I'd like to be converted. Can you help answer my questions?

reply to post by Brianegan


I wanted to step in earlier but had to finish the rest of the thread. (Only fair, right?)

I'd like to start talking about sheeple and the great delusion, but not really, because you originally stated you were willing to be converted. I had to ask myself when you posted that if you needed to belong or needed to know the truth. After reading, I feel you intended to say what the heck is going on, why do I understand all this and yet no one is listening? I have a nifty little book, that hasn't been published yet, but it's somewhat akin to translating the book of Revelations into modern english. It's not time to publish it yet. Maybe not in my lifetime, perhaps down the road when people are ready to listen. However, when I read a post like yours, sometimes I think to myself that you'd be ready.

It's not about who's right or wrong, as far as religion goes, it's about how we treat each other. I'd like to throw in a bit about being watched by "God" but I'm a pagan. Oh yeah, my head has been where yours is at now, so don't loose faith in chasing your mysteries. If anything, I'd like to convert you to paganism, where everyone follows their OWN path, without prejudice, helping others who are lost. Yea, and "lost" could also mean delusional. It's like being the person who doesn't take sides, helping people and being satisfied doing that, seeing that the christians and the non-believers are both sorta wrong, but that there is a pull toward something else, perhaps a middle ground that humans can't understand yet. I believe people can believe whatever they want, and yet I also believe that Adam and Eve were both naked in the Garden of Eden, and "naked" in that sense meant they were spiritual beings, without bodies, and when they "sinned" they became attached to physical bodies, something we've been cursed with ever since.

If aliens are technologically advanced, then god would be on the same sorta technology buff, knowing how to transcend physical flesh and have lots of good knowledge we've lost as humans over the years.

Hmm, should I go on? Let me know.

reply to post by Akragon

This week end ,i will be starting threads about the media and our bible,i am a believer of Jesus Christ,and our heavenly father.i can prove the bible,by facts of everyday in Jerusalem and Israel and turkey,bible facts are coming true.........they have found so much proof of the bible,it excites me.they found a stone on it written about him,the temple in Jerusalem things........ Jesus was in Jerusalem and preached and died and has risen.500 witness saw him,the non-believers and believers.all will bow down and worship Jesus when he comes.....the book of revelation will happen,we can't stop it,but we can be ready and live our life's the right way.pray,fast and do his commandments,we must first give all of sins to Jesus,at the cross,mean it,you will know,you get a whole different feeling.now i am not going to say it will be easy,after you get saved,it will be harder,the devil will be mad.you must find a good bible believing church,not afraid of standing up for god,and not ashamed to claim gods glory.be baptist,by water, Jesus gives us the comforter,the holy spirit,he will help you through all times.pray everyday.learn about fasting,and communions,he said to remember him.when the holy spirit over comes you that is with fire,like the disciples got in acts...communicate daily ,morn noon night, whenever,not just when you need something.thank him every day for everything.he is a loving merciful,god.do the 10 commandments.then your whole life will be different. don't walk away from sinners,help them,pray for them.like Jesus did.spread his word,like he commanded us to.get involved with your church,do things outside of your church...remember to tithe for the lord. You won't regret it,time is short,Jesus said he will come like a thief in the night.remember to forgive,if you can't forgive,how do you expect our father to forgive us.also love one another,that his one of his greatness commandments.I,can have books and websites that can help you freely...i get them all the time,and magazines from the holy land free.i go to a baptist church,but i go by my bible,first of all.god and Jesus,is my foremost and first love.you can google asking for proof of the bible,it will show you....i am venusstarlite on facebook,thevenusstarlite and venusstarlite,on you-tube....cnn i-reporter,i am venusstarlit,twitter,i am venusstarlite.i am everywhere,telling about Jesus............May god bless you and your family,and stay safe in jesus's arms.and the holy spirit watch over you with all the angels in heaven. I,stand with Israel to! Jesus said he would curse all that didn't stand with Israel,reward all that do.Jesus said what you do here on earth,tells how many crowns you will wear in heaven,I,pray everyday for jesus to remember me and my family and the world in the book of life.........I,pray this helps.........Jesus died for all of sins and the worlds sins,and he arose,he is alive and coming back,PRAISE THE LORD,THANK YOU GOD FOR GIVING YOUR ONLY BEGOTTEN SON,JESUS CHRIST. JESUS CHRIST IS THE ONLY WAY TO HEAVEN AND TO OUR HEAVENLY FATHER! WE MUST BE WASHED BY HIS BLOOD,TO BE CLEAN TO ENTER THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN.OUR BODIES ARE THE TEMPLE OF OUR LORDS.WHAT WE DO AND SAY,WE DO AND SAY TO JESUS AND GOD.SO WE BETTER BE RIGHT WITH GOD! REMEMBER MY DEAR PEOPLE,THE BIBLE CAN AND WILL BE PROVEN MORE AND MORE EVERYDAY.LISTEN AND WATCH THE HEAVENS,BE READY,THE TIME IS SHORT....THE BOOK OF ISAIAH,MICAH,DANIEL,THESS,AND THE BOOK OF REVELATIONS,TELLS THIS,IN THE OLD AND NEW,TESTAMENT.,IN JESUS'S NAME AMEN ALL

