ADVISORY: Smoke from Fukushima plant's No. 2 reactor is steam: defense chief (11:02)

# NEWS ADVISORY: Smoke from Fukushima plant's No. 3 reactor likely from burning debris: defense chief (11:00)


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I hope that 'burning debris' in reactor 3 isn't plutonium rods.
edit on 21-3-2011 by MedievalGhost because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by soundguy
 


There is no "full scale" for the graph. The graph scales itself to the data range. Note the graph for Tucson.


edit on 3/19/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)


Here's one of those graphs.

The levels rise and fall from peak to trough about every day, but the overall "maximum peaks" and "minimum peak" seems to follow a pattern that is much longer.

That's why I was remembering it as "two weeks." The common person won't see each rise and fall on the map, but will remember "the highest number I've seen it at yet." And that's where it's important to remember these longer-phase patterns.
edit on 21-3-2011 by 00nunya00 because: (no reason given)

edit on 21-3-2011 by 00nunya00 because: atrocious spelling



posted on Mar, 21 2011 @ 09:16 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 

Could be. Maybe I'll try charting longer term data just for the heck of it. The trouble is you can only download 400 datapoints at a time.




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