I'm a muslim. I'm not violent/radical. Tell me I'm lying!

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by minigunner

 

As does Judaism. And Christianity. Back in the day, so did adherents to Sol Invictus. And the early Buddhists bought into it, as well. It seems to be an important part of monotheism.

Of course, the overwhelmingly vast majority of all these people don't do any of this, and saying "OMG IT'S IN A BOOK SO YOU HAVE TO BE JUST LIKE IT" is about as ridiculous as accusing someone of being a child rapist because they have "Lolita" in their library.

Maybe, but I didn't advise him to join another religion and these religions aren't the subject. I don't belong to a church or donate my time to religion. Frankly religion is a large part of many of the worlds problems, which is why I don't subscribe to walking in the footsteps of a profit or disciple.

It comes down to this.

if you move into my country, next door to me, I hope we can be good neighbors. Hopefully we will become friends, and have barbecues together. We will help each other out when we can. My children will hang out with your children. Who knows, maybe my son with take your daughter to the prom, or your son will take my daughter to the prom. This would be fine.

BUT, if you move next door, and forbid your children to have contact with mine, treat my family like heathens, cover your women from head to toe even in hot weather, and teach your sons that my daughters are whores because they do not dress the way you think they should dress, then we will have serious problems.

Does this clear things up?

every nation, every religion and every state has good & bad people

S&F

second line

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


I dont think you are lieing, and I dont think Islam is any more violent than christianity, jeudaism or catholicism, which all have a pretty dark and bloody history.

Personally I think it has more to do with the old theory of the right place at the right time with the right message - which in this case is a time frame where there is 24 hour news coverage across the globe.

I think Islam has been hijacked by people who are running their own agenda, and using religion as a cover for it, to in some small way try to justify / rationalize their actions.

I used to live in Michigan, and not once had I ever had any issues with the large Muslim population there. As a matter of fact I never really saw animosity between Islam, Jewish or christian religions in that area either. The Jewish community there usually puts on community charity events. During one of those events, the event itself fell on a jewish high holiday, and they were trying to figure out if they should move it, cancel it, etc.

The Muslim groups contacted the Rabbi and volunteered to take over the event so they could enjoy their holiday while maintaining their event. That act led to the discussion of joint events and helping each other out on their respective holidays.

All groups have their wingnuts..

This whole Muslim / American-Christian conflict has not come out of nowhere. This conflict was social-sientically created by Zionists and their American stoodges in the US Government. The result is, that the lowest IQ puppets of the USA come crawling out on the streets, screaming damnation onto inocent muslims. Unfortunatelly, today there are many of low IQ puppets around in the USA, so the zionist crooks and their stoodges in the US Government have easy game. Americans in that video behave EXACTLY the same as brainwashed Germans behaved when Jews showed their faces on the streets. You Americans really ought to be ashamed of yourselfs. Your fathers and grandfathers died in a war to destroy exactly the same menace you allow to creep up on your own streets today! What did your fathers and grandfathers fight and die for, if something like this now happens in the very streets they once lived in, in front of the houses where they once created you...?! Wake up America! Wake up and look what you are doing and recognise where it will lead you to. Study recent history. Its not so long ago, only a few years more then a mans life span. It was only yesterday and you have allready forgotten it, althogh your fathers and grandfathers had died to fight it???? Is it the fluoride in your water, the thirdy plus vaccinations during your childhood, the poison in your food, your air and water? Whatever it is, get rid of it!

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

I'm a male. Do I believe in sharia law? I cannot say I do due to the simple fact that it has been twisted and changed, I'm a follower of the Qur'an first and foremost which some muslims fail to realize is the way to go.

Shari'a law is derived from the Koran. The commands of fasting, jurisprudence, social hierarchy and spiritual development in the Koran are what makes up Shari'a. While you may not necessarily follow all of the commandments of the Koran, the fact remains that most countries in the Middle East and many in North Africa are under pretty strict definitions of Shari'a.

Part of what Allah commands is found in various Suras:

Sura 9:5 "Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush. But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then leave their way free. Lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful."

Sura 9:123 "O ye who believe! fight the unbelievers who gird you about, and let them find firmness in you: and know that Allah is with those who fear Him."

The commandment to kill unbelievers is clear and shared by many in the Islamic world. Especially toward Jews, but Christians are not spared the wrath of Allah either despite this obvious contradiction:

Sura 5:17 "17. They have indeed disbelieved who declare: God is the Messiah, son of Mary. Say: "Who then has the least power against God, if He had willed to destroy the Messiah, son of Mary, and his mother, and all those who are on the earth?" To God belongs the sovereignty of the heavens and the earth and all that is between them. He creates whatever He wills. God has full power over everything."

