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Adolf Hitler -- Agent of Zionism and Freemasonry

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posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 04:00 AM
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reply to post by vinay86
 

Don't do that. Don't just dismiss what I said with "you don't know". Don't be a coward and just dodge my response. Show me exactly how I was wrong in what I said. It's not like that Grand Lodge has any authority or extra secrets over everyone else. You assertions are absurd and actually show no evidence of neo-Nazism, but rather your blatant ignorance of Freemasonry. Unless you can show me how one symbol randomly used on a Grand Lodge webpage is an indication of world wise use then just shut up. I'm growing tired of the tripe you flood this forum with. At least some post something worth responding to and put some actual thought into their posts.

Get rid of the blinders otherwise you'll be stuck with this tunnel vision that plagues your mind. Your interpretation of Freemasonry is your own, its an opinion and not fact.

For the Blue Lodge (Craft or Symbolic Masonry) there is no headquarters over it all. Every Grand Lodge is
sovereign unto itself with its own leadership annually elected by the members of the Grand Lodge, which the definition thereof is found in the Constitution, Statutes, and By-Laws of that Grand Lodge. Recognition is held and shared between Grand Lodges that hold true to the charges, usages, and landmarks of Freemasonry. The appendant bodies can have a hierarchy ranging from local to national, and sometimes international level, but those said appendant organizations MUST have the permission of the Grand Master of the Grand Lodge to operate within the bounds of the Grand Lodge. If one loses membership in the Blue Lodge it affects the membership in all other bodies, but if one loses membership in an appedant body it doesn't necessarily affect his membership in others.

If Lodge's operates in a criminal matter their is a process by which members will be charged and expelled, or the Lodge loses its charter. It was a hard thing for me to do to sit on the Appeals Committee and side with the tribunals decision to expel him for misuse of funds. He was a PM and sitting Eminent Commander, and he lost all his memberships for something he did in the Blue Lodge.




posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 04:38 AM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
Ford was primarily known in his day for raising the standards of living for his employees, introducing the 40 hour work week, and paying wages twice as high as the competitors.

Like many labor-progressive Americans, Ford was an early Nazi-sympathizer, naively believing German propaganda. He later supported the Allied war effort against Nazi Germany after realizing the true face of Nazism.

The charge that Ford profiteered off of slave labor in the german plant is false. The Nazis nationalized the factory, thus cutting the Ford Company completely off of it.


Nice white wash. Ford only withdrew his support for the Nazis when forced to do so and faced with the possibility of criminal prosecution and the wave of public support moving towards Britain. Ford, like all other shareholders, and board members of IG Farben, should have shared in the charge of aiding the waging of aggressive war (amongst other charges) that their German counterparts faced. Either way, despite all that, the fact remains that slave labour was used from 1934, on a growing scale from 1939, and Ford was definately giving and recieving with Himmler and Goering until 1941, it is really more than probable that via holding companies in Switzerland overseen by Allen Dulles, he made a fair bit out of the enterprise after that too...so still most definately guilty of benefitting from the use of slave labour a criminal offence under international law even then. Based on previous behaviour alone it is more than apparent that he was capable of bending the law to suit his own pocket. And he certainly moved in the right business circles. He made money both ways that way. Who takes sides when there is money to be made or deals to be done? Isn't that what 'fraternity' is about?



posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 12:27 PM
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reply to post by KilgoreTrout
 


It's not a whitewash at all, simply fact. Ford had quite a few problematic ideas. While he had a few Jewish friends, he was nevertheless an anti-Semite.

In any case, his relationship to Masonry seems to have been practically non-existent. He received the three degrees in 1894. I'm not personally aware of him ever having attended another Masonic function after this.



posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
It's not a whitewash at all, simply fact. Ford had quite a few problematic ideas. While he had a few Jewish friends, he was nevertheless an anti-Semite.


