Ladies. Women and children last says God?

Dear Greatest I am,
I am very grateful to you for responding. I am paying close attention to your questions which everyone should (or has to?) face. I have a couple of thoughts.

Originally posted by Greatest I am

If on earth as it is in heaven is to have meaning, should mankind reverse it‘s, to me, much better standard, or should we maintain our moral position and condemn the God who prefers to have his son be murdered instead of stepping up himself for the hard duty?

Of course you know that what you are referring to in your quote is commonly known as the Lord's Prayer. What comes before the words you quoted are "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done..." Jesus is saying that he accepts God's will and that we should pray the same way. Further it's fairly clear that God's will should be done on earth, just as it is in heaven. Not that what God does in heaven should be done on earth, but that God's will should be done everywhere. It certainly doesn't mean that the things done on earth are, or should be, done in Heaven. It was God's will that Jesus come to earth, and the rest follows.

You are right that everyone chooses their own path, but centuries of Christians have decided that the Bible can be believed without doing violence to the intellect. Yes, there is some belief involved, but that's true in any moral system. Christians should be challenged, and they should have an answer to that challenge.

Forgive me for rambling but I wanted to send something off quickly to keep the lines of communication open.

Originally posted by charles1952
Dear Greatest I am,
I am very grateful to you for responding. I am paying close attention to your questions which everyone should (or has to?) face. I have a couple of thoughts.

Originally posted by Greatest I am

If on earth as it is in heaven is to have meaning, should mankind reverse it‘s, to me, much better standard, or should we maintain our moral position and condemn the God who prefers to have his son be murdered instead of stepping up himself for the hard duty?

Of course you know that what you are referring to in your quote is commonly known as the Lord's Prayer. What comes before the words you quoted are "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done..." Jesus is saying that he accepts God's will and that we should pray the same way. Further it's fairly clear that God's will should be done on earth, just as it is in heaven. Not that what God does in heaven should be done on earth, but that God's will should be done everywhere. It certainly doesn't mean that the things done on earth are, or should be, done in Heaven. It was God's will that Jesus come to earth, and the rest follows.

You are right that everyone chooses their own path, but centuries of Christians have decided that the Bible can be believed without doing violence to the intellect. Yes, there is some belief involved, but that's true in any moral system. Christians should be challenged, and they should have an answer to that challenge.

Forgive me for rambling but I wanted to send something off quickly to keep the lines of communication open.

You would need to define violence to the intellect but to me, having to believe in talking animals and a water walking immortal God who can somehow die for his lowly creatures is quite unhealthy for the intellect.

This rather exemplifies that .

www.youtube.com...

Regards
DL

reply to post by Greatest I am


Dear Greatest I am,
I'm sorry that I can't give you a more full response right now, but I wanted to thank you for sending that video link. Besides be a strong argument, it was a powerful performance. I noticed that, to the very end, God's existence wasn't denied, there was only criticism of His actions.

I happen to believe that miracles are possible. Something that our science can't account for? That's easy for me to believe.

Are we done with the discussion about the Father's and Son's roles at the crucifixion? I don't mind either way.

Thanks again for your kindness and thoughtfulness.

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

Dear Greatest I am,
I'm sorry that I can't give you a more full response right now, but I wanted to thank you for sending that video link. Besides be a strong argument, it was a powerful performance. I noticed that, to the very end, God's existence wasn't denied, there was only criticism of His actions.

I happen to believe that miracles are possible. Something that our science can't account for? That's easy for me to believe.

Are we done with the discussion about the Father's and Son's roles at the crucifixion? I don't mind either way.

Thanks again for your kindness and thoughtfulness.

I don't know. Was God right or wrong to have his son murdered?

Regards
DL

Dear Greatest I am,

Good question, all I can give you is my answer (which I think is shared by some others). I blend two analogies in my mind in order to try to understand this.

One is the soldier who covers a grenade with his body in order to shield his comrades, or the Secret Service agent trained and willing to take a bullet for the President, It seems there are times when it is seen as noble or heroic to make that kind of total sacrifice for others.

The other is suspect who has been found guilty of some offense and fined $25,000. As it happens the offender is homeless and has no money. But a voice from the back of the courtroom says "I'll pay the fine." and the offender walks free.

We have fouled ourselves up terribly. I think it is partly our fault and partly the fault of an evil force or tendency that we listen to more than we should. We have screwed things up so badly that we have lost any chance to have happiness in our future lives (or manifestations, or what have you).

As in the man in the courtroom, I believe we have had the charge, or fault taken care of at the cost of the soldier throwing himself on the grenade.

Is it right? Not in any normal sense of the word. We screwed up, we should take the punishment. Innocence shouldn't suffer. No it's not right, but it is love. I am grateful for that. For me, the gratitude and love that I feel is the solid core of my religion, the rest is much less significant.

Anyway, thanks for your time.

reply to post by charles1952


Thank you.

I will just say the one thing and then leave a link for you to ponder.

To your grenade scenario. For it to be accurate with the story of Jesus. God would have put the grenade there and told Jesus to jump on instead of him making it disappear as he certainly could do or at least doing the right thing and jumping on it himself instead of sending a boy to do a man's job.

www.youtube.com...

Regards
DL