Stratospheric Aerosol Geo-engineering aka "Chemtrails" DEBUNK THIS !!!!

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posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 02:18 AM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 


By forthcoming I meant taking place after the evaluation


But as you presumably also read it, care to explain how it is in any way relevant to stratospheric geoengineering?




posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 02:51 AM
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reply to post by Essan
 


All of the data used in those studies helps in other studies for SAG.

How do you think they decided that putting the crap into the stratosphere was the best place?

They did it by spraying crap at different altitudes and seeing what happened.

You're intelligent enough to know that already. How many times do I have to keep saying it?

There are many different kinds of chemtrails and they all have different purposes. Some of them have multiple purposes.

GOOGLE: Atmospheric Tracers

Atmospheric Tracer Experiments
www.meteozone.com...

ncas-cms.nerc.ac.uk...

Tracers are gases or powdered materials injected into the atmosphere



posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 03:05 AM
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www.arl.noaa.gov...


What It Is Used For
ARL’s Atmospheric Tracer Technology provides data neccesary to develop, test, and improve dispersion models and air quality monitoring systems. Atmospheric dispersion models are primary tools used by emergency managers and first responders to determine appropriate responses (e.g., approach routes, evacuation routes, shelter inplace) to chemical, biological, and nuclear accidents or incidents. Dispersion models also are used by regulatory agencies to determine appropriate pollutant emissions controls. Dispersion models must be tested (validated) with “real data” to detemine their accuracy. Since actual toxic materials cannot be released into the atmosphere, surrogate benign material (tracers) that mimic a real threat, such as those described here, are used instead.

Why It Is Important
Understanding how the atmosphere transports and disperses materials released into the air is essential to understanding and dealing with important problems such as air pollution or the accidental (or intentional) release of hazardous material. For example, Homeland Security experts now envision terrorist threat scenarios whereby chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons are used in densely populated urban centers for maximum impact. Atmospheric tracer experiments yield a host of critical information that are then used to determine chronic and acute exposure risks to humans if such an event should occur.


www.arl.noaa.gov...



1. Pentagon Shield. A small atmospheric tracer study at the Pentagon has now expanded into a large study that will involve 8 of ARL’s 10 real-time SF6 (sulfur-hexaflouride) analyzers and all 100 of our bag samplers. The study now includes an indoor component that will use both real-time analyzers and bag samplers. The changes in scope occurred with very short lead time. This has required FRD staff to increase the focus on preparations. We are on schedule and the deployment will be May 1-10. kirk.clawson@noaa.gov & staff

Preparations for the Pentagon Shield project have been extensive. The SF6 continuous analyzers have been upgraded, tested, and conditioned. Special lab carts will be used to deploy the analyzers inside the Pentagon. Gas Lab personnel are testing the Programmable Integrating Gas Samplers (PIGS) and conducting an aging study to verify that the samples will not be compromised during shipping from Washington, D.C. to Idaho. Planning for the project has been challenging because of changing requirements and a tight schedule but preparations are proceeding smoothly. roger.carter@noaa.gov, Debbie Lacroix
edit on 22-4-2011 by MathiasAndrew because: add text



posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 03:43 AM
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Here's what a tracer aerosol generator looks like

www.particleinstruments.com...


Advantages
Generation of polydisperse aerosols, mainly



posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 05:27 AM
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You've completely and utterly lost me - and judging by the lack of other comments in this thread, everyone else too.

Suffice to say, you are entitled to your beliefs, Just don't expect anyone else on the planet to understand what they are.



posted on Apr, 22 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 

I'm not sure what you are trying to prove with that post. Are you trying to prove to us that aerosol generators exist? I have no doubt that they do. If spraying a can of "Glade" air freshener can nebulize particles, I'm sure there are industrial use equipment that can also nebulize particles. So I don't get what you are trying to prove here that isn't already obvious.

These aerosol generators (and similar machines) you posted here are for industrial and medical uses -- everything from measuring the filtration abilities of clean rooms to air pollution research to "salt therapy" for cystic fibrosis patients.