If it is not a white wash what is it? Anti-semitism has nothing to do with profiting from slave labour and I don't know why you even mention it. The majority of those used in the slave labour programmes were ethnic Poles and other eastern European Slavs. Jews, excepting the 'white' Reich Jews were usually shot on apprehension, they were not brought back to the Reich. The white Jews, those more 'humanely' 'euthananised' in the Death Camps, were not semites. It is not Ford's 'idea's that were problematic, it was that others shared those ideas and implemented them, with his money and backing. And that he committed a crime, under international law, a law signed by the USA, not to participate, in any shape or form, in the movement of citizens from their own country to another, for the purpose of slavery. Through holding companies he continued right through until 1945 to recieve dividends from his investments in Germany. Following the war, Ford, like other overseas investors in Germany successfully applied for reparations for damages caused to their holdings in the Reich as a consequence of Allied Air Raids.

So when you said it was a 'fact' that Ford did not profit from slavery, either you were lying, mistaken or perhaps more bluntly, your reference material is somewhat out of date...you were wrong simply put...but no worries you can now stand corrected



posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 06:30 PM
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Hitler and his reich was also supported financially by the Rockefellers, the Rothschilds, Wall Street, and the US Federal Reserve. Hitler had a silver tongue, and he used it well to corrupt the leaders of the world to bend to his will. The only other prime figureheads in human history I can think of that did this were Henry VII, Caligula, and Genghis Khan. All of those people almost conquered the world.

The globalist bankers that seek to enslave us 'embrace' Hitler's ideals.



posted on Mar, 7 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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Originally posted by KilgoreTrout

So when you said it was a 'fact' that Ford did not profit from slavery, either you were lying, mistaken or perhaps more bluntly, your reference material is somewhat out of date...you were wrong simply put...but no worries you can now stand corrected


I will concede the point if you have something that shows that Ford knew about slave labor, and wilfully profited from it.

I won't concede the fact that Ford seemed to have nothing to do with freemasonry after 1896, which seems to nullify the OP's position that Freemasonry was somehow complicit in Nazi slave labor.



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 02:34 AM
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reply to post by KSigMason
 


Show me exactly how I was wrong in what I said. It's not like that Grand Lodge has any authority or extra secrets over everyone else.

I asked you why their is a lightning bolt in your square and compass symbol. And your answer was this.

Every Grand Lodge website has a Square and Compass on it, and given the creativity of the webmaster they are naturally going to differ slightly from one another. As I've said over and over, symbols do not have fixed meanings as they depend on their meaning upon the viewer. Lightning can symbolize many things from super natural powers to salvation.

You are telling me that any of your symbol can be modified and posted on your website. When a web designer, uses his creativity to design a logo for an organization he studies its goals, background, objectives etc. Now you tell me where is lightning bolt fits your objectives. Do you offer supernatural powers or salvation, but freemasonry refutes that.

Freemasonry Compared with Religion.
Freemasonry lacks the basic elements of religion:
(a) It has no dogma or theology, no wish or means to enforce religious orthodoxy.
(b) It offers no sacraments.
(c) It does not claim to lead to salvation by works, by secret knowledge, or by any other means. The secrets of Freemasonry are concerned with modes of recognition, not with the means of salvation. Masonicinfo

edit on 8/3/11 by vinay86 because: Content.



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by vinay86
 


If people want to see fault in something then they'll see it. To me, it really sounds as though you're really looking into the symbolism a bit too deeply.

India is a completely different culture than most of us are probably accustomed to and I certainly don't claim to be an expert. That having been said though, the reason for the shape of their compass could be completely different from what you're thinking, could you possibly be jumping to conclusions?

The fact is that this is the only Grand Lodge with a square and compass like this most likely. One Grand Lodge has a different square and compass with symbolism which, with imagination, can be associated with something horrible and therefore all masons are bad?

Also, there are no bodies which rule over Grand Lodges. This means a Grand Lodge can really interpret and present masonry and symbolism however they like and the only repercussions they might face is they won't get recognized by other Grand Lodges.


edit on 8-3-2011 by JayTaylor because: need more coffee



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 09:55 AM
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Originally posted by JayTaylor
The fact is that this is the only Grand Lodge with a square and compass like this most likely. One Grand Lodge has a different square and compass with symbolism which, with imagination, can be associated with something horrible and therefore all masons are bad?

