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ask a christian

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posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 04:52 PM
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Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by danielsil18
 


ok why is it that what is beautiful to us usually follow the same lines.

why are we attracted to young, skinny, toned chicks with big boobs and big butts? because we are molded into seeing this as beautiful. by every magazine, by every television show, and every commercial that sells sex.

when back in the day people were attracted to larger women. in china woman would wear weird shoes to deform their feet cause it was considered beautiful. there have always been "social structures" to tell you what to think is attractive. if they can teach you to follow these thoughts you are allowing them to decide what is attractive for you... either way you choose to be attracted to it.

LOVE is a choice. just like it's a choice to love your fellow man.

you either lust or you love the choice is yours.


You do know that what you are talking about has nothing to do with a man choosing another man right?

I know what you are taling about, but it's not true that if I start watching gay porn everyday it will make me gay.

In Peru a gay person is rejected by his father because of their religious views, now tell me why would someone choose to be gay over there? why? there are no gay magazines, no gay commercials, etc. How did they become gay over there? You are only making assumptions.

You still haven't answered me if you can make a choice of sleeping with a man right now. Would you?




you can't control my thoughts and i can't control your thoughts likewise with action. so i am not responsible for you nor you me, but i am responsible for my actions. i used to be a drug addict cause i chose to be. i use to drink cause i chose to drink. i've been with people that were bad for me, because i chose to love them. i loved their outward appearance and not their inward appearance.


Please stop with that.

It's like you telling me you were born with blonde hair and me telling you that it was your choice like a drug addict has the choice to leave them.




it would be bad for humanity if everyone was gay because there would be no children. plain and simple.


It would be bad, but where is that coming from? That guys can be converted into being gay? Can you become gay right now? You can't.
edit on 17-2-2011 by danielsil18 because: (no reason given)




posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 04:58 PM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 


the mind is a tricky thing. why would someone choose to be a crackhead when everyone knows what crack does to you?

no i'm talking about the same thing.

can a girl find a girl attractive without it being sexual? can a guy find another guy attractive without it being sexual? yes, on both cases.

it's the decision to make that attraction sexual we are talking about. there are plenty of women i find attractive yet choose not move forward with for this reason or that reason. my love is a very valuable thing and i will give it to the person i find most deserving of my love.

edit to add:

well if i wanted to be gay... then yes i could turn gay right now. because i want to, not because i had to, not because of anything other than a desire that i choose to follow.

you are making yourself a slave to your own mind. you are making yourself a slave of your own emotions. come one give yourself more credit than that.
edit on 17-2-2011 by stuncrazy because: grammar



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:01 PM
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Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by danielsil18
 


the mind is a tricky thing. why would someone choose to be a crackhead when everyone knows what crack does to you?

no i'm talking about the same thing.

can a girl find a girl attractive without it being sexual? can a guy find another guy attractive without it being sexual? yes, on both cases.

it's the decision to make that attraction sexual we are talking about. there are plenty of women i find attractive yet choose not move forward with for this reason or that reason. my love is a very valuable thing and i will give it to the person i find most deserving of my love.


You have been ignoring my question. I'll ask it in bold so you don't miss it.

Can you become gay right now and sleep with a man? Would you sleep with a man right now?

Edit:



well if i wanted to be gay... then yes i could turn gay right now. because i want to, not because i had to, not because other than anything other than a desire that i choose.


Stop with the ignorance, you CAN'T become gay. You can't sleep with a man.

Are you trying to be serious or what?

Ask Sexologists who have studied in this field so you can be taught about homosexuality.
edit on 17-2-2011 by danielsil18 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 


i did answer your question.
personal response:
no, i don't want to
subjective response:
but if i wanted to i could.

if i wanted to be gay i could, but i don't want to be gay. it's not my thing, it's not what i want to do. i mean it really is that simple.

edit:
i don't need to ask a sexologist to know that i am in full control of my mind. that i am in full control of my desires. my mind and my emotions are all a part of MY BODY. self control and self will and self esteem these are the things I control.

stop making yourself out to be weaker than you are.
edit on 17-2-2011 by stuncrazy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by danielsil18
 


i did answer your question.
personal response:
no, i don't want to
subjective response:
but if i wanted to i could.

if i wanted to be gay i could, but i don't want to be gay. it's not my thing, it's not what i want to do. i mean it really is that simple.


