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Originally posted by Mason mike
Originally posted by Lucifer777
I have always been openly bisexual and my current girlfriend could assure you that I am not a homosexual;
sorry sally, once a pickle smoker, always a pickle smoker. It's like doing shots of Tequila, once you have done a few, you can't stop the inevitable.
And just so you know, masonry is the same globally. So UK masons practice the same version we do here. And vice versa. I would start your witch hunt by questioning daddy and see how many times he has dealt with pistols in lodge assembled, or whipped cream as part of a ceremony. Just don't tell him about Bubba.
Originally posted by Mason mike
And just so you know, masonry is the same globally. So UK masons practice the same version we do here. And vice versa. I would start your witch hunt by questioning daddy and see how many times he has dealt with pistols in lodge assembled, or whipped cream as part of a ceremony. Just don't tell him about Bubba.
Originally posted by King Seesar
i just find all this talk of eletrodes to the buttock, fake gold showers and such intresting if the whole mantra is to "make good men better" or greater or what have you,
Scientology and Xemu (aka Xenu)
Who is Xemu? I'm going to tell you a story. Are you sitting comfortably? Right, then I'll begin.
Once upon a time (75 million years ago to be more precise) there was an alien galactic ruler named Xemu. Xemu was in charge of all the planets in this part of the galaxy including our own planet Earth, except in those days it was called Teegeeack.
Now Xemu had a problem. All of the 76 planets he controlled were over-populated. Each planet had on average 178 billion people. He wanted to get rid of all the overpopulation so he had a plan.
Xemu took over complete control with the help of renegades to defeat the good people and the Loyal Officers. Then with the help of psychiatrists he called in billions of people for income tax inspections where they were instead given injections of alcohol and glycol mixed to paralyse them. Then they were put into space planes that looked exactly like DC8s (except they had rocket motors instead of propellers).
These DC8 space planes then flew to planet Earth where the paralysed people were stacked around the bases of volcanoes in their hundreds of billions. When they had finished stacking them around then H-bombs were lowered into the volcanoes. Xemu then detonated all the H-bombs at the same time and everyone was killed.
The story doesn't end there though. Since everyone has a soul (called a "thetan" in this story) then you have to trick souls into not coming back again. So while the hundreds of billions of souls were being blown around by the nuclear winds he had special electronic traps that caught all the souls in electronic beams (the electronic beams were sticky like fly-paper).
After he had captured all these souls he had them packed into boxes and taken to a few huge cinemas. There all the souls had to spend days watching special 3D motion pictures that told them what life should be like and many confusing things. In this film they were shown false pictures and told they were God, The Devil and Christ. In the story this process is called "implanting".
When the films ended and the souls left the cinema these souls started to stick together because since they had all seen the same film they thought they were the same people. They clustered in groups of a few thousand. Now because there were only a few living bodies left they stayed as clusters and inhabited these bodies.
As for Xemu, the Loyal Officers finally overthrew him and they locked him away in a mountain on one of the planets. He is kept in by a force-field powered by an eternal battery and Xemu is still alive today.
That is the end of the story. And so today everyone is full of these clusters of souls called "body thetans". And if we are to be a free soul then we have to remove all these "body thetans" and pay lots of money to do so. And the only reason people believe in God and Christ was because it was in the film their body thetans saw 75 million years ago.
Well what did you think of that story?
What? You thought it was a stupid story?
Well so do we. Unfortunately this stupid story is the core belief in the "religion" known as Scientology.* If people knew about this story then most people would never get involved in it. This story is told to you when you reach one of their secret levels called OT III. After that you are supposed to telepathically communicate with these body thetans to make them go away. You have to pay a lot of money to get to this level and do this (or you have to work very hard for the organisation on extremely low pay for many years).
We are telling you this story as a warning. If you become involved with Scientology then we would like you to do so with your eyes open and fully aware of the sort of material it contains.
Most of the Scientologists that work in their Dianetics* centres and so called "Churches" of Scientology do not know this story since they are not allowed to hear it until they reach the secret "upper" levels of Scientology. It may take them many years before they reach this level if they ever do. The ones who do know it are forced to keep it a secret and not tell it to those people who are joining Scientology.
Now you have read this you know their big secret. Don't let us put you off joining though.
www.holysmoke.org...
Originally posted by Lucifer777
"In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous,or
off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog........Trolls can be costly in several ways. A troll can disrupt the discussion on a newsgroup, disseminate bad advice, and damage the feeling of trust in the newsgroup community."
