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Military chaplain: Soldier's rape 'must have been God's will'

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posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 04:57 AM
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Originally posted by Jinglelord

Look I'm trying insanely hard to be civil and mask my real opinion. How stupid does a woman have to be to....


Obviously really stupid in YOUR idiotic world.

Thank frag I live in my world... where Women are not guilty for the crimes committed against them.





posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 05:15 AM
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Maybe the holy man was just telling her the same thing as he's told all of the alter boys that he's sexually assaulted and raped .



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 06:39 AM
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Reply to post by Sinnthia

Hi again,

Please try to understand I am not here to Oppose your view and offend you. I am here only to offer a different perspective to view Life in the World from.


Originally posted by Sinnthia
I understand that but what you do not seem to understand is that bigger plan involves DISMISSING this rape as a good thing for its part in that plan. It cannot really be more clear than that to me. ......


Sorry, but No, it doesn't mean Dismiss.. that is Your perception, not mine. And it doesn't mean it's "Good". If you re-read the words used you will see no value judgements of the sort were made... in fact I made a point of saying so.

Tayesin quote..

My perception is that we have all been Rapist and Raped in our lifetimes on this world... hence Empathy comes naturally. At no time have I said anything to belittle the Experience of this Lady.



Originally posted by Sinnthia
Actually you just belittled it right there by saying we are all either guilty of or victims of rape, you again relegate rape to something less than what it actually is.


No I didn't. This is Your Perception which is different to the words I used and meant.

I did not enter into an emotional Value-Reaction. The word "Victim" is Your addition. I did not use it because I think no one is a "Victim".. I think victimhood is a Belief people live out here. Likewise I did not use the word "Guilty".. Your addition again, based solely on Your Perspective.

In the words I used to offer this perception you will find the word Empathy.. which is based in having been on both sides of the scenario at various times in our long existence Here... a Far Cry from what You say I have said...isn't it?


Originally posted by Sinnthia
Sometimes I wonder how religions ever get new recruits. No, I do not see that. I do not see any of what you are saying. All I see, quite honestly, is you stepping over yourself in order to both belittle and dismiss a rape.


Lucky I'm not a Religionist or Believer in any such Belief-Systems then... they get recruits mostly from those who have reached the depths of despair in their life and need something to help them into some sort of Balanced Perspective that allows them to function again in the world.

Sister. Please Look again with open eyes at what I am offering.

I am not saying the rapist shouldn't be treated with the full force of the law.. I am not saying the Lady deserved her suffering in any way. You can see that... Yes?

So look again and ignore the initial emotional response that is blocking your view... it is causing you to make Judgements based on Responses and not what is actually in the message.


Originally posted by Sinnthia
Are you trying to make the case that it was part of God's plan or that it is just a normal condition or what? Between the two of you, I am able discern about 5 different gods here so please forgive me if I am having trouble "seeing it."


Really big question that one, thank you for asking it.

Not a "normal condition"... but very definately a part of the human experience here.. and in fact it is also part of the Condition/Experience for many other Animals.

"God's Plan" is a Religionist Belief that I don't subscribe to.. like all Beliefs. It has Limitations, like all other Beliefs.. so I cannot accept it as such.

But.. from where I stand to observe this world I can see many things of interest. The plans made by Souls are like Vacation Itineraries.. we arrange things we want to experience, and then add in a billion more Choices we could make in Life along the way.... each of those Choices are planned in.. but you have not made the Decision in Life yet.. so it is not Destiny (another human invention).

And each of those Choices will alter the path you walk in Life.. even if only marginally.. as most smaller minute by minute non-aware choices do.

Now for "God's" bit in this "Plan"...

"He" cares about as much for us and what we do as we care for an atom inside a skin cell on your arm.
"It" doesn't make the Plans.. it lets us do it for "Him". We are only portions of the Whole and so we are the means "It" uses to become aware of "Itself"

This is why in the Soul levels of Awareness and beyond, the Duality of "Good and Bad" does not exist by itself.. it is just a part of the mechanics for worlds working the Experience of Duality... just as we humans are doing in this one.




