It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Not Guilty. The Israeli Captain who Emptied his Rifle into a Palestinian Schoolgirl

page: 1
7

log in

join
share:

posted on Mar, 9 2011 @ 11:42 PM
link   
philosophers-stone.co.uk...

The child was only 13 years old when murdered by Captain R. They don't give his real name to avoid the furure trials which will hopfully come. When the story originally broke about a year ago I created a thread about it. All the Israeli apologists will now come out of the woodwork to defend the killing as necessary because she MIGHT have been carring a bom, although it was obvious to all except Capt. R that she was just a frightened school girl. NOW, reverse this. Had this been an Israeli school girl killed by a Palestinian what do you think the verdict would be? One might think this is an isolated event but in fact this happens (the killing of innocents) often.




posted on Mar, 9 2011 @ 11:45 PM
link   
reply to post by gem_man
 


the killing of any child is an abomination.
even if she had a bomb, can't people be wounded anymore like being shot in the leg to slow them down



posted on Mar, 9 2011 @ 11:48 PM
link   
Well, under Israeli law, you can only commit murder against humans; a category that in Israel, most definitely excludes Arabs, much less Palestinian Arabs. He's more likely to face charges for unlicensed animal slaughter than murder in that country.
edit on 9/3/2011 by TheWalkingFox because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 12:00 AM
link   
The sad thing is, that this is only a small portion of the genocidethat has been commited againt the palestinians, especially since 1967. How can a decent moral human beign have the animosity to kill a child. You are killing someones daughter, you are killing someones sister. If, "as they say they" have been prosecuted and murdered since the dawn of time, then why be a hypocrite and do it your self. Peace and Love, Tolerance and Understanding is obviously somthing many people on this globe don't understand.



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 12:33 AM
link   
But Defence Minister Barak says the IDF is the most MORAL in the world:

www.ynetnews.com...

A British army officer says likewise; so it must be true?

vladtepesblog.com...

and of course no Palestinian was intentionally targeted for his/her organs?

www.prisonplanet.com...

www.wrmea.com...

or how about the sale of Palestinian body parts...including those of Rachel Corrie's found to be missing by her family upon arrival back to Britain...

webcache.googleusercontent.com...:SRU-kK_sJAgJ:jfjfp.com/%3Fp%3D17312+organs+found+missing+in+dead+foreign+activists+in+palestine&c d=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=au&source=www.google.com.au


The search is now on for the most moral military in the world! Any takers?



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 12:46 AM
link   
Armies all over the world can claim morality and insist that their soldiers follow a strict code of ethics.
Damn, ou code of ethics in the British Military are some of the higest in the world.
However, not withstanding that, a war zone brings out the very worst in humanity. Some of the best trained soldiers, who behave like the perfect gentleman at home, become like rabid animals in theatre. The kill indiscriminately and murder inocent people without a second thought.

War is absolute hell and humans are the perfect devil to be placed in that hell.
I am ex-military, I have seen my share, but for God's sake, enough. Let's have an end to hatred.
Let people die in peace, with their loved ones. All it takes is the soldiers to face each other and say "NO" I don't want to kill any more.

Sorry, very tired and I am probably ranting. I just want people to love each other. Life is the most precious thing. More valuable than gold or any diamond.



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 07:02 AM
link   
I guess a good lawyer can get you out of anything, even if it's murder. Immoral? Hell yeah. Exclusive to Israel? Hardly. I am personally infuriated and saddened by this whole thing, as many Israelis were when this story came out six years ago.. I mean, the simple fact that his own soldiers voluntarily testified against him shows that they all agree what he did was wrong.

But I guess that wouldn't matter to the biased and the racist amongst us, and this thread will quickly be filled the usual anti Israeli racist offensive slur, as is often the case with these kinds of threads.
Thanks Gem_Man
.

So while we're taking a ride on the "racist train", here's a little tidbit of information for you guys, oddly missing from the blogs, but still found (hardly mentioned) in the original article in guardian-

Capt R claimed that the soldiers under his command were out to get him because they are Jewish and he is Druze.


Captain R is an Arab.

Oh, those murderous Arabs! Those murderous, evil Arabs! Lucky there were some Jewish soldiers in that outpost to testify against this guy....

Right?



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 02:53 PM
link   
reply to post by Eliad
Funny
You're the first one to bring up racism. Every one else was writing about the IDF and its policies.

Druze In Israel
In Israel, the majority of the approximately 102,000 Druze (not including 20,000 more in Golan heights) consider themselves a distinct religious group.[40] Since 1957, the Israeli government has also designated the Druze a distinct ethnic community, at the request of the community's leaders.

The Druze culture is Arab and their language Arabic, but they opted against mainstream Arab nationalism in 1948 and have since served (first as volunteers, later within the draft system) in the Israel Defense Forces and the Border Police. They are located in the north of the country, mainly on hilltops; historically as a defense against attack and persecution,[41] which they were subject to historically from the Arab-Muslims.[42] The Druze mostly do not identify with the cause of Arab nationalism.

