The Attack on Intelligent people.

One of my favorites

Wow.

Yeah, I do have to agree that your post contains a massive generalization, Beyond Creation. There are all types of people in this world, and maybe you just have experienced more of the shallow type. It's a problem affecting both genders, though, and there have been at least a couple other threads just recently on here about the dumbing down of the population.

As far as all the picture posting goes, I hadn't noticed the percentage of women posting their pictures as their avatar here was that high. To me that would say more about the way they approach this site and other online forums in terms of relationships with others (to know others and be known) rather than superficiality (merely showing off their appearance). But then, maybe I"m different enough that I could be way off on that opinion.

I was curious about your comment on how impossible it seems to understand women. I've come across that complaint every so often, and it always sort of amuses me. I've never understood why people have to try to make things more complicated than they are by treating one gender as if it's so mysterious as to be utterly incomprehensible. I guess it comes down to communication style, really. Some people are a bit less direct. Some integrate both emotion and reason, whereas guys stereotypically stick with reason. That may be where some confusion can tend to come in? I'm curious to hear others' thoughts on the matter.

On the subject of intelligence and love, this has been a very interesting discussion, if a bit cynical. When it comes down to it, love is an act of will. It goes beyond hormones, or sex, or even feelings to a devotion and commitment to taking care of each other, of being there for each other through thick and thin.

This is an interesting thread, given that there is NOBODY here on ATS with an intellectual quotient higher than 80.

Also, none of the males here on ATS have ever attracted a fertile female in their entire lives.

Originally posted by ErtaiNaGia
reply to post by WhizPhiz

 

It doesn't matter if that man earns his living through ruthless and underhanded tactics, because that's what wins in this society, and survival of the fittest will always rule.

This is true for societies also, and any society that pretends that stealing is a better way of providing for its citizens than production, will find its enemies numerous, its resources strained, and its economy utterly crushed.

Hence, The global Financial Downturn.

edit on 19-2-2011 by ErtaiNaGia because: spelling

You're definitely on to something here, but there has to more to it than that. The human trait for "taking value" currently provides more fitness to the individual than the human trait for "creating value," and I can't think of any time in history that this wasn't the case. Is this something that will correct itself over tens of thousands of years? Can you explain how hurting "society-the-entity" will ever be detrimental to the fitness of the individual? The only example I can think of is the extreme cataclysmic event of violent revolution which doesn't happen often enough to influence the species. Without a consequence to the fitness of the individual, I'm afraid that the trait of "taking value" will forever be beneficial.

I've thought this through, and I've come to terms with it. There won't be any world peace, shared prosperity, local planetary or moon colonization, and certainly no interstellar anything. Human civilization will languish like a sine wave until a near-ELE blows us back to the stone age. With any luck we'll be wiped out completely to make way for another species' advancement.

Intelligent people are so boring. Just the way they talk wants to make you go to sleep. My god. Who cares about half the stuff they moan about.

Guess this totally blows Darwin's theory out the water.

Mean, intelligent people would be considered as the best partner in a world like ours where intelligence is a way of survival.
But I guess not.

More power to the stupid

''Yeah, I do have to agree that your post contains a massive generalization, Beyond Creation. There are all types of people in this world, and maybe you just have experienced more of the shallow type. It's a problem affecting both genders,.. ''

Absolutely! Whenever I hear a complaint starting with 'all men are just..'' or 'some women are really..' I have to intervene and say 'what you mean is some people are..'. I realise that despite my awareness I have been guilty of this myself.

Although I offered an opinion, admittedly it is tainted by subjectivity and personal experience.

''As far as all the picture posting goes, I hadn't noticed the percentage of women posting their pictures as their avatar here was that high. To me that would say more about the way they approach this site and other online forums in terms of relationships with others (to know others and be known) rather than superficiality (merely showing off their appearance). But then, maybe I"m different enough that I could be way off on that opinion. ''

I may have exaggerated my observation but sometimes I get the impression that certain female members are fishing for compliments or perhaps are over-familiar with the likes of facebook etc.