Growth is only ever found outside our comfort zones.
.. me

I hope you can see the words I used here do not have to mean anything other than what I intend for them.


edit on 19-2-2011 by Tayesin because: Coz I'm dumb



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by Sinnthia
I had to read this response a few times because you kind of seem to criss cross your own ideas so before I respond to it, I need to ask one particular question. Do you believe your god has a master plan or do you believe he gave us free will?


God has a master plan, it is for us to love one, enjoy the gifts he has given us in this world, and explore all of it.

He gave us free will to do all of this, but most never use it. Most are stuck in the pattern of their life. What ever they have experienced is what they put out into the world. Some realise the power of free will and break out of the pattern their life has put them in, but this is a road taken by few and it is the more difficult one to take.

God waits patiently for Man to pull his head out of his proverbial posterior and do what HE wants, rather than what Man wants. His will is for us to love one another.

God has infinite patience, but he won't wait forever. Times they are a changin...

With Love,

Your Brother



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 11:00 AM
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Originally posted by Sinnthia
Personally, it reads like this -
"See my left hand? See what it is doing? Now, look at my right hand. See my right hand? See what it is doing? Ok, now look at my left hand. Huh? Huh? Impressed yet?"


We seem to be getting confused in theological mumbo jumbo. This thread is about poor theologians, and by turning me into one here, the message is getting skewed.

I am not a preacher. I do not preach God to anyone who is suffering. God is within me and when someone suffers, I do not tell them to go pray, or God has a master plan, or seek forgiveness from the lord. That is all bull#. That is why "Men of the cloth" are losing their flock. They do not deserve to have a flock any more. Any man who has read the words of Jesus Christ and has decided to follow in his footsteps knows we are not to preach. We are supposed to heal. No amount of preaching can heal.

What would I do?

My early life I do consider a blessing. Through fate, destiny, God's will, or natural attraction, my life has been filled with people who have been through much of the same things I have, if not worse. My early life and my triumph over it has given me an insight into the pain that other's endure. For that I do thank God because it has helped me help others.

My first wife was bi-polar schizophrenic as a result of herself being raped repeatedly by her Uncle. I met her in Highschool and there she had a reputation as "The Black Widow" by the school guidance counsellors because she had a way of getting guys to fall in love with her only to break their heart when they were most vulnerable. She had quite a list of victims, but that did not matter to me. I saw something there beyond her reputation. So we dated for several months, she tried various things to break my heart, but I was resilient and I loved her. So, I went in the Marines to set up a home for her and we married. She calmed down a lot in our early married life and opened up to me quite a bit. It was then that I learned of the rape, the drug use, the hospitalisations, and the rapes that occurred while hospitalised. I held her through numerous psychotic breaks, a comforted her through many attempted suicides, I endured episodes of her swearing I was out to hurt her. She made it through it all because I did not judge her, I loved her.

After a couple years of marriage I went alone to Okinawa, Japan for 6 months. While I was there, she shacked up with a new guy and got pregnant. When I returned she was living alone in a hospice. The guy had used her up and returned to his wife. I knew the only reason she had done what she had done was because she did not have the security that I proved with her. She could not handle being apart. So, I took her out of the hospice and brought her home. My command came down on me harshly for this and even threatened to revoke my housing, but I stayed with her, and we began again on healing.

I stayed with her for another four years during which time she revealed more and more about her troubled past. She was a case study at the psychiatric hospital when she young. They had nicknamed her "Sybil" after the case study of multiple personality disorder. There is no one who knows this woman like I do because I endured her suffering with her and helped her heal along the way. It wasn't always easy, but her life wasn't either. On Sept. 11th 2001, I had to make the hardest decision in my life. My unit was activated for possible retaliation for the World Trade Centers and I knew I could not go to combat while worrying about her. I could not do it for the sake of the men under me. So, I told her I couldn't do it any more, and asked for a divorce.

