US forces "mistakenly" kill Afghan president's cousin

US forces "mistakenly" kill Afghan president's cousin

www.monstersandcrit ics.com

Kabul - US special forces killed a cousin of President Hamid Karzai when they stormed a house in southern Afghanistan, a district governor said Thursday.

The troops conducted the raid Wednesday night in Kandahar province's Dand district after arriving by helicopter, Governor Hamdullah Nazek said.

'Haji Yar Mohammad Khan was martyred in the operation,' said Nazek, who declined to provide further details. 'We are investigating the incident now.'

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Last week, the president rejected an apology from US General David Petraeus, the top commander of the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force (ISAF) as well as US troops in Afghanistan, after ISAF troops killed nine children in eastern Afghanistan in an airstrike.

The president said that such apologies were 'not enough' and 'no longer acceptable.'

This could spell disaster for the war in Afghanistan! Gen. Petraeus apologized last week for killing civilians and now this! Since the apology was rejected, what happens now? Could this be a tipping point to where Afghanistan pushes the US from their borders or will it just keep going?

All the US is doing there right now is pissing off the Afghan government. How much more can they take?

www.monstersandcrit ics.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by ugie1028


When will it be learned by the military of the world, that collateral damage is not acceptable? Who has to die, and how before this pathetic terminology is eradicated, and the techniques of modern warfare made proof against accident and mistake?
Taking frag grenades instead of stun grenades to hostage rescues, airstriking children, killing photographers from a chopper, wiping out the relatives of dignataries who have put up with foriegn presences on thier turf, and not a single sign of anything deeper than apologies. This is a damned disgrace! How can a military outfit consider itself fit for duty unless it can pick its targets perfectly every time?
This is the 21st centuary, not the godamned dark ages, and with that in mind, it is an absolutely unjustifiable situation. We have satelites which can focus down to the square yard, we have scopes that can positively identify a target, and allow its elimination from a mile and a half away, thermal imaging and night vision scopes that are the pinnacle of modern war science, and for what? For a bunch of bloody idiots to make all of that effort and advancement worthless by being to lazy to ascertain the truth of a situation.
All our tech means nothing, unless the intent behind its use is pure, precise, surgical, and utterly accurate, reflecting the accuracy and mastery of technology that wartech represents. Simply put, until the people carrying the tech are as perfect in thier duty, as the technology they use, not a single soldier should be put to war, nor a single chopper lofted, nor a single warhead deployed from range.

Originally posted by ugie1028

Could this be a tipping point to where Afghanistan pushes the US from their borders or will it just keep going?

All the US is doing there right now is pissing off the Afghan government. How much more can they take?

www.monstersandcrit ics.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

edit on 3/10/2011 by ugie1028 because: (no reason given)

With any luck, yes, it's the tipping point!
Vicky

reply to post by Vicky32


Luck will show itself when they do an investigation. If its found that this was a mistake and due to poor intelligence, then maybe it will be a tipping point. If not then... it wont be.

Originally posted by TrueBrit
reply to post by ugie1028

 

When will it be learned by the military of the world, that collateral damage is not acceptable? Who has to die, and how before this pathetic terminology is eradicated, and the techniques of modern warfare made proof against accident and mistake?
Taking frag grenades instead of stun grenades to hostage rescues, airstriking children, killing photographers from a chopper, wiping out the relatives of dignataries who have put up with foriegn presences on thier turf, and not a single sign of anything deeper than apologies. This is a damned disgrace! How can a military outfit consider itself fit for duty unless it can pick its targets perfectly every time?
This is the 21st centuary, not the godamned dark ages, and with that in mind, it is an absolutely unjustifiable situation. We have satelites which can focus down to the square yard, we have scopes that can positively identify a target, and allow its elimination from a mile and a half away, thermal imaging and night vision scopes that are the pinnacle of modern war science, and for what? For a bunch of bloody idiots to make all of that effort and advancement worthless by being to lazy to ascertain the truth of a situation.
All our tech means nothing, unless the intent behind its use is pure, precise, surgical, and utterly accurate, reflecting the accuracy and mastery of technology that wartech represents. Simply put, until the people carrying the tech are as perfect in thier duty, as the technology they use, not a single soldier should be put to war, nor a single chopper lofted, nor a single warhead deployed from range.

You have a life time to pick apart what that team did. Any one in the military knows that. That team did what it thought was right, Will we find out what happened? Sure will the military be justified? who knows! you act like doing a raid takes hours instead of seconds.

Most of the tech you speak of is still new and still being learned by soldiers. Even when we master it there will still be F.N.G's to teach mistakes will always happen and collateral damage will always be a part of war in some small way to varying degrees.

It's what the soldiers and their commanders learn from these Trails that we will come out a stronger more capable battle force.