I,forgot one more thing, Jesus said all scales will fall from mankind's eyes,then you all will know the truth,he told us to watch for signs in the heavens and earth........they are coming to past,they started when Israel became a state in one day.....also watch for the Antichrist and for people that claim they are Jesus,or god....also when Jesus comes,people may think,he is alien,because he came from the clouds. BEWARE OF FOOLS,AND FALSE TEACHERS,CLAIMING WHO THEY ARE...........JESUS TOLD US HOW AND WHAT TO EXPECT WHAT HAPPEN WHEN HE COMES,THUNDER IN THE EAST...ITS IN OUR BIBLE.......THERE I A LOT OF THINGS ,I CAN SAY AND SHOW PROOF OF,THAT'S IN OUR BIBLE,BUT DON'T WORSHIP THE BIBLE,WE ONLY WORSHIP GOD AND JESUS,AND ONLY BOW DOWN TO THEM.NO IDOLS!!!!,THE BIBLE IS TO TEACH US,AND ITS A LOVE LETTER,FROM GOD.,ALSO A HISTORY BOOK OF MAN KIND............ALSO THEY HAVE FOUND MANY SCROLLS,TO PROVE OUR BIBLE. JESUS,IS OUR MESSIAH,OUR SAVIOUR.......DON'T TAKE THE MARK OF THE BEAST,A MICRO CHIP IN YOUR HAND OR FORE HEAD,YOU CAN GOOGLE THIS,OUR GOVERNMENT WANTS TO DO THIS BY 2017.........I WILL BE DOING MANY THREADS,STARTING THIS WEEKEND.....I, AM IN A WHEELCHAIR,WITH,CML LEUKAEMIA,I, GET TIRED EASY,BUT NEVER FOR GOD.I WAS TO OF DIED 6 YRS AGO,I AM HERE STILL TODAY,BY THE GRACE OF GOD,I DON'T FEAR DEATH. NOW,I AM NOT READY TO GO YET THO,BUT IF GOD SAYS IT IS,OK WITH ME.I HAVE BEEN IN REMISSION AND OUT,I AM SOMEWHAT OUT,OF REMISSION,BUT GETTING BETTER EVERYDAY.I WILL PREACH ABOUT GOD AND JESUS ONTIL MY LAST BREATH...

Originally posted by DeReK DaRkLy


Here's the way i look at it....
Christianity asks for your faith in something that you could not possibly confirm with hard evidence.

However, people are afraid if they don't "believe" in Jesus, that they will go to "Hell" for eternity.

What about good, honest living people who don't believe?
Is God gonna send them to Hell anyway?