Sura 5:82 "You will find that the worst enemies of the believers are the Jews and the idol worshipers. And you will find that the closest people in friendship to the believers are those who say, "We are Christian." This is because they have priests and monks among them, and they are not arrogant."

So even if we ignore this glaring contradiction in terms, we are to assume that both Jews and Christians are unbelievers. And NOT keeping to the commandment of Allah to kill unbelievers, "slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them captive, and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush" would make you a "Hypocrite" in the standard definition set in the Koran:

Sura 4:145 "The Hypocrites will be in the lowest depths of the Fire: no helper wilt thou find for them".

Sura 4:138 "To the Hypocrites give the glad tidings that there is for them but a grievous penalty".

The vast majority of Shari'a, as it is understood in the Middle Eastern countries who impose it, is illuminated by the Hadith. It is the Hadith that places women beneath men, and it is the Hadith(the sayings and deeds of Mohammad) that considers women to be "Crooked'.

But the Koran has it's own misogynistic commandments that you should probably be aware of if you are not already:

Sura 4:3 "If ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with the orphans, Marry women of your choice, Two or three or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly with them, then only one, or a captive that your right hands possess, that will be more suitable, to prevent you from doing injustice."

This particular Sura encourages polygamy and the use of slave women...We can guess what they are for.

Oh but there's more:

Inequitable treatment of women when it comes to inheritance:

Sura 4:11 "Allah (thus) directs you as regards your Children's (Inheritance): to the male, a portion equal to that of two females: if only daughters, two or more, their share is two-thirds of the inheritance; if only one, her share is a half. For parents, a sixth share of the inheritance to each, if the deceased left children; if no children, and the parents are the (only) heirs, the mother has a third; if the deceased Left brothers (or sisters) the mother has a sixth. (The distribution in all cases ('s) after the payment of legacies and debts. Ye know not whether your parents or your children are nearest to you in benefit. These are settled portions ordained by Allah. and Allah is All-knowing, All-wise."

Marriage of prepubescent girls Sura 65 which deals with marriage and divorce:

Sura 65:4 "Such of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the prescribed period, if ye have any doubts, is three months, and for those who have no courses (it is the same): for those who carry (life within their wombs), their period is until they deliver their burdens: and for those who fear Allah, He will make their path easy."

A womans testimony weighing less than a mans was a practice of old Arabia which got 'integrated' into various sects of Islam, which is one of the main reasons I don't follow any sect at all. Those who created these various sects, integrated Islams universal teachings with the culture of whatever country they came from, and now look where it got us.

Legal Testimony of Women:

Sura 2:282 " O ye who believe! When ye deal with each other, in transactions involving future obligations in a fixed period of time, reduce them to writing Let a scribe write down faithfully as between the parties: let not the scribe refuse to write: as Allah Has taught him, so let him write. Let him who incurs the liability dictate, but let him fear His Lord Allah, and not diminish aught of what he owes. If they party liable is mentally deficient, or weak, or unable Himself to dictate, Let his guardian dictate faithfully, and get two witnesses, out of your own men, and if there are not two men, then a man and two women, such as ye choose, for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her. The witnesses should not refuse when they are called on (For evidence). Disdain not to reduce to writing (your contract) for a future period, whether it be small or big: it is juster in the sight of Allah, More suitable as evidence, and more convenient to prevent doubts among yourselves but if it be a transaction which ye carry out on the spot among yourselves, there is no blame on you if ye reduce it not to writing. But take witness whenever ye make a commercial contract; and let neither scribe nor witness suffer harm. If ye do (such harm), it would be wickedness in you. So fear Allah. For it is God that teaches you. And Allah is well acquainted with all things."

Emphasis mine.


Maybe you should actually read the Koran. Otherwise, the only person you are lying to is yourself.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


its very sad and im very sorry you have to feel that way...it coud be divide and conquer curtiousy from tptb...its not natural.

Whenever my mates mention anything to do with the middle east or Islam, i always remind them that during the crusades the west were the 'bad guys'.. The Christians were ill educated and murderous. How much better if the west had followed Saladin. a great man with morals and a true vision of how the world should be

All our sciences, mathematics and dare i say it civilisation comes from our Islamic brothers and sisters.I disagree with a lot of both Christianity, and Islam, but together we are stronger !