It's not your thing and it never will because you are not gay.

You know that you will never sleep with a man and it's because you are not gay.

Someone gay won't sleep with a woman because he is homosexual.

Both can't make the choice, you know you will never make the choice of sleeping with a man.

I get my knowledege from a Sexologist, where do you get yours?



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:12 PM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 


we are not a weak species whom cannot control our desires.

i honestly don't care what your sexologist says. just like i don't refer to the pope when it comes to matters of my faith.

this whole conversation is completely off topic. seeing as it is not my place to judge you and tell you you are wrong. as a christian, i accept the fact that a person may choose to live a lifestyle because they are confused. it doesn't hurt me it doesn't change how i treat that person. it doesn't matter to me. i honestly don't care if your gay or your friend is gay or if anyone is gay. I DON"T CARE. not in a rude way, but your not hurting me so why should i?



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:17 PM
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Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by danielsil18
 


i honestly don't care what your sexologist says.


I finish it here, Sexologists study this field and you choose not to care what they say.


Why not choose to learn from those who know? I thought we had the choice to learn.

It was going back on topic when I was going to ask why many christians don't like gay people and compare them to child abusers.

But the answer is simple, they didn't study about homosexuality.
edit on 17-2-2011 by danielsil18 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:24 PM
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reply to post by stuncrazy
 


When a scripture is changed over and over to suit the human ego the spirit of it is lost each time. Such things do not need to be re-worded for better understanding for it will soon mislead those who read it no matter how pretty the words may be. I have written my own kind of bible, it is my own tool of measurement and it is filled not with light and goodness but encompasses chaos and evil. It is called Liber Evillennium and it contains the wisdom of the daemons. These scriptures are my truth alone. There has been much written about the defeat of evil that is little more than wishful thinking. This entire universe is evil and uncaring of humanity for it is the creation of a thought-form of a malevolent power that I have had contact with. Many seek truth and wisdom and so I will write a truth. This universe is inside a blackhole and reality is just an echo of itself.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 05:27 PM
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reply to post by Tindalos2013
 


but the bible has proven itself. through it's own prophesies and the like the daniel 70 week prophesy predicted the time the messiah would come specifically and it did this 500 years before it happened. that is the sign of a prophet. that is the sign to make a skeptic a believer. if i tell you when and how something is going to happen and it happens when and how i said it would... then i have powers correct?



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 06:33 PM
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reply to post by stuncrazy
 


It could be that you are misleading your thought process by posing to me a closed question that allows only one of three answers, two of which lead to a kind of entrapment answer, a closed circuit loop. To my occult knowledge such events are carefully crafted in advanced by means of privillaged information that has no connection to the divine powers you speculate. The bible, as it is, is out of time and needs to be forgotten. By this I mean it holds no further value for the evolution of the mind, not for me or anyone else. Write your own bible from scratch, your life and the events it contains.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 06:38 PM
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reply to post by Tindalos2013
 


so you claim we are evolving. can i ask how, and is this evolution a good thing?

and i wasn't trying to entrap you.

if i as a ordinary person claim something was going to happen and 500 years later when i claimed it would happen it actually happens. what would you say about me?

why would i want to write my own bible? we already have a book of wisdom. my own understanding would do no man any good.
edit on 17-2-2011 by stuncrazy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 07:08 PM
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reply to post by stuncrazy
 


Having a job is not the same as slavery. Slaves are treated as property. When I am employed I willingly enter into the agreement. If I am subject to a contract then I have every right to reject the terms of employment. The company also has no right to transfer that contract without my consent.

Slaves are treated like property and have no legal right to the fruits of their labor.

