Texas Group Launches Scholarship For White Males Only

Originally posted by MaryStillToe

Reply to Vizzle and Black Ops:

Okay, so your direct ancestors were not around 400 years ago when the natives and africans were being killed, enslaved, and discrminated against, right? So why is that even your problem?

Just a little history lesson for you: can you guess where the whites got those natives and Africans? Here, let me help you out. They bought them from the natives and the Africans! See, rival tribes (of both Native Americans and West Africans) would routinely raid other tribes. They would take horses, and food, and burn down their villages and take people as SLAVES. The ones they didn't want (or kill) they would sell to the whites that wanted to buy them! See how it all works out? This way everyone can be a-holes equally, just like the hippies like it!

As to the OP: good for them. I hope some liberal jerk doesn't get in the way and pull the race card. If so, the plug will be pulled faster than you can spell UNCF

And as to your points about accepting a job offered to you because you're white is wrong or improper? I couldn't give two # about it. I have responsibilities to exactly THREE people: myself, my wife and my son. If I was offered a better job because I'm white, you better believe I'd take it in a heartbeat. But you would call me racist. A rational human would say I'm doing what it takes to take care of my family. Instead of sacrificing myself for the common good and equality for all BS. I'll leave that to you.

/TOA

OK, SOME OTHER ORGANIZATION OR FUND WILL THEN GIVE SCOLARSHIPS ONLY FOW BLACK PEOPLE )

Good, maybe now we can all see that it's a class issue, not a race issue.

If every single identity group has a scholarship, wouldn't it then just make sense to say, "Hey, we need to take a step back. The system is broken. It's time to look at guarantees toward education that do not revolve around these sorts of ethnic-based stereotypes."

ANYTHING that separates us, or gives one race an advantage over another race, that is indoctrinated by man- is racist. PERIOD. Two wrongs do not make a right.

Originally posted by satron
Part of me thinks it's about time.

The other part of me really wishes any kind of race based benefit would go away.

Very well said! Unfortunately, racial and gender disparities still exist in society and necessitate different types of assistance programs. Things are balancing out a bit in some areas (more females attending college), but are skewed in others (zero blacks in the Senate, few among Fortune 500 CEOs )...

YES! This is wonderful. I very rarely comment on ATS, but this is worth one.
Ive been in and out of college for a few years now, and have seen many opportunities for scholarship directed at seemingly everyone except white males (which I happen to be).
There was even a ridiculous scholarship offered to Greeks. Well I happen to be mostly English, and part Polish, so wheres mine? I feel that if there is going to be any scholarship offered, the spectrum of who it affects should be very wide. Seeing this is very exciting, even though I probably wont see any ever personally.
This may be creating a shift in the collective consciousness, that acknowledging a minority and offering them a scholarship because of such, IS racist. But in the eyes of many being racist is ok, so long as we give these people something beneficial.
I had an english professor a few years ago who was African American, and would never shut up about the oppression of the black community, and how she supports every organization worldwide that helps her benevolent race. It drove me nuts! I consider myself to be colorblind when it comes to anything in that regard. Our whole semester curriculum was based around reading and writing about African importance, and their struggle. At the end of the semester we had to write a paper summarizing the class, and writing about our views of the professors teaching stance. I layed into her, saying that... as long as we continue to recognize any difference between us as human beings, even if it is trying to benefit someone, thats a prejudice, and is therefore contradictory to what youre trying to achieve. Ultimately her agenda to strive for equality is doing just the opposite.
---AS ARE EXCLUSIVE SCHOLARSHIPS. And the struggle for equality becomes a moot point.
Someone said on here something along the lines of wanting to see all of this go away.
Seeing these kind of scholarships clearly suggest to me that this is a step towards diminishing prejudices.
Anyone who thinks this is a racist attempt, is an ignorant fool.
A few weeks ago someone made an interesting thread about why there isnt a white history month. I didnt read it, but I thought to myself, Ive always wondered that. Im not going to go into that here, and get off topic, but what a load of contradiction and "racism" in itself to NOT have one. Ridiculous, Id say we sack the whole idea of any 'special' month... but Im sure Id be viewed as a racist for that. Oh please

Originally posted by James1982
reply to post by FoosM

 

I think this thread got quite derailed but nobody is harboring any hatred for these minorities or even their scholarship programs. My whole reason for posting in this thread was because I thought it was a good political statement to be made by the people offering this scholarship. Yes there is racism and discrimination in this country. But I can't think of any situation where actual policy or laws are setup in this way. There isn't any school that has a "whites only" sign outside of it. The past is the past, and it's up to the current generation to succeed, not blame people from history for keeping them down.

