"Karma" is the SOURCE of evil.

Originally posted by SystemResistor
reply to post by squandered

 

Yes, the names would swap places. I guess it is akin to saying that it is the very perception that something is "good" or that something is "bad" is the very basis for the tertiary consideration of "karma" as a balancing mechanism.

Awesome!

If there's something makes you happy and there's a way that you can make it happen, you know that you have good karma, no?

Karma isn't really considered a mechanism. That's a pop-Christian 'shame' tact if ever I saw one. I learnt about karma after being told it doesn't exist - it's not a 'thing'. My preconception was that deeds equal positive / negative responses!

There's was a good responses about alluding to what categorises karma at the top of the thread so I didn't want to go into my ideas. I put it down to faith in a better future - seems lucky.

I'm using a time paradigm... (future expectations create luck)

The paradise you seek is a world without choice hence without free will or action of any kind. That is the real prison Choice or decision is the very essence of life. Duality exist on the higher planes also because their is choice. Go high enough and we may not recognize it because we do not yet have the capacity to understand it but it exist.

The very fact that we exist in duality proves we chose to come here on this plane for the experience and progression it affords us. This is not a prison or there would be no choice here. It is more like a school where we can expand upon ourselves through experience and learning through free will choice or decision. the consequences of those decisions good or bad are the fabric of the universe, neither created, but always have been. Karma is like gravity, it just is, how it effect us for good or evil is based on our choice. Jumping off building is the cause or action and hitting the ground is the effect. Fire is hot choose to stick your hand in the flame and you get burned. Chose to keep the right distance and fire will keep you warm. The laws of karma go deeper such as if you chose to harm someone, you must pay for it by being harmed in this life or another. Hence your choices are what determine if you experience good or evil not karma.

reply to post by SystemResistor


Split bicameral brainmind, for starters. Left and right, male and female, anima and animus, need to be integrated, the best allegory being that of a marriage.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by SystemResistor

 

When Karma...imprisoned in the matter of people's bodies everywhere, at a very low density... as prisoners of the past.. It's a teacher, nothing more, nothing less...

edit on 15-2-2011 by NewAgeMan because: edit

I have a question.

Low density equals high energy?
No energy is pure-mass. (something forgotten)
No 'thing' is no energy or mass.

The good news of karma is that it's own resolution is contained self referentially imbedded within itself, it's undoing, already at hand in the absurdity of our own human misconceptions and misinterpretations and all manner of false judgements and false distinctions, at all levels. It's crazy. We were all nuts, insane.

Lol, you described what I call faith.

So, Imagine if Evil was rewarded, and Good was punished?

Just like now jk

In all seriousness.... Morality is not a "Magical Concept" it is the logical framework of human interaction that is nessecary for society to exist.

Quite simple, really...

"Do unto others, what you would have them do unto you"

"That which is hateful to yourself, do not do to your neighbor"

The golden Rule which people still do not seem to understand..... despite it being the PREDOMINANT TEACHING in almost ever religion known to man.





Morality may be described as such:

Any action that attempts to corrupt, or counter the free will of another is by definition, Evil.

Propaganda, Emotional Appeals, Instinctual Triggering, etcetera... these things attempt to subvert the free will that originates in the mind.

Just as force does the same thing, and can be considered Evil also... since it subverts the free will of another.

There is only ONE capacity that humans have, that animals do not, and THAT, is Reason... the ability to Think Critically.




Cause and Effect, in a moral framework WORKS in a fundamentally different capacity than the mystical... it works in the Logical, Rational, and subtle ways.

A society that worships thuggery, where all are bully's or thieves, will quickly run out of producers, since to produce, is to be robbed.

A society that worships unbridled Greed, will collapse through a super-concentration of currency in too few hands, that strangles the Base Economy (The people buying, producing, and selling) and destroys the inherent value of the society's economy.

A society that worships Feelings, will collapse through a cacophony of mismatched rationalizations for heinous atrocities that every individual feels that they deserve to profit from.

Action causes Reaction.

Cause, Causes Effect.


All of the Virtues of society's past... all of the "Moral" qualities that were held in high esteem....

These were Logical deductions of courses of action, that most benefited ALL within that society.

And this is what society *IS*, a collective agreement that we will all Get along with each-other, and agree not to screw each-other over, or ground each-other under our boots.

Societies whose populations fail to meet these requirements will not survive, logically... they cannot.

Since society is the Agreement of the principle of Trading, whereby the product of man's mind enriches the total experience and life of all of us; Any society that disregards the ONE QUALITY of humanity that produces value, shall perish, hollow, and valueless.... its producers no longer producing.

Originally posted by squandered

The good news of karma is that it's own resolution is contained self referentially imbedded within itself, it's undoing, already at hand in the absurdity of our own human misconceptions and misinterpretations and all manner of false judgements and false distinctions, at all levels. It's crazy. We were all nuts, insane.

Lol, you described what I call faith.

Precisely. Faith, is the only thing left when reason and logic is used like a sword to carve away everything that is unreasonable and illogical. It's the only thing that makes any sense whatsoever in the final analysis at the end of the day.

although I suspect that's not the paradigm you had in mind..

To each his own as they say!

OK, karma is payback, if karma exists - and I think it does because this universe requires balance.