All my posts here are relevant to the subject of American Freemasonry and include the subject of sacred and holy secretive hazing rituals. However I would like to encourage Masonic trolls in their consistent abuse, deception, cult denialism, obfuscation, bearing false witness and temper tantrums etc; please feel free to be yourselves and to further tarnish your reputation. Thank you for your assistance in this matter and if there is anything I can do top further assist you in presenting yourselves in this way, please do not hesitate to ask.
Her Imperial Majesty
Lucifer
Originally posted by King Seesar
reply to post by Lucifer777
I laugh at some of the christian channels too and i consider my self christian, but what you are watching is just a bunch of charlatans.
if you base your view on religion on this i see why you would see it as absurd but yea i agree it's more then likely side degrees that still do this type of hazing, if it were regular masonry we would have heard much more about these things if nothing more then for a good laugh during a late eighties Leslie Nielsen movie..
Originally posted by Mason mike
Originally posted by Lucifer777
"In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous,or
off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog........Trolls can be costly in several ways. A troll can disrupt the discussion on a newsgroup, disseminate bad advice, and damage the feeling of trust in the newsgroup community."
All my posts here are relevant to the subject of American Freemasonry and include the subject of sacred and holy secretive hazing rituals. However I would like to encourage Masonic trolls in their consistent abuse, deception, cult denialism, obfuscation, bearing false witness and temper tantrums etc; please feel free to be yourselves and to further tarnish your reputation. Thank you for your assistance in this matter and if there is anything I can do top further assist you in presenting yourselves in this way, please do not hesitate to ask.
Her Imperial Majesty
Lucifer
basically a troll tries to provoke a negative response. If you look at the bolded portions above, you might even see (and be able to comprehend) that the word "or" is used instead of "and". UK English being a bit different than american English must be the problem.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
Originally posted by Lucifer777
Originally posted by King Seesar
reply to post by Lucifer777
I laugh at some of the christian channels too and i consider my self christian, but what you are watching is just a bunch of charlatans.
Frankly the numerous evangelists who can be described as charlatans, exorcists fake healers and fake miracle workers who pray on the sick, the vulnerable and the disabled, are simply following the teachings of Jesus of the Gospels, who commanded his followers to go out and perform fake healings and miracles, perform excorcisms and to "raise the dead." 2000 years ago what we would refer to as "stage magic tricks" were quite commonly combined with religion, just as it is in India today where numerous wandering holy men also have a sideline in stage magic.
I don't see how a Christian can define the numerous Christian fake healers and fake miracles workers as charlatans without also defining the religious fanatic and religious schizophrenic described in the Gospels as also being a charlatan. No modern, rational, educated, scientific person would ever believe that a bunch of 2000 year old primitive religious fanatics could miraculously cure blindness, leprosy and cure the mentally and physicall handicapped through "casting out evil spirits" unless they have been subjected to religious hypnosis and indoctrination, which is a process which interferes with critical thinking.
if you base your view on religion on this i see why you would see it as absurd but yea i agree it's more then likely side degrees that still do this type of hazing, if it were regular masonry we would have heard much more about these things if nothing more then for a good laugh during a late eighties Leslie Nielsen movie..
Perhaps you have not seen the following:
Freemasonry is a term which we could use to describe a wide variety of sects within sects, some of which are referred to as "side degrees;" however that is part of what Masonry is; the more bizarre rituals are not for Neophytes (newcomers, novices); they are for Masons who have gone through various other degrees; thus the application of whipped cream and strawberries to the genitals is an "advanced" Masonic initiation availble only to the elect who have gone through the intial cult hypnosis and indoctrination or "gang initiation."
Lux
edit on 4-5-2011 by Lucifer777 because: Formatting
_________________
Originally posted by Mason mike
Originally posted by Lucifer777
"In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous,or
off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog........Trolls can be costly in several ways. A troll can disrupt the discussion on a newsgroup, disseminate bad advice, and damage the feeling of trust in the newsgroup community."
All my posts here are relevant to the subject of American Freemasonry and include the subject of sacred and holy secretive hazing rituals. However I would like to encourage Masonic trolls in their consistent abuse, deception, cult denialism, obfuscation, bearing false witness and temper tantrums etc; please feel free to be yourselves and to further tarnish your reputation. Thank you for your assistance in this matter and if there is anything I can do top further assist you in presenting yourselves in this way, please do not hesitate to ask.
Her Imperial Majesty
Lucifer
basically a troll tries to provoke a negative response. If you look at the bolded portions above, you might even see (and be able to comprehend) that the word "or" is used instead of "and". UK English being a bit different than american English must be the problem.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
You obviously have nothing to contribute to this thread other than abuse, deception, contradiction without argument and evidence and general cult denialism, which I essentially would define as the behaviour of a troll or a "football hooligan's" debating strategy; nevertheless I don't want to suggest that you are contributing "nothing" to the thread and I would like to encourage you to continue with your ranting, since this is a public debate and in the interests of the academic study of religion, it is important for the Freemasons to behave naturally.