I suppose it's possible for this technology top be used to spray aerosols from planes, but you need to do more than just show us that something is possible before you can convince someone that it is actually happening as part of a wide-reaching systematic plan to fill the skies with aerosols.



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 




Here's what a tracer aerosol generator looks like


I know your not trying to say that these are used to spray the atmosphere, are you? I hope not, because what your showing is used for this..


Applications •
Generation of tracer particles •

verifying measurements in very large clean rooms •

Test of HEPA and ULPA-filter media


www.particleinstruments.com...

That is right this is straight from your own linked info.



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 07:01 PM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 





Here's what a tracer aerosol generator looks like


And here is what one actually does..


Calibration of Measuring Instruments

The droplet size and output concentration of ATM aerosol generators makes them suitable for dispersing PSL size standards for instrument calibration (particle sizers, optical particle counters and photometers). Filter Testing Product quality assurance and safety aspects require regular testing of high-efficiency filters, certification of laminar air flow boxes and clean room measurements in general.
For this purpose a suitable test aerosol needs to be generated as atmospheric aerosols or ambient air do not have stable particle size or concentration. VDI-guideline 3491 suggests using aerosol generators to produce test aerosols in a definite manner. Aerosol generators producing highly concentrated aerosols, whose mean particle size is close to the most penetrating particle size (MPPS) allow leak locations to be found in a quicker time. Using an oil aerosol material (DEHS, DOP, PAO, Emery 3004) provides long term stability due to the lack of evaporation which can over time alter the size of aerosols generated from a solution with volatile solvent.


www.laborpraxis.vogel.de...

Funny thing I haven't read or even seen anything that remotely describes or even hints toward aerosol generators having anything to do with chemtrails.


Good Job again.



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:17 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 09:18 PM
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reply to post by tsurfer2000h
 


Read my post.
edit on 26-4-2011 by charlespearl because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 26 2011 @ 11:48 PM
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This video discusses cloud seeding with smart dust = more chemtrails




posted on Apr, 27 2011 @ 11:54 AM
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Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
This video discusses cloud seeding with smart dust = more chemtrails



Oh goody, more crap and conjecture from Tanker Enemy.

How many times have they been caught lying already? Like when they intentionally misidentify aircraft, and mislabel aircraft parts as spray nozzels?



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 09:03 AM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 

Hello, I am a good sky watcher from the Southern Hemisphere. I also have a good eye for colour & spent 3 months from Nov 2010 till Feb 2011 criss crossing the USA. West coast, East Coast, West Coast, East Coast, Canada to Florida etc. I was puzzled by your sky as it was such a different shade of Blue & almost sparkled. The sky towards the sunsets were very dazzling. I was very intrigued by the trails in the sky & their close straight lines at times. The height of these were much higher than I would normally see clouds so determined that they were in the lower stratosphere. At times I saw them forming but could not sight the plane & they stayed many hours at times before merging with each other. Did a little research & i was convinced that a trial of dielectric aerosols was taking place.
I know now that the USA is one of the only non-signatories to the UN convention that prevents this so I still think it is possible that a trial has been conducted as it has been widely discussed as a solution to AGW. The rayleigh effect fits from what I know. A trial was due to take place 2010-early 2011 sponsored by B.G who was stumping up many millions of his own. Paul J Crutzen has published a few papers with costings etc.
I don't believe it is harmful to a persons health if they are experimenting with (Physics-Based Modulation of Global Change)
I am more concerned about economic changes inflicted by the new religion of AGW being inflicted on my country. Some in the USA are the smart ones who see through this new religion.
Hope this helps.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 10:16 AM
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reply to post by MathiasAndrew
 



No.....what that video shows is that without a doubt, "Andrew", you DON'T understand science very well....


This video discusses cloud seeding with smart dust = more chemtrails


Did you even watch and LISTEN to it?

