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Private Union Workers Oppose Public Unions

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posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:14 PM
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I explain why the only rational position for a private sector union worker is to be in opposition to the unionization of the public sector:


It's very simply math, anyone should be able to grasp the concept.

Since the public sector is entirely funded by the productive economic activity of the private sector, any bargaining for higher wages or more compensation by the public sector workers automatically reduces the ability of private sector workers to collectively bargain with their employers.

The two types of unions are fundamentally diametrically opposed to each other.




posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:19 PM
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Reply to post by mnemeth1
 


Extremely pro Labor FDR was opposed to public unions.

That in itself should tell you something.

But the lemmings just plug their ears and yell "LA LA LA LA WALKER IS SELLING WISCONSIN POWER PLANTS TO KOCH LA LA LA"


 
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posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:21 PM
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reply to post by Lemon.Fresh
 


hahahaha that's pretty much it.

No rational thought is put into their political decision making at all.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:23 PM
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Very good thanks very nicely laid out and simple. I will post to my facebook and probably get flamed because alot of my friends are protesting, even though I'm not sure they are sure what they are protesting about.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:57 PM
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Workers are workers, regardless of 'public' or 'private'.

Governments and business' don't operate on a cost to loss analysis anymore. It's about how much 'profit' they stand to make in order to allow a bank to give them a loan that will be paid out over time.

There are a great number of backstory, historical references that can be made against your assertion here.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 08:07 AM
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Originally posted by links234
Workers are workers, regardless of 'public' or 'private'.

Governments and business' don't operate on a cost to loss analysis anymore. It's about how much 'profit' they stand to make in order to allow a bank to give them a loan that will be paid out over time.

There are a great number of backstory, historical references that can be made against your assertion here.


No, only government does not have to pass a profit and loss test. Private firms that do not make a profit go out of business. The only way a private firm will not go out of business is if the government hands them tax money to keep them afloat.

There are no "historical references" to the contrary.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
I explain why the only rational position for a private sector union worker is to be in opposition to the unionization of the public sector:
Since the public sector is entirely funded by the productive economic activity of the private sector, any bargaining for higher wages or more compensation by the public sector workers automatically reduces the ability of private sector workers to collectively bargain with their employers.
The two types of unions are fundamentally diametrically opposed to each other.

Gee...I donno about that. Why, then, are private sector unions actively recruiting public sector employees? Could it be that globalism has virtually eliminated the core industrial and manufacturing jobs that were the bread and butter of traditional labour, and now Big Labour needs the relatively secure public sector workers to maintain the unions? And is that yet another reason for bashing the public worker collective agreements?

Which is why you have unions like auto and steel representing public sector workers. Hell...the competition to sign up a new local is pretty fierce. And my rule of thumb is that no workplace gets unionised that doesn't richly deserve it. Happy workers in a safe and fair environment have no interest in paying dues.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:16 AM
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reply to post by JohnnyCanuck
 


The reason why is because people are dumb.

If one does not understand that an increase in public union pay and benefits means a decrease in the ability for private unions to bargain, it would make sense that they should support each other.

Of course, most people in unions only have a public high school education, so it is unsurprising to see them acting against their own interests.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:34 AM
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reply to post by mnemeth1
 


Here in Columbus Ohio Premier John Kasich the Corporate plant removed the collective bargaining agreement for state jobs. He also wants to cut salary,jobs, and benefits. They are going to cut social services too. Yay for the poor more torture!

Praise Mao!

I guess corporate is NOT going to foot the bill for extra payroll and health care. Just get your paycheck while you can get sick and die. Replace refinery cattle repeat process.F--- individual human value and uniqueness. You just refine/work and shut up.Its very fascist of them. Its efficient but fascist.