This is how I express what I believe to be God's will. I love unconditionally everyone I meet. I do not judge anyone for I know that underneath all the "evil" behaviors we do to one another, there lies a soul that has been tormented and abused. A soul yearning to be loved. A little piece of God, waiting to break free and feel safe again. I AM that Soul. I have broken free and nothing hurts me anymore. What hurts me is seeing others suffering. I see this everywhere I look. It is the world we created, from what God has given us.

You never have to even mention God in this life. You shouldn't have to. His love should radiate from you. The knowledge of him is in our relations with each other. There is no wonder most do not believe in a God any more. We are too afraid to believe it is possible. We are ashamed and angered at what we have done. I AM not ashamed, and this is why I can share everything about me with YOU. I do not believe we are family, I know we are family, and YOU are my long lost sister. There is no shame in my life. There is no shame in your life. It is what it is and I hope what ever you have endured, you never let it hurt you to the point that you no longer love.

Love is God.

With Love,

Your Brother



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 11:00 AM
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reply to post by Sinnthia
 


I understand the hostility towards my viewpoint, in fact I expect it.

First off I will repeat: The Chaplain did not condone the Rape nor did he say it was her fault. (Of course he could have but the evidence reported doesn't support that in my opinion)

Secondly everything else is about personal responsibility If I go walking through a known bad neighborhood at night by myself I had better be extra aware and prepared to defend myself because there is a good chance I will get robbed, and if I do get robbed its my own damn fault for putting myself in that situation.

I would argue that your viewpoint is misogynistic. Are women assumed to be so weak and stupid that they are unable to foresee a realistic threat and prepare to defend themselves against it? Society needs to stop teaching women how to be victims. But of course I'm the stupid one for thinking that women are somehow equal to men?

Apparently everyone wants to wander around in their fantasy land where nothing bad happens and if it does it is a horrible surprise. But see what happens when someone tries to say that women should be held in equal regard to men and be expected to use sense, be aware of their surroundings and fight back when attacked? Thats right I get insulted and told I obviously believe she deserved it and am supporting rapists. I'm also going to tell you that if you use your credit card on an unsecured server you are stupid, but I'm not supporting identity theft. I believe criminals should be punished and held accountable for their actions. I also believe victims should be aware of their part and strive to protect themselves in the future.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 01:38 PM
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reply to post by Sinnthia
 


It is more like - since I know feminists with a cause are known to exaggerate and lie in pursuit of their cause, I don't believe stories that have no logical evidence in my life experience or in fact. It is her word only. What Chaplin supposedly said this and what is his/her response to this lady's claim? Unlike you, I have no faith in professional "victims" with an agenda - on the left or right. Having lived in the US with social and cultural activists, that would be totally illogical.

Is it a happy accident that you are running around ATS responding negatively to every post I make? You have a crush?



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 01:52 PM
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Originally posted by LordBucket
reply to post by Wyn Hawks
 



this is REALLY about the military refusing to make male soldiers behave themselves

It could be argued that training soldiers to behave themselves, to be nice to gays, to not rape women, to be civil and humane and generally respectful of people...might not be completely compatible with having them go to foreign lands and kill people.


...yes, of course, all kinds of foolishness can be argued...


Originally posted by LordBucket
A dog can be trained to play nicely with children and allow them to play and jump on him. Or he can be trained to guard your house and bite intruders. Not both.


...and speaking of foolishness, your statement strongly indicates that you know nothing about training dogs... so, in addition to the other trivia being discussed on this thread, now we can include dogs, the training of them and how much male humans are like dogs... yippy - i can hardly wait...


Ex

posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:04 PM
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This thread is a prime example .....of the orginal post getting askewed
by religious dogma , rather than commen sense and military justice!

Would any of you feel differently if this was your sister, mother,
or dare I say son, serving in the armed forces??



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by DimensionalDetective
 


Not going to defend him. Going to say that the article doe snot add context. Technically everything's God's will, good and bad.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:12 PM
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Isn't organized religion just grand?

