On Masonic Charity. The world's largest non religious charity scam. On the Shriners and Jesters.

Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Lucifer777


Just so I can clarify my objections to your line of "thinking", you claim that american "Masonry" is into all this gay fantasy stuff. But you only can bring a few personal testimonies of questionable characters with evidence, and then only to the Shrine and one of it's sub bodies, and then only to a select few members.

The allegations are that homo-erotic hazing and general BDSM style hazings, such as beatings, electrocutions and sexual humilation is widespread in the Shriner Masonry and Jester Masonry cults. There are also allegations that hazing rituals occur in "Prince Hall" Masonry and then there is the take of the shooting during a hazing at Southside Masonic Lodge No. 493 in New York, which as I understand it was just a regular American Masonic lodge which had an assortment of hazing equipment.

I am not suggesting that "all" Masons are gay, just because they prefer to be in a male-only religious cult or because they engage in homoerotic BDSM style sexual humiliation; anyway in the modern world, there is no shame in such things, and I am certainly not homophobic; it is simply a matter of "describing" the rather bizarre hazing rituals of Masonry; frankly I find much of this stuff to be totaly hilarious; I think that if the American Masons were widely considered to be a cult of silly old fools with bizarre and rather childish "frat-house" rituals, it would perhaps diffuse the more bizzare conspiracy theories about Masons.

With regards to testimonies of "questionable characters" then it is for you to offer argument and evidence as to "why" all such characters who are critical of Masonry are questionable. Of course by the standard "cult midset" of a religious cultist, generally all forms of criticism against their cult is considered diabolical. The Scientologists also have a policy of not defending their cult, but rather of merely attacking their critics; and so refer to all critics of Masonry as being "questionable characters" is quite unsurprising for Masonic cultist.

For example, from the thread www.davidicke.com... which beings with my duplicate of the OP

thelonious:.... Many if not most of the esoteric Masons have viewed the Shriners in an unfavorable light................ most of them are like me: we were initiated in the Shrine, found the whole thing ridiculous, and never went back.

Thelonious is a Masonic cult apologist who debates on the British secret societies subforum on the above link. If you would like to explain why he is a "questionable character" I am only to happy to forward your comments to that forum.

From: freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com...

For over a hundred years, the Shrine has been the playground of Masonry, and has reveled in, and encouraged, its public image as a bunch of big-drinking, stripper-slapping, fez-wearing party animals, who engage in such behavior for the good cause of the hospitals. AND THAT'S FINE. The Shrine is what it is.

freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com...


I quit the Jesters more than 20 years ago, and this kind of thing has been going on at least 40 or 50 years,” said Malcolm “Mutt” Herring, 90, of Montgomery, Ala. “I quit because I don’t drink, and I don’t mess around with other women, other than my wife. Going to one of their events was like going to a whorehouse.”

"...........to claim that the ROJ doesn't know about this stuff on a widespread basis is sheer nonsense. "

freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com...

"During the initiation of new Jesters I was offered the opportunity by another fellow brother to sleep with a whore, even though I had a wife and kids waiting for me to come home. I was not strong at the time and I violated every oath I had ever taken with my wife. This did not stop at initiation. These were a constant occurrence at our Jester functions and they are a common occurrence today. The initiation practices have not changed as well. Prostitutes were offered/made available at our functions and often brothers would have sex in front of other brothers.

I should point out that the author of the freemasonsfordummies site is a Masonic cult apologist and so for this reason alone I would concede that he is a "questionable character," however perhaps you could explain why you would consider him to be a questionable character.

"Christopher L. Hodapp is the editor of the "Journal of The Masonic Society." He is the author of the best-selling "Freemasons For Dummies," and "Solomon's Builders: Freemasons, Founding Fathers and the Secrets of Washington D.C.

the story from last May about Jesters' "fishing trips" to Brazil that involved at least 19 members and hookers as young as 13."

