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Anti-Gravity & Zero Point Energy Device Confirmed by Measurements in Morningstar Energy Box

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posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 08:42 AM
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reply to post by wildespace
 


Go to my link. They are trying to use the energy. And it's a reputable link.




posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 08:59 AM
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Originally posted by Movescamp
reply to post by john_bmth
 


So is it barely a hypothesis or a genuine term? I am sorry but I am confused? Do you know what you are talking about or like another friend here do you need google and an engineering buddy to tell you?

Ok, I'll make it easier for you: "ZPE" is a genuine term used in QP. However, "ZPE" is also used by idiots who wouldn't know science if it came up and bit them in the ass use the term to mean all sorts of nonsense. Geddit?



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by john_bmth
 


Oh I get it. Do you? Dont you think educating people on what it means is a better solution than telling them its bs Unless of course you don't know what it means. In which case being silent is more appropriate. Did you go the university of Colorado link? Care to rephrase your post or do you still think it's perpetual bunk?

Yes this idea in OP seems strange and on the lines to be weary of since the concept is hardly new. But then again I haven't fully studied it and any real scientist usually is very careful with word choices. Like I don't see how it would work or from the figures I have done etc. You won't usually catch any scientist of note making such affirmed statements as you made.... especially without doing any research. Being humble helps one learn faster.
edit on 6-3-2011 by Movescamp because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 09:40 AM
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reply to post by Amaterasu
 


That still has nothing to do with the biefeld brown effect. I am not trying to be a jerk like some here but the biefeld brown effect has to do with Electricity creating an ion wind. That is not ZPE.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by Movescamp
reply to post by john_bmth
 


Oh I get it. Do you? Dont you think educating people on what it means is a better solution than telling them its bs Unless of course you don't know what it means. In which case being silent is more appropriate. Did you go the university of Colorado link? Care to rephrase your post or do you still think it's perpetual bunk?

What's the point? The "believers" do not care for science. Checking out the OP's link, there's a whole slew of misleading statements and outright deception that anyone with an even remotely critical brain would be able to spot. But that doesn't matter, it agrees with their presupposition so it's all good with them. This is old ground being todden for the umpteenth time.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 10:19 AM
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reply to post by john_bmth
 


I am sorry you feel that way. I am sure people said the same about the spruce goose. After all for 1000's of years people were trying to fly. Granted there were airships but winged flight was impossible to people for years.

While I am suspicious of the OP link I really haven't taken the time to "do the math".

Everything is impossible until it's done.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by illuminateme
reply to post by boncho
 

While I have not formed a solid opinion on the topic at hand, I must refute the claim because they have no assets or use a small building that they are not onto something. The big computer giants all started in their garage for pete's sake. Those who want to change the world with no resources must start small.

I really hope this technology works, I believe it will or we may already have it, from what I read some of the basis of it was found in the middle 20th century by well known scientists. It is just a matter of time before a craft using this technology crashes like the U2 or other secret crafts before it becomes public.



There is a huge difference, some of these operations have been going on 20+ years, when computer start ups develop something working, IT MAKES IT OUT TO MARKET.

There is evidence of computer start ups working. There is not evidence of this "Free Energy" working. As of right now, it doesn't work. And people perpetuating the idea that it is a working technology are helping people commit FRAUD

ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS FOR ME:

1. It's real and working, where is it?
2. Whats the point of this thread? Did they prove anything?, no, they made a Faraday disk.
3. Why are these people always selling books and doing conferences? If the technology is real than can just sell off some of their 'free energy' being produced, or, just sell a bloody machine.

And let me say this: some of these designers are claiming to have run their houses or shops over a year on these bologna energies.

I WILL ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS

1. Fraud: deceit, trickery, sharp practice, or breach of confidence, perpetrated for profit or to gain some unfair or dishonest advantage

To make any claim other than "We are researching the possibilities" is absolute and utter fraud. Here is why, science does not speculate, something either is or isn't. Anyone holding conferences on "energy of the future" is not part of science and instead part of business (shady business.)

To say that any of this free energy technology works is fraud. There are legitimate scientists working on these fields of study, they have been for the past half century. However, they would never tell you that any of this technology is a reality yet because they are still understanding how it works.

SCIENCE DOES NOT MAKE ASSUMPTIONS AND CALL THEM FACT



Why is it so difficult dealing with proponents of the "free energy" movement? Because they ignore any rational look at the subject.

