Homophobes:: GET A CLUE!!!

Originally posted by doom27
Sorry but that's BS. Sexuality is a choice, you are born to reproduce, all life is, trees, dogs, cats, bacteria. You were not BORN to be gay, you just like to be gay. Is there anything wrong with that? NO But there is something wrong is defying simple logic.

Its your PREFERENCE to be gay, in other words a choice.

You do understand that homosexuality exists in other species, right? It's been observed in dolphins, deer, monkeys, apes, chickens, frogs blah blah, are you really saying they all made a choice? And further consider what you are saying, if it's a choice then you could easily choose to have sex with someone of your own gender right? I'm guessing the idea of doing so disgusts you, i know i couldn't have sex with another guy, and yet if it's a choice then surely it should be easy right?

Please don't claim to use logic when you have barely thought your argument through.

Originally posted by doom27
Why don't you stop blaming your mother and father's genes and stand up for yourself?

You WANT to be gay so you ARE gay.

By saying you were "born" that way, you are pretty much saying you don't want to be and had no choice. No you have a choice. I chose to be straight. You chose to be gay. Its that simple.

Again if being gay is a choice then being straight must be a choice. So as you were growing up did you decide to be straight? If so then you must have had sexual urges toward both sexes, if you never had sexual urges toward the same sex then it's not a choice, you were born straight.

I was born straight, the OP was brn gay, it's not that hard to understand, it is quite logical and guess what we have evidence that the brains of gay and straight people are slightly different. This doesn't mean they're less intelligent btw in case that thought crossed your mind.

Scans see 'gay brain differences'

In other words, structurally, at least, the brains of gay men were more like heterosexual women, and gay women more like heterosexual men.

Explains a lot doesn't it.

reply to post by mizbeach40


Let's see, so you are wanting to see ATS ban:

homophobes
ultra religious
normal & straight
Bible
Koran
Bible verses
God
hateful rants

Anything else? So what will we discuss then?

What makes ATS great is that ALL are encouraged to speak their mind here as long as it is done within the constraints of the T&C. If you believe someone has violated the T&C you can click on ALERT and immediately notify ATS of any gross violations. I have used it and it works. You need not get into a hissy-fit with violators, as you will then be a part of the problem.

I DO NOT believe ATS should "ban" anything being discussed here within the confines of the T&C. I am aware of hurtful situations in which some have attempted censorship of others. I worked for a large corporation that had a homosexual girl who had falsely accused numerous men who she disliked. She would file false charges with human resources about conversations she had overheard between one employee to another, thus putting these men's jobs and future promtions in danger. This all on hearsay accusations that did not even involve the homesexual girl in question.

Bottom line is keep ATS an open forum just like it is...

reply to post by doom27


Granted that homosexuality is arguable as a species' survival characteristic (I say arguable because given the insane overpopulation of this planet by humans, homosexuality, which will slow the growth rate, can easily be considered as contributing to the survival of the species), what difference does it make if a person's sexual orientation is a choice or not?

Everybody makes choices with which other people are uncomfortable. Big WAAH! As long as the situation is one of fully competent adults making fully consensual choices, the details of those choices are not relevant, nor anybody else's business.

reply to post by mizbeach40


yep, i have thought about this for a while, i am a straight , patriotic guy who agrees with several world leaders that multiculturalism hasnt worked (bare with me here), having different races interbreeding creates, IMO, division in communities, so i would like to make a comparison with your OP.......gay couples who choose to have /adopt/IVF a child are welcoming into the world, something that may not be accepted in 20-40 years time ,and we may well have another division in the world as we do with multiculture atm. It is unfortunate that the majority of people choose religion as law ,otherwise we could all live happily ever after

reply to post by Turkenstein


I was raised Catholic, so yes I know scripture.

I do believe in an all loving GOD.

DO I still go to church? No. I think that would make me hypocritical, to praise something that hates me. I do not need a building to pray.

My ...rant....was more of a response to what I was reading here on ATS. I normally do not pay attention to those who don't understand or hate. I know we are all human, with all of our own upbringing and teachings or lessons learned. To get angry only fuels their hatred more. But obviously I was compelled to say ....something......because someone needed too.

Not condoning or approving homosexual behavior does not make one a homophobe.

Very true. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, even prejudices...

However, if and when it crosses the line into hate speech or violations of the terms & conditions, please notify staff, as we do not condone that kind of behavior (i.e. advocating violence on a group of people, etc.).

More power to you Mizbeach!

I remember in elementary school over 30 years ago, a classmate who was not as "macho" and "boyish" as the rest of us. He just wasn't into playing "kill the guy with the ball" or "king of the mountain." That classmate got teased and abused and pushed around incessantly. *I'm proud to this day to say that I never took part, and that in fact, I interfered on his behalf more than a few times. (Being an immigrant, I knew what it was like to be a little different. -- I wasn't targeted because I kicked the heck out of the first two guys who tried to tease me and it never happened again - except on my fourth day in high school, where again I obliterated the guy that tried to start something with me.)

