The Threat - Aliens are Evil

These investigators believe so completely in the reality of their own interpretation of these experiences that they have lost touch with both consensus reality and the everyday ethics of human behavior that go along with it

From what I'm reading, this women doesn't actually deny the abduction phenomena, she just thinks Jacobs and her ex are caught up in some delusional fantasy land and don't run their operations properly. Well, that's a ridiculous argument IMO, Jacobs is clearly a very intelligent man. There aren't many ways a person can interpret the transcripts and audio recordings presented by Jacobs, it's quite clear alien activity is taking place. The only "rational" answer is that they were leading the subjects and fueling their delusions. But I see very little evidence of that happening, but most importantly, I doubt the majority of hypnotists just so happen to "influence" confabulated memories that are so frighteningly similar in detail. I find there's a point where coincidence no longer seems like a "rational" explanation.

By some of the responses in this thread, it seems alot of you have seen different species of E.Ts. How do you know there are different races? How do you know if there are any at all? Next time yous see one how about a few pictures. Until we are told, yes ETs are real or they want to make contact with the world, nobody knows what the hell is out there.

reply to post by WhizPhiz

Aliens

I offer enlightenment to the readers of this thread. Do with it as you please.

the idea that aliens are on Earth for our benefit

Fluffy: Hello. I am a cat.

Human: Oh, it's a kitty! How adorable!

Flufy: *Purr*

Human: Here you go little kitty, have a treat. *pet* *pet* *love* *cuddle*

Fluffy: *Purr* *purr*

The Threat - Aliens are Evil

Spot: Hello. I am a cat.

Human: Ahh! A cat. How delicious. *Om* *nom* *nom*.

Spot: Gahhhh!!!! *runs away*

some New Age abductees have 'sought assistance from a competent hypnotist,
one who is well-versed in the abduction phenomenon. As a result, they remember events
that do not seem so positive.

Precious: Hello. I am a cat.

Human: Oh, look. Another stray. Come on, it's off to the vet with you. We can't have feral cats just wandering around.

Precious: I'm not sure I trust you.

Human: Hmm. Ok, well, here's a yummy treat. Now come with me please.

Precious: Oh, how delicious! *nom* *nom* Wait...why do I feel so sleepy?

Human: Ok, guys. The anesthetic will last about an hour. Let's neuter him so he doesn't breed more cats.

Precious: *zzzz*

Human: Trust me cat, this is for your own good.


Later, at the cat hangout:

Spot: There are humans!

Muffins: What are you talking about? I've never seen a human. You must be delusional.

Fluffy: No, it's true! I see humans regularly. They come to pet me and give me yummy treats. They are kind and love us.

Spot: What?!!?!? Are you crazy? They want to eat us! They're evil!

Fluffy: No! They love us and adore us and just want the best for us.

Precious: I...don't know. I mean, yeah, they give us treats so they seem very nice, but I don't really trust them. I think they have ulterior motives. I've never been quite the same since encountering them. I feel different and I don't like it.

Muffins: Ok, you're all crazy. I'm leaving now. "Humans." Heh. What rubbish.



When seeking to understand what is outside, try looking inside first.

reply to post by WhizPhiz

He doesn't just make completely baseless statement, he always has a deep line of thought behind everything he says and the conclusions he has reached.

He's a qualified historian telling people that qualified psychologists are wrong. He dismisses them as being focused on weight-loss and anti-smoking. He insists that only people who agree with his view are right. That's called bad research and pseudo science. It means no matter the evidence, it will always point to his conclusion.

In his own words, he won't accept therapists who don't share his view. How does this effect the outcome of regression? He only accepts people with an abduction narrative in place, subject awareness and when/if they don't reveal what he wants...he calls it 'screen memory.' In his own words, he doesn't accept conscious recall and prefers the hypnotic regression route.

There are a half dozen interviews with the guy going back 8 or 9 years. You should listen to them and hear his own words condemn him.

