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U.K Prime Minister, David Cameron, has not ruled out military action in Libya

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posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 01:43 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


But do we really need to spend so much and have such a large military anymore in the first place? the world is a very different place today and that is only going to continue...unless you are a country intent on empire building by attacking and subjugating countries without nuclear weapons, large conventional militaries seems a bit pointless imo.
edit on 25-2-2011 by Solomons because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 01:59 PM
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reply to post by Solomons
 


Its a clear strategic choice.

If we intend to have the military capability of belgium we will need to get used to being as important as belgium. The majority of the population don't really want that. However, public ignorance means politicians can duck the issue or fob the public off with bull#.

Most think we can still sail mighty task forces out to defend our assets round the world.

If you want to play you need the cards. Staying in the game with nothing but bluff is a recipe for defeat and loss of life.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 03:57 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


ll not Unless you threaten to use Nukes. Gaaffe will not bow down to Cameron.

Anoher Iraq people if we allow this to happen.

he wouldnt dothat though would he. UK PM, Cameron would he, if Gadaffe used chemica weapons?

edit on 25-2-2011 by Laurauk because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


Why does it matter if we are not an important player individually in the world and become as important as belgium exactly? We are part of the EU and the EU as a whole is a major global player...i fail to see the fascination with wanting to somehow boast in this day and age about being able to go toe to toe alone against other countries militarily etc etc and other macho mumbo jumbo...it does nothing to better the citizens or our country, just inflates ego's. Im not so sure the majority think like that...
edit on 25-2-2011 by Solomons because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:30 PM
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reply to post by Solomons
 


That is the point exatly. We are part of the E.U the first stepping stone to a NWO. The only reason we have disposed of our ageing fleet and aircraft is the fact that the E.U armed forces will protect us if required.

If you look at the E.U now we are effectively bigger than Russia. Maybe not quite in size, but definately on a military scale.

Anyway, I think this has got off topic. Mods. please close.

Thanks.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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reply to post by Cobaltic1978
 


The EU will protect us?

Thank you, thats made my evening. I feel much safer already.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


LoL The EU Canot protect its own nevemind you or anyone else.

Those who have said so are miseading you, and are offering you false hopes.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:50 PM
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reply to post by Laurauk
 


Indeed. I was joking.

note to self, must remember to add emoticon.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:54 PM
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Originally posted by RizeorDie
like i said before, thanks in advance for trying to help the people britain/nato/usa, but why hijack the protest? let the libyans overthrow ghadaffi with their blood. thats the libyans glory. let them have it. if you really want to help then send food and medicines to the countries after their revolutions so they can get back on their feet. for now let them die in honor for their country and freedom. dont intervene!!


I like this idea...what should happen is the UK, USA etc should give the protesting population guns, ammo, tanks, aircraft etc so that its a fair fight, then we'll see how long Gadaffi is in charge...your totally right though, its the peoples fight, lets just give them a hand!!!!



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 04:57 PM
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reply to post by jrmcleod
 


I like that idea, tho from biased Sky reporting they where reporting that the protesters had already cleared out a few of the army bases, so I think they have already made moves to level the playing fields.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:12 PM
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reply to post by jrmcleod
 


I think this probably is how it will pan out if the regime continues to resist the general population with heavy weapons.

I dont see NATO troop ground intervention but the 'No Fly Zone' and 'Humanitarian Re-supply by air and sea' option seems more likely every day.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:22 PM
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reply to post by Laurauk
 


Eh? In 2003 there was a worldwide protest against the Iraq war consisting of around 10 million people in 60 countries. 2 million of those people were protesting in London and iirc it was the largest anti-war protest staged during the conflict. It achieved nothing. During the protest the then mayor of London Ken Livingston stated

"This war is solely about oil. George Bush has never given a damn about human rights."


Sounding a bit familiar?