Christians say yes, you'll go to Hell for not believing, and that's where I draw the idiot line in the sand... no thanks!

If that's how it really works, then God is a first class a-hole.

This somewhat feeds into the idea of Pascal's wager. Some people (Pascal being one) suggest that If atheism is wrong, that you'd be risking the eternal pains of hell upon entry to the afterlife (according to some religions) and that as a result, one should not risk in not believing in God. Essentially, he thought that he had nothing to lose by believing in the Christian God, but that pertaining to an atheist dogma incurs the risk of eternal damnation - so it is a much safer bet to be Christian than a nonbeliever.

This is, however, based entirely upon a false dichotomy: either the Christian God exists, or He doesn't. If we venture outside of this, we see that in fact there are many hundreds of God's one could choose from, depending on where you are both in terms of time and place, and all of whom are told to punish those who believe in a false God(s). I think we can all agree that, even were these Gods were not mutually exclusive from on another, it would be nigh on impossible to worship all of them. Essentially, if we make the case that all options assume an equal likelihood of being true (i.e. it is equally likely that one of these Gods exists), the odds are very much against you falling into believing the correct deity. It can thus be said that not believing is a safer bet.

The next argument might be that the chance of there being no God should be also be assumed to having an equal probability of occurring. Thus, stating that it is in fact statistically 'safer' to opt for the outlook of an atheist is also an incorrect assumption. This may be true, however many religions will tell you that it is more forgivable to not believe than it is to believe in a false prophet, so to speak. Hence, it is still 'safer' for be atheist than not.

This mantra is a purely analytical, risk-assessment way of making a 'decision'. There is of course the evidence that each side of the fence attempts to present in terms of biblical accounts and scientific counter-proofs.

Frankly, I choose not to believe in a God(s) heuristically - it is simpler and more acceptable for my way of thinking. Many people I know do not believe in God(s) because the bible and other religious texts did not present a satisfactory element of evidentiary rigour. They didn't lay out a good or convincing enough case for them to accept it.

Another philosophical debate arises from looking at Occam's razor - the simplest explanation is the most likely (one diagnosis is better than 2, etc.). Much of science is based on this. Belief in a God(s) is so often used to account for the phenomena that we see and cannot explain. However, much of what we cannot explain is merely a result of a lack of technology or a lack of actual understanding of the finer processes. What I am saying is that faith in an omnipotent deity capable of the genesis of an entire universe and all that it contains relies on on many more assumptions than if you didn't believe. Similarly, believing that there is an afterlife and that you will go to heaven (or hell) is based on the purely speculative notion that such places exists, whereas the belief that you simply cease to exist is based on observable evidence.

In the end, whether or not you believe in something is not something you can simply decide, in my opinion. No matter what people say to you here, no matter how convincing their arguments, you will always have your prejudice and your own personal bias and it is that, and only that, which will allow you to reach a conclusion. It is about what is acceptable to you and not what is acceptable to strangers on the internet.

reply to post by Brianegan


There is only one truth and two rules.

Love God.
Love your Neighbors (fellow human beings).

Do that and that is all you have to do. Those two things are the full answer. It really is that simple and all this other nonsense is just useless banter.

You Love God and you love all that exists, this planet this universe, everything and you can do it no harm.

You Love your Fellow Man and you can do no harm to any other person.

Simple, isn't it. So simple a child can understand but intelligent adults can not.

reply to post by venusstarlite


First off i'd love to know why this reply was directed at me? I'm anything but lost, im here to help this guy... Notice i don't spit out bible quotes when i type.......i could if i chose to but its pointless and it proves nothing.

Though i appreciate the fact that you believe what your church tells you, preaching it to me is a waste of your time but im sure you don't mind. You religious folk love to preach

you must find a good bible believing church,not afraid of standing up for god,and not ashamed to claim gods glory.be baptist,by water, Jesus gives us the comforter,the holy spirit,he will help you through all times.pray everyday

My friend you would never catch me in a church, God is not in any church, nor is he in your bible...

