The 2012 Forum Has Become a Snake Pit

I'm sorry ATS, but I discovered the hard way how difficult it is to offer or obtain any meaningful information about 2012 in this forum. For anyone who's still trying to sort it all out, I recommend they look elsewhere.

Until about a week ago, I hadn't posted or even looked in the 2012 forum for a long time. But I was intrigued by the potential discovery/announcement of this new planetary body Tyche and started a thread about it. My last thread in this forum, What Happened 3,600 Years Ago? was generally well-received, with thoughtful and intelligent replies. Well, except for recent additions.

But since then, things have significantly changed. It reminds me of the 9/11 Forum in it's earlier days, before numerous members got so disgusted that they left for good (before it was generally accepted that the many questions about the official 9/11 story were legitimate.) By then it was too late to do much of anything except wonder what else was in store for us.

Well, the same thing is happening here. After six pages of pseudoskeptics, extreme pettiness and repeatedly being called a liar for no reason except to further confuse the issue, I've had enough. It's a hell of a lot easier to destroy and cast doubt on something than to share information, especially when you're going up against hired mercenaries with rehearsed arguments and unlimited time. For some reason, ATS continues to allow anyone with an obvious agenda to plant themselves in ONE forum, posting dozens of times per day on EVERY thread just to disrupt, derail and bury any pertinent or important information. Take a look at every thread in this forum and tell me if you see anything familiar? Sometimes people even ask a particular poster why they spend all their time here, but usually accept the improbable answer.

I was surprised to discover that Lucus was a former member here. If there's anyone on this planet who exemplifies an amazing ability to Deny Ignorance, it's Lucus. The video he compiled solely from 9/11 TV news clips (which were never seen again) was nothing short of brilliant. It's the most-watched YouTube video on 9/11, with over 20 million views. After I was initially misled about the reason for Lucus' departure (among other things), I finally read one of his threads from last year and discovered why.

I couldn't even get to the end of his 20+ page thread because the usual pack of hyenas immediately gathered to constantly nip at his heels in every post. It was disgusting, especially given the importance for everyone to weigh all available information about a possibly life-threatening and global event. Whether you think Lucus' information is valid or not, it deserves to be heard, especially given ancient and native prophecies and the potential consequences if Lucus is as right about 2012 as he was about 9/11. But even after that lesson in trusting any government, it seems too many people are afraid of being ridiculed if they ask hard questions or think for themselves.

I want to remind ATS that there's no way the average member can possibly compete with the all-too-common professional debunkers with their hidden agendas and forked-tongued arguments who take up permanent residence in a particular forum in order to obstruct, obfuscate and bury any and all pertinent information, which negates the very purpose of this board. How many more sincere truth-seekers like Lucus will ATS have to lose before something is done?

I can already hear the hyenas yipping in anticipation...

reply to post by GoldenFleece


Ahhh yes, "The Den of Asps."

Would we yet still be men if we did not address "The Abyss"

To Peer

So Deep

Into The Darkness of Ourselves

Would Shame not have it otherwise?

I have to agree with what you are saying. I have seen how some people are just not open minded at all and try to force their views and opinions as facts, wether one is for or against an arguement, I believe people should play with the idea or at least consider the possibility of an opposing arguement, which I think results in better and more civil duscussion.

But as I said, too many people refuse to look through another persons perspective, and in many instances blindly charge forth with their arguements without thoughtfuly and constructively analyzing any potential flaw in their own thinking.

It is my belief that no matter what the case is, no one can know for sure as an undeniable fact, what is to come or what has happened in a certainpoint in time unless one was physically there to experience it, and even then, if someone was indeed there, memory may fail someone.

well if you want to talk about 2012 without crazy
hyena debunkers there are some awesome 2012
forums out there we dont have much longer left and
this issue might debunk its self 2012 is not far away!
its just got to wild and confusing these days about this
topic so many what ifs and guesses but no proof anywhere
i lost interest in this when it failed to show its self in 08
but we might be in store for one hell of a solar doom senerio
that much has been admitted do you have any ideas on what
might happen?

Snake pit for a snake oil salesman...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

You should fit right in!

Originally posted by Chadwickus
Snake pit for a snake oil salesman...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

You should fit right in!

ouch !!!! now i know why debunkers are labeled hyena's

reply to post by IgnoranceAssassin


Yeah, I'm not a fan of charlatans and what they've got to say.

reply to post by Chadwickus


i almost felt bad after i read that post and was like yeah why people have to be like that
but you just completely changed my opinion lol people who go around hoaxing people have
no room complaining about debunkers nothing personal op but he made a good point.

I have to agree as well. I was reading through the whole thread on sky-map has nibiru on it and at first it started off decently and mature, until it became 10 pages of people yelling at one another, throwing insults around, and just simply acting like children. I am new here and I hope that there isn't more of that around. that would be pretty disappointing, especially for a site like this.

Snakes...Why did it have to be snakes? -Indiana Jones

I agree, it seems like a lot of people argue just for the sake of arguing.

I am also intrigued by this possible gas giant at the edge of our solar system, that might explain the Kuiper cliff. Pretty exciting stuff!

