Stratospheric Aerosol Geo-engineering aka "Chemtrails" DEBUNK THIS !!!!

reply to post by djcarlosa

Normal water vapor contrails have been known to be able to persist for hours and spread out to create cloud cover since the beginnings of high altitude flight. This is not new. In addition, ever since to growth of the "jet age" and the airline industry in the late 1950s through the 1960s, farmers have been commenting about the reduction of sunlight caused by CONtrails that can eventually become clouds. The idea that increased air traffic can create contrails that become clouds and reduce sunlight has been known for several decades, and has been increasing as the popularity of air travel increases.

The idea that a person can tell the difference between a contrail and chemtrail by looking at it does not hold up under scrutiny, because the characteristics people attribute to the look of alleged "chemtrails" are also the same characteristics of contrails.

As for the "silent" aircraft, I don't have an exact answer because I don't know of specific circumstances of the planes you are talking about. Suffice it to say, though, that depending on the location of the plane relative to you (in a path that takes it right overhead, a little closer to the horizon, at the horizon, etc.), it is very possible for a normal airline jet to be seen but not heard. Plus, (obviously) considering that a jet is 5 to 7 miles up, one passing overhead is not heard until it has already passed overhead. I know this last part is obvious, but I felt I needed to include it to be thorough.

Originally posted by djcarlosa
OK I see that this subject as with a few others that I'm interested in seam to have the most debunkers and I have to say that to me that's like raising a red flag.
I live in the UK and I know what is a normal contrail left by commercial aircraft's and what I'm seeing up in the sky are definitely not those

Well I live in the UK and I know what is a normal contrail left commercial aircraft and what I'm seeing up is the sky is definitely those.

also another point I would like to make here is that when a plane goes over you hear the sound it makes

I would say that I do not hear 99% of commercial aircraft I see fly over here - even when they are low enough to readily identify the airline. Mainly due to either wind or background noise.

It's actually quite weird being up in the Highlands and hearing an airliner flying 6 miles overhead!

Some of the hundreds of photos I have taken of contrails over the years can be seen in the link in my Sig. I bet your so-called chemtrails look exactly the same

Originally posted by Essan
reply to post by Seagle

 

The question you should be asking is why would people put up a video on the internet with a fake translation? Why are they trying to mislead you?

And why do people keep falling for it?

I think I may have a the solution to convince you that you are on the wrong side of the argument. Remember when you posted this a few days ago?

posted on 3-3-2011 @ 08:17 AM this post They are very obviously normal contrails produced by some of the hundreds of commercial aircraft that have been flying over Britain this morning.

Frankly, this outbreak of contrailophobia is not only very childish but very, very boring

Now I think its fair to say that when most people find something to be 'very, very boring' they usually stop doing it and move on to something else. Admittedly, things like employment, military service, a jail term and marriage can be exceptions to the rule but when its voluntary and you can opt out anytime, any sane person is going to move on.

So you were not just bored but very, very bored 8 days ago yet here you are still going strong today on every current Chemtrail thread where you have probably gone close to out-posting everyone else. So I have come to the conclusion that the reason you don't believe in Chemtrails must be because you don't actually get out much? Maybe ever? Extract yourself from that chair and get outside my friend and experience the beautiful haze and take a deep breath of the thing formerly known as fresh air, Aaaaahhhhhhh.

You see those of us that know Chemtrails exist don't need to see you tube videos because we have seen them many times with our own eyes. Most people noticed the rapid increase in the appearance of these in the skies long before they saw any documentary or went looking for answers on the internet only to find people from all over the world seeing the same thing. So those of you who think you are the global vision police and feel that you can convince us that there is nothing to see here are seriously off the planet. You are basically saying to people that they are only seeing these now because they obviously never looked at the sky for the first 20,30 or 40 odd years of their lives.

Maybe you're just lucky and it has happened over your house, every day for weeks at a time like it does for many people. Those who are now experiencing this and feel lucky if they get to see the sun 2 or 3 times a month know its happening. You see it and then you see all the patents filed relating to it and all the money being thrown into research you have all the proof you need. As the saying goes, where there's chemical smoke, there's fire

From my personal perspective, I know they exist and i assure you that I have never watched the documentary 'what the hell are they spraying' and have watched very few of the videos people post everywhere. Dont need to.

i have ms and therefore do not type well. i just read an article:www.fromthewilderness.com...

this is the part that made a ding! with me:

Dr. Rosalie Bertell depicts HAARP as "a gigantic heater that can cause major disruption in the ionosphere, creating not just holes, but long incisions in the protective layer that keeps deadly radiation from bombarding the planet."

hmmmmm? radiation...

absorbtion...

x-rays...

barium...

dont know if this train has been posted yet; if so, i apologize in advace...

Originally posted by Seagle
I have come to the conclusion that the reason you don't believe in Chemtrails must be because you don't actually get out much? Maybe ever? Extract yourself from that chair and get outside my friend and experience the beautiful haze and take a deep breath of the thing formerly known as fresh air, Aaaaahhhhhhh.