WRT to understanding the opposite sex, sometimes I feel that modern women have lost their respect for a chivalrous gentleman and may treat the courtesy as an insult. Also I feel that some women underestimate just how emotional men can be. Granted, its true that men generally don't discuss their feeling with each other but it is an error to assume that they don't feel the same relationship or commitment issues.

''I guess it comes down to communication style, really. Some people are a bit less direct. Some integrate both emotion and reason, whereas guys stereotypically stick with reason.''

Men talk in facts which has its origin in the hunter/gather days and deal with their emotions internally, whereas women often share their relationship issues with other females for advice and external opinion. Communication, or lack of is paramount to resolution and I'll agree is what it comes down to.


''When it comes down to it, love is an act of will''

Both partners need to be willing to work on and encourage the relationship but like the old saying goes ''you can't help who you fall in love with''.

Ironically, I'm quite good at helping with other's relationship, when asked, but when it comes to my own, I get it so wrong, which would be fine if I only understood what I do wrong.

I'm glad of the feedback. Thanks Ariel . Its been an education.

So...do you come here often? (just kidding)

Originally posted by MMPI2
This is an interesting thread, given that there is NOBODY here on ATS with an intellectual quotient higher than 80.

Also, none of the males here on ATS have ever attracted a fertile female in their entire lives.

so are you saying that my impecable knowledge of nibiru and it's 3600 year orbit will not get me laid?
well if that don't work guess I got to romance em with my chemtrail poetry.

Originally posted by wingsfan

Originally posted by MMPI2
This is an interesting thread, given that there is NOBODY here on ATS with an intellectual quotient higher than 80.

Also, none of the males here on ATS have ever attracted a fertile female in their entire lives.

so are you saying that my impecable knowledge of nibiru and it's 3600 year orbit will not get me laid?
well if that don't work guess I got to romance em with my chemtrail poetry.

Or you could try..''you have beautiful slit eyes and my, what a big tail you have. Ever heard of David Icke?''

MMPI2 - Judging by your cute little smiley I'm guessing your kidding right?

People with high IQs are good at IQ tests. That's it. Intelligence has far more meaning than answering multiple answer questions about patterns etc

Originally posted by Beyond Creation

"Absolutely! Whenever I hear a complaint starting with 'all men are just..'' or 'some women are really..' I have to intervene and say 'what you mean is some people are..'. I realise that despite my awareness I have been guilty of this myself. Although I offered an opinion, admittedly it is tainted by subjectivity and personal experience."

- Very wise. Hopefully you will find better experiences!


"I may have exaggerated my observation but sometimes I get the impression that certain female members are fishing for compliments or perhaps are over-familiar with the likes of facebook etc."

-Could be that, too. There are probably a whole host of reasons for it

.


"WRT to understanding the opposite sex, sometimes I feel that modern women have lost their respect for a chivalrous gentleman and may treat the courtesy as an insult. Also I feel that some women underestimate just how emotional men can be. Granted, its true that men generally don't discuss their feeling with each other but it is an error to assume that they don't feel the same relationship or commitment issues."

-It may not be a loss of respect for chivalry, but more like a reaction to taking it as being treated as less capable or whatever. I guess everyone has their way of viewing things, and the reactions to it are understandable, even though others may view it and react to it quite differently. And I agree about it being an error to understimate how emotional men can be, or that they don't struggle with the same relationship and commitment issues that women do.


"Both partners need to be willing to work on and encourage the relationship but like the old saying goes ''you can't help who you fall in love with''.

Ironically, I'm quite good at helping with other's relationship, when asked, but when it comes to my own, I get it so wrong, which would be fine if I only understood what I do wrong."


-Very true that it takes work on the part of both members of the couple. That's definitely what keeps a relationship going. I've been blessed in that regard in my marriage. Hopefully you'll one day soon find the insights you're looking for.


"I'm glad of the feedback. Thanks Ariel . Its been an education.

