I read in another topic:

Originally posted by dbrandt
To go to heaven and be with God for all eternity and see all of His creation you must accept Christ as Savior.

I failed to find the truth in this statement.

While I have no problems accepting that Jesus died for the sins of all men and that those who accept Jesus as Savoir will be lead down the path to Heaven, humility will not allow me to say this is the only way.

So I sought to understand the truth in this matter. My studies were directed to Gospel of Matthew.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matt 7:21-23)

Here are the words of Jesus, saying it is not those who says Jesus is Lord that will go to heaven, but those who do the will of God.

So I pondered what was the will of God. I found this answer also in the words of Jesus in the Gospel of Matthew.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:36-40)

So I ask Christians who would say something similiar to the original quote, "Why must one accept Christ as savior to go to heaven?"


.

I think that this is the general belief of most Christians. Are there other circumstances where one can get into heaven? Possibly, but that path isn't laid out clearly, so it's best not to "wing it" and do your own thing. Of course there are those who died before Jesus was even born who are under different circumstances. The idea of Jesus being the only way comes from a quote by Jesus, and words by Peter and John.

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. "

Acts 4:12 "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."

I believe the quote from Matt 7:21-23 was a lesson about not just giving lip service.
Guy #1 - "I'm a Christian" *actions = rape, murder, stealing*
Guy #2 - "I'm a Christian" *actions = kind, caring, sharing*

Which one of these two is actually a follower of Jesus? That's the premise of Matt 7:21-23.

[Edited on 15-7-2004 by dbates]

So I ask Christians who would say something similiar to the original quote, "Why must one accept Christ as savior to go to heaven?"

This is for people that their maine religion is christianity, and occurs a christian belief and part of their faith.

Originally posted by dbates
I think that this is the general belief of most Christians. Are there other circumstances where one can get into heaven? Possibly, but that path isn't laid out clearly, so it's best not to "wing it" and do your own thing. Of course there are those who died before Jesus was even born who are under different circumstances. The idea of Jesus being the only way comes from a quote by Jesus, and words by Peter and John.

The path to heaven is clearly laid out: follow God's commandments.

John 14:6 "Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. "

There are two points I would like to make about this statement.

1. The word "through" is translated from the greek word Dia, which also means "though: by means of" or "though: the ground or reason by which something is or is not done". Which would be an affirmation that Jesus died for the sins of all men.

2. This statement is taken slightly out of context. If you read it in context, you will see that it is just one part of an answer. The very next line of the answer is 7 If you really knew me, you would know my Father, too. But now you do know him, and you have seen him.

Acts 4:12 "Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."

Once again name is from the greek "Onama" which also means "everything which the name covers, everything the thought or feeling of which is aroused in the mind by mentioning, hearing, remembering, the name"

Which could simply be referring to the teachings of Jesus, or the fact that he died for the sins of all men.

I believe the quote from Matt 7:21-23 was a lesson about not just giving lip service.
Guy #1 - "I'm a Christian" *actions = rape, murder, stealing*
Guy #2 - "I'm a Christian" *actions = kind, caring, sharing*

Which one of these two is actually a follower of Jesus? That's the premise of Matt 7:21-23.

Actually, taken in context it is a lesson in humility. Read all of Chapter 7 for the context of the lesson it contains.

It is akin to the story I heard of some leaders of a church giving the humblest man in the church a pin to wear. The following week, the man wore the pin to services, and the leaders took the pin away.


Are these the only two verses that this idea come from?
If it were that important wouldn't there be more than 2 of 7955 verses stating it was so?


Marg,

This would be the crux of my problem. I beleive in God. I beleive Christ died for the sins of all men. I believe that by doing God's will, one will go to heaven. I believe in the second coming of Christ. I believe in the teachings of Jesus. All of these things make me a Christian. However, when I read "To go to heaven and be with God for all eternity and see all of His creation you must accept Christ as Savior", I do not see the humility that reflects the teachings of Christ.

.

Originally posted by Raphael_UO
I read in another topic:

i]Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matt 7:21-23)



.

Part of the will of God is that you come to Him by Jesus Christ. That verse is talking about people who tried to be saved by their good works. They didn't humble themselves and accept the fact that they were a sinner in need of a Savior. They did their own thing, even if it was good works. The thing is they were doing good works to be saved. That's not how you come to God. You enter by Christ and then develope a personal relationship with Him.

