It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by DaddyBare
I know some of you none red folks think it's funny... but you just don't know what it's really like... to be shunned by your on government... a prime example is this case...
70,000 people on the Navajo Nation live without easy access to one of the most basic necessities of life. That’s the same population as Santa Fe with no running water that is safe to drink, safe to wash vegetables with, safe to bathe children in. And they are U.S. citizens.... why no public outpouring? well maybe it's because they are just some dirty dusty Indians and not like real citizens ....
if there is a second class citizen in this country then most of us red folks fall well under that fellow...
Link to a vid on the "Water Haulers"
It's not just here in the US BTW... if you want to learn how Canada treats her Native population go read my current thread about murdered women...
www.abovetopsecret.com...edit on 28-2-2011 by DaddyBare because: (no reason given)
I understand, and thanks for replying back, after doing some looking, other than the apology you posted, which I had seen before posting this thread, I just needed to ask this question, you didn't come off rudely, I appreciate your post
Originally posted by bhornbuckle75
reply to post by TheForgottenOnes
Well, I wasn't suggesting it was the BEST appology....or that it was an adequate one. I was just pointing out that it had, indeed been done. Sorry if it came off rudely. Not really my intention...my intention, if anything, was to suggest that sometimes places like 'Yahoo Answers' are not always the best sources of correct info. It wasn't to downplay what happened to the American Indians in any way.
You are in a true sense of the word, the smartest man who ever has posted on this thread, I give you...no I stand up and applaud you!! My husband, when he went to Australia for the first time, had been asked so many questions, "what are you?" and he always said "I'm Native American and white" and I remember the shock I got when almost every single one of them said, "You're a red-indian? I thought you were all extinct!" seeing the sadness in his eyes, was more than I could ever want to see in a lifetime
Originally posted by apacheman
reply to post by superman2012
Where on earth did you get the idea we surrendered all of our rights? Nothing could be further from the truth. We've had the devil's own time forcing recognition of them, but cede all rights? Never.
Since when is a longing for freedom or pointing out the true history hate?
I hate no one.
What I hate is injustice.
As regards to land ownership, we define it differently, one of the reasons we want our freedom. The lands I refer to are tribal lands that belong to us by treaty that have been illegally usurped, not every last inch that was stolen, merely that which was stolen after we made a binding treaty, as international law agrees we are entitled to. What's wrong with demanding what belongs to you back?
I have no reservation: the one promised was never given, my tribe received only exile as prisoners of war for 27 years.
But to suggest that to an Indian is the same as telling you to go seek your fortune and opportunity in China.
We want to develop our own economies on and in our own lands: we don't want to be you or like you, and it isn't hate, it is just being different: we aren't you, we are us, different from you.
The name for my people is the Ind'eh, but you know us as the Apache, so I use what you will recognize.
I am fully aware of my potentials and have lived my life more fully and better than most: do not presume to lecture me.
I am a combat veteran, an ex-shrimper, ex-college instructor, ex-professional dancer, worked for years as a construction electrician, fought corrupt union bosses and won. I recruited and commanded my own Civil Air Patrol Squadron as a teenager. I've owned and run businesses and hold copyrights. I've helped arrange international events for Sister Cities. I once ran a concert that over 5,000 people attended. I've lived both in luxury and in a shelter I built in a canyon.
But always as a third class citizen, no matter what my achievements.
I want to live in an Indian land surrounded by Native American people, speaking their own tongue and living in their own ways without any foreigners dictating how, who, what or when. I want to live in the lands of my grandmothers and grandfathers. I want to walk the same lands and to speak the names of the hills and forests and streams from their proper places.
Did you know that Apache placenames are of a couple of different types?
The first type requires a very specific viewpoint. To understand the name means you are standing in the exact same spot where the name was created, because the name describes the view. You stand in the exact spot where your grandfather's grandmother's grandfather stood when he saw it and named it. It binds you to the land and bears the history of your beginnings.
The other sort of name tells the history of what happened there, sometimes big, sometimes trivial, but uniquely memorable, usually imparting a moral.
Look, it's not that we hate you or that I hate you.
It's just that we and I love our freedom more and are frankly tired of having you around bossing us over our shoulders. Really, even if we have a rough start, we'll eventually be strong and prosperous on our own, providing we have the proper land base and we can control our own resources.edit on 28-2-2011 by apacheman because: (no reason given)
...we'll eventually be strong and prosperous on our own, providing we have the proper land base and we can control our own resources.
Originally posted by zappafan1
JR MacBeth wrote: "... I don't see a sovereign NA nation standing anymore of a chance than a Palestinian one. I realize that it is a popular notion, that the Palestinians "should" have their land."
REPLY: There is no Palestinian land. There is no occupied land. Who taught you that? The Arabs started three wars against Israel, and lost all three so they are conquered lands.
Originally posted by Vash
So no, we've never got an apology (obviously we deserve it), and we don't ask for reparations. What I know many want is just for the Americans to one day say "yep, we commit ed a genocide, we ****** up, we're sorry" but I doubt it will ever come.
So let me get this straight? you want a Apology? Right? From who? Are we going to Raise the Dead so the people Who did these things can say there sorry?
Originally posted by VashHow many Years and years ago did this Horrible mind numbing event happen? Wait thats right i was not alive and neither where my parents or any one i know or have ever spoken to .. So why would any one ever say there sorry for something they never did?
Originally posted by VashThe sins of the Father Etc etc you know the Saying.
Originally posted by VashBesides most Indian casino's make more money then i have ever dreamed about having and instead of Bettering there Reservations where they don't pay tax's or have to deal with the US government in there butts about everything.. What do they do with it? How about right here in Oregon.
Originally posted by VashA friend of mine who is native american works at a casino in Oregon .. He got fired.. And the casino paid him 3 grand a month for a YEAR .. WHY!! WTF when i quit a job i don't get paid 3 grand a month for a year so everything will be Peachy damn keen! Hell How many Jobs pay 3grand a month for doing nothing but sit on your ass ?.
Originally posted by VashIN the end they will Never get a apology because frankly Its in the past its forgotten its Done and over with No amount of complaing bitching Whining or demanding something be done will ever happen..
Its just how the world is.
Originally posted by Vash
And honestly Worse things in history have happened Take for instance The nuking of japan. Or how many wars did the native tribes of the past wage on other tribes? where murder and War where common place..
I'd rather live as full citizen in a third-world free Indian Nation than as a third or fourth-class citizen the US, which is fast turning into a third-world craphole anyway.
Thing is, I don't think it would be that bad, we are different, have I mentioned that? We don't do things the same way and value things differently, so we will have different results from the same starting point. For one thing, we tend to value cooperation over competition and conflict. That's a huge difference. In time our old ways will reassert themselves, adapted to new times. That's what vibrant cultures do.