Originally posted by Bonified Ween
ALL"Aliens" are evil? Thread fail. As above so below. There is good and bad wherever you go. Don't proclaim that ALLare evil. If they were, why didn't they just deal with us a long time ago?

Exactly, threads like this are so friggen stupid. Threads like, "Aliens are Demons/Satan" stuff like that is just ignorance.

What do you think we are to them?

reply to post by WhizPhiz

So she's a biomedical scientist? Oooh, that explains it. All the pieces are now coming together. She clearly has very little knowledge related to psychology and not once does she examine the so called faults Jacobs or Hopkins methods in detail.

You're criticising Carol Rainey for not being a psychologist? You're dismissing her informed opinion and experience on those grounds?!

Jacobs is a historian.

Hopkins is an artist

You'll take their extraordinary claims that we're currently being taken over by telepathic white hybrids and yet her mild points are dismissed? Let's put it in perspective...

A: Alien species is conquering Earth through nightly abductions and diluting us from the planet by hybridisation?
B: At least two abduction researchers are using flawed methodologies?

reply to post by WhizPhiz




Geeze man, by the time I finished reading all that I forgot what the topic subject was and had to go back to the top and review. So then I decided to take notes and write a synopsis so that I could review if for myself later. You know, in case I wanted to make a nice reply or something. But then I found that my dog ate the notebook so I had to start over again. But then I got lucky (no, not that kind of "got lucky") and found a website that you can put text into and then a little later you get a kind of like Cliff's Notes in PDF format. So I did that and Wow it was cool so that is what I'll do from now on when I see a topic made up by you.

Oh I forgot to say....... Dang now I forgot.

Considering how vast the universe is, how can you say that ALL extraterrestrials are violent? by making that kind of statement, ur no better then the catholic church burning people at the stake for believing there are other beings in this universe besides us. Also, if ur assuming EVERY extraterrestrial is violent, that makes u no different then a racist. Im sure if extraterrestrials were really that violent, they wouldve wiped us out a while ago.

Have more faith in the beings out in the vastness of space. by the looks of our history on earth, you know how dangerous we are to our own species. Im sure they are a lot smarter then that if they are that much more developed then us.

reply to post by WhizPhiz


Well I think they are just like "scientist". The abduct us, experiment with us, kill us if they need to, just to study us... the same we do with animals :S and the same we would do with them too. Not "evil" or "good", just like us :S interested.

reply to post by WhizPhiz


Scientific studies have shown people who do have these experiences
Are clinically proven to have an over active imagination. Couple this with
Sleep paralysis and bingo , I've been abducted.

I suffered from sleep paralysis in my late teens and I can tell you it can be
Horrendous. I've witnessed with my eyes wide open and feeling totally awake
My girlfriend being killed , ive had my insides pulled out by humanoid figures.

99% of these boards can be explained by current scientific / understanding of
The human condition and the world we live in.


It's the 1% which fascinates me and unfortunately I think
Abductions are a lost cause..........

reply to post by WhizPhiz


So you have read a book and have decided everything in this book is true? have you even met an alien? can you even prove aliens exist? so how do you know? The word of some fruit cake author is not proof either! Sounds like a work of fiction, and this author has you hook, line & sinker to buy his next three books! lol lol lol!

Originally posted by WhizPhiz
reply to post by Bonified Ween

 

ALL"Aliens" are evil?

Please quote me saying all aliens evil. Did I say that? Because I don't think that.

edit on 25-2-2011 by WhizPhiz because: (no reason given)

Your title says aliens are evil. It means all aliens are evil. You have to clarify and say some aliens are evil because that is the correct title.

S n F for the OP. It takes alot courage to go against "them" and some dudes over here

Im gona to read up the whole online book later...anddd Be Brave!