Sorry, but thats a cop-out.
We are not talking about mild injustices here, we are talking about traumatic injustices.
Traumatic injustices require long term recovery periods. Generations when you are talking about damage to a people. And unfortunately there is no determined date when one can say a full recovery has been made.

I can't think of a single situation, beside being born homeless or with a mental disorder, that would keep someone from succeeding if they REALLY tried hard. I'm not blaming minorities or anything for me not going to college, I blame myself. I know if I would have worked harder I could have gone, but I didn't.

And there is the problem. How do you know?
You cant think of a single situation, but that doesn't mean situations do not exist.
You are not a minority therefore you don't understand what its like to be one.
For example, if you have are able to college but you were the first one in the family to do so, how would you fare compared to a young adult whose family has traditionally gone to college? Advantage would go to tradition, see how history helps?

Then once you are in College.
You have the issue that College and Universities are European in nature.
They are not designed around Native Americans, Asians, or African cultures.
Which means, non Europeans have to LEARN European culture.
How many European Americans have to bother themselves to learn African or Asian cultures?
Think about Fraternities and Sororities. The Greeks.
What would a minority know about joining one? Would they even be accepted?

Do you understand what I am getting at? Until you live in a society where you are the minority, you will NEVER comprehend the number of cultural and historical obstacles that you have to overcome day to day.

Athiests probably can understand this.
Do you know how much "God" promoting propoganda an athiest has to block out and sidestep everyday?
Its on the money, holidays, every day language from insults to blessings.
They have to make statements like, "No offense if you believe in God"
They may even pretend to believe in God just to get a job or promotion.

The same thing goes for young people of any race. Up until college, school is free for the most part, and low income families get help from the school or other programs for things like school supplies if they can't afford them. Aside from that, it is up to the student to show up every day, pay attention in class, do their homework, and ask for help if they don't understand something. If they fail to do those things, it is THEIR fault they don't succeed, not the fault of anybody holding them down.

Again, incorrect.
There is more to going to school than just going to school.
There is a life outside school that doesn't support a child being able to achieve in an environment of school.
You do realize that right?
You cant expect children currently in Iraq to be doing any better than children in Germany.
If you can fathom that, then you can understand that schools across the US are not funded equally right?
So which children would do better? The well funded school or the poorly funded school?

I don't see how being a minority would make it any more difficult for someone to do the things I just said. Although children with English as a second language would be an exception, most schools have an ESL program, and things like Math are a universal language.
I personally don't think there NEEDS to be a white only scholarship program at all. Just like I don't see why there NEEDS to be a minority only scholarship program. I am simply supporting the OP because it's a political statement that illustrates how these kind of things are not conducive to a fair, equal treatment of people. My ultimate wish is that all scholarships are awarded based on economic need, and scholastic achievement. If that was the case, there would be no excuse for anybody regardless of race.

I understand you dont see, this is how education has failed.
I know you want to have equality, or believe there is equality
But let me ask you, what has European Americans sacrificed to right its wrongs to balance out injustices and ensure equality?

I like that there's someone out there doing this, but I think they'll be bombarded with lawsuits untill people realize this is NOT racism or biggotry. I live in the middle of saskatchewan, and over here we have a large population of aborigionals. Here if you are atleast 50% native, you get cheap schooling and if you qualify they will actually pay you up to $800 a month for being a student. This bothered me a lot as there is no program like this for white students. Equality means embracing diversity, not recognizing it as something that deems differential treatment. Steriotypes can be positive or negative, as can racism. Forgive me if this sounds racist, that's not my intention, but giving certain people extra opportunities (scholarships, as the case may be) is the same as taking opportunities away for these groups, IMHO.

reply to post by jam321

This is amazing! I agree with this whole post!
I know this group is getting a lot heat for having this scholarship, but that is completely unfair. There are so many scholarships for all the other races. Does everyone assume that because you are white you can just go to college no problem?

anything that is race based needs to go away. If people want to be treated equal why are there scholarships for minorities? and why do certain races get more points on tests just because of their color?

IF PEOPLE WANT TO BE TREATED EQUAL EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE THE SAME OPPORTUNITY!

sorry had to shout that. I know there are also a lot of scholarships for single women, with children. (more along the lines of adult student)

I feel inspired to start my own scholarship for women who don't have babies.

seriously though I could possibly rant all day.