"The first deposition, 61 pages, was provided by Adilson Garcia da Silva on Sunday, April 13, 2008. He describes how he became a fishing guide, his work history, how marijuana was allegedly obtained for the plaintiffs' clients then began describing how girls, from age 13 on up, were lured into prostitution from Brazilian Indian reservations for the fishing trips' clients. The girls, he said, were hired to provide 'programs' that consisted of 'oral sex, strip and dance contests.'

Question: What is the youngest age that you’re aware of a girl being on the boat as a prostitute?

Answer: My brother would pick up a group of girls in Autazes and would take by boat to an American. One was 13, one was 14, and there was one who was even 9 years old.

sandyfrost.newsvine.com...

Just to refer to the "testimonials of questionable characters" is quite a blanket statement as I must assume that it refers to all persons making criticisms of Masons on this thread, and since some of this comes from FBI and police reports, I do concede that the US FBI and police are probably quite "questionable characters" and US narco-terrorist collaborators, however it is for you to explain why "you" consider them to be questionable characters.


Just to restate the New York Times allegations:

Jessica McGowan for The New York Times

www.nytimes.com...


(John C. Goline's) faith was shaken when he joined the leadership of the Suez Shriners in San Angelo, one of 191 temples affiliated with the order. He found that much of the money collected to support the hospitals was commingled with money used for liquor, parties and members’ travel to Shrine events. The Shrine’s national auditor largely confirmed his findings, but not before Mr. Goline was forced out of office.

His experience is not unique. An examination by The New York Times of Shrine records and minutes of Shrine meetings and interviews with current and former Shrine officials painted a picture of lax accounting procedures and oversight under which money earmarked for the hospitals instead financed temple activities.

The examination found these things:

¶More than 57 percent of the $32 million the Shriners raised in 2005 through circuses, bingo games, raffles and a variety of sales went to costs of the fraternity, including keeping temple liquor cabinets full and offering expenses-paid trips to Shrine meetings and other events.

¶Only 2 percent of the Shrine hospitals’ operating income comes from money raised by Shrine temples and members’ dues. (The bulk is supplied by the hospitals’ $9 billion endowment.)

¶A top Shrine official told a meeting of temple treasurers that poor accounting for cash coming into the organization was “an increasingly common problem,” and that more than 30 temples had discovered fraud — like theft of money and inventory, altered bank statements, padded payrolls and fake invoices — amounting to as much as $300,000 and involving members of their “divans,” the five-member boards that govern each temple.

Yet whistle-blowers like Mr. Goline are often greeted with hostility, retaliation and official sanctions.

“.......Critics say the line has been blurred between money raised for the hospitals and for members’ entertainment.

“Money raised for the hospitals is being used to pay for parties and liquor and trips, and they know it,” said Johnny L. Edwards, who was a leader of Oasis Shrine in Charlotte, N.C., until he began campaigning for better control over money. “The way I see it, they’re stealing from crippled children.”

............

For example you could provide evidence and argument as to why the authors of the New York Times article, and Mr. Goline himself are "questionable characters," and further you could even encourage the Shriner Masons to sue the New York Times, if you can subsantiate that such claims were false.

Fourth jester convicted former judge Tills out of prison in three weeks


In April, 2005, the Jester's national ‘book’ was held in Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada. As set forth below, a typical feature of a ‘book of the play’ is the presence of prostitutes (‘Jester Girls’) who engage in commercial sex acts with members of the ROJ. Arrangements for the prostitutes are generally made by the organizer of the ‘books,’ or the region hosting the national ‘book.’ On occasion, individual Jesters may make arrangements to transport prostitutes to ‘books.’”

sandyfrost.newsvine.com...

I am quite sure that in litigation-mania America that you could find a "pro-bono" lawyer to sue Sandy Frost for making false accusations, rather than just rehashing such issues over and over again on the Internet.


A Scottish Rite "Chaplain's" Testimony of the "Holy and Sacred Rubber Penis" Shriner Initiation.

I was Chaplain in the Scottish rite and a degree master. In the blue Lodge I was senior deacon and preparing to be the junior warden, only two chairs away from the office of worshipful master. I was very busy with all this responsibility.