Hey..ya all been under mind-control freakssssss

I don't claim to know the truth about abductions, although I do admit I'm skeptical about them. I don't think anyone knows the facts of the matter. So I have isses when someone says something like:

Originally posted by WhizPhiz
... it's very easy to tell a genuine account when you know some crucial facts about their operations.

Crucial facts? Really? I wasn't aware of any actual facts about abductions. To me there's only speculation and a lot of questionable accounts, and as soon as you throw hypnosis into the mix, all bets are off.

I do know, however, that in the exerpt in the OP there are a few names that I immediately recognize as BS artists/nutballs. The fact that they are included tends to cast doubt on the rest of this body of "research".

In the end, I reserve opinion due to lack of information.

Jacobs believes what he writes, and there is no reason to conclude that he is a liar, or that his contactee's are also lying. Their belief is merely a frame of reference, which is caused by the phenomena itself. On the one hand the phenomenon offers convincing evidence to some people, the contactee's, and at the same time it will offer similarly compelling evidence which completely negates itself.

Some people, incorrectly, believe that abductions/contactee's are a recent phenomena. This couldn't be further from the truth. It's been doing this for centuries. Whatever did happen to these people, it is disturbing, but that does not mean that what occurred is factual, there are so many contradictions within this book that getting any grain of truth has been rendered impossible by the author. There are so many contradictions contained herein that this book is The Truth for those who believe in such things, and a Big Fail for those who don't. The phenomena has done it again, a quite marvellous achievement.

Jacobs is scared at what he believes he has discovered, that much is self-evident from his book. Look around you, at all the cults which have been spreading this belief for at least 60yrs, and also at the exact same evidence which completely negates this viewpoint. Something is having a joke, at our expense, it has been doing so for many centuries, and this something will most definitely continue to do so for many centuries to come.

Rapid industrialization and technological development in the Western cultures apparently led to further restructuring of the phenomenon's frames of reference. The inundation of airships in 1896-97 marked the beginning of the modern UFO phase. Although the phenomenon experimented with the "outer space" frame of reference as early as 1866, it did not attempt to advance this concept on a worldwide scale until 1946. By 1950, it had, in a mere four years, firmly established the extraterrestrial visitants idea as a humanly acceptable frame of reference for the flying objects and manipulations.

Awesome, in as little time as four years, a new religion has sprouted up, entirely overnight, in the universal scale of things. Tip your hat, if nobody is impressed with what occurred here, just remember the historical precedence of most religions, they're normally spread by wars and/or take centuries to mature, but unlike all the other religions it has created, in this instance not a single shot was fired and it took the mere blinking of an eye to mature.

Aliens are defintley a threat to humans, then again, humans are also a threat to humans...

reply to post by LordBucket


Poor kitty.

reply to post by LordBucket


I truly expected a more intellectual response from you Bucket,, how disappointing.

reply to post by Kandinsky

In his own words, he won't accept therapists who don't share his view. How does this effect the outcome of regression? He only accepts people with an abduction narrative in place, subject awareness and when/if they don't reveal what he wants...he calls it 'screen memory.' In his own words, he doesn't accept conscious recall and prefers the hypnotic regression route.

Maybe if you bothered to research some abductions, you would understand the aliens DO always manipulate memories and hide the event deep in their head. Conscious memories of abductions are dangerous because they are almost certainly tainted with screen memories and confabulation. That's not to say many abductees can't remember fragments of their experience, it's just safer and easier to uncover the whole event under hypnosis.

You're criticising Carol Rainey for not being a psychologist? You're dismissing her informed opinion and experience on those grounds?!

Jacobs is a historian.

