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Debt now equals total U.S. economy

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posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 01:54 PM
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Debt now equals total U.S. economy


www.washingtontimes.com

President Obama projects that the gross federal debt will top $15 trillion this year, officially equaling the size of the entire U.S. economy, and will jump to nearly $21 trillion in five years' time!
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 01:54 PM
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Helping people by government spending is an addiction worse than crack coc aine. Both parties are addicted and in serious denial, though one is sicker than the other. The root of the problem isn't the money; it's the "helping people" nonsense that the Left, though a clever combination of induced guilt and name-calling, has tricked the Right into adopting as its own philosophy. I see very little sign of anything changing.

www.washingtontimes.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 01:56 PM
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I posted this in another thread, but it seems applicable here. . . .

We're in a hole. A deep hole. A really, really, really deep hole. A hole so deep that if someone were to drop an acorn in the hole, by the time it landed, it would be an oak. But it would be an oak that went, "YAAAAAHHH" all the way down the hole.

And Obama wants us to dig deeper to get out of the hole.





posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:00 PM
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reply to post by Surfrat
 


Over 40% of than is Federal Reserve " FRAUDULANT Fiat funny money" and another 5% is owed US banks. Agian " FRAUDULANT Fiat funny money" 20% is owed to "foreign interest" no doubt a large percentag is foreign banks.

We do not really owe the money since it was created out of nothing under the color of the law.

ABOLISH the FED!



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:00 PM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


Many don't realize how deep we are in the doodoo. What did Obama propose 2 trillion in cuts over ten years? And the Repubs want 100 billion in cuts now. Its a drop in the bucket. The only way to even start is to turn social security into a welfare program and the evil rich get none. That will never happen though as too many votes riding on it and both sides are scared to even make a whisper about it. Obama is just kicking the can down the road like the rest but the can is getting too big to move anymore.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:03 PM
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If US was a company, then it would be bankrupt by now as it has negative equity. S*# t is going to hit the fan pretty soon....



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by Surfrat


Helping people by government spending is an addiction worse than crack coc aine.


IMHO helping people is not really the problem... its military industrial complex spending, coupled with borrowing money from banks rather than printing it. The US spends more than the next 14 highest military spenders combined.


THIS:

List of Countries by Military Expenditures

...is the clear issue.

The US could cut HALF-A-TRILLION dollars ($500,000,000,000) out of its budget tomorrow, if it simply matched the second highest military spender: China.

Sri Oracle
edit on 14-2-2011 by Sri Oracle because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by HoldTheBeans
reply to post by beezzer
 


Many don't realize how deep we are in the doodoo. What did Obama propose 2 trillion in cuts over ten years? And the Repubs want 100 billion in cuts now. Its a drop in the bucket. The only way to even start is to turn social security into a welfare program and the evil rich get none. That will never happen though as too many votes riding on it and both sides are scared to even make a whisper about it. Obama is just kicking the can down the road like the rest but the can is getting too big to move anymore.


We are scroomed. But! All is not lost. If we can avoid raising the debt ceiling (that hasn't happened yet, has it?) And make serious cuts, we might squeek through this.

If not, buy land, seeds, ammo, and secure a water supply.

edit on 14-2-2011 by beezzer because: because Johhny can't spel



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:10 PM
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I'm just about 100% sure that the USA isn't worried about it's debt because it knows it can't pay it back and also knows it want have to because they know for sure that something is going to happen world wide.Either something they make happen or nature makes happens....The U.S. can't stand this kind of debt and continue on....



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:13 PM
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We are scroomed. But! All is not lost. If we can avoid raising the debt ceiling (that hasn't happened yet, has it?) And make serious cuts, we might squeek through this.

If not, buy land, seeds, ammo, and secure a water supply.

edit on 14-2-2011 by beezzer because: because Johhny can't spel


I don't think that comes up till next month. They will have to raise the debt ceiling or go bankrupt. Interesting to see all the fed empoyees have to deal with what the rest of the population has had to recently with no job to go to. Spending is just ridiculous and now biden wants another 53 billion for hi speed rail and they're talking about another stimulous. There is so much money wasted its unbelievable.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by HoldTheBeans


We are scroomed. But! All is not lost. If we can avoid raising the debt ceiling (that hasn't happened yet, has it?) And make serious cuts, we might squeek through this.

If not, buy land, seeds, ammo, and secure a water supply.

edit on 14-2-2011 by beezzer because: because Johhny can't spel


I don't think that comes up till next month. They will have to raise the debt ceiling or go bankrupt. Interesting to see all the fed empoyees have to deal with what the rest of the population has had to recently with no job to go to. Spending is just ridiculous and now biden wants another 53 billion for hi speed rail and they're talking about another stimulous. There is so much money wasted its unbelievable.

Nero is fiddling while Rome burns. . . .
A very sad, second line.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:31 PM
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This little game from the NYT gives you an idea of how easy, or otherwise, it might be to get Federal spending back in surplus & start paying off some of that debt.