The thing is, that classmate didn't go around telling everybody he was gay. He didn't walk or talk like a queen, and he didn't have a "proud to be gay" button on his shirt. We all just knew. I can't imagine the frustration, confusion, sadness, anger... that that kid must have gone through, beyond elementary school, high school, college..... and on to the day when he accepted himself and was proud to tell the world "screw you, this is who I am!"

Mizbeach, many of the comments here support you, but in others you're being accused of "ranting" and touting your "pride" and shouting out your "gayness," and you're being told that it's okay to be gay, but keep it to yourself. In NYC where I live, I see gay men and women dozens of times every single day. Sure, some are over the top in showing it, but the vast majority don't.

It's very easy for others to get on a high horse and say, "be gay but don't show it," but when an entire culture is constantly ranting against gays, you have every right to say Enough!

reply to post by mizbeach40


I'm sorry, but while I have absolutely no problems with anyone's sexuality, you are going to be taken considerably less seriously simply due to the tone of your post. What is the necessity for constant capitalization and exclamation marks? When I first read your post, I pictured a lunatic screaming at me about the Bible, homosexuality and gay rights. That doesn't add to your credibility, nor does it make you much better than those you are constantly judging and criticizing yourself.

I understand frustration and the need to prove a point, however a well thought out post will get your point across and you will also be taken a lot more seriously.

Disagreement is one thing, condemnation is another. Gay or straight, religious or atheist, liberal or conservative, it always makes me a little sad anytime a person clings fervently to an identity and consistently condemns that which is different rather than seek to understand it. I find myself wondering if their beliefs are in earnest or if they are born of fear, confusion or indoctrination. None of us can be sure of anything in this world except our own humanity and fallibility

Originally posted by mizbeach40
I have been on this site for about 6 months, and I used to enjoy it, but am totally disheartened as of late due to "certain peoples" views....

I know ALOT of you "ultra religeous " folks will send me hate mail. But I really do not care.!!!!

I am an Openly Gay female, and I am proud. What I am IS NOT a choice!!! I WAS BORN THIS WAY!!! I spent the first 25 years of my life "trying" to be "normal and straight". All it gave me was pain, missery, depression, alcohol and drug abuse. I had BOTH homocidal and suicidal thoughts on a daily basis.
When I finally accepted who and what I am, my life began! I have had success in all aspects of my life since that day of acceptance. I no longer drink, or do drugs, and am extremely happy.

To hate something just because a Bible, Koran, etc. tells you to, is ridiculous. It is natural for you to NOT UNDERSTAND, but it is WRONG of you to judge me based on how I live my life. I am NOT hurting you, or your family. I am not killing babies, or raping your land. SO leave ME and MY KIND alone!

I cannot believe anyone would waste their time posting Bible verses on here, to denounce homosexuality, but yet think it is OK to kill millions of innocents in the name of ANY "GOD".

You say God hates me, and is gonna send me to hell. FINE! Let that happen. LET GOD judge me WHEN I DIE!!! It is between me and him. NOT YOU!!! And for the record, I refuse to believe in "any GOD" that says ...Love they neighbor....but then turns a blind eye on his "gay children". That IS NOT A GOD.....and certainly not a "God " that I would waste my time worshiping. You should know, that "GOD" does not make mistakes. To say I am an abomination, is the same as saying a developmentally disabled child is too.

I DO NOT have sex with animals, nor do I know anyone who does. And for the record, statistics show that 91% of all pedifiles and rapist, necropheliacs and beastiality practicers are STRAIGHT white collar males. Before you lump people into a group, you should really do your research first.

Instead of posting your hateful rants, why not spend your time feeding the hungry or helping the homeless. keep your "religious" views to yourself. Because in the BOOK OF MARK, it says "he who does my judging for me shall he himself BURN IN HELL".. So I guess I will be seeing you in the firey pit someday! Bring your sunblock and that box of tissues!!!

First of all by definition the word homophobe doesn't even mean anything.... Am I afraid of "sameness"? No. Am I afraid of homogenized milk? No. Do I believe that homosexuality is wrong? Yes. Do I hate you? No. I commit sins every day, although I do my best to keep from it. But according to the Bible, this puts me in the same category as you. Thats the beauty of the Bible. We are ALL sinners, and are all on the same playing field. What makes this great, is that we are all also offered the same unconditional forgiveness!