Hopkins is an artist

I'm criticizing Carol for trying to tell them how to do their job when she's not even a psychiatrist/psychologist. At leat Jacobs clearly knows something about psychology, and he goes to great lengths to examine and avoid confabulated memories. I believe some of his patients are telling him fantasies, and that's unavoidable, you're always going to get crazy people. And their stories are often easier to pick out as false. But there's a clear portion of the abductees that are describing alien activity. Other psychiatrists/psychologists simply can't ever admit that's the truth, they can't handle that thought IMO, they pin it down to other factors such as stated on Jacobs Wikipedia page: "sightings and experiences could be attributed to mistaken identity and faulty memory.". Of course Jacobs is going to disagree with their hypothesis, he has reached informed decisions based on his research, and so have many others. The simple facts are, if you believe in abductions (which a vast amount of qualified psychologists actually do), then you'd have to be blind to not see the trend of reproductive related experiments taking place on the abductees. Jacobs has simply reached the natural conclusion they are carrying out some sort of hybrid program, and I would fully agree.

reply to post by tpak89

Considering how vast the universe is, how can you say that ALL extraterrestrials are violent?

*ultra-freak-out* I'm not saying that...sheesh.

Here is Jacobs take on false memories:

False Memory Syndrome

Critics of the abduction phenomenon charge that abductees, often with the
encouragement of researchers, unknowingly concoct abduction fantasies. That people can
have false memories is beyond doubt. Given certain circumstances, they can, for
example, invent complex accounts of sexual and physical abuse. The False Memory
Syndrome Foundation in Philadelphia is filled with members who have been unfairly
accused of sexual abuse.

False memories of abuse occur when people remember events, usually as children, that
did not happen. Nevertheless, the details the victims relate can be extraordinary. They
relive their experiences with the emotional impact of real events. Some remember Satanic
cults that terrorized them and even killed babies in human sacrifice rituals. When the
"victims" are confronted with facts (investigators have not found dead babies; no babies
were reported missing at the time and place of the ritual abuse cases), they angrily
provide explanations—such as that the mothers themselves were Satanists who gave up
their babies for sacrificial purposes and did not report them missing. People can convey
false memories with such conviction and sincerity that they have fooled many
investigators. Uncovering false memories of sexual abuse can also lead to major
emotional upheavals in people's lives. Families are torn apart, siblings are estranged,
lawsuits are instituted, innocent people are unjustly accused and even jailed.

Uncovering false memories is usually facilitated by a therapist who is convinced that a
client has been sexually abused (or whatever abuse the false memory recounts), even
though the client has no memory of it. Through insistent persuasion, the therapist
inculcates the idea into his client that all his emotional problems stem from the repression
of the memory of some earlier trauma. The therapist might tell the client that if he thinks
hard enough, he will remember the traumatic event. Healing can only begin, the therapist
says, after the memories begin to flow. Not remembering the trauma means that the
victim is in denial, and denial becomes further "proof" of the abuse. Caught in this loop,
the victim of an earnest but misguided therapist finds it difficult to break out. Eventually,
as in the widely publicized case of Paul Ingram and his daughters, the subject
"remembers" the abuse.3

There are expert investigators of false memory syndrome, who have had extensive
experience with allegations of sexual abuse and are able to detect false memories.
However, they have begun to extend their expertise to areas in which, unfortunately, they
are not expert. The abduction phenomenon has become an irresistible target.
For example, psychologist and hypnosis specialist Michael Yapko writes, in Suggestions
of Abuse, that the abduction phenomenon is simply a matter of "the phenomenon of
human suggestibility," which causes him "irritation and disbelief."4 Psychologist and
memory expert Elizabeth Loftus, in her book The Myth of Repressed Memory, treats
abductions as a form of irrationality engaged in by otherwise "sane and intelligent"
people.5 She cites psychologist Michael Nash's assertions that he "successfully treated" a
man who claimed that he had a sperm sample taken from him during an abduction. Using
hypnosis and other therapeutic techniques, Nash calmed the man and helped him return to
his normal routine, but, Nash laments, "He walked out of my office as utterly convinced
that he had been abducted as when he had walked in." Loftus agrees with Nash that the
power of this man's false memories enabled him to continue to believe his ridiculous
story.6

Loftus and Nash, along with other critics, are incorrect. Neither they nor any other critics
have ever presented evidence that abduction accounts are the products of false memory
syndrome (or, for that matter, of any causative factor other than what the abductees have
experienced). The reason they have not presented this evidence is that they do not
understand the abduction phenomenon. If they did, they would realize that abduction
accounts differ from false memory syndrome in five significant areas.