I have seen a lot of racism directed at me, and I am white. Its these kinds of organizations that are set up to keep everyone separated yet they shout they are being equal. That breeds hate, and encourages the continuation of racism. I have never once treated someone different because of their color. I dislike people based on how they act.

I am glad these people have started a scholarship like this, if only to prove a point.

reply to post by jam321


The concept of minority scholarships is based on the recognition that all people are created equal.
In that context minorities in this country still lack in available education, opportunity and financial resources.

US Population by race
White 74.8%
Black or African American 12.4%
Other minorities around 12.5%

The Median income of a white person in the USA is 50k, black 32k.
www.infoplease.com...

I am unclear what disadvantage this "white male" scholarship is aimed at reconciling?

Originally posted by The Old American
And as to your points about accepting a job offered to you because you're white is wrong or improper? I couldn't give two # about it. I have responsibilities to exactly THREE people: myself, my wife and my son. If I was offered a better job because I'm white, you better believe I'd take it in a heartbeat.

As you should. Survive. Take care of your family.

But the reality is that any business making decisions based on race rather than relevant qualifications is not making the amount of profit that they could otherwise. Capitalism is a more heartless master than the government.

That said, our nation as a whole suffers when our children are not given the tools to succeed and contribute to our economy and thus far that disparity has been directed at minorities and specifically African Americans.

I support any legitimate method to fix that disparity and putting the USA in a position where every little genius has the same opportunity.

The playing field is not level and while it might benefit those who are not minorities, it is a disadvatage to our competitiveness as a country in the world economy.

Originally posted by maybereal11
I am unclear what disadvantage this "white male" scholarship is aimed at reconciling?

Well you are assuming that EVERY white male is in an advantages financial situation, I KNOW that is not the
case with every case. Some people need help regardless of their sex or race, as a person I am all for helping anyone who want to get an education. If this adds to that pool of help, more power to it.

Originally posted by Janky Red

Originally posted by maybereal11
I am unclear what disadvantage this "white male" scholarship is aimed at reconciling?

Well you are assuming that EVERY white male is in an advantages financial situation, I KNOW that is not the
case with every case. Some people need help regardless of their sex or race, as a person I am all for helping anyone who want to get an education. If this adds to that pool of help, more power to it.

Agreed, then the mystery remains why the Scholarship requires a person to be white?

When applying the same question to "black" scholarships there is a dramatic statistically demonstrative gap directly attributable to race.

reply to post by maybereal11

In that context minorities in this country still lack in available education, opportunity and financial resources.

Is this due to the white man's oppression or could there be other reasons that contribute to the lack of available education, opportunity and financial resources for minorities?

I will share my story about my Hispanic family but will just keep it focused on my cousins and myself. I was pretty much the first one in my family to get a college education. My education was paid for through the GI bill, grants, scholarship, working, and a loan. Since I recieved my degree in 2002, only 2 other cousins (out of 40 in my area) went on to college to get theirs.

I have tried many times to convince my other cousins to get their education. However, talking to a brick wall has proven to be more successful. They refuse to see the light despite the fact that ALL my cousins qualify for grants and a truckload of minority scholarships. The opportunity is there for the taking.

Instead they rather be making the cartels richer, supporting the Anheuser-Busch family, living the luxury life of wannabe gangsters, milking government benefits, while struggling to take care of their families. This is my family.

Has the white man kept my family members from getting an education, opportunity at better jobs, or making more money?

Nope, they owe it all to themselves. They are the ones who are doing it to themselves by not seeking a better life and future for themselves and their family while they have the opportunity. Sad part is that this pattern will repeat itself in future generations and my nephew and nieces will more than likely end up on the same dead end track.. If my so called minority family is going to turn this trend around, we need to start getting a better education so we won't have to rely on government, scholarships, or grants as much to educate our future generation.

I got mine because I want to break this cycle of dependecy and instill in my daughters just how important education is. Education opens many doors and creates many opportunities.

I really wish there were no special scholarships for minorities or whites or any other special circumstances, but as long as such scholarships exist why shouldn't whites have the same opportunity to hand out such scholarships? Why should they be labeled racist for doing the same thing other organizations are praised for?

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by maybereal11

 

In that context minorities in this country still lack in available education, opportunity and financial resources.

Is this due to the white man's oppression or could there be other reasons that contribute to the lack of available education, opportunity and financial resources for minorities?

Yes and no. It is not due to "White man's" oppression in the context of the present...more or less, racism as a form of outright institutional oppression has eroded dramatically in the past 50 years.

IMO it is an after-effect. A cultural issue. An inheritance of depressed communities and economic struggle.

