It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Why Was This Thread 404'd? And Answers To Other Questions.

page: 1
23

log in

join
share:

posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:05 AM
link   

Why Was This Thread 404'd? And Answers To Other Questions.



All too often of late I see this question being asked and unfounded accusations thrown about. Agendas, COINTELPRO and other more wild and unfounded claims by members that quite frankly fill in gaps that they think exist out of anger and/or confusion. It is my desire to address those here.

The dreaded 404 or why threads are removed. There are several reasons for a thread to be removed from public view. And let me make this point clear, threads are not deleted. They are moved to forums that only the staff can see. One of those is called the Trash Bin. Another is a forum where the staff can see Alerts and Complaints/Suggestions.

Threads are removed for the following reasons.

  • Something about the thread (or the majority of posts within it) violated one or several of the Terms & Conditions Of Use.
  • The thread was a repeat and covered already.
  • The thread was really a Complaint that needed to be moved to the Staff Only forum to be handled there.

It really is that simple. So a thread on Bat Boy of the Weekly World News isn't going to stay in the Medical Issues forum. It is going to be moved, most likely to hoax. But it could end up in the trash depending on how it progressed or was presented. Enough T&C violations, and it will more than likely end up in the trash.

The Terms and Conditions. No one is above them. Not long term members. Not moderators and super moderators. Not administrators....Not even the owners. Springer himself has had a thread removed to the Trash Bin after Staff discussion. And that is the key point there, Staff discussion. Almost all actions are discussed by the staff before an action is taken. Exceptions to that are obvious extreme violations of the T&C's, such as posting pornography.

As members, we ask that you abide by them. As staff, you expect us to enforce them. We provide tools to the members to help us help you by alerting things that are questionable. Not everyone does and that is fine. But the tools are in place so when you have a problem with something you have seen, the staff can take care of it so you do not have to do so and in turn risk having your posts removed.

Nothing is worse than trying to read a 5 page thread only to see that 3 pages of posts were removed. And 99% of the time it was due to two or more people having a spat instead of alerting staff to get involved. And on that note, let me refer you back to the fact that staff decisions often take a group consensus. And sometimes that discussion takes time. It isn't that your request is ignored, it could be that the post only needs an edit and no one is on to make that edit. Supers can edit anywhere, regular mods can only edit in their assigned forums.

Agendas. Often times the staff are accused of various agendas. As a group we do have agenda, two of them in fact. Enforcement of the T&C's and keeping the site “Family Friendly” We often sum them both up as Civility and Decorum. But we are all human and as such we all have our own opinions about things.

I personally do not care for the 9/11 Forum. So it is rare that I will read one of those threads. It is even rarer still that I will action posts in the 9/11 forum for that reason. I don't want personal bias to be a factor. But by the same token, I like Politics. I read and participate in many threads. I don't often action posts in those thread for the same reason. To avoid personal bias. Which brings up a staff only rule, we do not action any post in any thread we have participated in prior to that action.

Public discussion of actions. This is the easiest question of all. It is a privacy issue between the staff and that member alone. Threads that petition or question why a member was banned, post-banned or had a thread or post removed are not discussed publicly. If you have a problem, send in a Complaint. The staff does read them. We may not be able to respond and sometimes do not respond, but we do read them.

In conclusion, I hope this has answered a number of questions that many people have had. And I ask that you look over this thread Index of Important ATS Related Threads before asking questions that were not addressed, as it is full of links to many commonly asked questions that have been answered a few times. And The Freshman Forum also has answers to quite a few other questions.




posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:19 AM
link   
When an entire thread is removed or closed for staff review...would it be possible to give a small note as to why the action was taken?

Even as little as stating the section of the T&C that it was violating? I think that would stop a lot of the questioning and rumors of staff having personal agendas.

You gotta admit, that on a conspiracy site...removing a topic without stating a valid reason is going to cause controversy and a conspiracy by the members.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 11:21 AM
link   
It's a good post and needed to be said.

I'm just waiting for the avalanche of "buts" and "what ifs"

you open a big ole can of worms here

edit on 28-2-2011 by monkofmimir because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 01:00 PM
link   
reply to post by MindSpin
 


Not a bad idea, and it's probably done by most in the majority of situations. There are rare occasions where there could be legal concerns preventing an explanation or a few other rare instances, but for the most part, I think if closing a thread, we should be able to state a reason for doing so other than just stating it's being reviewed. (and if we cannot comment as to why, we should at least say as much).


I'm just waiting for the avalanche of "buts" and "what ifs"

you open a big ole can of worms here


Perhaps, but we've often welcomed the comments and criticisms. First and foremost, the staff are members too, most of us for a while before becoming staff...so we share the same concerns. As we've already had a good point brought up right out of the gate, I'd say it's a "win" so far...





edit on 28-2-2011 by Gazrok because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 01:20 PM
link   
reply to post by Gazrok
 


That sounds good...and I think a simple "closed for legal matters" when you can't comment is perfectly fine also.

I do think it would take away a lot of the guessing and unwaranted accusations towards mods if members knew at least what T&C was broken. Rules are rules.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 03:28 PM
link   
reply to post by MindSpin
 


Often, such explanations are given by the mod (I know I try to)...but not in every case I imagine. I think you'll find it's more the norm to have an explanation though.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 04:12 PM
link   
So , to clarify , a thread like this would probably be 404 d . OK

FBI ARRESTS BAT BOY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 04:15 PM
link   
reply to post by bluemooone2
 


Actually, it'd be moved to the Hoax forum (at least that's what I would do)....based on the known attributes of the source.