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


Peaceful Muslims ???
Yeah Until i made a Smart Remark against Muhammad or Allah


if i was a middle eastern county and made Fun or some sort of Blasphemy

I would be Stoned to Death , Head on a Chop block or Hanged all in sake of making fun of your Religion

Funny thing is your Religion Acknowledges Jesus yet stil does the same thing

Christianity had One of the Darkest Past of religions Especially during 16th century Inquisitions of Europe
you know a Witch finder that loved Hanging Burning Innocent people that were accused of witchery satanic Worship People woken up now knowing Cures and Technology of today and Blasphemy is mostly ignored
within Christianity in a America well accept a small group of people that send their children to a place called Jesus Camp that camp it more like a School for Witch hunters at the start of a Elementary Level

Care to explain this ! ?

Here is Muslim that was trying to redirect that type of Stereotype of what people thought of Muslims
as he had a Made a Muslim TV channel and he does this Beheading his wife for going
against the Muslim religion ! !

As his wife was trying to Leave him and get a Divorce and this was called a Mercy Killing
Yet this Muslim Must of forgot that he was in America at the time of his murdering rage ..

Brutal Irony In New York Woman's Beheading
Police Say Couple Founded TV Network To Fight Muslim Stereotypes;
Husband Suspected Of Killing Her At Office
www.cbsnews.com...

Founder of Islamic TV station accused of beheading wife
Share this on:
Mixx Facebook Twitter Digg delicious reddit MySpace StumbleUpon LinkedIn
February 16, 2009|From Deborah Brunswick and LaNeice Collins CNN
articles.cnn.com...:CRIME


The VIDEO of the TRIAL!
Buffalo, New York: Moderate Muslim who beheaded his wife guilty of 2nd degree murder
www.jihadwatch.org...


Let us not forget a Military Psychiatrist ! ( A American Born Muslim ) at Fort Hood doing a Killing Spree 13 dead 30 wounded
all because he disagreed with the wars going on over in Iraq and Afghanistan
as could of easily left the military

Fort Hood Shooting
en.wikipedia.org...

Court martial recommended for Fort Hood shooting suspect
www.reuters.com...

Muslim image campaigns suffer after Fort Hood shootings
www.usatoday.com...


Peaceful Muslims ?

I would of thought different ! but both cases have to do with their religion ! Not them Selves


But if you try harm me because i made fun your religion in front of you or your better half (partner) wants to leave youand you make the attempt according to your Law of Religion to a Mercy Killing ..
Then Yeah your Lying




The END of Hate Speech, subtle or otherwise, on ATS

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


It is indeed unfortunate that there is a large number of people ignorant of the truths with regards to Islam and willing to use unsubstantiated statements to try to communicate their points, packed full of prejudice. I've also had many frustrating debates with them (you usually make fools of them) but whatever man, if they choose ignorance then they choose ignorance - its no skin off your back. If someone really can't see that they're just propagating the 'us vs them' mentality, presenting unfounded opinions as facts and spreading hate, then leave them to suffer their hatred.

It's ok to debate the ethics of a religion and this form of debate should be encouraged. However, this should also be applied to all organised religions, since they're fairly similar, otherwise it is merely an opportunity for these guys to vent. This is counter-productive.

At the same time, there's also plenty of good people with common sense on here and we could do with retaining as many as possible. Don't leave a forum full of wise, educated and intelligent people, who you can share information and experience with, just because a few are stupid! Their ignorant attitudes towards muslims only reflects their ignorance as a whole and this is not the general consensus on the forum - most of the members with common sense just can't be bothered to argue with those who have a stubborn agenda.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


All the religions in the world bring shame and ignorance to the word of GOD.
I can’t wait to the mother of all creation comes back into the text of life...I think you all need a time out!
I wouldn’t dare covet the gods that you humans have conjured in this world, those are not gods, their figment of your imagination of how you see your views…not god, not Allah, not Buddha, but your own fleshly, ill invaluable needs, and thoughts. You little earthlings let words and color separate you all from the common goal of lifes blood.

Because Muslim is spelled Muslim with an ‘M’ and chritianitity is spelled Christianity with a ‘C’, all of the sudden, we at war.
Because your black and I’m white, were at war.
Because your parents are racist, you have to be.
Because by pen and paper this is your land…‘GO BACK TO AFRICA’, ‘KEEP THE ILLEGAL ALIENS OUT‘, CLOSE OUR BORDERS’.

Because of a religion and government ,you have some as hole tell a kid ,to blow his self up in the name of Allah, for some 40 virgins ,and 40 Ackers and ‘WHAT EVER ELSE’ it is.

So what you’re a Muslim! What explaining do you have to do, its blood tainted all over the human race and in religions. What’s your point; the victims of 911 were causalities of war, just like the bombs Israel drops on the villagers, just like the 400’000 Iraq civilians that got killed, ‘SORRY’ .JUST LIKE THE 2.2 MILLION IRAQ civilians in both wars during both bush admirations that died from bombs, sanctions and rape, and unauthorized mass killings by Usa troops, was casualties of war.
It’s the law; it’s…the human way.

