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Japan declares 'nuclear emergency' after quake

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posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:27 PM
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From BBC

www.bbc.co.uk...


2220: Japan turned down an earlier US offer to provide technical support for cooling fuel rods at nuclear reactors hit by a massive earthquake and tsunami, a Japanese newspaper reported on Friday, reports AFP.


I dont really understand why they would turn down support????

Edit - Any news about reactors 5 and 6? Last I heard there was pressue and heat was increasing, but that was a few hours ago.
edit on 17-3-2011 by buni11687 because: (no reason given)




posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:37 PM
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reply to post by buni11687
 


The only people saying all is lost is on ATS. I believe that the Japanese believe that they have it under control. If assistance is needed they will ask. As they did when they asked GE for the pumps or generators. I believe that the information is getting twisted at the media level. Twisted in such a way to cause panick. Just my own opinion.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:44 PM
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reply to post by liejunkie01
 


Just like they were wise enough to accept US assistance when it was offered on day one? Like they were wise enough to ask for help before the situation got so far out of control in the first place? How many things have happened that were "never supposed to be able to happen"? Sorry, but I trust capitalists about as far as I can throw them, and capitalism is at HUGE play here. We're depending on a for-profit company to tell us the truth about details which may cost them more fines and profits? Yeah........not feeling confident with the actions of anyone in control over there right now.
edit on 17-3-2011 by 00nunya00 because: spelling



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:46 PM
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Reuters live feed is reporting that CNET is saying power has successfully been restored, but they are awaiting further confirmation

On a side note, the UN have just voted in favour of the no-fly zone ...........



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:48 PM
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muller.lbl.gov...

This pdf somewhat downplays plutonium and says that much of what is reported by the media, even the NYT, about 1 spec killing is not true, and that it only raises the risk of cancer.

It doent reassure me however. Whatever mix is in whatever may reach us, and even more, infiltrate the worlds eco system, doent look promising.

But a cloud of reactor 3's explosion impacting any area in a more concentrated form would not be good news I imagine.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:54 PM
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reply to post by cosmicpixie
 


You know, I've become really disenchanted with Reuters the last few days. They're totally taking one line in the CNET article that wasn't artfully worded and running with it. CNET says "power has been restored" but goes on to describe just the cable being connected, and nothing else to the effect of the power flowing right now.

But Reuters is all over it like it means the power's back on, which it's not looking like it is. Regardless, even if it is flowing again, they're irresponsible for posting that as an update BEFORE they verify it. Or before they even, apparently, asked a few people to read it and see what they think it meant. Because I could have told them "this doesn't sound like anything new."

And they've been allowing people to comment and give "updates" that are absolutely fake, false, lies. They moderate every comment, so they have no excuse. Some of those hoaxes have made their way to this thread, and that sucks. Reuters has been allowing its commenters to say power is back on and the pumps are running for 24 hours now. It's sad.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:54 PM
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reply to post by buni11687
 


Yeah, I agree. They've been turning down help since day one and it makes no sense -- unless they're hiding something. People keep saying it's because the Japanese are a "proud people" or believe in "saving face". That's great -- but this situation is out of control.

Japan: PLEASE accept the help.
edit on 17-3-2011 by dvrt10 because: Typo



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 05:57 PM
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www.facebook.com...
edit on Thu Mar 17 2011 by DontTreadOnMe because: --Off Topic, One Liners and General Back Scratching Posts--



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:02 PM
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reply to post by cosmicpixie
 


it was on cnn a minute ago, no fly-zone, now where is that ats member reporting stuffs from his hotel?



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:11 PM
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Someone on Reuters says that there is steam coming from 2,3,4


NHK are showing Fukushima plant live..no2, no3 and no4 are emitting white steam. 2307 gmt


live.reuters.com...

Plus someone is saying this about snow/ice but I dont really understand what they are saying


A major concern with ice/snow is that it could further damage whatever containment vessels it hits. If its dropped from even 30 meters, a 1 kg chunk would carry about 5 kj on impact (back of the envelope).



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:14 PM
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reply to post by buni11687
 



Plus someone is saying this about snow/ice but I dont really understand what they are saying


Maybe they are weighing the idea of dropping glaciers and snow on the stuff? I didn't go to the link you provided but that is the first thing that I thought of.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:16 PM
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We all knew this already, but it is being discussed in Japan (I wasn't sure how much Japanese were getting frustrated with things, or even talking about it) ...