I'm not surprised but I am disgusted. Good find, man.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:23 PM
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reply to post by Whereweheaded
 


It may prove that in your mind, but that's not true, it's just your reality. You can't blame religion because the idiot chaplain tried to justify rape in the name of God. It's the same concept with guns, as in guns don't kill people, people kill people. Religion does NOT cause war, people declare and participate in war. Religion doesn't force itself on people. People with weak or disturbed minds see it otherwise.

Peace



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:30 PM
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reply to post by getreadyalready
 


Whats your point?
I mean i dont really understand what you are trying to say.
Did the girl ask god to let someone rape her?
Thats logical.....
The Chaplain was most definitely out of line.
He basically told her she got raped because she doesnt go to church.
Using a really messed up situation to trick someone in going to church is
not something you would expect from a man of the cloth. Let alone any decent
person.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:45 PM
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Technically speaking, if you believe in a man in the sky, and he controls this world, then everything is his "will". Rape, molestation, war, famine...ect ect.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by Tayesin
Hi again,

Please try to understand I am not here to Oppose your view and offend you. I am here only to offer a different perspective to view Life in the World from.


Given that one poster on this thread has stated she got what she deserved for working in the US military in this day and age, and even went on to say it was a NONVIOLENT RAPE????????? the rest of you have a looooooooooooooooooot leeway before you can be offensive now.


Sorry, but No, it doesn't mean Dismiss.. that is Your perception, not mine. And it doesn't mean it's "Good". If you re-read the words used you will see no value judgements of the sort were made... in fact I made a point of saying so.


It is nice to repeat your quote where you claim to not be belittling her but you did not quote your entire post, as you needn't. You are cherry picking your own post. I got that you SAID you were not dismissing or belittling. I also got that you did just that with the REST of what you wrote.


No I didn't. This is Your Perception which is different to the words I used and meant.


You clearly said that EVERYONE has been a rapist or rape victim and therefor already take rape from what it actually is and made it just something that is part of the human condition like breathing or sleeping.


I did not enter into an emotional Value-Reaction. The word "Victim" is Your addition. I did not use it because I think no one is a "Victim".. I think victimhood is a Belief people live out here. Likewise I did not use the word "Guilty".. Your addition again, based solely on Your Perspective.


Yeah, that is about as belittling and dismissive as you can get. Someone who is a victim of rape is not a victim because they chose to feel victimized after the fact. Words like "victim" and "guilty" actually mean something. We assign definitions to words for a reason. Someone who is a victim is a victim because they were victimized. Not because they just can't think positively enough about what happened.


In the words I used to offer this perception you will find the word Empathy.. which is based in having been on both sides of the scenario at various times in our long existence Here... a Far Cry from what You say I have said...isn't it?


That is not what empathy means at all. That is how you understand sympathy. Empathy is being able to understand the feelings of someone NOT you that has endured something you have NOT. You do not get empathy purely by having been there. That is antithetical to the word itself.

Further, it is just not true. Not everyone on the planet has either been raped or comitted a rape. I am fairly certain you and I are not using many of these English words to mean the same thing. I am going by the dictionary definition and rape seems pretty easy in this context. This woman was raped - SEXUALLY ASSAULTED. You say we have all done something like that on one end. I say that is a pretty sick view of reality.


Lucky I'm not a Religionist or Believer in any such Belief-Systems then... they get recruits mostly from those who have reached the depths of despair in their life and need something to help them into some sort of Balanced Perspective that allows them to function again in the world.


Yet you are pushing the exact same platitudes as the faith pushers.



Sister. Please Look again with open eyes at what I am offering.


I am just having a hard time pretending words mean things they do not mean.


I am not saying the rapist shouldn't be treated with the full force of the law.. I am not saying the Lady deserved her suffering in any way. You can see that... Yes?


I can see you saying that yes. I also saw you write that you were not dismissing it before you dismissed it. It is kind of like when my cousin uses "No offense" before he brutally insults you. I did hear him say "no offense."


So look again and ignore the initial emotional response that is blocking your view... it is causing you to make Judgements based on Responses and not what is actually in the message.