OH’ the radical Muslims’
OMGOSHH, the terrorist musliIIIMSS, THERE going to get us.
Loll
You started a thread explaining to a race that dropped the first 2 nukes on countries LOL, put chicken pox in blankets and sold it to the Indians…get REAL DUDE, do you really think in gods life, that you have a damn thing to explain.. REALLY!

THE GREATEST STATEMENT EVER TO MY EARS WAS,

‘THE GENEVA CONVENTION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS’
‘YOU’RE EITHER WITH US OR AGAINST US’
And then this idiot went to war with Iraq!
‘No kids no woman’
It was the most coveted law amongst war …but now.

Causalities of war is the new event, a new event amongst a class of humans that was suppose to break this trend of stupidity by now.

2000 years from now, when they look at all the lost cds, and videos, and archives OF THIS MILLENNIUM. ‘This race and time age will always be considered, the ‘STONE AGE’ OF IGNORANCE.
The schools will use this time to teach there young of what not to be, of what not to do ,and how to be better humans with out all the names that separate one from another.
I see why they say pride is the greatest sin…now I see .

reply to post by arollingstone


You folks can pat this guy on the back all you want. But the fact remains that he is vastly ignorant of his own religion and has even made misleading statements regarding what is and is not Shari'a Law.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Mod Note: The END of Hate Speech, subtle or otherwise, on ATS

reply to post by current93


If you knew your history, you would know there was no true right or wrong side during the Crusades. Both sides were ill-educated, and committed great atrocities towards their fellow man. And assuming (since you mentioned Saladin) you must be using the movie "kingdom of heaven" as a reference...don't forget, Saladin was not always in charge of the Islamic people, nor was King Richard of England, the crusades did go for almost 400 years.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

Star and flag, I totally agree. It's a shame how many people are quick to put all who call themselves followers of Islam in the one basket. From my own Christian perspective, It's like comparing all Christians to the Westboro Baptist Church, or even worse, the Catholic Church during the more violent parts of its history.

I hope the islamophobes don't get to you, it would be a shame to leave ATS just because of them Peace!

There are good and there are bad muslims. Islam in my opinion, is one of the "purest" religions as the quran has not been tampered by various empires and translations. It's just too bad the average joes only see the extremism of the few fanatics self proclaimed "muslims". I have muslim friends and they are the among nicests and friendliest people I know.
Having said that, I think the problem mostly come from many muslims' lack of integration within a western society. How do you feel about it OP?

reply to post by Immortalgemini527


Brilliantly said my friend, You worded that just perfectly. But you have to ask yourself, has humanity really changed that much in 2000 years? what makes you think we will be any differently in another 2000?

Originally posted by TheOracle
There are good and there are bad muslims. Islam in my opinion, is one of the "purest" religions as the quran has not been tampered by various empires and translations.

This is not true. Much of Koran was edited or changed, or had parts replaced early on in it's history.

The early Caliph Abu Bakr told Zaid bin Thabit(A prominent scribe) after the death of Mohammad in 632 AD to seek out those who were closest to Mohammad, as the Koran had not be written yet, to recite onto parchment the word of Allah. Mohammad had Authorized only 4 others to give Koranic recitations, but Zaid had also sought out others who had purportedly learned the Koran by heart. Some of these men, by the time Zaid had gotten to them, had forgotten many pieces of the Koran.

After the initial writing of the Koran edits and omissions had also been made up to 200 years after it's original writing.

Edit:

By the way, Koran, or commonly Qur'an means "Recitation".

Again, before people start patting this guy on the back, learn a little something about the Koran.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


I just wish I had faith...True believers in any religion are lucky. I'm starting to realize that Humans need some sort of spiritual essence. I just don't believe in any of it! I wish I believed so strongly that I could kill others and myself in the name of my religion. Ive asked Jesus and Muhammad to come to me and make me a believer but they refuse....

So all you people out there fighting over different beliefs need to stop and think about what you have in common. You have faith and for that you are one the same. Others are not so fortunate.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

Excellent. Good to meet you. You are apparently 1 in a 1,000,000,000. I wish there were more of you and that you were all more vocal in your opposition of the radicals. S&F for you.

reply to post by phatpackage


Soooo, what is it about me talking about certain people on ATS that shows an assumption that everyone here is like that? No sir I haven't painted anybody with any brush. I know the people on ATS who are like that, and those who aren't. You fail for trying to put words in my mouth.