For those who haven't....basically, there is a nano-tech invention that can be tracked via GPS....called "MEMS" for "Micro-Electro Mechanical Sensors".....and, that tech can be altered (calling it "GEMS", the "G" for "geo") in a conceptual idea....a CONCEPT, a PROPOSAL, a POSSIBLE method, in FUTURE to.....do what?

NO, not to "seed clouds". "Andy", that is a lie on your part....or, a complete misunderstanding of the video, and what was presented.

No.....the idea is that these tiny particles can be distributed and then allow researchers, and weather forecasters, unprecedented INSIGHT into the Earth's atmosphere behavior and patterns.

Methods of delivery? Right now, currently --- an estimated 2,000 weather balloons ("radiosondes") are launched every day. Proposal is to (perhaps) up that to as many as 10,000. (These could be equipped to release the "GEMS"). In addition, it postulates some sort of "floating platforms" (not clear on the "how") way up in the stratosphere (so, above commercial airline traffic).

And, the mention of spacecraft and aircraft were made, too. But, in EVERY case, these would be machines and systems specifically designed, and tasked, for this purpose. Ultimately, the main force driving such a project will be the COST!! And, balloons, at first glance, seem obviously the cheapest by far.

In any case, "Andrew"....this is yet again an epic fail in trying to "prove" any of the assertions of the so-called (and totally non-existent) "chem"-trails......


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I had a thought, for people to possibly relate. Anyone remember the Spielberg motion picture "Twister"??

Think back, to that scene, where they are trying to deposit a can full of little sensors, so that the tornado will pick it up, and the individual units will disperse...so the scientists can track the internal structure, via wind patterns, of the funnel cloud.

THAT was like an early concept, and future tech improvements in miniaturization allow for even more sophisticated methods....

edit on 29 April 2011 by weedwhacker because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:13 PM
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reply to post by madscientistintraining
 


CHEMICAL trails come from the engine turbines of a plane, and form clouds which can en mass entirely cover a portion of the sky.

don't believe me? go ahead, spend an hour or so watching real planes in the very real sky above your real head.

Alright, how's y'all doing? Im new here, nice to meet all of ya, Anyway..

The exhaust of a plane engine, does last more than a minute in the sky, HOWEVER, The planes that release chem-trails, have lasted longer than an hour in the sky. I have WATCHED atleast THREE different planes this week, One of which was a passenger plane passing over, I didn't see any smoke that mass entirely covered a portion of the sky.. The third day of the week, I saw a Chemtrail plane. Let me explain. When the plane released it's chemtrail, The chem-trail lasts ALOT longer than the exhaust of the plane

Try this... Look at one with a telescope, or binoculars to get a closer look at one. You can literally see the vapor coming out of the nozzles on the plane.. These planes, release EXHAUST from burning gasses like every other plane, but normally EXHAUST Does NOT last more than a minute in the sky, if it does, it'd be a real thin stream of exhaust.

Now compare that with a chem-trail plane. The "exhaust" from it, lasts longer than an hour, or up to an hour, maybe even a little less than an hour. I don't know, never really timed it.... Thanks for reading.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:52 PM
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reply to post by Justdoofus
 


Welcome....

...but, sorry no....you are mistaken. Of course, IF you actually produced a photograph, to show what you describe and (thought) you "saw"?:


....binoculars to get a closer look at one. You can literally see the vapor coming out of the nozzles on the plane....


No....no nozzles. Excepting in the case of most wide-bodies ("jumbo jets") that have fuel dumping plumbing installed. And then, only when and if they are actually dumping fuel! (Very rare occurrence....).

And, in the specifically designed airplanes that operate to dispense things like pesticides and any other low-altitude operations involving target applications of substances to limited areas on the ground.

Of course, there exists "cloud seeding" technologies, of various types too. Still, not likely to be observable by you (or anyone) from the ground, due to the nature of the activity (usually in or above already existing clouds).