I am puzzled as to exactly what it is you think you are seeing from me now? I can detatch emotionally all I like. That does not diminish the act of rape to the likes of breathing for me though.


Really big question that one, thank you for asking it.

Not a "normal condition"... but very definately a part of the human experience here.. and in fact it is also part of the Condition/Experience for many other Animals.

"God's Plan" is a Religionist Belief that I don't subscribe to.. like all Beliefs. It has Limitations, like all other Beliefs.. so I cannot accept it as such.


Forgive me for getting you confused with the other posters on this issue. This has become quite a hefty little conversation. So no god's plan but you do believe rape is a natural condition of existence?

Sorry but I am not an animal. I am a human being. I am capable of making value judgements about my actions instead of acting soley on my base instincts. I expect everyone else I see around me that is wearing at least one item of clothing to be also human in that same way as myself. Murder is the natural state of things for animals far above and beyond rape is. Would you be as dismissive of rape as just something we all take part in? Not dying, MURDER. I hope not. I just cannot get on that boat either. Human beings can fight wars from control rooms thousands of miles away but we cannot keep our pants on when we get horny because we are just animals? No.


But.. from where I stand to observe this world I can see many things of interest. The plans made by Souls are like Vacation Itineraries.. we arrange things we want to experience, and then add in a billion more Choices we could make in Life along the way.... each of those Choices are planned in.. but you have not made the Decision in Life yet.. so it is not Destiny (another human invention).

And each of those Choices will alter the path you walk in Life.. even if only marginally.. as most smaller minute by minute non-aware choices do.

Now for "God's" bit in this "Plan"...

"He" cares about as much for us and what we do as we care for an atom inside a skin cell on your arm.
"It" doesn't make the Plans.. it lets us do it for "Him". We are only portions of the Whole and so we are the means "It" uses to become aware of "Itself"

This is why in the Soul levels of Awareness and beyond, the Duality of "Good and Bad" does not exist by itself.. it is just a part of the mechanics for worlds working the Experience of Duality... just as we humans are doing in this one.


Sorry but spirituality without a god of the specific brand weilded here is really just iced tea without the tea in it to me. God's plan or soul levels of awareness? Pfffft to it all. Neither excuses rape as part of a grander scheme.




Growth is only ever found outside our comfort zones.
.. me

I hope you can see the words I used here do not have to mean anything other than what I intend for them.


edit on 19-2-2011 by Tayesin because: Coz I'm dumb


I hope you see why that is actually more confusing that it seems you hope proclaiming it not should be. As far as learning from outside my comfort zone...

...I am still here. Look at my post history sometime and instead of reading my posts, look at the responses I get. I can barely remember a comfort zone from the depths of ATS but...

... I am still here.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:52 PM
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Originally posted by IAMIAM
God has a master plan, it is for us to love one, enjoy the gifts he has given us in this world, and explore all of it.


You really have to decide one or the other. Either he has a master plan or we have free will.


He gave us free will to do all of this, but most never use it. Most are stuck in the pattern of their life. What ever they have experienced is what they put out into the world. Some realise the power of free will and break out of the pattern their life has put them in, but this is a road taken by few and it is the more difficult one to take.


And this is all according to plan?


God waits patiently for Man to pull his head out of his proverbial posterior and do what HE wants, rather than what Man wants. His will is for us to love one another.


Waits? What do you mean he waits? It is HIS freakin' plan? You are then conceding that he is a terrible planner as I have been saying? Even a halfway decent planner has a clue when the job should get done.


God has infinite patience, but he won't wait forever.


Fonzie, sweety. Jumping things on waterskis is just not gonne bring in the kids anymore.

Please tell me you read what you just wrote. I have been trying to understand you and I keep pointing out that you seem to contradict yourself within your posts and that is where you lose me. CONTRADICT YOURSELF.


God has infinite patience, but he won't wait forever.


You see what I am getting at, right?


God has infinite patience, but he won't wait forever.


Please tell me you at least understand what a rational person of at least average intelligence reads there.


God has infinite patience, but he won't wait forever.