Govt, TEPCO fail on info-sharing / No N-crisis HQ for 4 days after tsunami disabled reactor cooling system


Both the government of Prime Minister Naoto Kan and Tokyo Electric Power Co. failed to exercise a firm grip over the release of information on the rapidly unfolding nuclear crisis at the utility's nuclear power plant in Fukushima Prefecture, and did not set up an integrated government-TEPCO headquarters until Tuesday, four days after the outbreak of earthquake-triggered abnormalities.


edit on 2011-3-17 by EnhancedInterrogator because: sepelengin, etc.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:17 PM
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OK, here are my calcs on the amount of water required to reduce the temperature of uranium oxide using water. I did make one error I know of before I run these, as I used uranium instead of uranium oxide (duh on me!), so let's see what happens with the new figures:

Uranium oxide (depleted) has the following properties (source):
  • Atomic weight - 236 g/mol
  • Density - 19.07 g/cm³ = 19,070,000 g/m³
  • Specific heat - 0.028 cal/g·K

Water has the following properties (source):
  • Moleclar mass - 18 g/mol
  • Density - 1000 kg/m³
  • Specific heat - 4.18 J/g·K

 
Heat capacity of one ton of uranium:
1 lb = 0.454 kg = 454 g
1 ton = 2000 lb · 454 g/lb = 908,000 g
1 cal = 4.18 J
0.028 cal/g·K · 4.18 J/cal = 0.117 J/g·K
0.117 J/g·K · 908,000 g · 1000K = 106,236,000 Joules of energy required to lower the temperature of one ton of uranium oxide by 1000K (or 1000°C)
 
Heat capacity of 1 gal of water:
1 gallon of water is 231 in³
1 in = 0.0254 m
Therefore: 1 gal = 231 in³ · 0.0254³ m/in = 0.00379 m³
0.00379 m³ · 1,000,000 g/m³ = 3790 g
Water will boil at 100°C... assume initial temperature is 20°C. ΔT = 100 - 20 = 80K
4.18 J/g·K · 3790g · 80K = 1,267,376 Joules of energy to raise the temperature of 1 gal of water by 80K (or 80°C)
 
106,236,000 / 1,267,376 = 83.82 gal water required to lower the temperature of 1 ton of uranium by 1000°C
 
So it looks like we were both wrong... I can admit a mistake.

But remember that figure assumes the water does not boil away, and as you pointed out previously, it also does not take into account how much heat is being produced on a continuous basis as we have no way of calculating that. This is a minimum, as it assumes that the water will remain and not boil away... and that in itself is impossible from a practical standpoint as the initial influx of water will flash to (radioactive) steam... and it does not include heat from the concrete container, nor from the cladding.

Happy now? 84 gallons per ton per 1000°C. That's still a lot of water.

TheRedneck

(Yeah, I know, some of those properties I did not need. I re-ran these from scratch as I typed the post, so I simply included anything I might need later.)



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:19 PM
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reply to post by buni11687
 


Please, please turn off the comments on Reuters. (The user comments, not Reuters' live updates) They're becoming extremely embarrassing to that news outlet. I don't know who they have moderating, but they're not worth their salt. I haven't seen any comments anywhere else that beats the info on this thread, if the comment wasn't reposted here and discussed because it was so good. If anyone on Reuters' comments says anything worth your time, I promise you, someone will post it here. It's just going to drive you nuts reading those.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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reply to post by 00nunya00
 

Totally agree on that. News sites like to show "participation" from the public. But, then completely unsubstantiated rumor get's treated as "news" - just because it's on the same page. They may as well close-down their site and just have a Twitter feed - the quality of the "news" would be the same.

edit on 2011-3-17 by EnhancedInterrogator because: speoh3lklhrl.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by buni11687
From BBC

www.bbc.co.uk...


2220: Japan turned down an earlier US offer to provide technical support for cooling fuel rods at nuclear reactors hit by a massive earthquake and tsunami, a Japanese newspaper reported on Friday, reports AFP.


I dont really understand why they would turn down support????

Edit - Any news about reactors 5 and 6? Last I heard there was pressue and heat was increasing, but that was a few hours ago.
edit on 17-3-2011 by buni11687 because: (no reason given)


YES UPDATE ON REACTORS 5 AND 6!
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.cnn.com...



Meanwhile, engineers got an emergency diesel generator for Unit 6 running that was supplying energy to Units 5 and 6 for use in cooling the spent-fuel pools, a spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency said Friday. Water injection to the spent fuel pool was continuing.


They got 5 and 6 almost under control with the diesel generators pumping water in...
edit on 17-3-2011 by hillynilly because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:35 PM
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This is getting frustrating.


Diesel generator sending power to Units 5, 6 at #quake damaged Japan nuclear plant on.cnn.com... 13 minutes ago via web


via @CNNbrk

But the link goes to a story saying no such thing. Grrr.

ETA: nevermind, they just buried the real news in the middle of the article under old stuff. Sigh.
edit on 17-3-2011 by 00nunya00 because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:37 PM
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If you had read what I posted instead of taking it down you would of seen that it was a link to someones firsthand account of being in Japan during all this. I was about to post links to all these other blogs. Whatever. I don't get all the ins and outs but I think it's silly how trivial some of you can be. Honestly....



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:38 PM
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Originally posted by liejunkie01

The only people saying all is lost is on ATS. I believe that the Japanese believe that they have it under control. If assistance is needed they will ask. As they did when they asked GE for the pumps or generators. I believe that the information is getting twisted at the media level. Twisted in such a way to cause panick. Just my own opinion.


Not exactly true... Science America interview/podcast here:

Fukushima will be a wasteland



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 06:40 PM
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reply to post by xxPUSH0Noo
 


Whoa, dude, that was a mod, not any of us.

And really, you could have at least said what you just said to describe what the link was about, instead of just the one-link post. Not a big deal, you can post all the links you want, and someone here will read them, guaranteed.



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