Treat an entire segment of your citizenry as literal slaves and non-citizens for a couple hundred years and I suspect it will take a little longer than 50 to undue the damage.

The average US "white man" of today has no guilt in the disparity between opportunities for Blacks and whites...but the institution/our gov at large does. They are not individuals...the gov is 230 years old....as is the black communities struggles.

Originally posted by jam321
I have tried many times to convince my other cousins to get their education. However, talking to a brick wall has proven to be more successful. They refuse to see the light despite the fact that ALL my cousins qualify for grants and a truckload of minority scholarships. The opportunity is there for the taking.

Instead they rather be making the cartels richer, supporting the Anheuser-Busch family, living the luxury life of wannabe gangsters, milking government benefits, while struggling to take care of their families. This is my family.

Has the white man kept my family members from getting an education, opportunity at better jobs, or making more money?

Nope. They have done that to themselves...but forgive me for speaking of your family, but that is a product of how and where they were raised. Would they think the same if they had been born in a wealthy predominately white suburb?

I don't blame in the white/black/hispanic thing and I don't think being Hispanic means you must be gangsta and live the "high" life of real or wannabe criminals.

Thier identitity as a minority group is determined as much by what they see themselves as...as it is determined by what the average "white" guy on his way to work thinks when he passes your cousins on the street.

Whose to blame? Who is wrong? I don't give a eff. I just want the avenue to be clear for any that want to take thier shot...like you did.

Originally posted by jam321
I really wish there were no special scholarships for minorities or whites or any other special circumstances, but as long as such scholarships exist why shouldn't whites have the same opportunity to hand out such scholarships? Why should they be labeled racist for doing the same thing other organizations are praised for?

Strange comming from someone that admittedly benefited from a scholarship.

Whites parents on average have 40% more income than black parents...more money to send thier kid to college.

Not remedying that disparity just expands the economic divide over generations.

Psst..Low income white kids get scholarships every day...I did....no need for a "white guy" scholarship other than stoking racial tensions.

Originally posted by FoosM
Sorry, but thats a cop-out.
We are not talking about mild injustices here, we are talking about traumatic injustices.
Traumatic injustices require long term recovery periods. Generations when you are talking about damage to a people. And unfortunately there is no determined date when one can say a full recovery has been made.

If there is no determined date, then how long is this going to go on? When the minorities have the majority, most the money, and most the power will it be be safe to say a recovery has been made? I'm not saying that's going to happen, just that a never ending program to make up for things in the past doesn't sound any better than a never ending war on terror or war on drugs.

And there is the problem. How do you know?
You cant think of a single situation, but that doesn't mean situations do not exist.
You are not a minority therefore you don't understand what its like to be one.
For example, if you have are able to college but you were the first one in the family to do so, how would you fare compared to a young adult whose family has traditionally gone to college? Advantage would go to tradition, see how history helps?

I will definitely give you that, there could be situations that I'm not thinking about, which is why I keep checking this thread. I want people to give me their side of things, and explain the reasons as they see them. Although I think just being the first person to go to college is not a valid reason. What does it matter if you are the first? I don't understand this. And, just like has been said 100 times, there are tons of white people that are the first in their family to go to college, wouldn't you agree?

Then once you are in College.
You have the issue that College and Universities are European in nature.
They are not designed around Native Americans, Asians, or African cultures.
Which means, non Europeans have to LEARN European culture.
How many European Americans have to bother themselves to learn African or Asian cultures?
Think about Fraternities and Sororities. The Greeks.
What would a minority know about joining one? Would they even be accepted?

Sorry, I think this is a cop-out. Care to explain exactly how this becomes an issue? Frats and Sororities, so what? Not everybody joins them. Not every college has such things either. I would appreciate an explanation on how exactly these things would effect minorities.

Do you understand what I am getting at? Until you live in a society where you are the minority, you will NEVER comprehend the number of cultural and historical obstacles that you have to overcome day to day.

I will also agree with you here, I won't know what it's like to be a minority, in the current sense of the word. But I have still yet to see anyone point out exactly what these cultural and historical obstacles are. No, being the first one in your family to attend college doesn't count as it's not only related to minorities. Making it harder to go to college because you don't understand European doesn't make any sense to me. I will keep an open mind and wait for an explanation though.

Athiests probably can understand this.
Do you know how much "God" promoting propoganda an athiest has to block out and sidestep everyday?
Its on the money, holidays, every day language from insults to blessings.
They have to make statements like, "No offense if you believe in God"
They may even pretend to believe in God just to get a job or promotion.