I have been linked to dozens and dozens of sites where the common theme is:

1. Talk about the future and how it will change with free energy.
2. Post 'scientific' papers. (Which are NOT, they are essays and social science theories)
3. Link to legitimate groups and agencies that have no relation to the original company so it appears as authenticity.
4. Claim that the reason there are no working models is because of suppression. (send me a blueprint for working free energy, I will be building them by tomorrow and selling them in weeks.)
5. Claim that the energy development process is super secret. Well, real research does not generally cover every aspect of a single system. They don't offer papers on anything related to these field. They don't offer anything of substance. Because there is none. If there was some it would be offered, people would be proud to show off their accomplishment.
6. Supposedly these quasi-labs are just trying to revolutionize the world so no one has to pay for energy, do WHY DO THEY WANT TO CHARGE FOR EVERYTHING? Conferences, books, memberships, etc.

Okay so that doesn't seem odd? So than if they are so altruistic, shouldn't they publish their findings for all to see so anyone can build these systems? Would they care who finalized the process as long as their free energy world became a reality? The answers are clear and the evidence, or lack thereof is telling in itself.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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reply to post by Movescamp
 





I could be wrong but I thought patents of these kinds require an actual working model because of the many pranksters who have tainted the field.


Patents do not need to work. There are thousands and thousands of patents that do not work.

If it works, than where is it?



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:26 PM
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Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Amaterasu
 


If you know it can than you must have first hand knowledge. Please build one of these devices and send it to me.

In fact, just send me blueprints or even a scientific paper on how your miracle machine works.


Here we go again. I have told you that *I* have knowledge of electrogravitics existing and being the hot research in the 1950's. My father explained all that came from this study - antigravity and overunity - before it went into black ops. *I* do not have access to above top secret details and therefore cannot fulfill these absurd requests.

Be all that as it may... Are you saying that ZPE cannot be extracted? THAT was my question.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by Movescamp
 





Did you go the university of Colorado link? Care to rephrase your post or do you still think it's perpetual bunk?


Did you? I did, and they have half a dozen papers that only have the abstracts available. Some of those papers are written by very suspect people, people that have been doing conferences for free energy and UFO's for the past ten years.

The other curious thing about the papers, (if you read them) is that they don't proclaim ZPE is harvestable. The suggest ways of researching how it could be.


You like to say that people aren't schooled on this subject, but I have yet to see you link us to anything you fully understand. Anytime someone contradicts you, you fire a dozen links at them that you, yourself havent read.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:32 PM
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Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by Movescamp
reply to post by john_bmth
 


So is it barely a hypothesis or a genuine term? I am sorry but I am confused? Do you know what you are talking about or like another friend here do you need google and an engineering buddy to tell you?

Ok, I'll make it easier for you: "ZPE" is a genuine term used in QP. However, "ZPE" is also used by idiots who wouldn't know science if it came up and bit them in the ass use the term to mean all sorts of nonsense. Geddit?


And it's also used by serious researchers in efforts to extract the energy for use. Just because there are idiots out there does not mean that the science and engineering of these serious researchers is also idiotic.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:38 PM
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Originally posted by boncho

There is a huge difference, some of these operations have been going on 20+ years, when computer start ups develop something working, IT MAKES IT OUT TO MARKET.


Sure, but when the product is a threat to the PTB, it DOESN'T make it out to market - and there is evidence that all free energy efforts have been suppressed. Even to the point of having "debunkers" make disparaging claims... Character assassination, patent purchase and tech never developed, threats, and murder.

So this argument holds no water.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:40 PM
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Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Movescamp
 





I could be wrong but I thought patents of these kinds require an actual working model because of the many pranksters who have tainted the field.


Patents do not need to work. There are thousands and thousands of patents that do not work.

If it works, than where is it?


Suppressed.

2nd



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:42 PM
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Originally posted by Amaterasu

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Amaterasu
 


If you know it can than you must have first hand knowledge. Please build one of these devices and send it to me.

In fact, just send me blueprints or even a scientific paper on how your miracle machine works.


Here we go again. I have told you that *I* have knowledge of electrogravitics existing and being the hot research in the 1950's. My father explained all that came from this study - antigravity and overunity - before it went into black ops. *I* do not have access to above top secret details and therefore cannot fulfill these absurd requests.

Be all that as it may... Are you saying that ZPE cannot be extracted? THAT was my question.



ZPE can not be extracted. Not on any level that would be useful to large scale energy production. ZPE is the lowest energy state of a quantam mechanical system. Meaning, the absolute lowest amount of energy there is, ZERO point energy, as in: none, nada, zilch, no way no how.

If you want to syphon magical energy out of something it would not be ZPE. It would be something else.

The papers on this subject are misleading, I understand how people get confused but the original theory still stands.