Back to the case:

Promotion
Subsequent to his acquittal, Captain R., was promoted to the rank of major.[21][22] In March 2006, he received 82,000 New Israel Shekels (roughly $17,000) to compensate him for his defense expenditures and time spent in jail.[23] Captain R. also filed a libel suit against Dayan and Channel 2.

From what I gather, he was never charged with any crime like murder, but for violating rules of engagement by closely approaching the girl, Iman Darweesh Al Hams (age 13) in order to "confirm the kill". Such action would expose the IDF member rather than leaving him safely protected from the possible hostile actions of the girl, Iman Darweesh Al Hams (age 13).
edit on 10-3-2011 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 11 2011 @ 09:29 AM
link   
reply to post by pthena
 


Oh, well, I guess if I'm the only one to point out racism then I must be wrong, right?

I'm glad you find it amusing, I don't. People rail up as if this sort of thing can only happen in Israel, as if Israelis are a bunch of murderous animals, as if Israelis have lower moral standards, when the fact is these sort of things happen everywhere- Every battle field, every legal system, everywhere. Even yours.

But no, Israelis are inherently evil, they treat Arabs as sub humans, and are trying to preform a genocide of the Palestinians just because some asshole somehow deemed it necessary to fire off an entire magazine into a little girl's head.

That's either ignorance or racism, whether they realize it or not, no matter what spin you put on it, and it just makes me sick.

The fact that the Israeli Druze are loyal to Israel doesn't make them any different from Arabs in terms of culture, traditions, way of life, etc.

I'm not surprised everyone else just shut up when it turned out the shooter's an Arab, bunch of hypocrites.

Back to the case:
It's infuriating to see that this guy gets to walk *and* gets compensated. I don't know the details of the trials, but it's obvious something went wrong there, but who do you blame? The investigative team? The Judge? The entire Israeli legal system? The entire Israeli people?

IDF examination reveals failures in probe of Palestinian girl's death in 2004

Court: Iman al-Hams death may have been prevented

Most people would rather just blame the entire Israeli legal system for the misconduct of a few bad or corrupt low ranking investigators, as long as it fits their narrative best, any other information is either downplayed or ignored.



posted on Mar, 12 2011 @ 02:28 AM
link   
reply to post by Eliad


I'm glad you find it amusing, I don't. People rail up as if this sort of thing can only happen in Israel, as if Israelis are a bunch of murderous animals, as if Israelis have lower moral standards, when the fact is these sort of things happen everywhere- Every battle field, every legal system, everywhere. Even yours.

No, I don't find racism amusing. I remember the Detroit riot of 1967, and how in every city or amusement park I ever went to, not many, I saw cops on roofs with shotguns, like the whole country was a potential battle field. It wasn't too many years earlier that racism was actually state sanctioned and respectable.

As for American battle fields, they've always managed to be in some one else's land since the civil war of 1865 or there abouts. I'm not blind to how many Afghans and Pakistanis and Yemenis and Iraqis are being killed, mostly civilians.

As for court decisions: There have only been a couple of decent Supreme Court decisions made in the last 12 years, and those were subsequently ignored. All the rest have been garbage.

I've been asked before why I focus so much attention on what happens in Palestine by Israelis. I already take it for granted that TPTB have made real democracy an impossibility in my country. When it comes to legislation: Corporate CEOs have a seat at the table in front of millions of the people. The Council of Bishops of the Vatican(a foreign sovereign state) has a seat at the table before any millions of the people. AIPAC (unregistered foreign agent for Israel and all the President's advisors) has a seat at the table before any millions of the people.

Without a well informed populace even democracy descends into tyranny. Schools are being gutted. What we have is brain washing by religious leaders, teaching American Exceptionalism as a matter of faith. 45% of Christians in the country are Fundamentalist Zionists, taught to support Israel as a matter of faith. No need for these respective countries to try acting moral when whatever acts they commit are a priori ( prior knowledge or justification independent of objective data) accepted as just.

Try doing a google search for " the security of Israel is sacrosanct ", you will be astonished at how frequently American politicians and Presidential cabinet members say it. Do they know what that means even? Sacrosanct means so holy that to critically question it is to be impious, to touch it is to die.

Be impious then, question the a priori, that's what data from these news items encourages people to do. Faith without works is dead, and kills.
edit on 12-3-2011 by pthena because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 15 2011 @ 09:18 AM
link   
reply to post by Eliad
 


Who cares if he was an Arab. He is an IDF soldier that murdered a little girl an recieved zero punishment. Why is it that everytime a thread is created critizing the Israeli government , Israeli posters assume it is an attack on the Jewish religion? This has to do with wrongful death NOT religion.



posted on Mar, 15 2011 @ 10:12 PM
link   
reply to post by gem_man
 


Oh, I'm sorry, perhaps I should highlight for you some of the comments in this thread-



Well, under Israeli law, you can only commit murder against humans; a category that in Israel, most definitely excludes Arabs, much less Palestinian Arabs. He's more likely to face charges for unlicensed animal slaughter than murder in that country.




If, "as they say they" have been prosecuted and murdered since the dawn of time, then why be a hypocrite and do it your self.


Don't you see? When you show something like this people don't see a murderer, they see a racist Israeli scumbag who, like all other Israelis, and the army they serve in, exists only to further the genocide of the Palestinian people.