Maybe you are joking?


Times they are a changin...

With Love,

Your Brother


I hope you realize that I am simply trying to understand at this point what you are saying. God has a plan and infinite patience but he is waiting for us to DECIDE to do things with our free will and he doesn't have forever?

Maybe we should leave it there?



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 02:59 PM
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Originally posted by Whereweheaded
Thus proving once and for all that all forms of religion need to be eradicated!


Thus proving ignorance is not only found in religion!

Hey last week I heard a man killed another man with his tractor. If we apply your logic then farming will be much harder. Wait, what am I thinking, understanding this requires logic.

Think about what a peaceful world the world will be when we put an end to everything that a person has abused. Gosh, unicorns and rainbows and stuff YAY!

And I'm not even religious.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by IAMIAM
We seem to be getting confused in theological mumbo jumbo. This thread is about poor theologians, and by turning me into one here, the message is getting skewed.


I am sorry. I did not realize that I somehow tricked you into posting your thoughts in this thread. Now I feel bad.


I am not a preacher. I do not preach God to anyone who is suffering. God is within me and when someone suffers, I do not tell them to go pray, or God has a master plan, or seek forgiveness from the lord. That is all bull#. That is why "Men of the cloth" are losing their flock. They do not deserve to have a flock any more. Any man who has read the words of Jesus Christ and has decided to follow in his footsteps knows we are not to preach. We are supposed to heal. No amount of preaching can heal.


So why are you trying so hard to convince me that I am wrong for thinking what this man said was anything less than unacceptable?


What would I do?


I am not really so sure that really even applies. My problem is with what happened and the posts attempting to justify what happened. I am not so concerned with what could have happened had different people been there. We can just replace the rapist with a coat rack if we are going down that road.


My early life I do consider a blessing. Through fate, destiny, God's will, or natural attraction, my life has been filled with people who have been through much of the same things I have, if not worse. My early life and my triumph over it has given me an insight into the pain that other's endure. For that I do thank God because it has helped me help others.


I do not deny that gods and belief in them has been helpful to some people. It has also been quite detrimental to others. Annecdotes are great because they are so easy to profess as some profound truth. The reality is that yesterday I went outside and saw a butterfly. That hardly means that people should go outside in hopes that they too find a butterfly. It is empty personalization of abstract instances of chance and does little to convey anything of real meaning other than a series of "I" and "me" statements. Clinically it reads as religious narcissism and I was asked to detatch myself emotionally



My first wife was bi-polar schizophrenic as a result of herself being raped repeatedly by her Uncle. I met her in Highschool and there she had a reputation as "The Black Widow" by the school guidance counsellors because she had a way of getting guys to fall in love with her only to break their heart when they were most vulnerable. She had quite a list of victims, but that did not matter to me. I saw something there beyond her reputation. So we dated for several months, she tried various things to break my heart, but I was resilient and I loved her. So, I went in the Marines to set up a home for her and we married. She calmed down a lot in our early married life and opened up to me quite a bit. It was then that I learned of the rape, the drug use, the hospitalisations, and the rapes that occurred while hospitalised. I held her through numerous psychotic breaks, a comforted her through many attempted suicides, I endured episodes of her swearing I was out to hurt her. She made it through it all because I did not judge her, I loved her.

After a couple years of marriage I went alone to Okinawa, Japan for 6 months. While I was there, she shacked up with a new guy and got pregnant. When I returned she was living alone in a hospice. The guy had used her up and returned to his wife. I knew the only reason she had done what she had done was because she did not have the security that I proved with her. She could not handle being apart. So, I took her out of the hospice and brought her home. My command came down on me harshly for this and even threatened to revoke my housing, but I stayed with her, and we began again on healing.


Bipolar schizophrenia as a result of abuse and living in a hospice until you rescued her? Sorry but this is all really losing me and getting as far from the discussion as possible it seems. Hospice is a place terminally ill people go to die comfortably. Not a place lonely people hang out. I am confused.


