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Wisconsin Is the New France: Entitlement Derangement Syndrome

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posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:04 PM
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Wisconsin Is the New France: Entitlement Derangement Syndrome


www.patheos.com

For days, chaos gripped France as protestors surged into the streets by the hundreds of thousands. The fury was palpable as protestors blocked roads, battled with police, and waved their red union flags. The reason for their rage? The government's proposal to raise the retirement age from 60 (one of the world's lowest) to 62.

Welcome to the world of Entitlement Derangement Syndrome. In this world, the battle isn't about overthrowing tyranny or confronting the threat of hunger, poverty, or invasion. Instead, the battle is about comfort. It's about leisure. We will even stop doing our job
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:04 PM
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The article makes a great point about there being a fundamental and negative cultural shift when individuals move from thinking they should keep the fruits of their own labor to believing they're entitled to the fruits of others' labor. Shutting down government for the sake of benefits you didn't pay for, and health insurance you didn't purchase, represents an entitlement mentality run amok.

Because when when the States rob Peter to pay Paul they always get Pauls help.

Problem is the state employees and welfare queens are Paul and tax payers like me are Peter.

www.patheos.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:22 PM
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That article is PURE propaganda....diagnose it as whatever you want MSM and other minions. Might be in next years DSM it sounds so intelligent and well thought out. I applaud people of Wisconsin for standing up. We've been force fed a mock democracy for years now. A facade carefully put on by TPTB, to keep us complacent with mouths shut. And its worked. I don't care if its a pebble among boulders. Point is people need to stand up and protest unlawful and unconstitutional local & federal government. Americans have sat on their ass like nice little boys since JFK was murdered. Had not one significant protest during the Bush regime.Unbelievable Americans. Should be ashamed.
edit on 18-2-2011 by DivineVirtue because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:22 PM
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Maybe the derangement is the government's "let them eat cake" approach.

A wide chasm of class stratification does not a stable and productive society make.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:34 PM
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Originally posted by pirhanna
Maybe the derangement is the government's "let them eat cake" approach.

A wide chasm of class stratification does not a stable and productive society make.


The derangement is the unions thinking there is cake to eat.

There is no cake. Or pie. Get over it.


edit on 18-2-2011 by Califemme because: I must.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:40 PM
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reply to post by DivineVirtue
 


Pure propaganda? Have you compared what the private sector employees receives and what the public sector ones get? Closing down the schools to go protest? The propaganda is that the big loss is at the union leadership level not the rank and file. No union dues, no pay for the union heads, no campaign contributions and no redundant group "negotiating" things that are already regulated by the "gasp" government! Imagine the economic situation if union members were not paying dues to the vestigial appendage called the union!



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by SirMike
 


You really are pissed off at workers having the gall to ask to be paid and treated well, arent you?

If the deal they had was 60, they why shouldnt they be pissed off if that deal is being changed? Do you think my mortgage company would be pissed off if I borrowed 70k but later decided I was only going to pay them back 50k?

Why shouldnt the citizens of a nation, the people who work, and sweat, and bleed and die for this country be treated like valuable human beings? Why shoudlnt the enormous wealth generated by those people make their lives better, in the form of higher wages, better health care, earlier retirements?

Why should all of Americas wealth end up in the hands of a very small percentage of the population who has figured out how to rob the shareholders of corporations and the employees of those corporations blind? Both through outrageous salaries and bonuses as management, and by insider trading on the stock market?



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:53 PM
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Why Are 25 Hedge Fund Managers Worth 658,000 Teachers?


What work do we value most?

In 2009, the worst economic year for working people since the Great Depression, the top 25 hedge fund managers walked off with an average of $1 billion each. With the money those 25 people "earned," we could have hired 658,000 entry level teachers. (They make about $38,000 a year, including benefits.) Those educators could have brought along over 13 million young people, assuming a class size of 20. That's some value.


www.huffingtonpost.com...



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 05:59 PM
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The facts on the ground in WI is that the people voted for less government spending since that was the platform the Republicans came in on so this is one of the first steps the governor took and the republican majority legislature was due to vote on. It is the people of that state that want these type of cuts and they are by the way pretty minor compared to what most people get. I am not a repub or dem but we are a democratic republic and the people want these cuts.

The teachers and other unions just showed they do not care what the people want they want their cushy retirement without paying into it and their sweet medical insurance for next to nothing. There is a lot more spending that is going to get cut across the nation so they better get used to it or find a private sector job. (Good luck with that in this market)



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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A deal is a deal.

ALL employees have the right to be represented by a union if they so choose; and the WI state employees made that choice with their votes.

Neither the Governor of that state, nor anyone other than the employees themselves, have the right to dis-enfranchise the employees under any circumstance.

What Walker is trying to do flies in the face of long established contract law. And I'm not talking about simply Labor contract law here; I'm talking about ALL CONTRACT LAW!!


It is a basic principle of contract law that, once both parties agree to the terms of a contract, neither party may unilaterally renigg on any of the terms of said contract unless they are to be found in breach of the contract in whole.

"Tough times" or not, the Governor, as the State's chief representative, is legally bound to adhere to the terms of the contract signed in the State's behalf.

And that includes all the rights granted to the State's unionized employees.


Consider what would be the outcome if, in the private sector, a contract between two parties could be voided at the whim of either party, simply by claiming a "financial emergency".

That is what this Yayhoo is attempting to formalize.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:13 PM
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Man, I keep thinking what problems will be solved if we move into abundance (no money - no poverty). This is one of them.

For a view of what we are just now in a position to do, please read here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

And the Ethical Planetarian Party platform linked in my sig.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by Bhadhidar

What Walker is trying to do flies in the face of long established contract law. And I'm not talking about simply Labor contract law here; I'm talking about ALL CONTRACT LAW!!