No stars I'm sorry but im not gonna read your entire post.

I suggest you become agnostic however. That way when people ask you if your athiest you can say no, and when people tell you to put all your faith in god you can say "Sorry, the Patriots play the Colts tomorrow, maybe in a few months"

reply to post by Brianegan


The only "religion" worth fighting for now is the one called HUMANITY where ALL man and woman are equal in the eyes of God or whatever entity you want to create for yourself.

Right now, humanity if fighting for it's right to survive amongst the poisons we are fed, the water we drink, vaccines, banks are looting our money, etc....

so how about you step forth and help make a difference there because the forces against us don't separate us common man and woman from our religious beliefs.

In these days of rising petrol prices, a conversion to ethanol makes good sense.

Seriously, you need to find your own truth. One made to fit the crowd is not true repentance nor is it likely to last.

Ask God (whomever you concieve him/it to be) to help you find clarity and reach a true conclusion.

God does not require or desire religion, but does desire relationship and truth. We are finite and can easily become lost in the noise.

But God said "If you seek me with all your heart, you will find me". Just do so.

There is one thing I don't get. In these types of discussions, Christianity always seems to pop up first in the replies. I was raised in a pretty strict Christian household, so I'm familiar with the bible. I just don't understand why it is toted as the end all and be all truth. What about all the other religions on the planet? All of them are false? I don't get how that can be possible. The Christian God YHWH isn't even the oldest guy on the block. What about ancient Sumerian creation texts? I do not see mention of YHWH anywhere, and they were one of the first to have their ideas down in writing. What about the numerous ancient texts of eastern philosophers?

Many creation texts do have a lot in common, especially when it comes to the flood event, which very likely has a modicum of truth to it. We can also see likenesses in many literary figures, which shared similar qualities, miracles, etc. across different religions. So why are these religions not taken into account? Maybe because the Romans had a hand in making Christianity the most popular? Most of the Christian holidays were adapted from pagan holidays, in order to keep the peace among peoples that the Romans conquered, and they're still around. I just wish everyone that does believe in God(s) could just share that common interest and not squabble over the details. How can it be possible for any one group to truly comprehend all the intricacies of the thought of a creator? There's too much that has spanned over thousands of years for it to be 100% recorded in a way that our modern minds can accept. If any of it is true, we'll know when we die. We do not need to spend our life stressing over something we cannot relate to or comprehend.

Originally posted by cerberus00
There is one thing I don't get. In these types of discussions, Christianity always seems to pop up first in the replies. I was raised in a pretty strict Christian household, so I'm familiar with the bible. I just don't understand why it is toted as the end all and be all truth. What about all the other religions on the planet? All of them are false? I don't get how that can be possible. The Christian God YHWH isn't even the oldest guy on the block. What about ancient Sumerian creation texts? I do not see mention of YHWH anywhere, and they were one of the first to have their ideas down in writing. What about the numerous ancient texts of eastern philosophers?

Many creation texts do have a lot in common, especially when it comes to the flood event, which very likely has a modicum of truth to it. We can also see likenesses in many literary figures, which shared similar qualities, miracles, etc. across different religions. So why are these religions not taken into account? Maybe because the Romans had a hand in making Christianity the most popular? Most of the Christian holidays were adapted from pagan holidays, in order to keep the peace among peoples that the Romans conquered, and they're still around. I just wish everyone that does believe in God(s) could just share that common interest and not squabble over the details. How can it be possible for any one group to truly comprehend all the intricacies of the thought of a creator? There's too much that has spanned over thousands of years for it to be 100% recorded in a way that our modern minds can accept. If any of it is true, we'll know when we die. We do not need to spend our life stressing over something we cannot relate to or comprehend.