You should take time to talk to people who truly believe and at least try to practice the principles of the Bible rather than lump us in with all the crazies. In your disdain for all those who believe the Bible based on predetermined stereotypes, you are no different then them. The people that you are referring to who claim that you are going to burn in an extra hot hell more than anyone else for your lifestyle are no more Christlike than members of radical Islam, perverting and distorting a religion to their own benefit.

To reiterate, yes I believe it is wrong, science will also tell you that despite tireless searching, there is no "gay gene" Yes, people can be predisposed to be more feminine or masculine, which can make it easier to believe that they were destined to be the opposite gender, but this does not make them "born gay". I just hope that you'll take time to explore the Bible and a God who not only does not hate you, but to the contrary created you,loves you, knows everything about you, and desperately wants a relationship with you!

reply to post by Open_Minded Skeptic


Non reproductive couples also provide ready homes for children who are without their parents. Non reproductive couples also are an extra set of eyes/ears/hands/incomes to focus on the children of sibilings, helping to ensure their success. Its very easy to see Homosexuality as a "big picture" survival adaptation of a species. Humans invest a vast amount of energy and resources to the care of children, is it really so hard to imagine that there would be adaptations to have some members of the pack/flock/pod/family non reproductive, yet still have parental instincts?

Not only is Homophobia bigotry, to restrict their rights and freedoms in a society is a waste of resources that could be contributing to its long term success.

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one around here who is sick of seeing bible thumpers being archaic cretins.
I'm not gay, but I just can't believe the mindset of some people around here. I posted my disgust in another thread, so I won't go on with it here.

I'm just going to avoid those kind of threads. The only reason I came into this one was because I had to see who else was as pissed as I am.

Also, It's not a choice. If you really think that, go try sleeping with your own sex. You wouldn't be able to do it.

Good on you OP, I support you

Nothing wrong with being gay, it’s the earth’s way of turning off the birthers. A slight control of population. I don’t mind gay people at all but... I really cannot stand the big show and attention seeking act that a lot of the males put on, especially the cross gendered ones. Being gay is one thing, but flaming so hard that you light everything around you on fire is not, and i think that’s were these two intersections come to meet. Most people I know that are gay, look normal, act normal and are very normal, but then you get the people that accentuate every little thing to the point that they look retarded. And no one wants to be around them, so I’d say most are against the "show" of being gay that others put on. The average gay person has the same ideas, lifestyle, and interests as the rest of us, but the few that go way overboard with ruin it for the average people. Anyone spewing hate against gays are just ignorant, same as it always has been about people or things that are different, and just don’t understand, unfortunately they would have to walk a mile in your shoes but their ego is too big to let them understand humanities simple issues.

reply to post by mizbeach40


I have only skimmed through part of your opening post.
God does not hate you!He sent Yeshua/Jesus to die for
you.He does hate sin,not the sinner.Homosexuality is a
sin.
You are right about your relationship with God is between
you and God.

reply to post by mizbeach40


Nowhere in the Bible does it say "Turn a blind eye to his Gay children."

You are who you are. Good for you!

I love you. I hate the sin you commit.

Man/Woman is not supposed to lay with the same. It is against the plan of God and nature. If Adam and Eve were Gay then civilization would never have started. We are supposed to procreate. That is what God and nature intended.

You CAN NOT procreate without science or doing what you despise. That means you are NOT what God and nature intended. Every species that can not procreate the way they are born dies off.

If you want to be gay, go be gay. Please do not expect us who disagree with your lifestyle to accept it. No matter what I say you will never agree with our thinking that you are leading an immoral life. So please don't expect us to agree with you.

Go be gay. God loves you. I love you. If others say that they hate you then...well...welcome to being part of the human race. Every one of us is hated for SOMETHING. Irish, Muslim, Jew, Catholic, man, woman. On this site the most hated group are Christians.

Grow thicker skin.

reply to post by mizbeach40


i am glad for you that you got to a point in your life that you felt comfortable enough to be your self. there will always be homophobs; it is wasted energy listening to them

mizbeach40,

I am a Christian, but I am not a homophobe, nor am I full of hatred.

I have an honest question for you: "How can I, as a Christian, show a homosexual (like yourself) real, unconditional love and friendship, without condoning the behavior or lifestyle?"

I am not interested in hating anyone. You said it best - God will judge every single one of us. I leave that up to Him. However, the Bible does speak against homosexuality. I cannot compromise God's moral judgments. I understand that you don't believe in God like I do, but I hope you can understand my position.

The Bible never orders Christians to hate homosexuals. The Old Testament is no longer in place. Christians are a part of a new covenant with God. Nevertheless, homosexuality is never condoned or approved by God anywhere in the Bible.

Lastly, please do not take offense to this, but I must say something.