So...do you come here often? (just kidding)"

-I'm glad to have helped!

Originally posted by pcrobotwolf
reply to post by ErtaiNaGia

 

A lot of women don't think logically in relationships please do not kill me for this but its true and I'm not saying they don't think logically I'm saying in relationship they don't. They let emotions take control and when that happens wow watch out.

Won't jump down your throat. But as one intelligent woman, I can say that the same is true for men. I cannot tell you how many times (and from many men) I have heard, "I'm right because I'm right."

At that point, not liking argument, I nod and tell them they're right. Usually the issue is petty, anyway.

Originally posted by Beyond Creation
I'm not even sure if there is a degree of intelligence obtainable to understand women, or are they really that simple?

You just have to understand the feminine part of yourself, they really aren't that hard to comprehend even though most guys rave about women being impossible to understand, hell, I'd even go as far as to say that I probably understand the psychology of women better than most women do, because they don't even understand themselves and what they want, and that's a central part of their psychology. Keep in mind I'm generalizing here so don't shoot me down.
How many times have you heard a woman say "I just want a nice guy that treats me like a... *long list of demands*". Then they go out and get their brains screwed out by the football captain, why? Because they don't even understand what they're attracted to, at least most young girls. I would like to think that older women have searched themselves enough to know.

When you know how their minds work, and how attraction works it's pretty easy to manipulate them if you're into that. I'm not however, sure I'll play games, but women love it and I have no nefarious intentions.
Just because I know the rules and play by them doesn't mean that I'm cheating them in any way.

I "figured women out" when I was about 18-20 and they lost a lot of appeal because of it, I agree with your assertion that most women are shallow, I think it has a lot to do with conditioning though. So I won't go out of my way to find a girlfriend or a one night stand. Even when I am approached I'll usually decline any invitations because of my high standards.. usually there's no intellectual stimulation so it would come down to sex and I don't f with average looking chicks.
Besides, sex is incredibly overrated.. by the way society treats it you'd think that it's eternal salvation in heaven or something ... boggles my mind.

I'm still searching for a partner though, but I have no illusions of finding one in the near future, I guess my taste is too specific.

This quote is very appropriate:

"An intellectual is a person who's found one thing that's more interesting than sex."
- Aldous Huxley

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


It could be several different things.

Intelligent men could realize that this world is severely void of freedom/justice/peace and abound with suffering and corruption etc, who the hell would want to bring someone else into this mess against their will?

I used to think along these lines and vowed never to get married or have kids. I reneged in this pretty hard a year ago when I got married and had a kid within a 2 year period...

I love my wife and daughter with everything I have and the EXPERIENCE of having them in my life has definitely changed my perspective and approach to life.

I am burdened with a sense of guilt as to what type of world I brought my daughter into. What type of life is she going to have to live? Especially concerning the state of the world currently.

It could also be that the more intelligent males have troubles with relationships because their "interests" and "topics of discussion" bore their dates, the interests are not the same. While she is concerned with the latest Jersey Shore or Kardashian show, the latest fashion trends and consumption he is contemplating quantum physics the nature of our reality and the realities of other dimensions etc...this relationship won't go too far I don't think.

Luckily my wife has intelligence that matched mine and we feed from each others outlooks..This is ultimately why we got married.

Unfortunately I think women succumb and become victim to the consumption game easier than men, there is just simply more stuff for women to consume. Disclaimer: not all women are like this.

I do believe though that women are at a significant disadvantage when it comes to "seeing" through the materialistic BS as opposed to men.

The disease that has become our society from over consumption and excess is killing everything, our relationships with the opposite sex and willingness to participate in this crap anymore are just an example of what society is evolving into.

I think I can solve the problem without the need for any particular scientific input...

Its saturday night and we're all sat at home on ATS, instead of being out clubbing with all the thickos..and getting laid...

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


hey , maybe u shouldnt think of having a high IQ as a negative :L i bet if you looked at the average income of people with an IQ of above 100 it would be double that below 100 ,

Intelligence is far too complex and subjective a concept to be accurately measured or quantified.