haha dude its funny you say this because im agnostic and whenever I meet other agnostic people usually they grew up in very strict Christian households. Their religion is what drove them away from strict organized sects. You make alot of sense. I don't understand why their is organized religion at all. If there is a GOD, let it be personal and private to you and only you. In the meantime, better yourself and help others. When the time comes if there is indeed a heaven the one thing God is gonna look at is the fact you spent your life not judging others and belittleing their beliefs. And if you go to hell for not believing in the right religion, then join the other billions of people who will also be down there and bring some swimming trunks, cause its gonna be hotttt

IF im not from the middle east,why i have to learn this middle east,manmade religions?????.....I will never understand their traditions depicted in a book they call bible,as a matter of fact the way is written sounds like riddles,maybe im the only one saying this,but reminds me of the tale 'The emperor new clothes'....And why christians religions send letters to people asking to donate their 401-k???.....And from what exactly im being saved??????

To all you religious folk around here, I cannot tell you what to believe or what not to believe. If I did that, I would be stooping to your level. I was born Roman Catholic but my eyes were open at a much earlier age than most people. I am not religious! I think this Jesus guy had some powerful messages and we would all do well to follow his teachings. That said: I do not believe that you should be giving money away to the churches (which are the true anti-christ). Those heads of state (Vatican) are the true anti-christs. Please stop enabling them to corrupt and oppress people. Please stop enabling them! I speak to you from the heart.

Anything can be predicted... it's all about how you interpret the predictions. This Nostradamus fellow... is one of two things.
1. Part of the propaganda TPTW put in place, made him popular, published his literature and subsequently planted the 'seed' that they needed to take back power one day when things got to the point when them taking power was once again viable.
2. Some random dude who smoked a lot of pot, had an open mind, was reasonable, rational and logical who simply stated things that would one day happen. You wait long enough anything that can, will happen. Nothing magical here... it is just logical. By 'your' same 'logic', I state that Gene Rodenberry was a true prophet! He predicted cell phones, needle-less injections, space flight, the awakening of people to 'knowledge'. etc. etc. etc. This can be said for many, many of the great sci-fi writers (Big Three at the very least).

Religion is another layer of B.S. I am not religious, i do not believe in any true christ/anti-christ or single omnipotent god. If there were an omnipotent being of such immense power, you can count that it would have a race of similar beings like itself.

I agree that I would rather stay here on earth and face whatever is coming because, quite frankly, looking at who I would be going with into this 'rapture' scares the crap out of me.

I am not religious, I DO, however, believe in higher beings more advanced, powerful and civilized than ourselves.

I would gladly die today if it meant that all the people I know and love (and even those that I do not know) could live in peace and prosperity together, united. How many 'religious' people have stated likewise? I speak from the heart and I am not affraid of ridicule or the 'crazy' stigma.

They have done such a good job at obscuring the truth that even if Jesus did come down, half the people wouldn't believe... the other half would just label him as crazy and slap a white coat on him. I have morals and values comprable to Jesus... you know what that gets me? Funny looks when I speak up for myself or other. Am I Jesus?

OP: Awesome post man... it is really rational and logical the way it is thought out. I'm affraid that people, these days, are not capable of critical thinking anymore. This makes me a sad panda. On the other hand... We have people like Ron Paul and Arthur Keynes, who are the most Jesus-like figures we can hope for in the near future. How serioiusly are they being taken? Hmpf.

reply to post by Brianegan


Hey man that is a very interesting point of virew and I have thought about that myself. Like what if someone came forward and tried to change the world for the better. And they was deemed the anti-christ killed and someone who shouldn't be followed. Does get that power. And the man everyone should be following was slain.

It's what really makes me sit back and think in this world. People are so misguided and confused. I just hope whatever happens ends up working out for OUR betterment. Not some alien wanting to get his jollies off tricking a lesser species.

