How to protect yourself when SHTF in UK/country where guns are banned?

Originally posted by clintdelicious
reply to post by blaenau2000

 

You would never kill a person? Even if they were in the process of attempting to murder your family? If someone tried to take your life you have every right to kill them or if they are trying to kill anyone else for that matter. If everyone was passive against violence then the world would be great, but it just takes one violent person then to dominate everyone

I see where youre coming from, and in that situation I agree I would instinctivly protect, but then violence will never win either, it is a very difficult situation to imagine, and one would hope never to be in that position, but I have always been very spiritual in nature and believe love, warmth and knowlage will win me my wars, more so than a bullet. But in an attempt to murder my family then yes i would kill i believe, The beast inside would take over then so i take back what I said.

Originally posted by minkey53

Originally posted by mr-lizard
Why would anybody want a gun, unless you're planning on killing someone. This isn't Texas. This is the UK.

I'd much rather have a bicycle than a gun.

How do you protect yourself when TSHTF with a pushbike??

You could get on yer bike and ride away into the sunset leaving all the zombies behind...

or you can hit people with it

I also know where a armory is i also have a 'Back Up Box' in my room under my bed! its got a survival knife in, air pistol (g2005) bbs, also got a katana on my wall...ive also heard on the grapevine you can pick up a AK47 in Hull for 50 quid! (prob not true but thats how the rumor goes)


One of my friends has thought to much into a zombie attack an is going to use my house as base! but at least will be safe if the SHTF!

i also play to much COD so my ideals would be a Spas12 with dragons breath rounds, and also either a SA80 with susat or lsw! if i could get my hands on the latter two weapons i would be a happy bunny! as i know how to handle them any questions about them ill do my best to answer them

reply to post by chaztekno


If you want cheap and ok then get a barska, tasco, nc star or aimpoint optics.

Im from the uk too mate but i moved to peru years ago. it's pretty wild out here and without incriminating myself, let's just say I'm not unarmed and i never felt so safe. I often wonder about this topic, lawlessness in the uk, and all i can say to you is weapons come in all shapes and sizes, and the best ones aren't always the most obvious.

a guy i know in northern england has the following home defence:

5 Akitas in remotely opened pens in his garden. 4 bitches and one stud dog (who is extremely territorial and protective towards his women and owner. the front and back garden are all one area and his house is a semi-detached, surrounded by 6 foot high walls. all the doors to his pens open either at the click of a keyfob he has on him at all times, or by activation of the security light. the only way to his front or back door is to enter that area, and if it's nighttime and the security light gets activated, you're pretty much dead. even if (say) a gang of armed wrong uns got into that property, they would need to headshot 5 dogs in a matter of seconds to get to my mate, who has on the walls of his kitchen such things as medieval maces, double-headed axes samurai swords, 180lb pull crossbows etc. on that note: there's a local bylaw loophole which means that it's ok to own an offensive and dangerous weapon if its mounted on an interior wall. Classed as 'ornamental' then, wink wink

just cos owning an illegal gun in britain means a minimum of 5 years in jail, doesnt mean theyre the best weapons to have.

Originally posted by minkey53

Originally posted by mr-lizard
Why would anybody want a gun, unless you're planning on killing someone. This isn't Texas. This is the UK.

I'd much rather have a bicycle than a gun.

How do you protect yourself when TSHTF with a pushbike??

By not being anywhere near the fan or the other.

First thing I was ever taught in self defence. Avoid trouble. Avoid dodgy areas and your first option should always be too flee. Which... If the proverbial hits the proverbial. I intend to just ride away and find a quiet place. Let it all blow over. No need for violence or trouble.

Besides, i'm less likely to be hassled if i've got a bike chain in my hand.

ESPECIALLY if according to this thread - there's gonna be a lot of weapon carrying people.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


As a fellow Brightonian I can vouch for the number of arms, however I confess I have only seen them in the form of Nerf guns from the local toy shop, my son made me buy him one the other day, so here's hoping we now have it covered

Although something tells me darling daughter's vocal capacity could well be a more effective weapon

reply to post by mr-lizard


I tend to lean towards the notion that any kind of situation would most probably end up with us breaking down into smaller communties.. street by street we'll join together to protect each other and share what little we have as evidenced in places like Chille quake.. some morons will go feral (as they are now) but I think most people will take the route of joining together and protecting each other rather than outcomes found in books like "the road"

I was being truthfull about the boat, that is my plan (excepting situations involving tidal waves then I'll be kissing my rear goodbye) got an eye on an older catamaran (more room and stable) and I posted reciepes earlier on how to cook Seagulls (tho illegal) is always helpful to know since they are widly available and have lots of meat, but need boiling (this is from some of the older fishermen I know who used to get bored of just eating fish)

A little bit of distance by water could always be a helpful option to have.. just in case.