You see those of us that know Chemtrails exist don't need to see you tube videos because we have seen them many times with our own eyes.

So when did I take all those photos in the link in my sig?

I do get out a lot and look at the sky far more than most people, You could say it's my passion

reply to post by egregore


There are a fair number of "pseudo"-scientists who have jumped on this "HAARP" bandwagon.

They apparently read, and completely misinterpret the information. With hysterical consequences.

(Hysteria, as in rampant and unfounded concern....and, hysterical as humorous, too....in that alleged "scientists" simply get it so wrong).

A basic flaw seen often, and in that (along with many) articles is: They rightly refer to the ionosphere, as the level of the "atmosphere" that HAARP is designed to interact with....but, they make the incredibly incorrect assertions that the ionosphere also directly affects weather!

What is amazing is it only takes minimal research to realize that the ionosphere is many dozens of kilometers above the parts of the atmosphere where weather actually develops, and occurs. The troposphere....above that, is a very thin region called the tropopause, and then starts the stratosphere.

The only weather activity that occurs above the tropopause is when the occasional very strong development of active cumulus clouds build with such energy that they rise that high....and above the tropopause (which normally acts as a sort of natural barrier). Those types of storms expend their energy rather quickly, though...matter of hours, and collapse and deconstruct.

Since the ionosphere is just a layer of charged particles (ions) it has RADIO wave reflective capabilities....and is the reason that lower radio bands (lower frequencies, longer waves) can "bounce" and travel around the curve of the globe, in stead of being limited by direct line-of-sight. These are what Ham Radio hobbyists use.....and there are also military communications aspects that come into play too.

HAARP is comparatively quite weak, in power output....think of this: The Sun is incredibly more powerful than anything humans can build, in terms of energy output. The Sun is the primary reason for the ionosphere, in the first place....its energetic particle radiation energizes the ions. And, if the SUN can't alter our weather, just from energizing the ions, then how can HAARP (at a puny fraction of the power) do anything to weather?? Doesn't matter which side of the ionosphere you are on, either.

The Sun does, of course, affect weather...in other ways. Its incredible amount of infrared radiation (heat) is the major supplier of the energy in storms.....either directly, or indirectly, as storms extract the energy from the heat of the land, or oceans...it is a very complex relationship, but it IS Nature, and self-correcting and evolves along in the same ways it has continued to do for millennia......

reply to post by weedwhacker


And you know all about HAARP don't you? You're an expert on HAARP aren't you? Just like you're an expert on Chemtrails. Oh but wait I thought they were all just a hoax? Sounds like you just blew your cover to me.

reply to post by weedwhacker


The Suns energy doesn't travel in a scalar wave. It's also not directly focused on a small area. HAARP may be weak compared to the energy output of the Sun but it's function and the type of energy output is totally different.

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

The Suns energy doesn't travel in a scalar wave. It's also not directly focused on a small area. HAARP may be weak compared to the energy output of the Sun but it's function and the type of energy output is totally different.

Ahhh, getting your science from conspiracy crackpot sites I see. And if you think HAARP is some supersecret facility ran by the military, you are sorely mistaken.

reply to post by firepilot


You're the only crackpot when it comes to science and you have no idea where I get my information from. You should keep your ignorant opinions to yourself.

How would you know any information about what HAARP is or the facility?

Get some facts about HAARP
www.haarp.alaska.edu...

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
Get some facts about HAARP
www.haarp.alaska.edu...

OK -- so HAARP studies of the uppermost portion of the atmosphere (the ionosphere) by transmitting high power radio frequencies to temporarily excite a parts of the ionosphere, then analyzes the results. This is done in hopes of developing ionospheric radio communications, and creating better surveillance systems (possibly for missile detection?)

...But what does the information provided in that link have to do with the "many of the contrails we see are actually chemtrails" argument? What does it have to do with weather modification at all?

It seems that the research being done by HAARP has intriguing and useful potential for the military (communications and surveillance) and for U.S. national security in general, but how specifically is it being used for weather modification?

Originally posted by MathiasAndrew
Get some facts about HAARP
www.haarp.alaska.edu...

EXACTLY.

Its such a super secret facility involved in all kinds of nefarious stuff, that it has a webpage, on the University of Alaska website, and its the University of Alaska that runs it. And nothing on that webpage supports any of the conspiracy types that get drawn to it.