The following fall however, after the reunion, I decided it was time to enter the Shrine.
Mike had come into the Scottish rite at spring Reunion and now was eligible also.
We went into the Shrine together. I knew that the Shrine initiations got really rambunctious and wondered what might happen when they laid hands roughly on Mike. The initiation was performed in the Coliseum
before a very large crowd of Shriners who came to see the fun.

......



We began the initiation about noon that Saturday. After the medical screening came the hazing, which was very childish. Some of it was not only childish, but downright vulgar. At one point we were placed in a large, mesh cage, and one of the Shriners climbed up on top of it. He exposed a very convincing rubber penis which was connected to a water bag concealed in his clothing and hosed down all of us in the cage to the delighted howls of the spectators.

After the hazing it was time for the serious part, the ritual, and then time to take the oath. We took the obligation, again with terrible bloody consequences if we revealed any of the "secrets" (one form of mayhem we promised to accept was to have our "eyeballs pieced to the center with a sharp, three-edged blade"). And, with the Koran on the altar, we sealed our solemn oath in the name of "Allah, the god of Arab, Moslem and Mohammedan, the god of our fathers." I had taken so many bloody oaths already (one for each degree) that I paid little attention to this one, except to notice that it, like the rest of the ritual, featured desert settings, Arabs and Allah, the Mohammedan god.

www.xs4all.nl...

But sources close to the investigation and former Jesters from other parts of the country tell a different story, one of bizarre activities — including routinely hiring prostitutes for gatherings, sex competitions and degrading initiation rites for new members — at many Jesters outings, with off-duty police hired to keep nonmembers away......

Last August Martin (the Jester's president) sent a directive to all 191 local chapters, forbidding the following conduct during initiation ceremonies:

• “Any type of physical brutality, such as whipping, beating, striking, branding, electronic shocking [or] placing of a harmful substance on the body.”

• Sleep deprivation, exposure to the elements, confinement to small spaces, or other activity that subjects Jesters to “an unreasonable risk of harm.”

www.noonehastodietomorrow.com...

I really cannot see the point of the president of the Jesters having to forbid "Sleep deprivation, exposure to the elements, confinement to small spaces, or other activity that subjects Jesters to “an unreasonable risk of harm,,” if such holy and sacred hazing rituals were not happening.

Further the 1930's Demoulin catalogue seems to indicate that the various Masonic rituals which were testified to in court have been happening since the 1930's

Just t restate the allegations:

Originally posted by Lucifer777

the points in the catalogues mentioned so irritatingly by Lucifer takes the debate in the other direction and makes the cult look silly...

Silly?



Impersonating His Satanic Majesty and prodding canditates with and electric baton is a holy and ancient rite which dates back to ancient Egypt; Devil's Tridents with portable electric batteries have just never been discovered in Egypt because it was such a secretive and holy rite.

Masons are anyway bound by their sacred oaths to His Imperial Majesty not to speak of such matters, and this probably accounts for the cult denialism and deception on this thread, however I do release Masonic cultists from all such secrecy oaths at the point where they break them all; however if they chose to keep their oaths, then I will happily continue the torture and sexual humiliaton in the halls of the Great Temple in the hereafter with my Masonic slaves.
Further with regards to your previous;

Oh, and in every masonic lodge in every city, town, and province, the degrees are taught in the same manner that they have been for hundreds of years.

Please provide some evidence that British Freemasons parctice the holy and sacred electric shock and branding initiation rituals and I will repost it on forums where there are British Freemasons participating for their consideration.

The following story appears to indicate that holy and sacred "paddling" rituals are also part of the "Prince Hall" Masonry

Mannheim soldier’s death has element of Masonic mystery

www.stripes.com...

....
In order to become a third-degree Mason, Wilder knew he would have to endure being beaten on his buttocks with a paddle by fellow Masons.




His plan was to get so drunk for the Jan. 7 ceremony that he wouldn’t feel the pain of the beatings, according to a friend, Spc. Tony d’Ercole. His mother, Diane Wilder, said her son told her that if he got so drunk that he passed out, his fellow Masons would take his blows.