Originally posted by cerberus00
There is one thing I don't get. In these types of discussions, Christianity always seems to pop up first in the replies. I was raised in a pretty strict Christian household, so I'm familiar with the bible. I just don't understand why it is toted as the end all and be all truth. What about all the other religions on the planet? All of them are false? I don't get how that can be possible. The Christian God YHWH isn't even the oldest guy on the block. What about ancient Sumerian creation texts? I do not see mention of YHWH anywhere, and they were one of the first to have their ideas down in writing. What about the numerous ancient texts of eastern philosophers?

Many creation texts do have a lot in common, especially when it comes to the flood event, which very likely has a modicum of truth to it. We can also see likenesses in many literary figures, which shared similar qualities, miracles, etc. across different religions. So why are these religions not taken into account? Maybe because the Romans had a hand in making Christianity the most popular? Most of the Christian holidays were adapted from pagan holidays, in order to keep the peace among peoples that the Romans conquered, and they're still around. I just wish everyone that does believe in God(s) could just share that common interest and not squabble over the details. How can it be possible for any one group to truly comprehend all the intricacies of the thought of a creator? There's too much that has spanned over thousands of years for it to be 100% recorded in a way that our modern minds can accept. If any of it is true, we'll know when we die. We do not need to spend our life stressing over something we cannot relate to or comprehend.

Realize that every religion is talking about the same God, but there has been a war between beliefs.

"Our God is better then your God, heres our proof"....

Its a pointless arguement but when politics comes into play things get out of control...

I hope one day humanity will realize they're all argueing about the same God....

reply to post by Brianegan


follow your heart, the truth is within you

reply to post by Brianegan

My problem is I don’t know what to believe and I don’t think it’s necessarily fair to be persecuted based on the society that tries to confuse its members at every turn especially when I’m trying as hard as I can to make a decision. I don’t want to run out of time before I feel like I can make the right choice.

Your problem is you believe you have to make a choice, you have to "pick a side". Can't you see it's clear humans don't have the answers to these bigger questions? Why do you think you're so confused? Why do you need someone to convince you, you already know there's no proof, what are you trying to accomplish?

The answer is simple: agnosticism.

reply to post by DeReK DaRkLy


I agree. I think that all paths lead to god, good or bad, EVERYTHING comes from him after all. On the premise that a creator god had a hand in this world, he would save those who believed in him. Possibly because they deserve their reality. Personally, as nice as it would be being whisked up as one of the 'chosen', on my path, i would choose to stay and fight, until death, in this reality for what i believe is right. And that is to fight for this earth to be the heaven we all imagine. How many of us grew up with utopian dreams, wanting a betterment of life for all on this world? Only to be reprimanded by elders and told how illogical and silly such ideas are. Its so hard to put this world of thoughts into words. Brianegan, i hope you will find what you're looking for. I wish you the best on your path. I pray that a forgiving god will accept me as having faith in doubt (lack of certainty) for that is how i've come to live with regards to religion and spirituality. Do you think god would ask forgiveness for creating an imperfect world?

Originally posted by WhizPhiz
reply to post by Brianegan

 

My problem is I don’t know what to believe and I don’t think it’s necessarily fair to be persecuted based on the society that tries to confuse its members at every turn especially when I’m trying as hard as I can to make a decision. I don’t want to run out of time before I feel like I can make the right choice.

Your problem is you believe you have to make a choice, you have to "pick a side". Can't you see it's clear humans don't have the answers to these bigger questions? Why do you think you're so confused? Why do you need someone to convince you, you already know there's no proof, what are you trying to accomplish?

The answer is simple: agnosticism.

This is funny... So what makes agnosticism more true then lets say...orthodox.... Theres another guy on here that argues orthodox means "the true teaching"

What makes it funny is that you had the answer perfectly right...until you threw in that last line

Originally posted by RapturedNotBeamed

Originally posted by Akragon





Just because it was written by men, doesn't mean that it didn't come from God.

I wonder? if a man, that ears god today were to write a book what would be said of
that man. would you follow him, or do you think the only ones who could ear god lived
thousens of years ago?