Mother shot twice with a Taser after she was arrested for leaving baby in car to go to tanning salon

Originally posted by undo
btw, i thought it was the general concensus of ATS, that tasers were inhumane. a bit odd that it's suddenly okay to use on a young mom (even if she's not a shining example of motherhood, tasering and potentially killing her should not be an option.)

edit on 14-2-2011 by undo because: (no reason given)

I agree. Her choices are lousy, but she is young. Now what? She is charged with neglect, and put in prison. Now the baby gets placed in a foster home with strangers that typically foster children for money? Her actions demonstrate neglect, but I do not think that this condones VIOLENCE on the part of the officers. I am sorry, but Tasers are NOT NECESSARY, particularly on a young woman. What, is she godzilla that can't be restrained otherwise? Were they afraid of her? Did she threaten them with violence? Come on people, why are you condoning POLICE BRUTALITY?

Originally posted by Advantage
Anyone here ever see a baby who has died from being left in a hot vehicle? I have. Therefore I wouldnt mind it if theyd have stomped her to death in front of the tanning salon.... forget tasering.

Ive seen enough to really be firm on my change of heart over the yrs concerning mercy shown to inept parents. The break down here she will get a finger waggled at her, someone has to sit her in a class and explain to this fool that she cant leave an infant trapped in a car seat in a vehicle alone.. and she WILL get the baby back.

That's a myth that was started because Aboriginals were known to steal babies from Cars in Australia and blame in on Dingos.

reply to post by undo


Kudos for helping that man, and not judging him immediately as you could have.

I don't think any Medical personnel are lobbying to be inserted into these situations, it is volatile and comes with a lot of liability. The decisions are always second-guessed in court, and someone will always disagree with the outcome.

I do think it could help, but I don't think it will happen. The most we can hope for is extensive training for the officers in the area of mental health and situational diffusion. This is already on-going, and this is part of my reasoning for defending the cops. These situations are just almost impossible to see clearly during the heat of the event with limited information and the necessity to make lightning quick decisions. It seems extremely unreasonable to look back in hindsight and criticize their actions, except in the most obvious cases.

reply to post by getreadyalready


That's true. Also the rule of thumb when you're a police officer (or even a security guard like I am and have been trained by cops and ex-cops) is even if it's a woman you're dealing with and she becomes aggressive. A woman wants to act like a man and fight? Treat her like one. I'd do everything I can to restrain a woman w/o hitting her but if necessary I'd take her ass to the cleaners if I had to.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
The cops had every reason in the world to stop, detain, and evaluate her before letting her reunite with the baby.

I do not agree. Is reuniting with your baby a crime? Can they reasonably expect she is returning to hurt the child? Then there is no need for physical force (rights violation) to stop her.

They can issue a citation for the past crime while she comforts her child. She wasn't trying to flee the scene.

Where is your humanity?

letting her run straight to the baby would have been an extremely unwise decision.

What do expect would have happened if she had gotten there before the police? Would have she been an immediate threat to the child? Do you expect she would have beaten the child for puking?

I cannot fathom how it is unwise to let a mother comfort a crying baby after a brief but uncomfortable separation.

Sri Oracle

watch this video and pay attention the last part, where the description of women with post partum depression is given.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
These situations are just almost impossible to see clearly during the heat of the event with limited information and the necessity to make lightning quick decisions. It seems extremely unreasonable to look back in hindsight and criticize their actions, except in the most obvious cases.

We look back in hindsight to criticize actions such as these that they might not become precedent for future injustice.

Sri Oracle

reply to post by Sri Oracle


Well you're assuming that's what happened. From my perspective the officers most likely checked on the welfare of the child and then went into the salon to confront the mother and tell her she was being charged with neglect. After that point with the information we're given it really does become a guessing game. Diplomacy should always be used over force unless completely necessary however it was the police officers that were allegedly attacked. She's the person that escalated the situation from verbal to physical.

Your posts are very well written and I enjoy reading them btw! Hope we can get the full story from the perspectives of the officers and the mother to reach a more educated conclusion on what happened that day.

reply to post by Sri Oracle


I listed all of my most notable concerns. They don't even know for certain she is the mother. They don't know if she is mentally stable, or impaired by drugs. And yes, what is to keep her from immediately smashing the baby to the ground? We cannot assume her intentions are good, especially since she is already suspected of abandoning the baby in the first place. Members like Undo have posted pretty good suspicions that she may have had Post-Partum depression. Mothers have been known to systematically drown all of their kids, one at a time, when suffering this way, with no regard for their own criminal situation. This mother could easily have acted unexpectedly.

Where is my humanity? Where is your humanity?

How would you feel if your gut told you to let her cradle the baby, and she did, for a brief second, and the next second it lay smashed at your feet? Sure, you could arrest her, but would you feel any better about your bad decision? In these situations, it is always first and foremost to ensure everyone's safety and take a good appraisal of the situation. The police attempted that very thing, but the mother continued to act irrationally. Had she calmed down and realized they were trying to help, maybe she would have been cradling the baby and going home instead of going to jail.

reply to post by Marked One


when i was giving birth to my second child, the nurse taught me accupressure to help me keep my mind off the pain. i was given pitocin (to accelerate and regulate the contractions) but the baby was turned the wrong way. so during each contraction, which were unnaturally hard contractions due to the pitocin, without pain medication, they had to reach up inside and turn the baby. i don't mind telling you, i was in such horrible pain, i would've ripped the head off a gundar if it was anywhere near my hands at the time.

like i said before, the operating manual for the ladies, should be different, because ladies are different, even the ones that try to or succeed in smacking ya across the chops.