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 04:16 PM
link   
Its clearly been 404'd because its an obvious lie and fake!
With so many real issues to be discussed on here why waste room with such ridiculous threads as this?



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 04:19 PM
link   

Originally posted by bluemooone2
So , to clarify , a thread like this would probably be 404 d . OK

FBI ARRESTS BAT BOY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Ha Son of Obama Found in the swamps ! inorite?



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 04:58 PM
link   
However, if one could find additional sources such as police reports, or other news outlets (not only regurgitating the WWN story) supporting it, then maybe in BAN or the Cryptozoology forum, hehe..

Of course, since very few WWN stories have any other corroborating sources, I'd feel pretty safe moving it to hoax...



posted on Feb, 28 2011 @ 08:25 PM
link   

Originally posted by Ahabstar
Springer himself has had a thread removed to the Trash Bin after Staff discussion.


Now THAT is a thread I would pay to see



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 11:12 AM
link   

Originally posted by Ahabstar
All too often of late I see this question being asked and unfounded accusations thrown about. Agendas, COINTELPRO and other more wild and unfounded claims by members that quite frankly fill in gaps that they think exist out of anger and/or confusion. It is my desire to address those here.

The dreaded 404 or why threads are removed. There are several reasons for a thread to be removed from public view. And let me make this point clear, threads are not deleted. They are moved to forums that only the staff can see. One of those is called the Trash Bin. Another is a forum where the staff can see Alerts and Complaints/Suggestions.


Thanks for your post Ahabstar, but I'm not sure I understand from it why some threads are trashed rather than simply locked/closed?

I've seen quite a few threads trashed which duplicate earlier threads or refer to material which originates on websites banned by ATS. I can understand why some of those threads should be rapidly closed, but wonder if trashing them is really necessary.

Sure trashing threads (so that members cannot even see what was in them, fuels the conspiracy theories you mention (particularly on ATS...).

All the best,

Isaac



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 03:07 PM
link   
reply to post by IsaacKoi
 


I would say to keep reading. It really wasn't that long of a post and the paragraphs with bolded headings tend to support the opening. When there are measures of heavy T&C violations, threads are moved. Pornography, stoner talk (personal use or advocacy), extremely graphic images, etc. are a few common examples.

The Bat Boy example, mostly likely would go to the hoax bin. However, spamming that thread over and over is going to result in a few going to the Trash Bin.

People like to think that the staff are all cloak wearing practitioners of esoteric arts that protect arcane magics and secrets, but the reality is that the T&C's and commons sense explain our actions.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 03:32 PM
link   

Originally posted by Ahabstar
reply to post by IsaacKoi
 


I would say to keep reading.


And I would say that I did keep reading...

I had the remainder of your post in mind when I posted my comment.



the paragraphs with bolded headings tend to support the opening.


Those paragraphs do not explain why some threads are closed while others get the more draconian treatment of being trashed (nor, frankly, do those paragraphs explain all of the trashings of threads I have seen).



People like to think that the staff are all cloak wearing practitioners of esoteric arts that protect arcane magics and secrets, but the reality is that the T&C's and commons sense explain our actions.


When things occur which are not explained, or an explanation is given which does not make sense (or reflect what people can see themselves), this can result in conspiracy theories being generated. This applies almost as much to the moderating of a conspiracy forum as it does to statements by government officials in relation to UFOs.



posted on Mar, 1 2011 @ 07:00 PM
link   
reply to post by IsaacKoi
 


You seem to be focusing on more to a specific as opposed to a general type of thread. If there was a thread of yours that was removed, you can always ask the moderator that moved it or the staff in general. However if it was not your thread, that sort of information can border on privacy reasons that are not discussed.

A good example of that would be a member circumventing a ban or engaging in a form of solicitation or recruitment, even if it is a worthy cause. Again those would be a T&C violations. And in both cases a matter of privacy between the member and the staff.

Why the privacy? Two reasons, one to keep it to the parties involved and two, to reduce drama.

But let's go to the full extreme. If I had a genuine and indisputable video and sworn testimony of George W. Bush and myself stealing a UFO, shooting up Congress (with graphically explicit scenes of gore) and then celebrating by snorting coke off the breasts of underaged extraterrestrial hookers. It is still at the discretion of the Staff and Management of ATS to not allow it to be viewed on their site due to the numerous violations of the T&C. It still is not censorship, it is enforcement of the rules and a right of community management. And quite honestly, if I continued to repost the video after being told not to do so, I should be permanently banned.

It is also at their discretion to allow it. But they can remove it if their are too many complaints of it being too offensive. Again, a right of community management.



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 10:20 AM
link   


Originally posted by Ahabstar Springer himself has had a thread removed to the Trash Bin after Staff discussion. Now THAT is a thread I would pay to see
reply to post by zorgon
 


i agree, i would pay dearly to see that thread!
can we maybe start a donation thread to get that particular thread reactivated to those who pay? just kidding of course

edit on 10-3-2011 by schitzoandro because: add



posted on Mar, 10 2011 @ 10:46 AM
link   
I had a thread about Ian Thorpe having Dolphin Genes removed purely cause I cracked a joke myself in it and a forum moderator, said that it was impossible from his opinion or experiences. It doesn't matter, I was new when I posted it, probably with too little information and not a great knowlegde of this site. I am learning though and will repost the story i was told, maybe edited a little(because it referred to MJ) and with lots more evidence although its all a bit speculative. I was rather insulted when the forum moderator called my "tripe" tho so if you haven't had that happen you haven't had it that bad.



new topics

top topics



 
23

log in

join