Also, there are no bodies which rule over Grand Lodges. This means a Grand Lodge can really interpret and present masonry and symbolism however they like and the only repercussions they might face is they won't get recognized by other Grand Lodges.
What you say is correct. In fact, the Grand Lodge of India may, in fact, be all Nazis. How would I know otherwise? I've never met a member. The Grand Lodge of India only answers to the Grand Lodge of India and its members. Not my place to tell them how to run their organization.



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 10:10 AM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 




What you say is correct. In fact, the Grand Lodge of India may, in fact, be all Nazis. How would I know otherwise? I've never met a member. The Grand Lodge of India only answers to the Grand Lodge of India and its members. Not my place to tell them how to run their organization.


Well we really can't know but it seems highly unlikely. That being said however, even if someone was to assume the worst I simply can't understand the logic where someone would come to assume that the beliefs and actions of one Grand Lodge would be indicative of all others.

By that same token though, I also really don't see why people would think that the actions of one mason should reflect on the entire fraternity either. Yes, bad people have been made masons, this is an unfortunate truth, but bad people have infiltrated every man-made organization at some time or another. If Henry Ford really was a horrible person (and I'm not saying he was) should that really mean all masons share the same mindset simply because of association?



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 10:56 AM
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reply to post by vinay86
 


You'd think a man who grew up Hindu would tread lightly around the idea that any symbol bearing a resemblance to Third Reich insignia inherently implies evil intent in anyone or anything that uses it.



posted on Mar, 8 2011 @ 11:12 AM
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reply to post by vinay86
 

I replied to your asking about the different meanings, other than neo-nazism. You would have to ask the Grand Lodge webmaster why he picked that particular square and compass.

Look here at:

Grand Lodge of California
Grand Lodge of Oregon
Grand Lodge of Nevada
Grand Lodge of Idaho
Grand Lodge of Ohio
Grand Lodge of Illinois
Grand Lodge of Iowa
Grand Lodge of DC
Grand Lodge of Indiana
Grand Lodge of Louisiana

Yes I am telling you the Square and Compass is slightly modified from Grand Lodge to Grand Lodge. The Grand Master's coin or pin differs every year (usually). My Lodge's centennial coin was not the same as anyone elses. Doesn't mean we wield more information than others. I should know, I designed the damn thing. Idaho's Child Identification Program logo is no the same as others as I designed that one too. I also founded many programs in my Grand Lodge, lead them, and drafted the policy that is still followed today.

The webmaster for my state is also the Grand Recorder for the Grand Council of Cryptic Masons and General Grand Recorder for Cryptic Masons International so he needs help from time to time, and that is where I step in. Our designs are usually more coincidental than anything else. Every design I do is custom and from my own mind.

You must realize that lightning is also a symbol of masculinity. I'm sure you can connect the dots from manhood to fraternity.



posted on Mar, 14 2011 @ 05:03 PM
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Originally posted by Masonic Light
I will concede the point if you have something that shows that Ford knew about slave labor, and wilfully profited from it.


I won't go into your backtracking and how you cannot concede something that you have already lost...you agree though that Ford is not subject to the same judgement as his German counterparts? They were not permitted the defence of 'not knowing' that you feel Ford is entitled to. He started on the wrong side, but changed just in time, so is therefore exempt from 'blame'/justice? Of course, he was on the same side all the time, whether he was supplying the Axis or the Allies, his own. Just like the rest of 'them'. Fraternal structures designed to aid business...cartels and the such like...cultural takeovers can be hard or soft.


Originally posted by Masonic Light
I won't concede the fact that Ford seemed to have nothing to do with freemasonry after 1896, which seems to nullify the OP's position that Freemasonry was somehow complicit in Nazi slave labor.


In the case of the second world war, the Freemasons were more likely to be used as slave labour.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 04:19 AM
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reply to post by KilgoreTrout
 


Originally posted by Masonic Light

I will concede the point if you have something that shows that Ford knew about slave labor, and willfully profited from it.

I won't go into your backtracking and how you cannot concede something that you have already lost...

Ford 'profited from Nazi slave labour'



The Ford Motor Company is facing legal action in the United States for allegedly making a profit from its self-confessed use of slave labour during World War II. Its factory in Germany produced trucks for the Nazi war effort.

It is believed to be the first time a legal action has been brought for compensation against an American multinational for its activities in Nazi Germany.