SM

I think people are just fed up with all the ridiculous theories that it's clouding their judgment to the more legit ones and would much prefer to respond with witty 1-liners that garner a lot of stars than actually reply intelligently. Simply put, with all the hype surrounding 2012, SOMETHING is going to happen. It might not be an asteroid collision, Nibiru, a giant solar flare, an alien invasion, spiritual ascension, etc., but there will be a lot of people who will "bet all or nothing" on that date, and that alone could cause something to happen.

Its not just on random ATS forums, It happens on any forum on any website.

This is the nature of forums.

These issues are near impossible to contain 100% because then the mods are accused of being forum gods and nobody likes a forum god.

Not everyone is civilized.

The only thing you can do is ignore them and not flame the situation by replying to their ignorance and massaging their egos.

reply to post by GoldenFleece


OP, what is a "pseudoskeptic"? Is that someone who is skeptical but has no formal training in knowing bull when he/she hears it?

As always, the burden of proof is always on the people making the claims...but that's just pseudologic I guess...

The often condescending tone of some folks' posts is one of the first things I noticed here. It's unfortunate to have to wade through that to get to the good stuff. The bottom line for me is this: None of us really knows exactly what is going to happen with any of the topics presented here. I like to entertain many different possibilities...I find life to be much more interesting that way. And in my hippy-trippy-unicorns and rainbows opinion...TPTB would love for us to be "up in arms" against each other, because then we don't really pay attention to what they're doing. Unity is what we need...we gotta stick together folks, because one day, we might be all we have left.


Peace to ya'll

If an OP is controversial not even wrong..
or wrong
its a hoax the OP is lier etc

if a debunker is wrong
and they have been proven so many times on may issues
isn't that a hoax?
Debunker get of easy on that score.
though like the 911 forums the readers notice, if no one else does.

There are many here who aren't persuing truth.
freindly debate is not why they are here...

for instance it is illegal for NASA to tell you you are about to be hit with a buss sized rock
they can tell you it will miss
but they can't cause terror by telling you it will land on you....
you might beat the PTB to their bunkers you bought.

so take it all with a grain of salt.

Yes, I totally agree here, my last post in 2012, I was a racist because I used a Mayan Elder as a reference and that is deemed racist if he does not hold a PhD I guess. I am not giving up hope, I have ideas, I just research now and look to see if anyone has made a post in the past and U2U them, seems easier than letting the trolls that have nothing to do on here but derail threads and get satisfaction somehow......

As a new comer on here, I have noticed, that in every forum there is debunkers, haters and just plan mis info agents. I don't know how long i'll stay here as it looks more like a place to waste time than find out any true information. The group thing is real. The problem is there are niche groups on here as well as most of these groups have a Mod friend.

And its not just the 2012 forum.

Ohh.. I'm intrigued with one bit in here...this Lucus...does he have a youtube video about 2012?? if he does I'd love to see it anyone point me in the right direction?

reply to post by GoldenFleece


So your complaint is that if you post obvious and glaring falsehoods on ATS you want everyone to pretend that you did not do that. The first 5 or 10 times you posted the same obvious and glaring lies you were told that was incorrect and you were asked why you did that. After you continued to post the same glaring lie it became apparent that this was an intentional act and not a mistake. You were told that this was now a lie since you knew better. Quite a few people told you that you were mistaken even believers in 2012.

You also lashed out at people. In fact, the way you lashed out was very much like your hero Lucus. Let's see. You label people with other points of view pseudoskeptics, petty, and hyenas. You even claim that dissenters are paid. I've read through the threads and it is clear that none of these posters that you sneer at did anything other than tell the truth.

The problem with your falsehoods also applies to Lucus who took it upon himself to post falsehoods. He and you did it knowingly.

Lucus told lies to support his income. Why did you resort to posting glaring lies?

reply to post by Majestic Lumen


You make some interesting arguments. But what happens when someone posts an obvious glaring lie.

Suppose that someone claims that there was a lunar eclipse last night and during that eclipse the core of the Moon was ejected and it destroyed Hawaii. Should this be considered a possibility of last night's events? It is no different than someone stating that a particular newspaper article states without a doubt that a new planet was discovered.

Suppose that someone claims that Egyptian hieroglyphics found at Mesa Verde in Colorado describe the impact of an asteroid 5000 years ago in Kansas. Should this be considered a possibility? Is this any different than claiming an event 4000 years that took 300 years to complete was a sudden event 3700 years ago.

Suppose that someone claims that a chemtrail fell out of the sky with such force that it destroyed a row of houses outside of Chicago setting off a chain reaction of fires destroyed a square mile of properties. Should this be considered a possibility? Is this any different than claiming that a meteorite destroyed a small town in South America last year and that the local news never bothered to film the destruction?

It is my belief that no matter what the case is, no one can know for sure as an undeniable fact, what is to come or what has happened in a certainpoint in time unless one was physically there to experience it, and even then, if someone was indeed there, memory may fail someone.

I disagree. We can figure out if a chemtrail fell out of the sky and set off a firestorm on the ground. We can figure out if there is was a lunar eclipse last night. We can figure out a lot of things.

On the other hand there are cases which are more difficult to figure out. Did a driver run a red light or was it still yellow? Did the ball hit the ground or the player's hand as they dove for the catch?

Events run the range of easy to figure out to impossible. To lump everything into a single pile is not appropriate.