Originally posted by solargeddon
reply to post by thoughtsfull

 

As a fellow Brightonian I can vouch for the number of arms, however I confess I have only seen them in the form of Nerf guns from the local toy shop, my son made me buy him one the other day, so here's hoping we now have it covered

Although something tells me darling daughter's vocal capacity could well be a more effective weapon

I was thinking of the nutters in Lewes and the other bonfire societies..
have you seen the things they carry!
Shakes head...
not to mention probably having the global supply of black powder at their disposal

Just do what you do when you are anywhere the SHTF and you don't have a gun - wait for the USA to come sell you one

Originally posted by blaenau2000
If the SHTF last thing i would want is a gun, I would escape to the mountains and hide.
If you are carrying a gun and are confronted with someone also with a gun you will be shot at, ill take my chances without one thanks.

Guns are for cowards.

Guns being for cowards is nothing but indoctrination by a pro-establishment and pro-fascist media.

Some of the toughest most honest people you'll ever meet carry guns. I'm sure farmers would love to be as tough as the rest of the office working sorry excuse for men in this country.

What's cowardly about a weapon? It's cowardly to run around shooting people for no reason, but nobody is talking about that.

Why don't you try thinking for yourself instead of letting the government do the thinking for you. Most people with guns use them for hunting. And in a SHTF scenario you'll be one of the first lying in your own blood, I assure you. You'll be begging armed civilians to save you, this I guarantee.

Something we do in the US that might be helpful to you with or without crisis is "crime watch" neighborhood organizations. Neighbors get together for meetings with local law enforcement representatives and they talk about what is going on and agree to help one another and to call the cops when they see a crime or gangs of troublemakers wandering around the hood. The cops agree to respond and the neighbors agree to help identify and prosecute the bad guys. We all walk away with a better relationship with the cops and with one another and a better understanding of what crime is happening in the neighborhood and who the bad guys are. Knowing this helps everyone know what to watch for. We have a phone tree to call each other when something dangerous or destructive is in process. We are prepared with plans within this group for more advanced plans of self defense if the shtf.

Since we are armed, and have the ability to overcome the power of criminals who break into our houses or attack us, some members of our crime watch groups goes to the shooting range together and takes classes. Since you don't have that freedom to defend yourself with overwhelming force, I suggest you come up with a group coordinated neighborhood strategy. Make an agreement to respond as a group to aggressors while waiting for the cops to respond. When people don't roll over for criminals, the criminals/bullies move on to other lower fruit on the tree. You do have weapons available - baseball bats, knives, axes, hammers, etc.

You all have to get laws passed that protect citizens who act with violence in self defense when dealing with aggressive criminals. Until you get the right to self defense, you will have to do a version of "shoot shovel and shut-up." Americans do this when protected wild animals are preying on the neighborhood. They shoot the predator, bury it and shut up about it. So you guys might have to adopt that strategy if you don't have legal protection in self defense. It would be more like meeting the thugs with organized and more scarey thugery. For vandalism and harassment by teen thugs, for example, your crime watch group would agree to go out and without words and dressed like an anarchist, smash the problem and then run off and no one would see anything. Play Robinhood. Make the bullying and thugery against the innocent costly. What choice is our government giving you when being total unprepared victims of theivery, rape and violence is unacceptable? That goes for crime on the streets and subways, too. The good guys have to stop being observers and start protecting the victims and hurting the bad guys. Make your hit and disapear before the cops come if you don't have the right to defense of yourself and other victims. Learn to do it then train others.

A long time ago when random violent crime first took off in the 60's Americans did not know how to deal with it. They called the police and did not get aggressive with self defense as advised by law enforcement. Americans were told not to resist so no one would get hurt. In other words, we were told to be helpless victims of crime. That went on until the seventies and they like the 100th monkey, by the 80's Americans had enough and the criminals and the criminal loving politicans became the endangered ones.

We organized for new laws protecting citizens and taking criminals off the streets (which is why we have so many street thugs in prisons). No more politically correct race baiting and sob stories that had kept criminals free to harm more Americans. The victims are the ones who deserve society's sympathy not the thugs! We got laws passed to protect people from charges when we defend ourselves. We also have the power of jury nullification and it is real hard for a prosecutor to get a jury of Americans to find anyone guilty when violence happens in response to crime, no matter the law. Unfortunately, you don't have citizen juries.

So...get busy learning, discussing, organizing and turning the tables on the criminal loving politicians and criminals and aggressors BEFORE the shtf! Organize your neighborhood to meet with each other and the cops and practice on the idiots you are dealing with now. Contact an American neighborhood crime watch group on the Internet for information. Your whole society needs a whole new attitude of taking charge of your fates with or without your ruler wannabes so after you organize yourself, get other neighborhood crime watch groups organized. They don't get to kill you to feed their twisted, criminal loving, British people hating ideology. Ultimately, power rests with you if you take it.