Above a brief humerous introduction in how "not" to construct an "Argument."
Lucifer
edit on 4-5-2011 by Lucifer777 because: addition to text
You obviously have nothing to contribute to this thread other than abuse, deception, contradiction without argument and evidence and general cult denialism.
Originally posted by Mason mike
Originally posted by Lucifer777
You obviously have nothing to contribute to this thread other than abuse, deception, contradiction without argument and evidence and general cult denialism.
Awww, U mad bro?
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
Originally posted by King Seesar
reply to post by Lucifer777
The thing is when most of these people on tv do there so called miracles most of it is what they call in the wrestling world "a work" they know there not healing anybody but the person on stage just acts it out, it's all scripted and i don't mean by the bible....
Even if you don't agree with what Jesus did (i do) he at least believed in what he was doing so it wasen't "a work" it was real in his mind anyway...
Originally posted by Lucifer777
The Seven Signs of a Christian Charlatan.
"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
Mark 16.
Consider the 7 Signs of those who are allegedly "not" condemned according to the Gospel of Mark
1: You must believe.
2: You must be baptised.
3: You must be able to perform exorcisms.
4: You must be able to speak in New Tongues.
5: You must be able to pick up serpents.
6: You must be able to safely drink any deadly poison.
7: You must be able to lay hands on the sick and miraculously cure them.
If you do not have the 7 signs, you are allegedly condemned by the first century religious fanatic and fake healer Jesus and you won't get to spend all eternity with other Christian fake healers and religious charlatans.
It was also stated by the Jesus of the Gospels that his followers would do even "greater things than he."
I think that the "belief only" theology was possibly developed because the professional Christian hypocrites realised that many of the teachings of Jesus were either too hard or impossible to follow.
We know that Christians cannot safely drink poison or miraculously cure leprosy and blindness, and since the professional Christian hypnotists know this also, they have just developed this much easier "belief only" theology, where you just become a rambling religious fanatic, talk incessantly about the teachings of Jesus, and yet reject the teachings of Jesus, and the religion of Jesus (fundamentalist Judaism) apart from a few ethical maxims about love and so forth, which were common to that era; it is really just all about "believing" and about acting like a total hypocrite and being eternally rewarded for that.
Originally posted by Lucifer777
Originally posted by King Seesar
reply to post by Lucifer777
The thing is when most of these people on tv do there so called miracles most of it is what they call in the wrestling world "a work" they know there not healing anybody but the person on stage just acts it out, it's all scripted and i don't mean by the bible....
Even if you don't agree with what Jesus did (i do) he at least believed in what he was doing so it wasen't "a work" it was real in his mind anyway...
I don't really want to turn this thread into a "Jesus" discussion however see my essay: "The New Testament: A Fourth Century Fabrication. The 7 Signs of a Christian Charlatan" subtitled The New Testament: A Fabrication, created for Social Control. The Conclusions of Historical and Textual Studies of the New Testament. on: www.abovetopsecret.com... and " Is the New Testament Fabricated & Fraudulent? on: forum.davidicke.com...
Essentially the New Testament is a fabricated document derived from "in all, two thousand two hundred and thirty-one scrolls and legendary tales of gods and saviors, together with a record of the doctrines orated by them
(Life of Constantine, see hyperlinked essay above.)" I simply do not see the point of taking it seriously as an historical document.
Further although there were numerous religious fanatics 2000 years ago who claimed to be the Messiah (the king of Israel) and the texts may be based on an historical archetype, if a person geniunely believes in their own mind that they hear voices from God and have special miraculous powers, as many religious schizophrenics do, then they can be classified not merely as charlatans but as being mentally ill. Part of the problem of religious fanaticism is that the religious models of what a "holy person" is, such as Jesus and Mohammad, are classic models of religious schizophrenia; when we have schiziod models as models of "human perfection" it is no wonder that we live in a rather insane world.
Lux
Originally posted by Lucifer777
Originally posted by Mason mike
Originally posted by Lucifer777
You obviously have nothing to contribute to this thread other than abuse, deception, contradiction without argument and evidence and general cult denialism.
Awww, U mad bro?
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e4e74069a809.jpg[/atsimg]
No not at all darling; please feel free to troll the thread and to behave as badly as you possibly can, and I encourage all Masonic cultists to do likewise; anything I can do to assist you in this matter, please don't hesitate to ask. I don't expect intelligent debate from religious cultists and I have come to be rather familiar with their incessant temper tantrums and abuse.