During the war, at least 1,200 of the workers at Ford's Cologne plant were Russian. They were considered by the Nazis as Untermenschen, or subhuman.

He said the firm has a responsibility to those forced to work in its name.

"They were out for profit, pure and simple," he told the BBC. "They didn't care how it was earned and who was abused in the process."
BBC

Freemasons are trained for covering-up the misdeeds of their fellow mason brothers, the Oaths of secrecy are not just symbolic, they can even murder their own masonic brothers, if they reveal any of their secrets. And that too, in a ritualistic manner.


Google Video Link


And don't forget freemasonry is a cult of brainwashed slaves, and keeping secrecy is of utmost importance for a cult member.



edit on 17/3/11 by vinay86 because: Content.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 04:42 AM
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reply to post by vinay86
 

Did you not learn anything from me posting on this stupid video before?

What a ridiculous video. Just in the first 10 seconds I had to stop the video several times to make sure I heard it right. Love the “theatrics” at 25-seconds.

Our members do not give up or leave their families to Freemasonry. We encourage our members to be great husbands and fathers. In fact, family should always come before the Fraternity. Two of my officers were hardly ever around my year as Master because they wanted to focus more on their family. I held no ill will and kept them in their positions.

The only money required by each member is the annual dues which for my Lodge are only $100, but as I decided to join the Eastern Star there goes $30, $100 for the York Rite, and I think $25 for the York Rite College. So I am required to pay $255 a year. Oh God, how will my bank account survive? My fellow Past Masters of my Lodge sometimes pull our money to assist in paying the dues of Brothers who were laid off during the economic downfall. Any other money given is strictly voluntary. I’d say in the last 6-months I’ve given $1,000 to the KTEF, $300 to the YRSCNA Charitable Fund, and $400 to the ID CHIP. Here’s the thing though, no one told me to, I just wanted to because it all goes to good causes; one of them I founded in Idaho and the other I used to chair.

Give up our bodies? Such absurdity.

We do not ask for our members to give up their lives for Freemasonry. Maybe I’m playing simantics, but I say I’d rather have a dedicated member than a devoted follower as the latter seems almost to infer a mindless drone. Freemasonry does not want mindless drones or “yes” men.

Nowhere do we consider any member, officer, or leader in Freemasonry to be God. We don’t worship anyone other than the God (the divine being) of our faith.

Nowhere has a Mason ever been instructed to go kill people. Such an order would be against my conscience and the law. It would be a criminal act and I would not do it.

Freemasonry is not a cult and not an onion. If anything it’s a tree with various branches. The structure of Freemasonry is rather simple. We don’t hide things from our members. Just because a Scottish Rite Mason doesn’t tell what he swore not to non-Scottish Rite Masons doesn’t mean he’s hiding anything. It means he is keeping to his word. That is honorable and something not seen too much in this world.

We don’t promise to fulfill anyone’s dreams. Nor does Freemasonry believe that we hold the exclusive rights to teaching lessons of morality or to self improvement. Nor do we think we will bestow on someone “special powers” – that’s just stupid. We are just one organization, one path, out there. Some join and don’t think it’s for them, and we are okay with that. We bid them farewell.

When a member comes in and has question we do give them a free meal, but we do not do the “well least you could do in return is…”. If they are interested and return that is their choice and their choice alone. We had a gentleman that wasn’t going to join, but just wanted to come talk to us and question us, and we gave him a free meal every time. There is no “too late” coercion put on a potential member. To join the Freemasons you must join of your own free will and accord. That is indisputable. We encourage them to think it over and for as long as it takes. We even encourage them to bring their families along to dinner if they have questions. I’ve even been asked to go to someone’s house because they had questions and wanted a one-on-one discussion. Sometimes the entire family would join in the discussion.

We don’t separate our new recruits. They in fact are often paired together in my Lodge to help each other. We do not segregate, we believe in integration. We do get to know them, but why wouldn’t we? We want to know what kind of person is joining. We don’t do “personality tests” like the scientologists do. That’s just weird.