I'm an Atheist and I don't have a problem with hearing about god or seeing god references all over the place. People have the right to believe what they want, and if it's god, I may disagree with them but I'm not going to stop or, nor am I going to try and fit in with them.

Again, incorrect.
There is more to going to school than just going to school.
There is a life outside school that doesn't support a child being able to achieve in an environment of school.
You do realize that right?
You cant expect children currently in Iraq to be doing any better than children in Germany.
If you can fathom that, then you can understand that schools across the US are not funded equally right?
So which children would do better? The well funded school or the poorly funded school?

I'll agree with you that what goes on at home can affect going to school. But I'll ask the question again, how is this a minority or race issue, and not a CLASS issue? Until we stop thinking minority=poor white=rich we are never going to get anywhere.

I understand you dont see, this is how education has failed.
I know you want to have equality, or believe there is equality
But let me ask you, what has European Americans sacrificed to right its wrongs to balance out injustices and ensure equality?

And this is when I roll my eyes. What have European Americans sacrificed? I don't know, I'm not able to make that call. But they shouldn't have to. There are no wrongs to balance out because you CANNOT judge a race based on what people hundreds of years did. I am not responsible for any wrongs in relation to this issue, nor are any other European Americans alive today. Unless we are going to go around the whole globe with a scorecard awarding points and demerits to each race to get a final tally of things, which would be equally as wrong, then nobody owes anyone anything.

Do white people get blamed for Nazi Germany? They are European, and white, so evidently by your logic all while people should make up for what the Nazis did. They shouldn't. Nor should the current German PEOPLE because they are not, and have never been Nazis.

We can weave the blame game around the world and back in time to condemn different races and cultures. Or we can start where we are today, where nobody is actually responsible for what happened in the past, and give all people regardless of race, culture, or skin color the same opportunity.

Originally posted by James1982

If there is no determined date, then how long is this going to go on? When the minorities have the majority, most the money, and most the power will it be be safe to say a recovery has been made? I'm not saying that's going to happen, just that a never ending program to make up for things in the past doesn't sound any better than a never ending war on terror or war on drugs.

Her is my bottom line on the issue.

Minorities are disadvantaged in a dissproportionate way.

Family and education..

There is no genetic basis for this. Native Africans today and in the past are passionately family oriented. It is a cultural, if not genetic, touchstone going back thousands of years. Tribal. Thier sense of "Family" and community is the center of thier daily lives.

Here in the USA post slavery, African Americans were derided, segregated, dehumanized, declared second class citizens.

That time has passed but the communities that resulted from that period stille exist. The culture of poverty and lack of opportunity and accompanying crime was significantly concentrated in these communities.

A child born into these communities might not by subject to discrimination in the present day that existed 50 years ago, but he is being raised by parents that might have been, who in turn were raised by parents that most definetly were.

Just like a 3rd generation Dupont, Rothschild, Bush etc. is raised in a culture of wealth that they themselves did not create...a wealth obtained decades or even a century ago...a black child is often born into poverty and a community not his own making.

Great teachers don't migrate to these neighborhoods, just the opposite...and the cycle continues...long after widespread racism in this country has faded.

How to fix it? My first choice is to fix the education system in these nieghborhoods...watch "Waiting for Superman"...I thought the movie would be boring, but it was just amazing. I highly reccomend it.

Scholarships seem to be a fair tactic. They don't address the educational system, they simply say if by some miracle some child manages to rise above the miserable education he was provided, his culture, impovershed community, his drop-out criminal peers and shine despite it all...then we should give that child a chance.

But give me a choice? fixing the educational system comes first. I am pro-teacher unions in general, but for the love of God eliminate tenure. Fire bad teachers, pay the good ones like rock stars. BTW - Walker in WI isn't looking to eliminate tenure or create a more incentivised pay structure...he just wants to raid thier pensions and benefits...and that is moving in the wrong direction.

reply to post by jam321


It will be shot down in the courts, white males cannot be allowed anything that other ethnic groups already have, that would be too 'racist'. I mean whites don't even get their own month, but we have African-American month, hispanic week, asian-american appreciation month, all the groups but the whites as the are the scrouge of mankind, well people there won't be a 'white' race in another hundred years or so, so where are you going to get your taxes for your 'entitlements" then?

reply to post by MaryStillToe


Well just think in a few more decades you will not be able to kick the white males around, then who will you go to for your entitlements and who will you then blame for not being a success?

What's the problem?
United Negro College Fund ring any bells?