You've also not acknowledged how we're supposed to take the flood story seriously. There's no geologic evidence, there's no way that ship could have been sea worthy let alone carried 2 of every unclean animal and 7 of every clean one.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 07:10 PM
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reply to post by stuncrazy
 



Originally posted by stuncrazy
reply to post by Tindalos2013
 


so you claim we are evolving. can i ask how,


Genetic mutation + natural selection + sexual selection + genetic drift = evolution.



and is this evolution a good thing?


It's neither good nor bad, it merely is.




if i as a ordinary person claim something was going to happen and 500 years later when i claimed it would happen it actually happens. what would you say about me?


You'd either have made an easy claim, gotten lucky, or made a great prediction. Of course, nothing in the Bible fits that profile.



why would i want to write my own bible? we already have a book of wisdom. my own understanding would do no man any good.


The Bible is a misogynistic illogical document which supports the treatment of humans as property, glorifies genocide and mass rape, and doesn't actually make a lick of sense.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 07:32 PM
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reply to post by stuncrazy
 


I would say about you that whatever you claimed would have come to pass regardless of you voicing it. Anything that happens which in turn causes another thing to happen, happens. Events as humans record them are chaotic at best and false 500 years later.

Example.
The so called uprising of Eygpt write now will be re-written time and time again and each time a little truth will be lost. Then someone like yourself will try to link it to some kind of prophecy written even further back in the annuals of recorded history.

Time is now for new wisdom that is not found in the minds of the current world leaders that you give mantle too. Take the old wisdom and shape it forward for yourself. Apply it with result. THAT is the whole purpose yet here humans are unbalanced and not understanding why. I digress.

If you seek wisdom then you must forget everything, your name, your life, your friends, everything. Let go of your identity and once you can do that whatever happens next will be filled with wisdom anew.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 07:44 PM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 



Thank you for the answers. Unfortunately they are unacceptable.

You are welcome. If you accept them or not it´s up to you. No one is forcing you to accept anything, that´s the reason also why i said on my post, if you really interested, do your own research.

Slavery of ANY kind cannot be justified morally. I could care less if it was based on race, social class, or anything else. Owning people is morally wrong.

Of course slavery can not be justified morally, but nevertheless in the ancient world such an Egypt and Middle East was common practice. And the treatment of slaves varied in the ancient world. For example Code of Hammurabi.

Your second offering is a pathetic mess of apologetics trying to excuse God's actions by bringing up Pharaoh's evil.

Why pathetic?? The fact that you do not agree with the answers, does it make it pathetic?? You are entitled to your opinion, but pathetic?? The source deals with the whole account.

I'm well aware that Pharaoh was an evil and wicked man, in fact that is my entire point, Pharaoh is labeled as EVIL for enslaving the Hebrews and killing the Hebrew children,

Yeap, the Pharaoh was an evil person.

when God does it he is a HERO seen as being a just and righteous God. How horrible! So God, who is meant to be better than we humans, hardens Pharaoh's heart so that he can carry out an act of genocidal revenge.

According to the source God was giving Pharaoh increasingly severe warnings. The Pharaoh ignored them all. And after that God hardened further Pharaohs heart and the rest of the plaques came, the Pharaoh let them go. That´s the whole story of the Ten plaques. God is a hero in the eyes of the Hebrews. After all He liberate them after 400 years of slavery and muss murder.

As if to throw salt in the wounds the website you quote from claims that the plagues were an act of mercy. So murdering innocent children is an act of mercy. So their defense to make God seem like less of a jerk is to make him seem like more of a jerk by saying he SHOULD have destroyed all of Egypt

Salt in the wounds?? Defense??Not, at all. As i mentioned above according to the source God was giving Pharaoh increasingly severe warnings of the judgment that was to come, if he did not let His people go. The pharaoh chose to bring judgment on himself and on his nation by hardening his own heart against God’s commands. So,the destruction of the Egypt would have been just. Only the fact that Egypt was not destroyed completely was an act of mercy.