IQ tests merely attempt to measure some aspects of intelligence, such as logic and problem-solving, and consequently, the result of an IQ test only suggests someone's level of adeptness at applying these skills, and is not an indicator of intelligence as a whole.
They are not an accurate measure of other important facets of intelligence, such as speed of learning, creativity, originality, memory, practicality, forethought, assessing and reading a situation, emotional intelligence, lack of manipulability... the list goes on and on. Many of these abilities are impossible to measure, as there are no test or questions, let alone right answers, that could be used to quantify someone's ability in these departments.
Overall, an IQ test only focuses on a small number of facets that contribute to overall intelligence.

What I believe to be the case, in terms of IQ scores, is that the average to above average level is all you need on a practical, day to day basis, and that anything higher is only useful in an academic sense.
In other words, having an IQ of 170 isn't going to give you any advantage over someone who has an IQ of 100 in a real-world set of scenarios and situations.

Those who score highly on IQ tests are usually involved in academic and scientific pursuits, as their skills are suited to that, whereas those who score averagely on IQ tests have much more of an opportunity to hone their intelligence to master more mundane and practical skills and gain a more balanced level of social intelligence.
All of the latter abilities are far more important and attractive to a mate than a high level of scientific and academic knowledge, which is more useful to a group as a whole, but not as an item of value to a potential mate.

Only practically applied intelligence and social intelligence are relevant in attracting a mate, and those with high IQs don't have any more of this than those without a high IQ. On the contrary, they tend to have less.

reply to post by TheLaughingGod


LOL.

Most of your post could have been written by me, as your experience echoes mine in many ways.

I bought in to the whole ''women are impossible to understand'' thing and the general bad advice that about finding a nice girl right up until my late teens and early 20s.

It was only after getting my fingers burnt a few times and seeing several nice girls pass me up in favour of men who - without wishing to sound arrogant - didn't offer as much as I did, that I realised that I was approaching it all wrong way and that everything that I had been taught about women was largely bs.

It was at this point that I decided to ignore and forget all my preconceptions about what women want and how to attract them, and instead, through logic and observation, I studied and analysed their behaviour, attitudes, interactions, and generally what made them tick, for a couple of years.

The more I analysed and applied the results of this analysis in my meetings with women, the more successful I became over the two years, until I finally thought ''Is this it ? There's nothing more ?''.

Consequently, I find women to be largely boring, easily manipulated, and - dare I say it - child-like, and I have no interest in forming anything other than a physical relationship with them.
I don't mean to be mean, and I know there are women who aren't like this, but I really haven't got the inclination to go out of my way to find one.

I wish I was a teenager again, when they still had mystery about them.

evolution is not survival of the smartest. often is survival of the dumbest or the most opportunist.

reply to post by Beyond Creation

People with high IQs are good at IQ tests. That's it. Intelligence has far more meaning than answering multiple answer questions about patterns etc

This is a Highly uninformed and idiotic opinion, Intelligence is a measure of critical thinking, abstract thinking, problem solving, and knowledge application, A.K.A. What built the world that is around you.

Please do not *ATTACK INTELLIGENCE* in a thread describing how TPTB are attacking intelligence.

IT MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE THE ENEMY


Just saying.


reply to post by Sherlock Holmes

Intelligence is far too complex and subjective a concept to be accurately measured or quantified.

And this is also a pseudo Scientific Bull[snip] Response, IQ is a rather rigorous determination of intelligence, seeing as how we KNOW what intelligence is by MANY metrics, including Definition, Neuro-Scientifically, and what have you.

IQ tests merely attempt to measure some aspects of intelligence, such as logic and problem-solving, and consequently, the result of an IQ test only suggests someone's level of adeptness at applying these skills, and is not an indicator of intelligence as a whole.

No, listen.... that is WHAT INTELLIGENCE *IS*

IQ Tests MEASURE INTELLIGENCE.