...Also, he told them about the paddlings he took when he became a first- and second-degree mason last fall

The "beating" of the Prince Hall Mason described above was a "Third Degree" Masonic ritual, however the article alleges that such beatings also happened in the first and second degrees; n order to establish your claim, I think it appropriate to ask you what evidence you have that all First, Second and Third Degree Masons are similarly beaten in evey Masonic lodge throughout the world?

b]Guillotines and Guns

A Ritual Gone Fatally WrongPuts Light on Masonic Secrecy
By PATRICK HEALY
Published: Wednesday, March 10, 2004

hazingmasonic.blogspot.com...

PATCHOGUE, N.Y., March 9 � The initiation rituals at the Masonic lodge here had been bathed in secrecy over the years. The climax of Monday night's ceremony was to be a simple prank. A new member of the Fellow Craft Club, a select group within the lodge, would sit in a chair while an older member stood 20 feet away and fired a handgun loaded with blanks.



That ritual went terribly wrong inside Southside Masonic Lodge No. 493, in a basement littered with rat traps, tin cans, a 9-foot-tall guillotine, and a setup designed to mimic walking a plank.

Further in order to establish the claim that Masonic cult rituals are the same internationall, please provide some evidence that all Masonic cults use guillotines and guns.

I should point out that I in no way dissaprove of Masons shooting thier cultists, and I would like to take this opportunity to encourage such behaviour.

Originally posted by JoshNorton
reply to post by Masonic Light

 

I stand corrected. Seems like it's no longer an "official" part of the ritual, but a lot of guys still do it.

The Imperial Shrine has requested all Temples to stop it use, so a Shrine Temple is on their own should a law suit develops as a result.

I've walked the Hot Sands and have no problem doing it again. But you never know how some others may react. *

Further JoshNorton who is a Masonic cult apologist who posts here, seems to think that such electrocution rituals were once an "official" part of the ritual which is still practiced. If you consider Josh to be "questionable" please state your reasons for this.

Yet when I try (to no avail since a brick wall has more responsive understanding than you) to explain that Masonry is universal all over the world, including Scotland, you fail to grasp that. If you were to close your mouth for a brief moment and actually study the global aspects of craft masonry, you would find that Blue lodge masonry is the same in US, UK, India, Scotland, Greenland, and Iceland. We use virtually the same ritual, we learn things the same way, and we all take the same obligations. Including your father.

By "Blue Lodge" Masonry, this only refers to the first three degrees, and there numerous other cuts within Masonry which a "Master Mason" can join after he has completed the three degrees. It could also be argued that Sceintologists do not indoctrinate "all" their cultists with the beleif that L. Ron Hubbard in the Messiah, since those on introductory courses do not have this revealed to them. Similarly the allegations don't refer to the three basic degrees of Masonry but are to do with advanced rituals. For example prior to the 2st century to a person would have to firstly do all the Blue Lodge cult rituals, then all the York Rite or Scottish Rite cult rituals, then the Shriner rituals and then only then could he hope to be chosen to join the ranks of the elite Masonic cult of Jester Masonry.

The Ancient Arabic Order of Nobles of the Mystic Shrine

www.angelfire.com...

.. The mother of the Masons, the Grand Lodge in England, is not fond of Shriners: it threatened to expel any English Mason who enters the Shrine. But for Americans, the Ancient Arabic Order offers a chance to let their hair down after they have achieved the highest Masonic degree. The Shrine was founded so that Masons could get drunk...... Only the cream of the Masonic crop are allowed to join this fraternal cult!...

Not everyone was happy with a bunch of men who regularly got together to put on fez hats, look at dancing girls and get totally wrecked. The Shrine was becoming the target of a lot of (well deserved) bad publicity. Some Masonic lodges were so embarrassed by their cousins that they considered expelling any Mason in the Shrine. Shriners met to come up with an appropriate response. An honest Shriner hit the nail on the head. "You know?" he said. "I bet if we opened up charitable hospitals for crippled children, people would think we were legitimate. No one is going to criticize people who give crippled children hospital beds!"

And that's how the Shrine Hospitals for Crippled Children came about!!!