Peace
edit on 17-2-2011 by Seed76 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 07:45 PM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 



Slavery is still slavery, it's the ownership of individuals and is wrong. Hell, the idea that you should be allowed to beat an individual within an inch of their life and get away with it so long as you don't kill them is just insanely wrong.


Of course slavery is still slavery and it´s wrong. And as i mentioned before in the ancient world such an Egypt and Middle East was common practice. And the treatment of slaves varied in the ancient world. For example Code of Hammurabi.

Peace



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 08:46 PM
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reply to post by Tindalos2013
 


ok quick question do you think i support the system we have been bound to? the bible makes it clear give what is Caesar's to Ceasar and give to God what is God.

give them their money, but give your soul to he who is all that he is(Everything).

yea you have to pay your taxes you have to live your life, but be a light to the world. make the world better just by being.



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 08:55 PM
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reply to post by Seed76
 


It wasn't God who warned Pharaoh it was Moses who claimed to be speaking to God. If I were the President of a nation and some sheep herder came to me demanding I fire my entire work force because a burning bush told him I would probably take the same course of action as Pharaoh and refuse. Not that Pharaoh's other evils are at justified, for sure the Pharaoh deserved to be punished. In the end for some strange reason God decides to murder the innocent first born instead of those who are actually to blame (Pharaoh and Egyptian nobility). It goes along with the bloodthirsty eye for an eye mentality of the Old testament God which I find offensive and also the sins of the Father passing onto the sons.

While I have no issue with people who like the story itself as a literary work I find it disturbing when Christians defend such atrocious actions and claim that they actually happened. When people attempt to justify God's actions or claim they are righteous it truly bothers me which is why I was interested in the OPs opinion. The answer I'd like to see from Christians is that God's actions are wrong and that the story is probably not true.

reply to post by stuncrazy
 




oh but your gonna get mad because he protected his people.


How does killing innocent people protect the Hebrews again? God never stated that his intention was to "protect his people" and in fact God hardens Pharaoh's heart several times in the story meaning that the Hebrews would have been freed SOONER but God wanted to complete the plagues.



yet you'd root for it if someone did it to someone you knew deserved to die.


I'm not at all sure what you mean however I don't think the Egyptian First Born deserved to die, many of them were innocent children who had no control over the enslavement of the Hebrews and had nothing to do with the evils of the Pharaoh. You mentioned Hitler, let's say Hitler is the Pharaoh, would God be justified to smite all the German first born who weren't Jewish? Would you consider him to be protecting his people?



that's poetic justice my friend. poetic justice at it's finest


If you truly believe that genocide of innocent children is poetic justice than perhaps you need to reevaluate your moral compass. There is no justice in killing innocent people, poetic or otherwise.



i think the indians were pretty dead on honestly.


Yeah, too bad all those Christians came over and killed em.
edit on 17-2-2011 by Titen-Sxull because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 10:01 PM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


before i tackle your post... and i'm glad you returned. i'm enjoying our little debate we got going on. your an intelligent "opponent" for lack of a better word.

i challenge you to take this debate to the spiritual or "the ego" side of things. this is what the bible is about. to understand the bible you must compare it to self. to judge oneself, but not in a bad way. take it as constructive criticism.

i mean life is your canvas, why not take pride in it and do it right? live the life of your dreams. any who here we go.



reply to post by stuncrazy
 



Having a job is not the same as slavery. Slaves are treated as property. When I am employed I willingly enter into the agreement. If I am subject to a contract then I have every right to reject the terms of employment. The company also has no right to transfer that contract without my consent.