Now on to what I think!

Who the hell cares about that Crooks cousin got nailed, the whole government is corrupt if the military didn't have its hands tide behind its back baby sitting poppy fields and protecting opium routes which is the main income for that country.

not to mention the main income for the C.I.A than we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place. We do need out of that country Hopefully it is the tipping point. When we pull out I hope the military burns every Opium farmer their crops and all storing areas on their way out.

-As Above
-So Below

Reaper

BBC just confirmed it

BBC

Nato 'kills cousin of Afghan President Hamid Karzai'

The cousin of Afghan President Hamid Karzai has been mistakenly killed by Nato troops in southern Afghanistan, officials say.

Yar Muhammad Khan was at his home in Dand district near Kandahar city when he was shot dead in an overnight raid.

Nato says they are investigating the incident.

Hundreds of Afghans took to the streets of the capital Kabul last week to protest about civilian deaths at the hands of foreign forces.

Poor Karzai made a deal with the Devil and now is finding out the hard way what puppet dictators the world over do.

He who controls the strings takes a deadly and deadlier toll.

He might have paid better attention what happened to the President of Afghanistan the Soviets installed, and thought about just what is going to happen to him, when America withdraws and there is no longer a fortified propped up "Green Zone" (money, money money) to protect him.

I don't know who Karzai is fooling, he and his drug smuggling, wheeling dealing family have as much blood on their hands as the Coallition of the Deadly's Forces do.

You know Ahmad Shah Massoud the former Northern Alliance Commander who refused to get in bed with the CIA assissinated two days before September 11, 2001 by assailants posing as a TV reporter and Camerman had the Taliban on the down swing and would have likely had them completely out of Afghanistan in other year or two between his military offensive and the Taliban's own harsh religious laws.

About the only thing that could make the Taliban look great is the one thing that is doing it, the U.S. Military's murderous excesses.

Nightime, helicopter, raid on his home? I know I will get "flack" for this, but was this guy strung out so bad on heroin that he did not here the 'copter? IDK but it seems that it would be hard to "covertly" raid anything with a loud helicopter...at night. Again, something smells funny (to me).

Originally posted by Reaper2137
You have a life time to pick apart what that team did.

Sure I do, but the problem at hand, is that the victims do not have that luxury, because thier bullet drilled corpses cannot point accusing fingers of their own accord.

Any one in the military knows that. That team did what it thought was right,

The problem with that is, that they thought horrificaly wrong, because they didnt do enough work to ensure thier assumptions were correct.

Will we find out what happened? Sure

We will only find out ANYTHING about this incident, after it has been scoured of any evidence of wrong doing, and evidenciary markers put in place (falsified i.e.) that suggest reasonable grounds for this otherwise inexcusable incident.

will the military be justified? who knows! you act like doing a raid takes hours instead of seconds.

I am under no false impressions about the amount of time these things take to happen. It takes mere seconds to go off half cocked, like a bunch of gung ho idiots, without doing the barest minimum of actual recon. That in of its self IS the problem. "Special forces" are supposed to be better than that, we all know this. If it were any other way, they would merely be called "forces". These folks are supposed to be nigh on unkillable, and capable of inhuman speed of reaction, accuracy , and intelligence under fire. In short, this incident, and the others I have mentioned, which involved special forces personel should NEVER have gone down the way they did.

Most of the tech you speak of is still new and still being learned by soldiers. Even when we master it there will still be F.N.G's to teach mistakes will always happen and collateral damage will always be a part of war in some small way to varying degrees.

I have to disagree here. Night vision is in current terms, a true old timer. Its been around for about two decades now at least. Thermal assisted vision is pretty much the same basic trick as night vision, requiring no intense training to master. This argument is empty of all value. You would literaly have to be a drooling moron not to understand the functions of the military thermal and night vision equipment available today.
And regards F.N.G. 's there is no escape from the truth here. If the US government cannot train its troops to use all the equipment they will come into contact with, BEFORE they leave the US, then they have no business feilding a damned army in the first place. There is not the space in the world for a bunch of undertrained boys , charging around with extremely powerful military hardware.
The key thing here is that the US government has a responsibility to train its soldiers effectively so that they are not only a competent and dangerous force of men, but so that they do not pose a threat to thier allies and to innocent people. Calling deaths caused by mistaken discharge of a weapon, or mistakes in targeting ,collateral damage, is just a pretty way of saying " Sorry, we are a group of people who do not care enough about innocent non combatant targets to bother thinking before shooting. We care about our lives, more than yours, and we dont care what you think about that." which makes the US military great targets.
Keeping collateral damage down to one life a year might give your idiots , Im sorry, special forces, a little more credibility.

It's what the soldiers and their commanders learn from these Trails that we will come out a stronger more capable battle force.