They are not an accurate measure of other important facets of intelligence

This is a common misconception, that there are forms of intelligence that are not "Intelligence", like "Kicking a Ball Intelligence" for example, popularized in the book "The Theory of multiple Intelligences by the Jewish Howard Gardner.

The Theory of Multiple Intelligences, and Emotional Intelligence is a Pseudo-Scientific *FICTION*

None of it is REAL, and none of it is even ACCEPTED by the scientific community.

Here, take a look at some of the Psychologists, Psichiatrists, Neuroscientists, etcetera that discourage taking Gardners "Theory" (And I use the word as loosely as possible) seriously.

www.bcl.edu.ar/spip/IMG/pdf/3.pdf

The Myth of Multiple Intelligences

Inadequate Evidence for Multiple Intelligences,
Mozart Effect, and Emotional Intelligence Theories

*What I believe to be the case, in terms of IQ scores, is that the average to above average level is all you need on a practical, day to day basis, and that anything higher is only useful in an academic sense.
In other words, having an IQ of 170 isn't going to give you any advantage over someone who has an IQ of 100 in a real-world set of scenarios and situations.

The Qualifying statement at the beginning of this paragraph "What I Believe" should have been bolded, Highlighted, and made 2 text sizes larger so that we can all be absolutely sure that you are attacking intelligence for no reason other than a hunch. So I have done that for you.

You are of course, Completely Wrong.

Those who score highly on IQ tests are usually involved in academic and scientific pursuits, as their skills are suited to that, whereas those who score averagely on IQ tests have much more of an opportunity to hone their intelligence to master more mundane and practical skills and gain a more balanced level of social intelligence.

Social Intelligence is not a Real form of intelligence, it is merely a skill set consisting of experiance and knowledge about situations.

It requires experiance and positive feedback to gain Social Aptitude... that is all.... and that is something that Intelligent people get less often, as they have the weight of the world placed on their shoulders.

You see:

Women require Greater and greater "Experience" and "sexual confidence" in their male mates as they get older (as they "Sample" other men), thus, men who didn't "get er Done" when they were supposed to be LEARNING, will have a harder time than those whose scholastic schedule revolved around making them more physically attractive, socially dominant, and surrounded by perky cheerleaders for that added confidence boost. (Not to mention the draw of a men dressed to present a unified front of strength for psychological intimidation....)

Please stop using "Social Intelligence" "Multiple Intelligence" and such as actual words that you believe have some sort of Merit, they DON'T... they are not REAL THINGS, and have NEVER met the criterion for accepted scientific theories, and have been COMPLETELY Debunked.

This is what I mean about an ATTACK on intelligence..... By the Way.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Now don't take any offense to any of this. These are only my observations, and thus, from my point of view and not meant to demean anybody. Having said that I think the major issue is that most intelligent people are more analytical and less emotional, and thus have been socially awkward most of their lives. Also, they aren't usually very attractive (think of the nerds in Revenge of the Nerds) Not saying all intelligent men fit into this category, but a majority do. When a woman is looking to reproduce (and subconciously they all are), they seek out strength, asthetics, and security. Most intelligent men are lighter weight, a great many wear glasses (An old fashioned indication subconciously to the woman that his genetics are imperfect) I actually saw this on history of sex, so these are valid facts. I mean about the eyeglasses, but same goes if they use an inhaler, or have allergies, etc. Another big thing is intelligent men tend to be more controlling when they do have the strength behind it. Women do not like to be treated like a robot, so if they feel their partner may manipulate and coerce them etc, they may walk away.
This is coming from a woman. So there you go, I don't really think its so much discrimination, I beleive it really is more subconcious.

reply to post by Sherlock Holmes

I studied and analysed their behaviour, attitudes, interactions, and generally what made them tick, for a couple of years. The more I analysed and applied the results of this analysis in my meetings with women, the more successful I became over the two years, until I finally thought ''Is this it ? There's nothing more ?''

I wish you would share with the rest of us the result of your study, research and insight.