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:24 PM
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reply to post by Itop1
 


Indeed. Most of the redundancies in the Armed forces are coming from civilian staff, which at the moment the MoD outnumbers the entire Army in terms of manpower! Most Army redundancies are for long serving NCO's who have already exceed their 22 years and have stayed on as rolling contracts.

The RAF is slimming fighter squadrons because they simply are not needed. We have several, highly advanced UCAV programmes, including Corax, which will provide strike capability.

The Navy is getting several new destroyers and bidding has begun on the Frigate replacement programme. The reason "some" bemoan the cuts is

A) They have been mislead by media hype
B) Don't understand our capability
C) Aren't aware of future procurement

The next 7 years will be a slightly dodgy time in terms of overlap between cuts and procurement, but the Government is still following the strategic commitment of the UK being able to deploy forces the world over. What people also forget is just because ships and planes have been cut, they aren't all binned or sold straight away. The UK has a massive fleet in reserve, just bobbing around in Portsmouth, massive amounts of reserve soldiers, hundreds of aircraft and tanks are sat in storage and some of the world's most advanced weaponry.

The UK always has maintained the ability to deploy two brigade sized missions anywhere in the world. Combine this with our Allies and the fact we have no Naval Air cover at the moment is irrelevant. We can, if needed in the case of Libya, fly Air Support from the UK, France, Spain, Cyprus or Italy. No need for carriers where this is concerned.

EDIT: As for the whole "it's about the Oil" nonsense. So what if it is? Our military and Government are here to look after OUR national interest, not anyone elses. If a country that supplies a vast amount of our fuel suddenly cuts us off, then we should be prepared to intervene.
edit on 25/2/11 by stumason because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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reply to post by stumason
 


Well informed and optimistic. You are a rare breed. :-)

You have faith that the jam tomorrow will actually arrive. I doubt it.

The capability holidays will more than likely become retirement.

The army will be gutted out as soon as its expedient to do so. Its just too embarrassing at the moment.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:36 PM
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reply to post by stumason
 


Not to mention that the services have operated a blue peter approach with men and kit for,
well, pretty much forever..



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:36 PM
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reply to post by lpowell0627
 


We already pay roughly the equivilent of $9usd a gallon, do you see fuel protests in the UK? Our government takes something like 70% of that in tax and the idiot masses let them. The people of Britain cant complain for crap, unless its about the treatment of illegal immigrants or minority groups. Stiff upper lip and all that bollocks.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:39 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


From memory (I'll need to check this) but in the 1820s while in economic distress we (Britain) made 90% of the Navy redundant... and I believe the same approach was used across the board... that approach (massive reduction in our military) led (in part) into the Swing Riots of the 1830s (massive under-employment).. but even so that still did not stop us being one of the worlds preeminent nations.



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 05:50 PM
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reply to post by thoughtsfull
 


Its all a matter of timing isn't it.

If you have a capability and don't need it, its MoD bloat. If you don't have it and don't need it nobody notices. Everybody gets upset if you need it and don't have it.

I'm sure nothing unexpected will happen in the next decade. Its a calm safe world after all. :-)



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 06:10 PM
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reply to post by justwokeup
 


Our illustrious leaders usually seem to be unprepared for everything, with awful timing but somehow the services manage in true blue peter fashion.

IMHO our military seem to be perpetually under funded and miss managed by the donkeys in power, and I can not see that changing any time soon.

Tho if I was wearing a tin foil hat and reflecting on how convenient for fleet management and refit it was that Maggie had some capital ships in dock ready for the scrap yard at the onset of the Falklands war, one could in theory assume the same *cough* luck might be applied today



posted on Feb, 25 2011 @ 06:32 PM
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reply to post by thoughtsfull
 


Its always worth keeping our fingers crossed that theres some cunning master plan.

Although, we do seem in a real hurry to turn things into razor blades these days.

Invincible is already spoken for.

www.bbc.co.uk...

Seems likely Illustrious will go the same way in short order and the Nimrod was barely announced before the chopping started.

I did like the sneaky chinese bid to buy Invincible. You have to give them credit for having a brass neck.



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