1. In contrast to victims of false memory syndrome, abductees do not recount only
childhood experiences. They do, of course, recall abduction events during
childhood, because the abduction phenomenon begins in childhood, but they also
recall abduction events as adults. In fact, many abduction accounts, unlike false
memory accounts, are of very recent events. Of the last 450 abductions that I have
investigated, nearly 30 percent happened within the previous thirty days and over
50 percent had occurred within the past year. I have also investigated abduction
events that were reported to me only a few hours, or even a few minutes, after
they took place.7

In 1991, for example, Jason Howard, a schoolteacher, was on his way to my
house for an abductee support group meeting. He put on his shoes, which he
keeps by the front door. It is the last thing he always does before he leaves his
house. Suddenly it was four hours later and Jason was on his bed in his bedroom
upstairs. He called me immediately, explaining that he vaguely remembered
putting on his shoes and then lying on the couch. When I conducted a hypnotic
session on this event, Jason remembered putting on one shoe and then feeling an
irresistible urge to lie on the couch. He recalled that small beings appeared in his
living room and floated him directly up through the ceiling into a waiting UFO. A
series of procedures followed, including sperm sampling and mental envisioning
sequences. The aliens returned him to his house, but instead of putting him on the
couch, where he was at the beginning of the abduction, they put him on his bed in
his upstairs bedroom. When he came to consciousness, he realized that something
had happened, and he called me. The immediate reporting of this event does not
fit the description of false memory syndrome.

2. In contrast to victims of false memory syndrome, abductees have indirect
corroboration of events. For example, I was on the phone with Kay Summers,
whose abduction experiences began while we were talking. She described a
roaring noise sometimes associated with the beginning of an abduction, and I
could hear this noise over the phone. Hypnosis later revealed that soon after she
hung up the phone, she was abducted. False memories do not take shape
simultaneously with the occurrence of actual events during which a researcher is
an indirect corroborator.

3. In contrast to victims of false memory syndrome, abductees often remember
events without the aid of a therapist. They can remember events that happened to
them at .specific times in their lives. They have always known that the event
happened, and they do not need a therapist to reinforce their memories.

4. In contrast to victims of false memory syndrome, abductees are physically
missing during the event. The abductee is not where he is supposed to be; people
who search for him cannot find him. The abductee is usually aware that there is a
gap of two or three hours that neither he nor anyone else can account for. Such
physical corrobo-ration does not exist in false memory.

5. In contrast to victims of false memory syndrome, abductees can provide
independent confirmation of the abduction. Approximately 20 percent of
abductions include two or more people who see each other during the abduction
event. They sometimes independently report this to the investigator.

In addition, it is important to note that unlike victims of false memory syndrome,
abductees do not usually experience disintegration of their personal lives after they
become aware of their situation. In fact, in many ways the opposite takes place. When
abductees undergo competent hypnosis and understand the nature of their memories, they
often begin to take intellectual and emotional control over these memories. They feel
more confident as they realize that their supposedly inappropriate thoughts and fears over
the years (for example, fear of going into the bedroom at night, thoughts about lying on a
table in a strange room surrounded by creatures, being unduly frightened of physicians)
were appropriate reactions to a powerful, but unknown, stimulus. By remembering the
events, abductees seize control of the fears that have plagued them for years and get their
lives back in order, even though they know that the abduction phenomenon will not
cease. Knowledge of the abduction phenomenon helps them to lead more "integrated"
lives, rather than having the powerfully disintegrating effects so common with victims of
false memory syndrome.