This planet, is not a training ground, its people are not obstructions on a mock battlefeild, nor paper targets on a firing range. To give a god damn what benifits the commanders and the men get from such a "learning expirience" shows exactly how arrogant the attitude of US citizens toward the mistakes of thier military is. The US military must learn that this planet is not its backyard, is not its territory, and further, that if there is learning to do , it should be done at home in the safe confines of thier own nation, where the only people they can hurt actualy have RIGHTS according to US law. Maybe then they will learn when to shoot and when not to, and how to shoot STRAIGHT!

Now on to what I think!

Who the hell cares about that Crooks cousin got nailed, the whole government is corrupt if the military didn't have its hands tide behind its back baby sitting poppy fields and protecting opium routes which is the main income for that country.

First things first, this scentence is lacking an end, a punchline, a meaning. It doesnt MATTER how much of the GDP of a nation is based on poppy farming. What matters is what the majority of PEOPLE in the region do for work, and I can assure you that many more people are being payed pennies a day to make rugs, to sell matches, to farm FOOD and look after animals, than are actualy employed in poppy growth or harvest. Sure, the harvests may bring in more money than all the regular peoples employment pooled together, but that doesnt mean that everyone in the government is corrupt. Its not as if the Afghan government sponsor poppy growth. Thats the job of the CIA. Not giving a crap that special forces are incapable of limiting the outworking of thier homicidal tendancies to the terrorists they are supposed to be killing, cannot be excused by what the GDP figures of the nation they are operating in happen to be.

not to mention the main income for the C.I.A than we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place. We do need out of that country Hopefully it is the tipping point. When we pull out I hope the military burns every Opium farmer their crops and all storing areas on their way out.

-As Above
-So Below

Reaper

On that last point at least, we can agree.

lol,

that sucks.

he was the drug dealer?

are we getting smarter about this war?

sounds like a loud and clear message to me.

This is just crazy .. how can the US just go around killing so many civilians and innocent children and women .. I can not believe I am paying taxes to support this murderous system ..
As a citizen of America .. there is no doubt blood is on my hands for paying for such killings ..

Everything is ok as long as it's other peoples' families far away .. so far away that even the news channels are told not to show the truth ... just wait till they start doing that to us here in the US .. then we will realize what it feels like ... one minute you're drinking tea in your house ... next min .. some strangers storm in and kill half your family in front of you while humiliating and degrading them before they are killed ...
What goes around comes around .. it may take some time .. but it's coming .. God knows how many more terrorists we have created around the globe with our senseless killing of peoples' innocent family members ..

Originally posted by flashcube
Nightime, helicopter, raid on his home? I know I will get "flack" for this, but was this guy strung out so bad on heroin that he did not here the 'copter? IDK but it seems that it would be hard to "covertly" raid anything with a loud helicopter...at night. Again, something smells funny (to me).

Originally posted by fooks
lol,

that sucks.

he was the drug dealer?

are we getting smarter about this war?

sounds like a loud and clear message to me.

Did I miss something? Where did it say he was a drug user or dealer? I've seen a few threads that say Karzai hates our raids which he claims is because of violations of Afghan sovereignty, but I don't see anything here alleging that against Karzai's cousin.

This should really get Karzai on our good side, because he was so fond of us already (/sarcasm)

reply to post by ugie1028

I just hope its not the Taliban or Pakistan's ISI who probably did the job and playing the game by using US and NATO.

Wow some of you are acting the the U.S. just sent in the SS to rape and kill all living things. Name 1 war where civilian casualties did not take place......................you can't. Personally I'd rather 100 afghans die than 1 U.S. soldier, it's not like anybody from that country has EVER contributed anything to mankind. This was a message to the Afghan president to play ball or meet the same fate.

i like how the afghani's think they have any sovereignty or control over their country. i guess they didn't get the puppet's guide to government.

Originally posted by flashcube
Nightime, helicopter, raid on his home? I know I will get "flack" for this, but was this guy strung out so bad on heroin that he did not here the 'copter? IDK but it seems that it would be hard to "covertly" raid anything with a loud helicopter...at night. Again, something smells funny (to me).

One flip of a switch and you will never hear them coming. Besides they will not land that close.

Apart for giving some drug traffickers and murders a job I do not see any valid reason for America to be in Afghanistan. Kill a bunch of school kids, sorry, take some towns of the map, sorry, no real plan just perpetual war, sorry, 9/11 was an inside job, sorry, well they have not actually apologised for that last one yet so they still meant it. With many the other nations having rallies to get rid of their corrupt leaders I wish the Afghanistan luck with their evil infliction.

Sounds like the Afghan president himself is next in line to be "mistakenly" killed.

What kind of world is this when even your puppets oppose you?

I don't think it was a mistake.........
When I was there we knew where all relatives were.....