Her Imperial Satanic Majesty
Lucifer
Originally posted by King Seesar
Yea we agree to disagree on the merits of Jesus and what constitues a charlatan, if a person is hearing voices in there head you are right it's more then likley one of two things either A: there schizophrenic or B: there being experimented on with advanced technology, both cases exist, the way i see it is God hasen't talked to many people and i doubt he's talking to them verbally now....
But yea i'm aware of your thoughts on religion also masonry and politics and even tho we disagree on certin issues i agree with your points on others such as the Military–industrial complex ect ect...
Originally posted by King Seesar
Yea that's what makes you intresting because you've had experiences that can't be explained by modern science or i should say modern science that isn't classified, i'm one of the most logical people you could ever meet but i'v had experiences that some would say isn't covered by thus modern science either...
Yea that is another point of yours i agree with i do think there are other dimensions and some times different dimensions bleed into each other, the only point we disagree on is i think one of those dimensions is heaven, like you said you have been in a plane many times before and you ran into no heaven and it's like i said people only point up as a symbol of faith, heaven is a dimension in my opinion..
....the criticism of religion is the prerequisite of all criticism.
The profane existence of error is compromised as soon as its heavenly oratio pro aris et focis [“speech for the altars and hearths,” i.e., for God and country] has been refuted. Man, who has found only the reflection of himself in the fantastic reality of heaven, where he sought a superman, will no longer feel disposed to find the mere appearance of himself, the non-man [Unmensch], where he seeks and must seek his true reality.
The foundation of irreligious criticism is: Man makes religion, religion does not make man.
Religion is, indeed, the self-consciousness and self-esteem of man who has either not yet won through to himself, or has already lost himself again. But man is no abstract being squatting outside the world. Man is the world of man – state, society. This state and this society produce religion, which is an inverted consciousness of the world, because they are an inverted world.
Religion is the general theory of this world, its encyclopaedic compendium, its logic in popular form, its spiritual point d’honneur, its enthusiasm, its moral sanction, its solemn complement, and its universal basis of consolation and justification. It is the fantastic realization of the human essence since the human essence has not acquired any true reality. The struggle against religion is, therefore, indirectly the struggle against that world whose spiritual aroma is religion.
Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.
The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.
Karl Marx
further Schnoebelen's claims of bizarre hazing rituals in Shriner Masonry (which includes participants of numerous other rites, such as the York rite, Scottish rite, etc., all of whom can be classed as having undergone "Blue Lodge" initiations) can be verified from the numerous other sources which litter this thread, including the admission of current Masons who concede that such bizarre hazing rituals do take place.
Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by Lucifer777
Please focus on the point that I was discussing the York Rite and your claims of its hazing rituals. The story you posted discussed nothing of the York Rite.
Another part of the ceremony required inductees to insert an arm inside a depiction of a horse's rear-end, where gobs of mayonnaise and other gooey substances had been placed, a source familiar with the ceremony said.
The basement of the lodge was adorned with a large replica guillotine for show, rat traps, and a mock plank that inductees were forced to walk blindfolded.
One member of the club, who identified himself only as Joseph, 63, said Wednesday that similar props had been used when he was inducted years ago, including shooting cans that were placed beside his head.
www.freemasonrywatch.org...
Quit being a revisionist. You can't just change our terms around to meet the needs of your story. What a Mason did outside the Blue Lodge is not evidence of hazing in the York Rite.
Guns do not take part in any Masonic ritual. Please find me the ritual in which it does and I'll refute my statement.
William James, 47, was shot while participating in an induction Monday night at the Southside Masonic Lodge, Suffolk County police said.
hazingmasonic.blogspot.com...
Do you even know how long that club existed before this incident occurred?
Carl Fitje, grand master of the New York State Freemasons (search), issued a statement Tuesday denying that guns play a role in any officially sanctioned lodge ceremonies.
"We don't use pistols," Steve Mayo, who described himself as a senior deacon of the lodge, told reporters Tuesday. "This is not a Masonic ceremony where we bring pistols."
However, (Detective) Fitzpatrick said members told police the rite involving a gun goes back at least 70 years.
Ibid
Here's the difference though, my knowledge comes from first hand experience while yours comes from, at best, 2nd hand information. You pull from sources who may or may not have alterior motives, and you often further twist and misconstrue facts to suit your motives.
Actually, you have yet to prove any hazing in the York Rite.
Originally posted by Lucifer777
The three major Masonic rites in the US appear to be the York Rite, the Scottish rite and the Shriners and all three rites have the three blue degrees in common. For the purposes of avoiding obfuscation I think it better to simply state that hazing rituals occur in American Masonry, and that the Masons involved in such rituals are of various rites.