2: You dad could have lied to you. You don't have knowledge, you have hearsay, and there is nothing to say that your dad was telling the truth, or even that you are telling the truth about what he told you. For someone that quotes bunk studies and bunk organisations so often, I would say that your vetting process is flawed.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 12:49 PM
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Originally posted by Amaterasu

Originally posted by boncho

There is a huge difference, some of these operations have been going on 20+ years, when computer start ups develop something working, IT MAKES IT OUT TO MARKET.


Sure, but when the product is a threat to the PTB, it DOESN'T make it out to market - and there is evidence that all free energy efforts have been suppressed. Even to the point of having "debunkers" make disparaging claims... Character assassination, patent purchase and tech never developed, threats, and murder.

So this argument holds no water.


Show me examples of this. You must have examples if you know about it. Link me to the hundred or so scientists and their untimely deaths. Link me to their area of research before they died. You can't because these statements are not true.

If they are suppressing all these free energy devices than why are the numerous labs that are 'developing' it (or at least claiming to) not being shut down?

When multiple groups of people work on the same technology there are independent breakthroughs. Think about how many countries there are that have developed nukes. You paranoid delusions are not based on any facts. And any time you are confronted about this technology being non-existent you rely on utter BS to substantiate your claims.

Let me spell it out for you:
By not questioning bogus claims and by promoting false labs and false research you are partaking in FRAUD. You are helping people be conned out of money. That is morally reprehensible, it does not fit into the 'free world' paradigm that you like to believe in. You have no proof for your claims! You perpetuate lies.

edit on 6-3-2011 by boncho because: Format error



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 01:25 PM
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reply to post by Flatfish
 


Did anyone read the "technical paper" linked from the site?

Here are some clues:

1) It contains absolutely zero equations

2) It contains absolutely zero diagrams illustrating the experimental setup

3) The description of the experimental apparatus is vague and ill-defined

4) There are only two references, one a popular book on antigravity, not a scientific paper, the other only mentioned in passing (see 7 below)

5) No mechanism is detailed to explain the "anomalous observations"

6) No actual mention of zero point energy, anti-gravity or anything of the kind in the actual paper

7) some speculative theory of gravitomagnetism is cited but it is admitted that it does not explain the results of this experiment

8) Paper was written in 2000 and translated from Russian shortly afterwards and buried deep in an extremely voluminous physics letters volume

9) There is only one diagram representing their measurements

In short, I don't think there is anything remotely interesting here. There's nothing to discuss because no actual detail has been provided.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 01:47 PM
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reply to post by XtraTL
 


Every single paper linked to this field of study is the same thing. And proponents will just keep linking more and more useless studies. None of which claim to create 'free energy'.

Hypothesis: People from these labs are viral marketing. Basis: The level of stupidity and ignorance is too high.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 01:51 PM
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reply to post by boncho
 


Um how does that make peop suspect? You are exactly the example of how suppression works. If you have EVER done any lab or patent work you would know how silly you sound.

Oh and there are patents that need an artifact. Like overunity devices. Look it up.


Again you are pretty transparent. Just a grouch. Did you read the abstract. What about he 22 page patent?

It's onething to be skeptical but you bring it to a whole new level and insult an entire department of physics at the university of Colorado because Do you assume you know more than phds who are employed as professors. or is it possible this could be something.

Oh and again this particular research has not been done for 20 years or there would be a patent. I also know it's something they exclusively are developing based on past theories. But as for an artifact being used to create it that has never happened.



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 01:53 PM
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reply to post by boncho
 


ZPE can not be exploited. Show me you research showing that. You are way off on your definition too. Trying to pull one over on the less physics based folks are you?



posted on Mar, 6 2011 @ 02:02 PM
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Originally posted by Movescamp
reply to post by boncho
 


ZPE can not be exploited. Show me you research showing that. You are way off on your definition too. Trying to pull one over on the less physics based folks are you?


My sentiment doesn't go against what the current theory states. You explain how it can be exploited. I am not the one making bold unsubstantiated claims.

And unless you have a PhD in physics than you are in the same boat as me. Saying I don't know what I am talking about doesn't mean you know what you are talking about. I admit I am not a physicist. But my interpretation of the claims made by these fraudulent companies is cogent enough in its own right. There are no credible physicists that will back up these ridiculous claims.

You are spewing things out like they are facts, they are not facts. Are these areas of energy production being studied, yes. Are there any conclusive results? No. Is everything you say hogwash? Most of it, nearly everything.

You support unproven garbage that you portray as fact. You also have no credibility.



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