I can tell the woman was ghetto-trash. And I'm happy to know she was treated in the right orderly manner--as just that; trash. Humane or not. And I stand by what I say. I've dealt with ghetto-trash before first-hand and I say with full confidence that they're not always friendly.

Originally posted by Marked One
I can tell the woman was ghetto-trash. And I'm happy to know she was treated in the right orderly manner--as just that; trash. Humane or not. And I stand by what I say. I've dealt with ghetto-trash before first-hand and I say with full confidence that they're not always friendly.

there's no such thing as ghetto trash. only human beings, with various problems.

learn, please.

something really weird is going on. it says on marked one's avatar box, that he was on ATS 13 minutes ago. yet he posted only 4 minutes before i did. how'd he post on ATS when he wasn't on ATS?

Maybe I'm old school, but I don't see the severity of this issue. We were left in the car for hours while our parents went shopping, hunting, or out farming, etc. Bunch of sensitive whiners you people are. Raise your own kids and stop supporting CPS in the way they raise them. So she went for a 10-20 minute tan??? So? Guess we should just beat the SH-- out of her......

Hell when I was 5 was left with my 6 month old brother while my parents went to feed calves (not saying it was the smartest thing on my parents part, but this world could toughen up a bit)! I love how they equate this with abandonment! LOL!!! Unbelievable. And maybe she attacked the officer because he was taking her daughter from her, which she has every right in my opinion.

Have any of you ever taken a nap while your baby was in the other room? Pretty much the same damn thing, guess you should be tasered and thrown in jail for negligence!

As George Carlin would say, "I am sick and tired of this 'child worship'".

reply to post by undo


His location says Chernobyl, maybe that has something to do with it!

reply to post by getreadyalready


I'm not from Ukraine. I'm from Texas.

reply to post by undo


Learn? Please. Spare me the liberal BS. I'm telling you I've dealt with these kinds of people before.

reply to post by gnosis111


We were left in the car as well. At age 7 and my brother at age 10 we stayed home a lot alone as well since both our parents worked. We also rode our bikes for miles, slept with our windows up and our doors unlocked, we went trick or treating in the street instead of the mall, we played hide and seek alone after the sun set, we even accepted candy from strangers at times.

Times have changed. Being left in the car is not emotionally damaging. It is dangerous. It is a risk in our times to do this. And IMHO a tan is not worth that risk. That is why we now have laws against that when back in our day we did not.

Originally posted by Marked One
reply to post by undo

 

Learn? Please. Spare me the liberal BS. I'm telling you I've dealt with these kinds of people before.

it isn't liberal BS. okay, here's where i am coming from. a friend and i were in detroit, on the outskirts, to be exact. i was visiting her. she was an adopted child. anyway, we decided to take a walk to the local hamburger joint and get a burger. we were both accustomed less populated neighborhoods and didn't think twice about walking to the restaurant. it wasn't quite dark when we left, but by the time we were almost there (could see the restaurant like a block away) it was dark. we noticed a white cadillac pulling up across the street from where we were walking, and 2 black guys hopped out.

they ran across the street, one in the distance in front of us, and one behind us. the one in front walked towards us, while the one behind, walked towards us as well. we discussed what we would do if this was going to be a problem.

finally we all met. instead of waiting for them to start the convo, i asked if either of them had a match. this seemed to diffuse the situation for a second, and one of them said sure, in exchange for a cigarette. so we gave them cigarettes and they gave us matches. then we said thanks and started to walk away. one of them was all happy, and started to walk away as well, but the other pulled out a gun and told us to give him our purses.

problem was, there was no money in them. lol just a couple quarters for hamburgers (it was one of those 15 cent hamburger places). i said sure, but told the guy there was really no money, just a tube of lipstick, cigarettes, some change, and some pocket lint. he took my purse and dumped it on the ground. the other guy, did the same to my friend. when there was no money to be had, we were inevitably knocked to the ground in attempt to drag us behind the apartment buildings along the sidewalk, presumably to rape us or something. my friend got away, and ran out into the busy street, jumping up and down, shouting for help.

suddenly, a car came to a stop and a huge black guy got out. in a booming voice he said "What's going on here!?" man you never saw 2 guys vanish so quick in your life.

the huge black guy gave us a ride home, safely, but not before lecturing us about the safety of walking down the side walk in detroit, after dark.

now i was a white chick, raised in a small town where bigotry was rampant. i could've easily been convinced by that event that black people in detroit, were "ghetto trash", had it not been for the other black guy, who lived in detroit as well. he taught me that regardless of where you live, regardless of your skin color, people are human beings at various stages of learning, with various problems. there's no such thing as human trash.

Originally posted by undo
btw, i thought it was the general concensus of ATS, that tasers were inhumane. a bit odd that it's suddenly okay to use on a young mom (even if she's not a shining example of motherhood, tasering and potentially killing her should not be an option.)

edit on 14-2-2011 by undo because: (no reason given)

Great point and yes, it does show how quickly the crusaders will turn the sword on you. Yeah, she was a negligent mom, but tazering was still out of line. Why do burly police officers need to taze a woman to arrest her? It doesn't seem to make sense unless you realize that they like to tazer people rather than restrain them the old fashioned way.