Screw the teachers,screw the police,screw the firefighters...Until a drop out meth fiend breaks into your house that can't read "WARNING: Do not smoke around gas container."Ends up burning down your house smoking dope in your basement. No firemen to get there and the meth head punches your pregnant wife while running away.What? Your not allowed by law to carry ANY gun? Suck it up or.die. Slave on serf. The police get there being overloaded with emergency calls and your situation is pretty much f---ed sauce.



edit on 1-3-2011 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: (no reason given)



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by mayabong
Very good thanks very nicely laid out and simple. I will post to my facebook and probably get flamed because alot of my friends are protesting, even though I'm not sure they are sure what they are protesting about.


LOL. Yep that about sums it up.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by John_Rodger_Cornman
reply to post by mnemeth1
 


Here in Columbus Ohio Premier John Kasich the Corporate plant removed the collective bargaining agreement for state jobs. He also wants to cut salary,jobs, and benefits. They are going to cut social services too. Yay for the poor more torture!

Praise Mao!

I guess corporate is NOT going to foot the bill for extra payroll and health care. Just get your paycheck while you can get sick and die. Replace refinery cattle repeat process.F--- individual human value and uniqueness. You just refine/work and shut up.Its very fascist of them. Its efficient but fascist.

Screw the teachers,screw the police,screw the firefighters...Until a drop out meth fiend breaks into your house that can't read "WARNING: Do not smoke around gas container."Ends up burning down your house smoking dope in your basement. No firemen to get there and the meth head punches your pregnant wife while running away.What? Your not allowed by law to carry ANY gun? Suck it up or.die. Slave on serf. The police get there being overloaded with emergency calls and your situation is pretty much f---ed sauce.



edit on 1-3-2011 by John_Rodger_Cornman because: (no reason given)


Hmmm 80% of our firefighters are volunteer and we have a county sherriff that rolls through town every once in a while. We never seem to have your problems of wild gunmen running wild and houses going up in smoke. I also live in one of the meth capitals in the midwest and never see any methheads running around shooting folks they're too busy cooking. Maybe you need to either move or stop leaving your safety at the hands of the state. Little personal responsibility goes a long way.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:49 AM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
Of course, most people in unions only have a public high school education, so it is unsurprising to see them acting against their own interests.

What is surprising is people coming out in support of the government and financial interests that took all of their jobs to China...and then turn around and blame their neighbours.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Of course, most people in unions only have a public high school education, so it is unsurprising to see them acting against their own interests.

What is surprising is people coming out in support of the government and financial interests that took all of their jobs to China...and then turn around and blame their neighbours.


The only people who support the bank bailouts are bankers and wall street tycoons, neither of which are private sector union workers.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 10:01 AM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by mnemeth1
Of course, most people in unions only have a public high school education, so it is unsurprising to see them acting against their own interests.

What is surprising is people coming out in support of the government and financial interests that took all of their jobs to China...and then turn around and blame their neighbours.


The only people who support the bank bailouts are bankers and wall street tycoons, neither of which are private sector union workers.

Yes, indeedy...so who's looking out for the interests of the middle class? Right now I'd say the unions, because the government sure seems to be giving Wall Street a free pass with the GOP in particular enabling the process.

Like I said...no workplace is unionised...public sector included...that doesn't richly deserve it.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 10:09 AM
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From what I've seen, the public union's aren't actually protecting the people from the government policy changes, they are now protecting the workers from each other. In Canada at least, the union and the management are reasonable. (at least PSAC is). Between harassment suits, bullying, and other nastiness, the union has its hands full.

However they do tend to lean towards defending those who MAKE the accusation rather than the accused. And I know of one incident where the accuser was a nutcase who had already harassed other people with false accusations.



posted on Mar, 2 2011 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by juniperberry
From what I've seen, the public union's aren't actually protecting the people from the government policy changes, they are now protecting the workers from each other. In Canada at least, the union and the management are reasonable. (at least PSAC is). Between harassment suits, bullying, and other nastiness, the union has its hands full.

In the public sector contract that I had a hand in negotiating, our main goal was to put language in the contract that forbade bullying as a management tool. It was the one point they refused even to discuss.



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