It is a basic principle of contract law that, once both parties agree to the terms of a contract, neither party may unilaterally renigg on any of the terms of said contract unless they are to be found in breach of the


Exactly. I dont know why the pro-business crowd has such a problem with that. If everyone just unilaterally decided that they could sign contracts and then do what they hell they wanted to do regardless of the terms stuff would go down hill fast.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:18 PM
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Our grandparents, great grandparents and great great grandparents fought long and hard to get rights which we take for granted today.

Don't be so quick to give them up, because it's a hell of a lot harder to get them back.

Don't forget the Koch's, and don't forget this governor is on his payroll.

The governor had the gall to threaten workers with the national guard.

You have to stand up to that kind of arrogance, one way or another.

They want to break the back of the unions so that they can make more profits, and skin a man for a fair days work.

Don't buy into it - drip down economics is a crock.

Wealth comes from the bottom up - that's why those guys are so wealthy - and they do it on the back of others.

Nothing wrong with that, if there's a factory owner producing something, or council workers tidying up the streets, or doing whatever has to be done to keep things running smoothly for the taxpayers.

What's wrong is someone wanting to cut wages so that he can earn a few extra 100k a year.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:22 PM
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The deranged behavior I see is the people who refuse to see that the problem here is not about benefits or pay. Everyone I have talked to or heard speak have talked about the union busting part of the bill. What is going on is not an attempt to balance the budget but an attack on the political opponents of the republicans. They tried to push through this bill in a week without discussion, without even an attempt to talk with the unions involved about concessions.

If collective bargaining causes so much of a problems then why were police, firefighters, and state troopers left out of the bill. Most likely because they supported the Governor in the last election.

The deranged behavior I see is people blaming public workers for our economic problems while supporting tax breaks for businesses again, those who supported the Governor in the last election.

This is the definition of corrupt Government but some people refuse to see because "my side is winning".



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:32 PM
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reply to post by budski
 


Absolutely. Trickle down economics is a LIE. Economies trickle up, they always have. Every one of them without exception.

And the elite know it.

www.economist.com...


Some fear that the productivity improvements that have driven profit growth since the financial crisis will soon tail off. “Around 90% of the productivity growth in corporate America has come from cost-cutting, and that is now reaching its limit,” says Carsten Stendevad of Citigroup’s corporate-advisory arm. Scared for their jobs during the crisis, employees toiled more for no more money; but they cannot be whipped much harder. To increase profits still further, firms need to increase sales far more than most analysts think they will, reckons Mr Stendevad.

Squeezing the lemon

Others disagree. “There is a lot more juice to be squeezed out of the lemon,” insists Hal Sirkin of BCG, a consultancy. Firms brag about having introduced “lean systems”, but most have done only “10-25% of what they could do”, says Mr Sirkin.


Squeezing the lemon. And we, my friends, are the lemons they think they can get 10-25% more efficiency from. Efficiency meaning less pay for more work.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:34 PM
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reply to post by wayouttheredude
 


The "teachers and other unions" happen to be citizens of the state state, you know.


Or did you think that the State of WI imports its employees from Mars?


State employees ARE TAXPAYERS TOO!.

What does it take to get that simple fact through everyone's thick dogma?


The only difference between public sector employees and private sector employees is that private sector wages are generally higher than those paid in the pubic sector; because private sector employers do not fund their employees benefits, and do not generally, contribute to their employees' retiremnt funds. These provisions are left up to the individual employee to provide for him/herself.

Pubic employees accept lower wages because their retirement funds and benefits are paid for them.


So, if you are making less to start with, and your employer (the government, in this case) forces you to start paying for your own retirement and benefits, while cutting your actual wages, you are going to be in a world of hurt very quickly.


If you think government workers have health and retirement benefits that are too cushy, fine.

Raise their WAGES to true "market" value and then cut their benefits.


Let's just see how the so-called "taxpayers" like having to come up with the tax dollars needed to pay for true "Parity"!



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by Bhadhidar
A deal is a deal.


THANK you! This isn't about "entitlements", at least not as usually understood. These people _are_ entitled to their union and their benefits because they were _promised_ them.

Heck, this whole thing is a scam anyhow. Gov. Walker is looking to cut $170 million to pay for the breaks and subsidies he promised to his big contributors. It's a BS emergency ginned up for political gain. It's a clear case of political theater with lasting negative repercussions for all of the fine people of Wisconsin (and having grown up in Northern Illinois, you cannot beLIEVE how it pains me to say that).
edit on 18-2-2011 by Stunspot because: typo



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 07:14 PM
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reply to post by Stunspot
 


Been there, Done that!

I'm a California State employee.

A recovering victim of "Arnold the 'Governator'".


The WI state employees' union needs to file suit against Walker for Breech of Contract if this travesty goes through.

There is legal precedent. A federal judge in, I think it was Vermont, or Maryland (?), found that labor contracts are subject to the same constraints regarding breeches as any other form of business contract.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by Califemme

Originally posted by pirhanna
Maybe the derangement is the government's "let them eat cake" approach.

A wide chasm of class stratification does not a stable and productive society make.


The derangement is the unions thinking there is cake to eat.

There is no cake. Or pie. Get over it.


edit on 18-2-2011 by Califemme because: I must.


the republican governor and a republican majority in the state house came in, with a state surplus already in place...they cut taxes for the wealthy, and then declared there was a budget crisis and he had to cut the regular state workers pay and benefits. hey i know...why don't you tell the truth...class warfare? you're damn right.



posted on Feb, 18 2011 @ 07:46 PM
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It made me laugh when the democrats ran away and hid in a hotel out of state so that the governor couldn't call on them.



nice move, but in a democracy, it shouldn't be necessary.



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