I stayed with her for another four years during which time she revealed more and more about her troubled past. She was a case study at the psychiatric hospital when she young. They had nicknamed her "Sybil" after the case study of multiple personality disorder. There is no one who knows this woman like I do because I endured her suffering with her and helped her heal along the way. It wasn't always easy, but her life wasn't either. On Sept. 11th 2001, I had to make the hardest decision in my life. My unit was activated for possible retaliation for the World Trade Centers and I knew I could not go to combat while worrying about her. I could not do it for the sake of the men under me. So, I told her I couldn't do it any more, and asked for a divorce.


Bi-polar schizophrenic PLUS disassociative personality disorder? Quite a story this is turning out to be. Thanks for sharing it. After all that you walked out because you were more loyal to some men? So this is going somewhere, right?


This is how I express what I believe to be God's will. I love unconditionally everyone I meet. I do not judge anyone for I know that underneath all the "evil" behaviors we do to one another, there lies a soul that has been tormented and abused. A soul yearning to be loved. A little piece of God, waiting to break free and feel safe again. I AM that Soul. I have broken free and nothing hurts me anymore. What hurts me is seeing others suffering. I see this everywhere I look. It is the world we created, from what God has given us.


But you already admitted some people are born broken and are bad as a result of THAT, and not abuse or torment. See why this is a very hard discussion to have? I cannot read that god has a plan but is waiting for us to come up with it and that bad people are a result of bad lives even though that is admittedly not true either. OK?


You never have to even mention God in this life. You shouldn't have to. His love should radiate from you.


Why should it? How about my love? My love is something real and tangible. My love involves reality and now. My love would treat a rape victim with some care instead of dismissing her suffering as part of something she should be happy to have a part in. That is my love. I am not liking your god's love so much.


The knowledge of him is in our relations with each other. There is no wonder most do not believe in a God any more. We are too afraid to believe it is possible. We are ashamed and angered at what we have done. I AM not ashamed, and this is why I can share everything about me with YOU. I do not believe we are family, I know we are family, and YOU are my long lost sister. There is no shame in my life. There is no shame in your life. It is what it is and I hope what ever you have endured, you never let it hurt you to the point that you no longer love.

Love is God.

With Love,

Your Brother


I do not believe in your god because I understand logic. It has nothing to do with shame. I also do not believe that your god is all powerful yet uses rape as a teaching tool as part of his master plan to have us all use our freel will to achieve a very specific end.

Thanks for sharing your personal details and all but I feel less and less like we are discussing anything at all and more and more like you are just sharing. That is all good and fine but I thought there was a topic here and you were trying to explain how I should be able to understand why this man said what he did. I am not sure what your personal disclosure has to do with the case you were making.

edit on 19-2-2011 by Sinnthia because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by sara123123
It is more like - since I know feminists with a cause are known to exaggerate and lie in pursuit of their cause, I don't believe stories that have no logical evidence in my life experience or in fact. It is her word only. What Chaplin supposedly said this and what is his/her response to this lady's claim? Unlike you, I have no faith in professional "victims" with an agenda - on the left or right. Having lived in the US with social and cultural activists, that would be totally illogical.


Again, your logic is that because you are a Christian, you do not believe a chaplain would say such a thing. Yet you completely ignore the chaplain I offered up that has been convicted of rape. I guess just closing your eyes to things helps you keep your beliefs intact.


Is it a happy accident that you are running around ATS responding negatively to every post I make? You have a crush?




Uh...oh yeah? You mean this thread that I was already posting in and that one other thread I responded to you in? That is some interesting ego you got there. I guess then my crush on you means I am hopelessly stalking several other people as I have responded to some of the same posters even more than twice.
What do you have, 3 total responsed to you from me? If that is flattery to you, not that I swing that way, but take it. Some people needs those little ego boosts I guess.

Wow.



posted on Feb, 19 2011 @ 03:27 PM
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reply to post by Whereweheaded
 


Religions should not be eradicated but forbidden to be spread and claimed as the right one.

There is nothing bad about believing something, it's only bad if it is being instrumentalized by a few people...




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