Slaves are treated like property and have no legal right to the fruits of their labor.


we are all slaves to money. people live and die for money. money is the god of this world and people follow it's rules and it is forced upon it. you are a slave to money. you think you have rights to your money, but you don't it never truly belongs to you. you don't even really own the land you live on. that belongs to the government. TPTB are your slave owners and you are their property, and no you can't reject their terms of employment. you live, you learn just enough to do your job, you work, and you die. those are the rules, and if you reject those rules you suffer horribly and you more than likely die.

if that's not the truth man idk what is.

give to ceasar what is ceasar's and give to God what is God. that is the ego or self


You've also not acknowledged how we're supposed to take the flood story seriously. There's no geologic evidence, there's no way that ship could have been sea worthy let alone carried 2 of every unclean animal and 7 of every clean one.


honestly i've never felt the need to research or clarify this for myself seeing as the morale of the story is the most important part of it and is honestly the only part that matters about the story. the morale of the story is people were overwhelmingly evil and needed to be eradicated. this was preached for 4 generations that it was gonna happen and the people where living to be 1000 they had time to change, but they didn't. it's not like he just punished them without warning. they could have stopped being selfish, hateful, vindictive, cold, loveless people, but they didn't. Yet in all that he saved those who were righteous, just, merciful and loving. there's a reward for being a good person. a good-hearted caring person, even if your the absolute last good person left you will be saved.

although, if you need physical evidence, could i suggest the ice age. i mean that's always what i figured. just a personal assumption i mean i've never done the research on the subject, cause the how or what really don't matter as much as the why.

but if i were to guess. i mean what would a world under water be experiencing. i mean it would have to completely change the world around it.

more importantly we would have to figure out how it started. i would say that it started with cataclysmic volcano eruptions. that would raise the atmospheric pressure which would evaporate a large amounts of water and then a large rain. i know at one point in time all the continents were completely together and a single land mass. i'm not sure if this was at the same time of the ice age or not, but would be more compelling if it did. actually that could be damaging to my hypothesis. oh well i'm sure i can find out easy enough.

now comes the undertaking of understanding what it would do to the world as a whole. i mean what kind of evidence would it leave behind? i mean can you imagine. an earth covered completely by water. i mean the reality of that is amazing. it would have to drop the core temperature down enormously. i mean we are talking about water higher than the highest mountains. i mean take st. helen turn it upside down fill it with water and go to the very bottom of that. and that is on top of the water we already have. the temperature of the earth had to drop dramatically. sounds like an ice age to me. i got a question did the meteor that killed the dinosaurs start the ice age... cause that would make it come full circle in my mind. the how and the what.

i mean i'm just throwing that out there. the how or the what don't really matter when it all boils down to it. the way i read the bible is for personal assessment.

i mean come on the old testament clearly shows people can suck. and guess what when people suck they suck big time. so don't be a cappy person. get it?
the new testament is the good news. the good news is love triumphs over all. who was Jesus? as an individual. as a person. what sort of character did he display? who were his friends? who were his enemies? you find that out you find out that us as conspiracy theorists have a lot in common with Jesus. cause he didn't like the system either. he was like screw the system man. and he did every time the Pharisee messed with him he made em look stupid. cause they were trying to be self righteous and hypocrites. demanding people live lives that they themselves could not. the pharisee were the high priests of the Jewish law. these were the heads of the religion. do you get where I'm going with this?
edit on 17-2-2011 by stuncrazy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 17 2011 @ 10:17 PM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 

exodus 1


8Now there arose up a new king over Egypt, which knew not Joseph.
9And he said unto his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are more and mightier than we:
10Come on, let us deal wisely with them; lest they multiply, and it come to pass, that, when there falleth out any war, they join also unto our enemies, and fight against us, and so get them up out of the land.



13And the Egyptians made the children of Israel to serve with rigour:
14And they made their lives bitter with hard bondage, in morter, and in brick, and in all manner of service in the field: all their service, wherein they made them serve, was with rigour.



15And the king of Egypt spake to the Hebrew midwives, of which the name of the one was Shiphrah, and the name of the other Puah:
16And he said, When ye do the office of a midwife to the Hebrew women, and see them upon the stools; if it be a son, then ye shall kill him: but if it be a daughter, then she shall live.



21And it came to pass, because the midwives feared God, that he made them houses.
22And Pharaoh charged all his people, saying, Every son that is born ye shall cast into the river, and every daughter ye shall save alive.


ok so here we got a guy who is picking on God's children and you're going to tell me that the ending to the story is not poetic justice?
edit on 17-2-2011 by stuncrazy because: (no reason given)



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