Just as there's no such thing as Communism, nor Good, nor Evil. Are you going to dismiss all abstract concepts?
Since there is essentially no such a thing as Masonry independent of Freemasons (i.e., persons who are Freemasons) just as there is no such a thing as Christianity independent of Christians (persons who are Christians), I think it better to merely claim that those taking part in Masonic hazings rituals are members of various rites, such as the York Rite, Scottish Rite or whatever, all of whom have undergone the basic blue degrees,
In the case of the 76 year old Albert Eid, I am unable to source the article which claimed that he was a York Rite Mason, however rather than stating that hazing rituals occur in York Rite Masonry, which can lead to obfuscation by Masonic cultists and apologists,
Nor was it a York Rite ritual, nor was it a Scottish Rite ritual, nor was it a Blue Lodge Ritual. It was a ritual particular to that one club, which, may only exist in Suffolk County, and may only be 70 years old, but has nothing to do with any other aspect of Masonry other than requiring that it's members meet the prerequisite of being Masons.
I think it better to simply claim that York rite Masons are involved in hazing rituals, as indeed are Scottish Rite Masons, these being the two main divisions of Masonry which are joined after the first three degrees, and that some of these Masons are also involved in side degrees such as the Shriners where there are clearly hazing rituals. The shooting at the Masonic Temple in Patchogue, New York, was clearly not a Shriner ritual however.
I am revising my position for language for clarification and in accordance with your request; York Rite and Scottish Rite Masons are members of Shriner Masonry and other side degrees where hazing rituals clearly occur.
This is obviously a fraudulent statement and typical of cult denialism.
No, what's fraudulent is how you're spinning the facts to suit your own ends. The fact is, the Masonic lodge room was rented out to a group. That group was not a Masonic blue lodge acting under the authority of the Grand Lodge of New York, nor a York Rite body, nor a Scottish Rite body, nor a subset of the Shriners. It was a club entirely independent of the rule of any of those other groups.
If you wish to dispute that this was an "induction rite" in a Masonic lodge involving Freemasons, I would suggest that you take the matter up with the Suffolk county police in New York and suggest to them that their statements were fraudulent.
You're wrong. It exists in the constitution, bylaws and ritual of the order. It exists within the lodge room from the gavel opening the lodge until the gavel closing the lodge.
OK let me make this clear; there is no such a "thing (i.e., a substance)" as the York Rite; it has no shape nor size; it cannot be measured or weighed; the York Rite does not exist independently of York Rite Masons
I think it better to simply claim that York rite Masons are involved in hazing rituals, as indeed are Scottish Rite Masons
The shooting at the Masonic Temple in Patchogue, New York, was clearly not a Shriner ritual however.
York Rite and Scottish Rite Masons are members of Shriner Masonry and other side degrees where hazing rituals clearly occur.
This is obviously a fraudulent statement and typical of cult denialism.
Originally posted by Lucifer777
I am revising my position for language for clarification and in accordance with your request; York Rite and Scottish Rite Masons are members of Shriner Masonry and other side degrees where hazing rituals clearly occur.
Guns do not take part in any Masonic ritual. Please find me the ritual in which it does and I'll refute my statement.
This is obviously a fraudulent statement and typical of cult denialism.
William James, 47, was shot while participating in an induction Monday night at the Southside Masonic Lodge, Suffolk County police said.
hazingmasonic.blogspot.com...
If you wish to dispute that this was an "induction rite" in a Masonic lodge involving Freemasons, I would suggest that you take the matter up with the Suffolk county police in New York and suggest to them that their statements were fraudulent.
Frankly I find your attitude to be blasphemous and heretical; it is as if you wish to deny the most sacred and holy mock execution rites, and the "shoving ones hand up a horses ass" rite of the Southside Masonic Lodge; you should be utterly ashamed of yourself; why not just be proud of the holy and sacred rites of your eternal brotherhood. It is as if you are ashamed of your eternal brothers. Could it be that you have not yet been considered worthy for the holy and sacred mock execution rite or the shoving one's hand up a horses ass rite? Be of good faith frater and endure; the time will come when all your genocidal mayhem in Iraq will be rewarded in the great Halls of Judgement of the etyernal temple, and I may even be able to put a good word in for you and rush you through to the holy and sacred shoving one's arm up a horses' ass rite, and if you could show a more submissive attitude, I might even be able to put in a word for you and have you rushed through to the most holy and sacred "dog urination and simulated oral sex" rite..
Fraternally Yours
Her Imperial Satanic Majesty
Lucifer