Like I’ve said, Freemasonry is not the primary in one’s life. God, family/friends, country, work, and then Freemasonry for me. Freemasons live outside the Lodge, meeting sometimes only once a week or sometimes less than that. We do not control their behavior or habits in anyway. I have changed my habits or behavior one bit since I’ve joined. I still act the same way and still hang out with the friends I always have. Other than when I was Master of the Lodge, if I didn’t want to go to an event, I didn’t go. I wasn’t ostracized. Love wasn’t withheld. There is no rigid schedule. We do plan events to have, but those are often planned out months in advance and often change to meet others needs. None of these events however are mandatory nor affect your standing within Masonry if you miss it.

We do not ask for our members to move into some barracks or living quarters. Everyone has their own residence and never is this private property asked to be taken over by the Masons. We do not do sleep deprivation as some of our members are old and couldn’t do this. Why would we do this anyway? Low protein food in the Masons? HA!!!! Anyone who has ever attended a Masonic event with food knows that we eat well, and if it’s like my area, it’s homemade.

Freemasonry is no religion nor do we believe we can answer the questions of the universe ie the meaning of life. Again, we do not want drones, someone who cannot think for themselves. We want individuals who seek knowledge on their own. We want someone who can contribute to the group. Drones should be despised.
We do not do guilt trips or spread messages of fear. We do not spy, tail, or report on one another like the video suggests. We do not induce mental breakdowns.

Nowhere in Freemasonry do we claim divine authority to one’s salvation. As many of us have said, we are not a religion nor do we make promises of salvation that you must do on your own according to your faith. Nor do we say our methods are proven by science or that we have special abilities or powers. Nor do we say that without us they will die, get sick, or be ruined in life.

The methods in the video of spinning and dancing is just nonsense and Freemasonry doesn’t do “self hypnosis”. Ditto for breathing exercises, chanting, or meditation. Again, we don’t want mindless obedience, drones.

This next part is something I touched on a bit earlier. We don’t want members to separate from their family or friends. We live separate lives outside of Freemasonry and it should never interfere with those lives. I took leave last summer and on one day there was a Masonic BBQ, but I decided to go floating the river with my friends instead. No one held ill will and in fact I was actually recently asked to sit as a Grand Lodge officer for this upcoming GL year. We encourage the family to approve of one’s membership and encourage them to ask questions.

In Masonry there is some conformity, but to the usages, customs, and regulations; mostly to maintain order in meetings. Individuality is encouraged though. We don’t do confessions nor do we say that before you joined the Freemasons your life was terrible.

At 08:35 the video mentioned something that you anti-Masons do. You have tried to demonize us and make us your scapegoat. By your logic and you posting this video, you must belong to a cult. Maybe the anti-Masons are a cult? Freemasonry doesn’t believe in a us versus them mentality. Hell, we even allow Catholics to join if they so choose, but the Catholic church on the other hand will excommunicate their members for doing such a thing.

If someone wants to leave, to demit, they are more than allowed to do so. No tries to stop them. As Master I signed several demit slips. People demit for many different reasons. They are not ostracized or made to feel guilty for it.

By this video, it can be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that Freemasonry is not a cult.



posted on Mar, 17 2011 @ 04:43 AM
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A person wearing a "cult member" tee shirt helps your credibility more than the rest of your post.



posted on Mar, 19 2011 @ 04:21 AM
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Originally posted by vinay86

Ford 'profited from Nazi slave labour'




You're preaching to the converted Honey. And General Motors, ITT, Texaco...etc etc etc. Most of them though did deals to supply to the Allies and part of that deal was, clearly, exoneration from their 'sins'. The majority of the profits that were funnelled out of Germany through Switzerland and Sweden in the closing years of the war, a war that the Allies ensured lasted long enough to get those funds out, were then returned to Germany in the form of 'relief' under the Marshall Plan. The rest was reinvested into establishing the CIA. So while those individual companies benefitted, so did many others.

It is a large and mutually destructive cartel based on each having collaterel on the other. If one goes, they all go. That keeps things tight and provides an almost impenetrable position for jurisprudence to infiltrate or investigate. War, world or civil, is their primary business. For some that means provision of materials for war, for some the provision of materials to clear up after war. For some both. It is a very, very dirty, incestuous and corrupt world.