If you have any evidence that such hazing rituals occur in Scotland or England, then please present such evidence, rather than just claiming that such behaviour is "universal" all over the world.

I would invite you to look back at your first few posts and the responses you received from people on this site. Most everyone tried to be cordial and well mannered to you. You came out of the gate trying to be disliked by all and in that only partially succeed. If you goal is to be disregarded as a pinhead or a troll, then by all means continue with your current direction, but if you decide that you would like to have actual conversations with people here, you might want to read a bit of the past threads and learn how to do it without being a dick. many in the past have been able to accomplish that task while still getting their point across. At a few very brief moments, you almost seem like you could have some value in your words. It would be a shame to have all of them ignored by most simply because you want to be different.

Well this is just abuse and it is beneath myself to respond, however in many years on the Internet on discussion forums, I have not found the Masonic cult apologists to be "cordial and well mannered" at all, with very vew exceptions; their general debating strategy is cult denialism, deception and the use of ad hominem; it seems that their strategy is mostly to insult their criticis, and I would like to encourage this behaviour from Masonic cult apologists, since I consider it important that you just "be yourselves."

The Masonic Gang on ATS:

"Without fail, topics that begin with a critical analysis of one or more aspects of Freemasonry are soon inundated with rapid-fire defensive replies from a select few members. And, those select few members appear to have 95% or more of their focus on those types of posts, within those types of threads... or, rapid-fire atta-boy replies in threads with positive remarks about Freemasonry. In other words, an apparent dedicated single-minded effort."
-----------ATS Site Owner.

And please, if you have any shred of decency in your body, do not reply to this post with pictures or a 1000 word essay.

I can be of no assistance with your lack of literacy skills; you have challenged the allegations on this thread, and so I have briefly restated them.

I believe that by revealing the holy and sacred homoerotic Masonic cult initiations such as the holy and sacred electrocution and sexual humilation rituals, that this will clear up any misunderstanding that non Masons have about Masons and I find your attitude to be most ungrateful. The Masonic cult apologists here have an opportunity to explain the sacredness and holiness of such ancient rituals and I think that you should all be grateful to me for such an opportunity

As long as the priest, that professional denier, calumniator and poisoner of life, is accepted as a higher variety of man, there can be no answer to the question, What is truth? Truth has already been stood on its head when the obvious attorney of mere emptiness is mistaken for its representative. .............Upon this theological instinct I make war: I.... Whatever a theologian regards as true must be false: there you have almost a criterion of truth. Nietsche: The Antichrist

Just in case the gang of Masonic cultists here feel a bit persecuted by me, let me assure you that I have been an evangelical anti-cultist and an opponent of all forms of organised religion since the early days of the World Wide Web and that I generally tend to specialise in the persecution of Christ and his church (i.e., the Christians) and that I consider the Masonic cultists to be only one sect of numerous sects in this vile and diabolical Christian religion; thus bear in mind that it is not "only" the Masonic cult fanatics whom I conisder to be untermenchen (subhumans); I consider all religious fanatics to be similarly unworthy of life.

Further your behaviour on this thread has simply been typical of Masonic cult denialism, obfucation and deception, and you have essentially accused other Masons, ex-Masons, Masons wives, jouranlistsm, the Police and the FBI of whose reports litter this thread as being "questionable characters" merely on the grounds of being critical of your religious cult; I rather think that it is "you" who has shown yourself, by your behaviour here to be a "questionable" character.

His Imperial Satanic Majesty

Lucifer

"Like computer viruses, successful mind viruses will tend to be hard for their victims to detect. If you are the victim of one, the chances are that you won't know it, and may even vigorously deny it." Richard Dawkins

reply to post by Lucifer777


thanks for playing Richard.
Cue the crickets.

reply to post by Lucifer777


Dude, seriously...

You seem as stupid as you do misguided...

You have yet to present a single shred of proof of ANYTHING that you claim in ANY of your threads. Proof or NOTHING you say is real. It is not the job of ANYONE but the person making the claims to provide proof.