By the way. We are meeting with our local police guy to discuss self defense measures we can take when attacked by a pack of racist ghetto thugs as this is becomming common in the streets of the US. It will be something we have to deal with when the shtf.

Originally posted by blaenau2000
If the SHTF last thing i would want is a gun, I would escape to the mountains and hide.
If you are carrying a gun and are confronted with someone also with a gun you will be shot at, ill take my chances without one thanks.

Guns are for cowards.

How are you going to kill your food? At some time you will run out of supplies and have to start hunting.

I see alot of Brits thinking like Americans here seeeeeee being bad feels good

reply to post by clintdelicious

Unless you get to this armory first and get out fast, what better place to run into other people with guns, newly acquired or not, than this armory? I assume it would be a highly targeted location if the SHTF. Get a ghillie suit. Learn to disappear when you want. Get a silent killer or fairly quiet one. A silenced rifle? Bow? Crossbow? Pneumatic weaponry? If you hear a gunshot you know there is someone in the area that may be a rival for resources, and vice-versa, so you may become the hunted if you fire one, and if you are on your own you may be out-gunned and outnumbered should you be the one revealing yourself by gunshot. Pre-form a group of friends for your own group or know how to avoid them and still survive. What is unseen and unheard may remain unfound. There is an old saying. It is better to remain silent and appear a fool than to speak and prove yourself one. Likewise, firing a gun may foolishly reveal yourself.

Originally posted by clintdelicious
The title explains what im asking really. Here in the UK getting a gun is not an option unless you have a lot of land and even then they are very limited capacity and power.

Not far from me is a school that I have been to with a cadet force and there is an armoury with single action SA80's (GP rifles) and a few LSW's which are fully automatic. There are also live 5.56 rounds there. If the SHTF I know that would be one place that is very loosely protected and with just a double brick wall and a thick steel door it wouldnt be too hard to get in there.

This is just an example of a place nearby that I know has a wealth of arms, But this is not a certainty. I wouldnt want to aquire a gun of the street, risking years in prison or getting ripped of. So I thought i'd ask every on here who have a pretty good idea when it comes to this sort of thing. I've heard other posts people discussing crossbows etc which are ok, but there will be people out there with guns and a crossbow or bow will just not cut it against the people who do have weapons. The majority of these would be .22 rifles, shotguns and lower calibre pistols.

While im not saying I would steal a weapon illegaly, if TSHTF then the rules change, i'd consider this an immediate option.

Anyway sorry this isnt a very well structured and thought out post but I just wanted to throw another view ion there.

You don't need to own land to own a gun in the UK!
You can apply for a shot gun certificate living in a terraced council house as long as you have a secure gun cabinet.
For an FAC you need to be in a gun club and have a home office approved range to shoot it on.

reply to post by minkey53


like this! - www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by minkey53

Originally posted by CholmondleyWarner

Originally posted by minkey53
You can't legally buy a shotgun or rifle here in the UK without going through a whole load of paperwork, police visits and checks etc.

An Air Rifle / Pistol can still be deadly and is easy to obtain, can't order online though!

If somebody tries to loot your property, point a gun (even an airgun) at them with a laser sight that puts a red dot on their chest and they won't want to hang around long!

Perhaps someone, maybe you, should give a list of the type and power of the air rifles we should be looking at getting?

A full power spring loading Pistol (not relying on gas bottles) should be something like a Browning 800 MAG. These can be obtained for just over £100, .22 is better than .177 if you're hunting with it. Scopes or Red Laser Dots that fit on top can be had for £20 upwards.

A Rifle has a longer range and good ones can be purchased from £100 (new), again same price as above for small scope. A Weihrauch HW99S .22 is a superb rifle, would last a lifetime and is pin accurate. £200 new of half that 2nd hand.

No license is required and both are deadly up to about 50 metres.

At 12 lbs of pressure (legal limit) I strongly disagree with that last sentence.
You'd have to be at near-point blank range to bring down a man-sized target, and you'd have to hit a vital-organ at that.
Now with an FAC air-rifle you possibly are looking at lethality up to 100 yards or so..

reply to post by thoughtsfull


Yes, many years ago, and walked in the parade, the way they wave those torches around I reckon they would be double handy to have around in a SHTF scenario lol

On a more serious note, when is the night op going to occur when we can lay our hands on some of their stash ???

Originally posted by solargeddon
reply to post by thoughtsfull

 

Yes, many years ago, and walked in the parade, the way they wave those torches around I reckon they would be double handy to have around in a SHTF scenario lol

On a more serious note, when is the night op going to occur when we can lay our hands on some of their stash ???

edit on 9-3-2011 by solargeddon because: (no reason given)

not to mention a few bags of rookies would always be help full as a distraction
Personally I am sure they hide it all under Mount Caburn