You cannot assert with 100% certainty that you were "born this way". No homosexual or heterosexual can assert this, actually. Identical twin studies prove that what makes us homo or hetero sexual is not strictly genetic in nature. It is my opinion, as a mere psychology student, that sexual preference is largely a figment of the brain's imagination. Chemically, testosterone and estrogen / progesterone levels may also come in to play.

Please understand that what makes a person homosexual or heterosexual is not currently understood by science.

I do not doubt that you feel as if you were born this way - the Duke of York apparently felt as though he were born with a stutter, but he was not. (Go see "The King's Speech" if you haven't already - awesome movie!)

I will not deny your experience, or how you feel in your own skin. I just want you to know that this issue is not cut and dried on either side of the fence. Human sexuality is extremely complex.

I hope that you can understand where I am coming from as a Christian. I do not hate you, but I do not condone homosexuality either. I still love you, and so does Jesus.

Cheers,
Cody

Homosexuality is a sin

reply to post by mamabeth


that is not the word of god , that is the word of man

Mizbeach,

I'm sorry you have been offended here on ATS, but please also remember that this is an "opinion" site and some people's opinions differ from yours.

However, I would like to toss some thoughts your way...just for consideration. I don't have any "problem" with someone being gay, and I fully understand that some people will always have issues with gay people. But what I do have issues with is the "this is who I am...I'm gonna stick it in your face and force you to accept me" attitude. I don't know you, nor do I see this attitude from you, but, as you well know, there are many gay people out there who do support this attitude.

The simple fact is that neither I, nor anyone else, has to "accept" someone else's way of life. Our society has fallen into this state where people think everyone should accept them, regardless of who they are or what they do. We are permitted to look at another person and make a decision about them from their actions...if we want. I can look at a drug addict and decide I don't like a person that can't control themselves. I can look at a poor man and decide I don't like someone who mooches off the system. (NOTE: I am not implying these examples are always the case...just that they are sometimes)

I do my best to understand a person as much as possible before making a decision about them, as it relates to me and my family. I am friends with people that I wouldn't trust to baby-sit or be alone in my house...for example. Sometimes, however, we don't have the luxury of getting to know someone due to time restraints, etc. In those cases, we are forced to categorize or label them. That is just how the human brain works..."this fits into that". If I don't get to know you, I have to put you in my filing system in a folder, and I have to choose that folder by what I see...by my first impression. And if that folder is not a category that I consider acceptable to me, for me...you are unfortunately still in that folder. I understand that this fact sucks, but it is human nature to start to categorize things as soon as we encounter them.

I'm 46 years old with a wife and children. I have my moral beliefs and am 100% anti-religion. But my values dictate that there is acceptable behavior and unacceptable behavior. There are standards and "the norm". When thinking of my children, their future, and how hard life is, in general...I hope they are at least perceived as "normal" by others. They will have enough challenges in life being "normal". If one of them was gay, etc...I wouldn't love them any less...I wouldn't treat them any differently. However...if they decide to show up to a party I was throwing with their "friend" and start French-kissing or preaching views, demanding others accept those views...they probably wouldn't be invited to future parties...at least not with the same guest list.

So, in summary...I don't really care what someone's personal situation is, unless it affects me. If it affects me, then I have to decided if I want to be affected. That is my choice. If I decide that I don't like their way of life, what they do, how they act, etc...that is also my choice. It doesn't mean I hate them...it doesn't even mean I can't be their friend...it doesn't mean they are bad, evil or deserving of prejudice. All it means is that what they are, is not something I like. I don't like to eat cucumbers either...but I don't go out of my way to insult them...I just don't eat them.

So everyone should be who they are, like what they like and do what they do. They should make sure they are doing it for themselves...not others. And if they are doing it for themselves, there is no need to "stick it" in other's faces. Sure...who you are will show, and it is too bad if someone else doesn't like it. But unless you are doing it for others...there is no need for a parade, demand "marriage" instead of "domestic partnership", etc. The only reason I can find for demanding this level of recognition, is in attempt to force others to accept things they don't have to. In doing so...they are trying to "pick a fight" or forcing an argument.

There are things about me, things I may do in my personal life that some others wouldn't accept or like. Those things are personal and I don't demand recognition or acceptance of them, by others. I don't have that right to demand someone likes me.

Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
reply to post by doom27

 

Granted that homosexuality is arguable as a species' survival characteristic (I say arguable because given the insane overpopulation of this planet by humans, homosexuality, which will slow the growth rate, can easily be considered as contributing to the survival of the species), what difference does it make if a person's sexual orientation is a choice or not?

Everybody makes choices with which other people are uncomfortable. Big WAAH! As long as the situation is one of fully competent adults making fully consensual choices, the details of those choices are not relevant, nor anybody else's business.

You don't need gays for population reduction. We have war, famine, abortion, and disease/plagues to cull the population. That lowers the population far more than gays being unable to produce offspring.