Instead, you spam and spam and spam the same pics over and over. You fill in the blanks with your obsession with bdsm and homosexuality. You should seriously consider professional help...

Originally posted by YourPopRock
reply to post by Lucifer777

 

Dude, seriously...

You seem as stupid as you do misguided...

You have yet to present a single shred of proof of ANYTHING that you claim in ANY of your threads. Proof or NOTHING you say is real. It is not the job of ANYONE but the person making the claims to provide proof.

Instead, you spam and spam and spam the same pics over and over. You fill in the blanks with your obsession with bdsm and homosexuality. You should seriously consider professional help...

I generally consider it to be beneath myself to respond to abuse and simple contradiction; however the post which is at the top of this page contains a summary of the "allegations" on this thread; to simply argue that this does not represent "a single shred of proof of ANYTHING" is just indicative of your lack of literacy skills; since I think that anyone with sufficient literacy skills to actually read that post before responding to it would find that it establishes a great many "facts;" including facts generated from police and FBI reports and the testimonials of Masons themselves; contradiction without argument is essentially also indicative of a person who has an inability to contruct an argument.

Just to help you out, let us say that you were a defence lawyer, defending Masonic cultism in a court or in a philosophers' debating society; if the allegations in the post at the top of this page were made, it would not be sufficient to claim "I don't agree with that" or "this does not prove anything;" that is the kind of simple contradiction which any football hooligan, a drunk or a child in a playground could make; rather you would have to offer argument and evidence that the claims stated above were false or fabricated, and it would be "you" who would have to prove that; thus it is "you" who have failed to present any proof of your claims.

With regards to "repeating" the same accusations, this is simply because of constant denialism by Masonic cult apologists regarding the allegations; if a person states "there is no evdence of such allegations" it is thus perfectly appropriate for me to restate that evidence, and if the "Trolls for Masonry" continue to make such denials, and to dispute that such evidence exists, it is quite appropriate for me to restate what that evidence is.



Above: Monty Python's "Argument Clinic;" a beginners guide to how "not" to construct an argument.

His Imperial Satanic Majesty

Lucifer

edit on 11-5-2011 by Lucifer777 because: Formatting

All you do is spam the same photos on every masonic thread. You fail to offer proof of ANYTHING you claim.

Incredible claims such as yours require incredible proof. It is not my job to provide that proof of your homo-erotic bdsm obsessed claims being false, it is your job to back up your gay-obsession laden claims with proof.

You can't do it because you have none.

(ps, embrace the baldness... growing the back of your hair long doesn't compensate for it)

Originally posted by YourPopRock
All you do is spam the same photos on every masonic thread. You fail to offer proof of ANYTHING you claim.

Incredible claims such as yours require incredible proof. It is not my job to provide that proof of your homo-erotic bdsm obsessed claims being false, it is your job to back up your gay-obsession laden claims with proof.

You can't do it because you have none.

(ps, embrace the baldness... growing the back of your hair long doesn't compensate for it)

It appears satan just registered this year/ The avatar is not necessaruly him and I consider what satans age is, probably under 25, appears to be playing here and some take the bait. peace

Originally posted by lbndhr

Originally posted by YourPopRock
All you do is spam the same photos on every masonic thread. You fail to offer proof of ANYTHING you claim.

Incredible claims such as yours require incredible proof. It is not my job to provide that proof of your homo-erotic bdsm obsessed claims being false, it is your job to back up your gay-obsession laden claims with proof.

You can't do it because you have none.

(ps, embrace the baldness... growing the back of your hair long doesn't compensate for it)

It appears satan just registered this year/ The avatar is not necessaruly him and I consider what satans age is, probably under 25, appears to be playing here and some take the bait. peace

edit on 2-12-2011 by lbndhr because: spell check

It appears you are speaking to someone who has been banned. Don't expect a reply any time soon! LOL

www.youtube.com...

Hear and see this mason's take on this.....






Posting video links - ALL MEMBERS PLEASE READ
* Link
* Description
* Review/Opinion

reply to post by partycrasher

This video has been discussed already.