I may have missed a few more prosaic examples....can't be all-inclusive in each post. But, suffice to say, high-altitude jets make CONTRAILS, but not in every instance. And, the CONTRAILS will vary greatly in appearance and shape and time of persistence, and how they evolve and develop over time. The atmosphere is a very dynamic place.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by Justdoofus
reply to post by madscientistintraining
 


CHEMICAL trails come from the engine turbines of a plane, and form clouds which can en mass entirely cover a portion of the sky.

don't believe me? go ahead, spend an hour or so watching real planes in the very real sky above your real head.



Yes, they're called contrails. We've known that for 80 years
But some still refuse to accept it.



posted on Apr, 29 2011 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by Justdoofus
...These planes, release EXHAUST from burning gasses like every other plane, but normally EXHAUST Does NOT last more than a minute in the sky, if it does, it'd be a real thin stream of exhaust.

Now compare that with a chem-trail plane. The "exhaust" from it, lasts longer than an hour, or up to an hour, maybe even a little less than an hour. I don't know, never really timed it.... Thanks for reading.


Technically it is mostly exhaust gasses, but those exhaust gasses are primarily water vapor (plus a few other more nasty things). The water vapor is created by the engines burning hydrocarbon fuel. During the combustion process, the oxygen from the air is chemically bonded to the hydrogen in the fuel, thus creating H2O -- water.

However, depending on the conditions, the other impurities in the exhaust can act like a "magnet" in a way and attracting the water vapor already in the atmosphere by giving it something to "grab on to", and thus causing that vapor already in the air to condense out of the air. That's what happens when a very thick persistent CONtrail forms.

This persistent contrail is mostly water vapor and is almost identical to a cloud, so that's why persistent contrails often spread out and form into cirrus clouds.

edit on 4/29/2011 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 02:13 AM
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reply to post by Justdoofus
 


Your really posted your first post in the midst of a long standing argument.

There seems to be very little middle ground. There are those like me, mat, cyote, tec, etc... who clearly agree with you. And those who can not agree like weed etc and paid disinformation agents who you will know by their techniques once you learn them... so 3 camps of people here.

We (who believe there is geoengineering going on) have proven there is So2 and carbon in ALL jet airline gas which is clearly having an effect as shown by several peer reviewed science papers... as much as 2 degrees. We have not ben able to proven mass geoengineering though... just tests, and aluminum and barium spraying for military operations. I have a project i am in the process of working on which will hopefully show some results. I will post my results when I get them done.



posted on Apr, 30 2011 @ 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by pianopraze
...We (who believe there is geoengineering going on) have proven there is So2 and carbon in ALL jet airline gas which is clearly having an effect as shown by several peer reviewed science papers... as much as 2 degrees...

Well, obviously airplane engine exhaust adds to air pollution -- just like automobile exhaust and factory smokestacks/industrial emissions. However, that doesn't really tell us that contrails are chemtrails -- i.e., that they are trails being laid with the express intention of putting materials into the atmosphere.

While contrails are mostly water vapor, there is definitely also some nasty stuff besides water that is in a contrail -- just like there is nasty stuff besides water vapor in a car exhaust Theoretically, car exhaust should be about 50% water vapor, but can engines don't run at optimal efficiency, so it's usually less than 25% water. Jet engines burn hydrocarbon fuel differently and are extremely efficient. Therefore jet exhaust, pound for pound, is typically "cleaner" than automobile exhaust.

Admittedly, even the water vapor in a contrail could potentially add to global warming. Water vapor is a greenhouse gas, acting like a blanket that traps in heat. Also, the clouds that could be created by normal persistent airline contrails could contribute to cloudier days, which is usually not good for agriculture.

However, I do NOT believe these potentially harmful effects caused by airline travel are being done intentionally. By that, I mean with the express intent of causing pollution and global warming -- just like when you drive your car, you are not doing so to intentionally add to the air pollution problem. I see these issues as simply an unfortunate by-product of the huge increase in airline travel.

edit on 4/30/2011 by Soylent Green Is People because: (no reason given)





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