Originally posted by vinay86
Freemasons are trained for covering-up the misdeeds of their fellow mason brothers, the Oaths of secrecy are not just symbolic, they can even murder their own masonic brothers, if they reveal any of their secrets. And that too, in a ritualistic manner.


I don't agree actually. What Freemasonry represents, or what it represented at it's conception as a 'body' in the early middle-ages, was a standard or a position of merit. What is clear firstly, is that the Freemasons always conducted themselves privately. The various Trade Guilds of the Middle Ages are very well documented, the wills of their members, their affiliations, records of their wages or the work they were commissioned to carry out sometimes even. The Freemasons on the otherhand, the Guild of those that built buildings in stone, there were/are other Guilds pertaining to woodworking, brick building, tiling, daubers (plasterers) etc and the specific crafts involved in building, but those that work with stone, including the carpenters who worked on stone structures increasingly from the 12th century, the tilers (roofers) etc, are to the most part nameless, though their deeds are mentioned. The Freemasons were responsible for searches and inspections, and were often called in to settle disputes where surity was in question due to poor standards of workmanship. They are seldom named as individuals but as representatives of Freemasonry. The Lodge Master at York was paid by the civic body a stipend to provide that service, this is recorded. Now if you walk up to York Minster and through the North Door, along the Transept into the Crossing and take in the Nave from that vantage you will clearly understand the reason they had that reputation. These men defied God. The tools and learning by which they did that, furthermore, defied Christianity and the establishment. Only they understood what they did and how they did it. We know now of course. But the Freemasons, and ultimately the Architect, were highly revered by society in the Middle-Ages and the Gothic Cathedrals dotted over Europe, the Castles and Palaces, are all testament to their success.

Such knowledge eventually passed into the public realm and ceased to be magic. But it never was magic to those who had passed through the degrees of the apprenticeship though because they understood the processes and the mathematics involved, it was part of the training. This mode of training seemingly had and did survive the fall of many empires. So, in England, emerging from the Middle-Ages, free from any influence from Rome, can move forward without a fear of a heresy charge. And certainly by the end of the 18th century it is perfectly acceptable for anyone with a knowledge of mathematics and an eye for the aesthetic of the day to become an architect. Freemasonry by then had become more about an exploration for 'inner knowledge', highly influenced by the emergence of Alchemy as legitimate science without the need to factor in Rome in British culture, and a comprehension by those who entered it, of this continuity of knowledge that had, seemingly, been preserved despite the fall of empires. It sits very firmly at the heart of emergent Deism because the world in which these men lived in was questioning their perception of God and 'rule'. The architects of the Industrial Revolution had no less need for secrecy as the architects of the pyramids. You should never reveal to murderous despots just how clever you are. Your life depends upon it.

I am rambling. Long stories short. Intentions are sometimes good, but they can be twisted and corrupted. That Ford joined the Freemasons long enough to learn the lingo and the handshakes would not surprise me. I should imagine he used it to fool one or two good men and engratiate himself into places he would otherwise have been unwelcome. The problem with unspoken trust, is that it can, in the wrong hands, be abused. The Merchant Guilds of the Middle Ages operated on the same structure as the Freemasons, but used that to push out small and lone operators by price fixing and sharing vessels (logistical costs). Capitalism therefore is a branch off from Freemasonry, but prior to the end of their operative phase. That they seeded Capitalism is not the fault of the Freemasons. Or the essence of that which lies at their core, depending upon what you might think that is.



posted on Mar, 20 2011 @ 10:23 AM
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Sorry, I can't keep reading all this BS without responding.

The matter of Alois Schicklgruber's (Hiedler/Hitler) paternity is a mystery that will never be solved. There is a SLIGHT CHANCE that his father was a Jew as Maria Anna Schicklgruber was a domestic in the household at Graz of a wealthy Jew named Frankenberger or Frankenreither, NOT Rothschild.



posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 11:23 AM
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reply to post by coyotepoet
 


I commend you on giving real information. Thank you. There is so much spattering going on and no true discussions.



posted on Mar, 28 2011 @ 11:25 AM
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reply to post by Hessdalen
 


His original spelling of his last name was Histler, not Hitler. What, do Rothchild's go around impregnated random women at factories? Get real.



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