Hey masons, I hope you are not going to kill the old fellow in that video for telling the truth.

reply to post by partycrasher

Do some research, this video has been discussed in the past and the absurdity of it all. It's just as absurd as your claim that we might kill him.

Get a life.

I think I will devote a bit of time / life to the exposure of freakmasonry....hows that for a life?

Originally posted by partycrasher
I think I will devote a bit of time / life to the exposure of freakmasonry....hows that for a life?

Sounds pretty boring, if you ask me. But if you want, go for it. Nobody's going to stop you. Probably a waste of time though.

Started when I was very young, family / relatives talking about god / religion and attending its institutions and performing the rituals and then......freemasonry. Saw as a child two relatives masonic funerals, the woman had to leave but the men got to stay and I was told "that I would be one of them someday" Hearing about fm at school more from the relatives/family and then talk on the job, seeing fellows throw down a royal arch in the middle of a bar and then per work related job stuff I was told "I would have to join"

FM's should just keep their mouths shut but they cannot since they are recruiters and they should be more careful.

Too late.

Originally posted by partycrasher
Started when I was very young, family / relatives talking about god / religion and attending its institutions and performing the rituals and then......freemasonry. Saw as a child two relatives masonic funerals, the woman had to leave but the men got to stay

I've never seen anyone, male or female, asked to leave a Masonic funeral. It's for the family. We wouldn't turn them away.

and I was told "that I would be one of them someday"

If you want to join, the choice is yours.

Hearing about fm at school more from the relatives/family and then talk on the job, seeing fellows throw down a royal arch in the middle of a bar and then per work related job stuff I was told "I would have to join"

I've never heard the phrase "throw down a royal arch", and I'm not familiar with any Masonic gesture that I could imagine might be described as that...

FM's should just keep their mouths shut but they cannot since they are recruiters and they should be more careful.

We, as a rule, do not recruit. It's a fairly basic part of every initiation ritual that you have to be there because you want to be, not because someone coerced you.

Too late.

Too late for what, exactly?

too late for me to join.
too late for me to stop shining the light on the secret society.

I know you wanted to turn this into another of your attempts to assume I was talking about doing something tyranical or unconstitutional.

reply to post by partycrasher

Kind of a pathetic one. Spending your life trying to infringe the rights of citizens and their assembly.

reply to post by partycrasher

So you have some family issues? Well, those issues cannot interfere my right to freely assemble.

Saw as a child two relatives masonic funerals, the woman had to leave but the men got to stay and I was told "that I would be one of them someday"

Wait? The women had to leave the funeral? Ummmm...yeah, that's not how the Masonic funeral rites work.

FM's should just keep their mouths shut but they cannot since they are recruiters and they should be more careful.

We're not recruiters, but even so I will not "keep my mouth shut".

Originally posted by partycrasher
too late for me to stop shining the light on the secret society.

Secret society? Secret societies hide their membership and their meeting locations. Tons of websites created by the Masons highlighting their meeting time and locations. Clothing apparel, public ceremonies, car decals, parades, and so on that show we are a not a secret society. Much is written on the internet and in books on the subject, but yes, yes, because you said so, we're a secret society.

We're a private organization with some secrets.

reply to post by partycrasher


If you goal is to expose Freemasonry, I wish you luck. I only hope you have a tiny bit of integrity passed down from your ancestors who were masons. If so, you will search for the truth, and not just the answers that fit your preconceived ideas.

a reply to: Lucifer777

Do you think that you have found something here? Do you think that you have uncovered some dark truth? I have a question or two then, just to clear a few things up. First, do you honestly, or should I say do we your readers believe that if this were real news, it would not be splashed across the headlines in big bold letters of every respectable news outlet vs buried in some nowhere news no one has ever heard of and you might very well write yourself? Second, if what you say is true, why would masons bother about the charity at all? I mean, that much money would buy a lot more booze and hookers if it wasn't spent on hospitals and stuff. I mean it's not like the masons need to do it for publicity, since it's rarely advertised and the inner workings of masonry are secret. Why not just have more parties and hire a bouncer, to keep out prying eyes?