Jesus did die for every sin ever committed. But we have to respond to what he did and accept it. He didn't do it generically for all mankind so your safe. You respond individually to what he did. In responding you walk and talk with Him and get closer to Him. That's why He said, "I never knew you". Those people did it their way, never getting to know God through Christ.

Originally posted by dbrandt
Part of the will of God is that you come to Him by Jesus Christ. That verse is talking about people who tried to be saved by their good works. They didn't humble themselves and accept the fact that they were a sinner in need of a Savior. They did their own thing, even if it was good works. The thing is they were doing good works to be saved. That's not how you come to God. You enter by Christ and then develope a personal relationship with Him.

The lesson is as it was taught. Simply, they failed to do the will of God.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:36-40)

This is the will of God. There are no commands greater.

The essence of this is Humility-- Humility to God and Humility to ones fellow men.

In Matt 7:21-23 their very words betray the pride in their hearts. They judge themselves worthy because they accept Jesus as Lord and do his works. It is not their place to judge.

This is taught numerous times. Even Jesus would not do this even though he, being one with the Father, could judge.

John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.



But perhaps, that was a poor choice of Scripture as it is detracting from my question. Here is another passage which teaches the same.

1 John 2:16-17
For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.

And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

.

Originally posted by Raphael_UO
I read in another topic:

Originally posted by dbrandt
To go to heaven and be with God for all eternity and see all of His creation you must accept Christ as Savior.

I failed to find the truth in this statement.

While I have no problems accepting that Jesus died for the sins of all men and that those who accept Jesus as Savoir will be lead down the path to Heaven, humility will not allow me to say this is the only way.

So I sought to understand the truth in this matter. My studies were directed to Gospel of Matthew.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matt 7:21-23)

Here are the words of Jesus, saying it is not those who says Jesus is Lord that will go to heaven, but those who do the will of God.

So I pondered what was the will of God. I found this answer also in the words of Jesus in the Gospel of Matthew.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:36-40)

So I ask Christians who would say something similiar to the original quote, "Why must one accept Christ as savior to go to heaven?"


.

Auctually that is not what it means. It is talking about those who Talk the talk , but do not walk the walk in a since. He is saying look you have to believe in your heart, because..... Technically anyone can do those things, god gives us all the ability, but to enter into heaven is to believe in your heart that Jesus was the son of God, hope that helps

[Edited on 18-7-2004 by infovacume]

Originally posted by infovacume
Auctually that is not what it means. It is talking about those who Talk the talk , but do not walk the walk in a since. He is saying look you have to believe in your heart, because..... Technically anyone can do those things, god gives us all the ability, but to enter into heaven is to believe in your heart that Jesus was the son of God, hope that helps

[Edited on 18-7-2004 by infovacume]

Originally posted by Raphael_UO

The lesson is as it was taught. Simply, they failed to do the will of God.

Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:36-40)

This is the will of God. There are no commands greater.

The essence of this is Humility-- Humility to God and Humility to ones fellow men.

In Matt 7:21-23 their very words betray the pride in their hearts. They judge themselves worthy because they accept Jesus as Lord and do his works. It is not their place to judge.

This is taught numerous times. Even Jesus would not do this even though he, being one with the Father, could judge.

John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

They did not err while casting out demons. They erred when they thought heaven was deserved because of their faith. They judged themselves worthy of heaven.

The chapter begins, "Judge not, that ye be not judged."
That is the lesson in that verse, only phrased another way.

.

i think all you need to get into heaven is to be a good person

To go to heaven and be with God for all eternity and see all of His creation you must accept Christ as Savior.

I think the more correct version of the main christian doctrine would be:

You have to accept the Christ as described in the official Bible, the 4 gospels accepted as Bible around the year 400AD, using the King James translation regardless of mistranslations, using the exact words stated there to describe Christ, including interpretations by priests. If you dont, you go to Hell.

Muslims accept Christ as a creation of God, born of a virgin, did miracles, cured people, was a Messiah, didn't die on the Cross, is a Saviour and will return before the Judgement Day. Only they do not use the exact wording of the above described Holy Book, therefore they will go to Hell... somehow I dont think so.

Belief in God and Christ might be the only way to salvation.
Bible, on the other hand, is most certainly not the only way.