And you certainly did not get anything about "Scalar" from there, you got it from some crackpot site. And there is n

Wow that was really fast for you all to jump on me just goes to show that there must be some truth in this as for you saying that I can't tell the difference between contrails and chem trails is rather insulting.
I live in a very quiet part of the UK so there is hardly any background noise here and the chem trails are only used on clear sunny days so wind is not a real factor.
I have spent most of my life watching the sky's and I therefore know what is normal plane trails look like and up till a year ago that is what I saw in the sky.
Now the trails are not normal at all and you can't tell me that plane routes criss cross the sky in like a lattice pattern when there is only one plane route that passes over where I live.
Also I would like to point out that until a year ago I never saw clouds cover the sky so quickly after planes went over and now within 30 min's of this lattice pattern occurring the sky is completely covered in clouds when it was a cloudless day to start with.
Now I know that most airlines are using the same planes they where 5 to ten years ago so therefore I can deduce that it is not commercial planes responsible for these chem trails so as any educated person would notice the difference.
Also I will finish by saying that if you are so sure that chem trails do not exist then why waste your time and energy posting on a subject that you don't believe in.
I must thankyou though because the more you attack threads like this the more people we begin to believe the truth after all the time and energy you are putting in here just shows that you know the truth but don't want us to know.

reply to post by djcarlosa


NO....

Wow that was really fast for you all to jump on me just goes to show that there must be some truth in this as for you saying that I can't tell the difference between contrails and chem trails is rather insulting.

No...you can't. And, there isn't any "truth" to "chem"-trails....only ignorance. See it too often, in these threads, and it is sad, sometimes....people are wasting their energies over nothing at all. Because, there are no such things as "chem"-trails....you just see nothing but contrails, every time. You have been brainwashed / influenced by this hoax.

I have spent most of my life watching the sky's and I therefore know what is normal plane trails look like and up till a year ago that is what I saw in the sky.

Let me guess....your memory is biased....because of this "chem"-trail topic. Cart before the horse, here....

Now the trails are not normal at all ....

"normal" will vary, from day to day --- even hour-by-hour too.

...and you can't tell me that plane routes criss cross the sky in like a lattice pattern when there is only one plane route that passes over where I live.

NO....there are far more "plane routes" than you realize, obviously. This is something we so so often, from laypeople who are uneducated about the reality of modern aviation. This will start to teach you a bit, visually (I'll wager you've never seen it?):



And, this website for future references....live flight tracking. (You can also use it when you know people who are travelling, if you want to watch their progress throughout....):

www.flightradar24.com...

reply to post by djcarlosa

as for you saying that I can't tell the difference between contrails and chem trails is rather insulting.

Good morning Carlos,

As an avid sky watcher, aviation, and meteorology enthusiast myself, I am curious as to what methods you employ to identify and differentiate persistent contrails from chemical spray trails?

Also, are the methods you use an industry standard used among meteorologists and the scientific community or is it an exclusive method created by yourself?

All the best

Originally posted by djcarlosa
Wow that was really fast for you all to jump on me just goes to show that there must be some truth in this as for you saying that I can't tell the difference between contrails and chem trails is rather insulting...

I don't quite understand your logic...

...It seems you are gauging the amount of supposed "truth" that is in what you say by how quickly someone can find fault with what you say? Please explain how THAT logic works.

When someone says something that is patently wrong, such as that they can see a visually spot a alleged chemtrail due to characteristics that (as they say) cannot be attributed to contrails, of course others will quickly come and point out the errors in what you are saying.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Thankyou for the site you just posted it was most helpful as it showed that where I live has only the one route that goes over which was as I said earlier so it just proves to me that the planes being used to spray these trails across the sky are not commercial planes.
Now I know that it is very hard to be able to prove that what is being sprayed without the use of a plane to get samples but I trust my eyes and if you've every seen the red arrows display team when they do there coloured sprays you see a trail similar to the ones I'm seeing and you can't tell me that those are normal contrails.
The red arrows have tanks that SPRAY out a coloured liquid which gives you the coloured trails as they cross in the sky.
I will finish by saying that the more time you spend trying to discredit me or all the other people that are seeing what's going on the sky's above just confirms what we already know.

Originally posted by djcarlosa
...Thankyou for the site you just posted it was most helpful as it showed that where I live has only the one route that goes over which was as I said earlier so it just proves to me that the planes being used to spray these trails across the sky are not commercial planes...

One air route can have several "lanes".

reply to post by djcarlosa

but I trust my eyes and if you've every seen the red arrows display team when they do there coloured sprays you see a trail similar to the ones I'm seeing and you can't tell me that those are normal contrails. The red arrows have tanks that SPRAY out a coloured liquid which gives you the coloured trails as they cross in the sky.

You are 100% correct that The Red Arrows smoke trails are not normal contrails.

The smoke trails left by the team are made by releasing diesel into the exhaust; this oxidises straight away, leaving a white smoke trail. Dyes can be added to produce the red and blue colour. The diesel is stored in the pod on the underside of the plane; designed to carry a 30 mm ADEN cannon, it now houses three tanks: one 50-gallon tank of pure diesel and two 10-gallon tanks of blue- and red-dyed diesel. The smoke system uses ten gallons per minute; therefore each plane can trail smoke for a total of seven minutes – 5 minutes of white smoke, 1 minute of blue and 1 minute of red.

Red Arrows

Big difference between a SMOKE trail and a CONDENSATION vapor trail.