Karma itself is a concept - a concept cannot be blamed for evil.

It is what we do that is good or evil which attracts karma.

So what attracts evil is the actions of humans. Equally, what attracts good is the actions of humans.

All you have to decide is whether you will do good or evil.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


No you said it well.

The only thing I might disagree with based on the wisdom in the post above yours is that the product of faith expands faster then logic. Logic will only collapse what is understood.

Faith is a synapse away. It's the real mover and shaker, but who knew free will was so powerful... ?

karma, is way more then everything applyed so far, it is the need to understand/overcome/learn law, its not based on human morales, or laws, based on your personal karmic needs it can be anything , morally good or bad, even law biding or not, it is the main reason everyone lives different lives, from drug addicts to teachers to holy men, criminals etc, now there are even things in this that are in error, it is a idea that has nothing to do with good or bad, a inner need to understand something so deep can active a karmic effect to yourself, really the ideas of good and evil are human, but its also based on our inner need to realizes we are all one, just divided, so there our morales come into play, when we help someone we are helping our selfs as a whole, but the idea is to have sympathy for all as we all work thru our own karma and lives here on earth,and WOE to he who interferes with another mans KARMA

Lets turn the tables on this whole thing, what if, pain did not "hurt" however we instinctivley avoided damaging ourselves - what would be the point of karma, positive or negative?

Originally posted by catwhoknowsplusone
OK, karma is payback, if karma exists - and I think it does because this universe requires balance.

Karma itself is a concept - a concept cannot be blamed for evil.

It is what we do that is good or evil which attracts karma.

So what attracts evil is the actions of humans. Equally, what attracts good is the actions of humans.

All you have to decide is whether you will do good or evil.

I think you are talking about your energy field. If you fix your mindset you can attract more luck, but you can still do evil deeds.

It comes down to what you call happiness to me.

reply to post by squandered


What would be "free-will" if we lost the ability to predict the outcomes of our actions? A more accurate question, "how would we start to behave if our free will was taken away from us?" Would we start to act like primitive animals if we are not exposed (i.e. isolated) from the system, as most of our knowledge and behaviour is due to what we have been programmed with by various schools of thought, how many humans have been observed in a controlled environment/enclosure to see how they behave with minimal contact with civilisation?

reply to post by pathwalker


I'm starting to think the deeper your understand of what is good for you and how important you hold your beliefs is the ultimate creator of karma - good or bad.

Sounds more like self determination.

Originally posted by SystemResistor
Lets turn the tables on this whole thing, what if, pain did not "hurt" however we instinctivley avoided damaging ourselves - what would be the point of karma, positive or negative?

It would still hurt, just another brand. That's karma for you...

positive and negative to people are completely different depending on an individual's stance. What's bad for you might be good for me and vice versa. To deem something as a negative or a positive one would have to come to that deceision by themselves. Regardless of your belief's or past experience's. Cause and effect happen's 100% of the time because in everything we do a cause and effect is the outcome. As far as positive and negative go there is no relation to cause and effect. You could have a LUKEWARM product from your actions which could be neither of the two or neutral

Originally posted by SystemResistor
reply to post by squandered

 

What would be "free-will" if we lost the ability to predict the outcomes of our actions? A more accurate question, "how would we start to behave if our free will was taken away from us?" Apparantley we start to act like vicious animals if we are not exposed (i.e. isolated) from the system. We could really just be well-trained monkeys, a heavily controlled and modified genetic experiment?

edit on 15-2-2011 by SystemResistor because: (no reason given)

Without free will are either less, or we do what we're told. You have free will. If you think you're a monkey there's a karmic link for you, to that. People won't like you unless they willing agree.

there's no link to any new info' justifying alien DNA theories, etc. That's stuff you want to believe. Someone will point out why. You could try asking that question. "Why do I have this suspicion".

If you understand me...

reply to post by squandered


I mean the physical sensation of pain. What if animals "enjoy" being eaten, and also enjoy running from predators. What if we enjoyed sharing with each other and felt bad when we did not?

reply to post by squandered


Wild animals do not have "free-will" and they are far more diffiult to control than the average human, usually an elaborate system of fences and continuous supply of free food before they can perform any "tricks" - much like us really!

reply to post by SystemResistor


Karma, or Destiny, in neither good, nor evil - in fact, I would classify it as an "Convenient Excuse".

Every action, decision, option, and paths, you make, or take, throughout your conscience past, will have inevitable consequences in you near, and far future.
Of course, not all these decisions are always available to everybody, since we, as individual, are "programmed", from cradle to grave, by our surroundings, upbringing, and environment. Many times, the paths taken, and latter perceived as being harmful to the self, are the only ones available, at the time.

I personally dislike the word Karma, due to it's "Oriental", religious associations, and, above all, to some misguided notions the word implies.
The point I really find pertinent is, whether or not, each individual, in his environment, is free to build his own Karma, Destiny, Fate...

So, to sum it up, the notion in itself is neither good, or evil - if you assume such things exist. But, due to it not being entirely the consequence of a Free Conscious Individual, in a Neutral, Controlled Environment, it tends to be more a product of outside forces. Thus, in the long-run, it mainly manifest itself, in most individuals, as pernicious.

reply to post by CerBeRus666


In other words, another chain...