Instead of recognizing the fact that this happens in every army, in every battle field, and in every legal system.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 06:51 AM
link   

Originally posted by Eliad
reply to post by gem_man
 


Oh, I'm sorry, perhaps I should highlight for you some of the comments in this thread-



Well, under Israeli law, you can only commit murder against humans; a category that in Israel, most definitely excludes Arabs, much less Palestinian Arabs. He's more likely to face charges for unlicensed animal slaughter than murder in that country.


Don't you see? When you show something like this people don't see a murderer, they see a racist Israeli scumbag who, like all other Israelis, and the army they serve in, exists only to further the genocide of the Palestinian people.


Oh, I see a murderer. I also see a system that is designed to give him a free pass when he kills people of a certain ethnic group, no matter how blatant it is.The problem is the system that says "You can pump a little girl full of lead, so long as she is arabushim."

Had he been a Muslim, and not a Jew, would he have been acquitted? Had it been a 13 year old Israeli Jewish girl, would he have been acquitted? Hell, would he have made it to court in that case?


Instead of recognizing the fact that this happens in every army, in every battle field, and in every legal system.


And it should never be tolerated. He gunned down a little girl, bragged about it, said he was proud to do it, and the courts found him innocent. And here you are, acting as though this is not only perfectly acceptable, but is even admirable - because to do less than admire it is of course, anti-Israel.

Do you think that whoever killed those five colonists will get an acquittal? If, by some crazy farce that does happen, will you be first in line to wave it off and say "Oh, that happens in every legal system, no reason to even mention it?"
edit on 16/3/2011 by TheWalkingFox because: (no reason given)

edit on 16/3/2011 by TheWalkingFox because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 06:58 AM
link   
This will only fuel the other side. People need to wake up and realize that this affair has been going on for thousands of years. Best not to get involved.



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 12:56 PM
link   
reply to post by TheWalkingFox
 


The system does not give him a free pass! It's a military! You give a boy a gun, and put him in a situation where he either has to use it or die, and then you expect to try him as if he was just an ordinary citizen out to kill someone? Nowhere in the world do soldiers get tried the same way as civilians do.

I think I said it best one or two posts ago-

Originally posted by Eliad
reply to post by pthena
 


It's infuriating to see that this guy gets to walk *and* gets compensated. I don't know the details of the trials, but it's obvious something went wrong there, but who do you blame? The investigative team? The Judge? The entire Israeli legal system? The entire Israeli people?

IDF examination reveals failures in probe of Palestinian girl's death in 2004

Court: Iman al-Hams death may have been prevented

Most people would rather just blame the entire Israeli legal system for the misconduct of a few bad or corrupt low ranking investigators, as long as it fits their narrative best, any other information is either downplayed or ignored.


Problem is you guys never hear of the soldiers who go to jail for misconduct, or misuse of their weapon, or you do and you're outraged by the verdict being too easy.. Do you remember how you were like when you were 18? Did you make any mistakes? You're forgetting these are children.



Had he been a Muslim, and not a Jew, would he have been acquitted?


You've got it all wrong, friend, the shooter was an Arab soldier, and it was the Jewish soldiers that testified against him.



Had it been a 13 year old Israeli Jewish girl, would he have been acquitted?

No, there would have been an outrage.



And it should never be tolerated

Yes, but why is Israel singled out? Why not the American legal system, where I'm sure many murderers get off the hook each year? Why not other armies? Why does a single blunder of the legal system and the IDF have to mean that the entire system is corrupt?

Why can't we put things in proportion? The same proportion we use when we judge other armies and legal systems?



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 01:03 PM
link   

Originally posted by Eliad

The system does not give him a free pass! It's a military! You give a boy a gun, and put him in a situation where he either has to use it or die, and then you expect to try him as if he was just an ordinary citizen out to kill someone? Nowhere in the world do soldiers get tried the same way as civilians do.


Oh, he's a soldier, conditioned to kill or be killed? Well, that makes it all okey dokey then... doesn't it?

This was an unarmed, scared little girl, who posed no threat and had already been shot and injured before this sick piece of crap emptied his gun into her. There is no justification for this, no matter how you try to spin it. Murder is murder...full stop!



posted on Mar, 16 2011 @ 01:57 PM
link   
reply to post by Britguy
 


Oh, I'm not making excuses for this guy, he should rot in jail, I'm talking about the system itself.

And I'm not saying these people are conditioned to kill or be killed, I'm saying they're specifically put in danger zone with a gun in order to defend their fellow citizens, and there's just no way to judge them with the same severity you do a person that actively makes the effort to obtain a weapon and seek out a target.

That being said, I really don't get how this guy wasn't charged and convicted with murder.



posted on Mar, 19 2011 @ 07:24 AM
link   
reply to post by Eliad
 


Of course your're right Eliad. These threads often attract posters that look for an opportunity to advance their agenda of hate. That said, I feel a strong sense of commitment to address wrongdoing by the IDF because I believe it happens far more often then what normally occurs in any other defense force. I also post about the violent actions by the settlers . I will continue to do so.



new topics

top topics



 
7

log in

join