It's a bit of a laugh watching ppl try different approaches - here's how I did it



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:32 PM
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This is a good read on defaulting on the debt. I've pasted the conclusion of the article. Others will simply stop investing in government (bonds) which is being wasted on ridiculous things which in no way stimulate economic growth and start investing in private industry which will provide a return on their investments. Maybe defaulting on the debt will actually finally get rid of the federal reserve and put the money back into the hands of the people where it belongs. This article is from dec 2010 and notes that default normally doesn't occur unless debt/gdp reaches 100%. At the time it hadn't.


Conclusion. For as long as there have existed deep capital markets able to fund the needs of governments, there have been defaults on the debt raised by governments. During that time, investors have been compensated to varying degrees for the risks they've taken. Sadly, inflation in the post-Bretton Woods era has given governments another way to reduce their debts, and savers around the world have suffered, not to mention entrepreneurs and those eager to work for them. It should be stressed that devaluation is merely a more subtle form of default, and the U.S. has used it with great vigor over the last four decades. In contrast, government default in the traditional sense is not something we should fear. Governments can only spend what they've taxed or borrowed from the private sector first, so while default would surely singe investors reliant on steady income paid for on the backs of taxpayers, it would serve as a boost to the private economy thanks to investors starving the government in favor of growth-enhancing initiatives in the private sector. At this point U.S. politicians have shown no spending discipline no matter the party in power. In that case, if market discipline proves the only cure for the spending disease, then we should embrace a U.S. debt default without reservation.


Link



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:32 PM
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Airline travelers would pay more to help finance airport projects under President Barack Obama's budget plan.

The president's budget released Monday would raise the "passenger facility charge" to $7 from $4.50 per flight to offset cuts in airport grants.

Just because it's in the president's budget doesn't mean the increased facility charge will fly. Some Republicans with a hand in writing aviation laws have different ideas.

Airlines are also fighting the proposal, saying it amounts to a $2 billion tax increase on the flying public

news.yahoo.com...

But he said no new taxes on anyone making under 250,000 a year.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:41 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
This little game from the NYT gives you an idea of how easy, or otherwise, it might be to get Federal spending back in surplus & start paying off some of that debt.

It's a bit of a laugh watching ppl try different approaches - here's how I did it


Its quite obvious that social security and meidiacare are the two huge issues in the growing size of the budget deficit. Sadly politicians on both sides are scared to make any kind of suggestions for savings. Baby boomers will be hitting the rolls very quickly.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by beezzer

Airline travelers would pay more to help finance airport projects under President Barack Obama's budget plan.

The president's budget released Monday would raise the "passenger facility charge" to $7 from $4.50 per flight to offset cuts in airport grants.

Just because it's in the president's budget doesn't mean the increased facility charge will fly. Some Republicans with a hand in writing aviation laws have different ideas.

Airlines are also fighting the proposal, saying it amounts to a $2 billion tax increase on the flying public

news.yahoo.com...

But he said no new taxes on anyone making under 250,000 a year.




Who will these carbon taxes effect most when its passed down to the consumer? Folks heating bills will skyrocket when enacted. Then you got all these electric cars running around now. How are they recharged? Coal powered plants. Little guy gets hammered every which way he looks anymore with taxes here and there on everything from fed to state levels.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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AFAIK burning coal to generate electricity to power cars is still more efficient than running them straight off oil - and of course at least some of the power used its going to be from non-coal sources - wind power, for example, is likely to be under-used during the wee-small-hours, but would be available for charging electric vehicles overnight.



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 04:50 PM
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reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul
 





- wind power, for example, is likely to be under-used during the wee-small-hours, but would be available for charging electric vehicles overnight.


Wind power is a HOAX go nuclear instead. Safe Thorium to be exact.


WIND POWER FRAUD

Everyone believes alternative energies are the answer to all our power problems, with wind power leading the way. The truth is: Wind power is unsustainable and a total waste of resources.

... the utter uselessness of wind power, including how:

* Wind turbines rarely produce their advertised full power. On average, wind turbines only produce about 20% of their nameplate rating.

* Wind power is unreliable and undispatchable. When it is needed most, it will likely be unavailable to provide any power when it is needed most.

* Wind power is not clean. It takes a lot of dirty energy to make the materials, manufacture and install a wind turbine facility.

* Wind turbines are not environmentally friendly. They are noisy, unsightly, kill bats and birds, interfere with radars, and have been shown to be responsible for a slew of health problems.

* Wind turbines consume electricity whether operating or not. Often this power is not even metered. Care to guess who is paying the bill for this power?

* In theory, if 20% of US electric generation was replaced by wind power, the decrease in CO2 emissions would be an unnoticeable 0.00948%.

* In reality, wind power doesn't reduce CO2 emissions at all, because backup fossil power plants have to cycle wildly and inefficiently trying to keep up with erratic wind power output.

* Wind power will not replace fossil fired power plants. Germany estimates that by 2020 up to 96% of its wind power capacity will need to be backed up by new coal fired power plants.

* Wind power will not reduce US dependency on foreign oil. If wind power replaced 20% of US electric generation, the resulting decrease in oil imports would be a measly 0.292%.

* Wind turbines have an embarrassingly low Energy Returned On Energy Invested value of 0.29. The manufacture, installation and operation of wind power facilities will consume more than 3 times the energy they will ever produce.

Wind Power is Big Business. The big winners will be developers, land owners, brokerage houses, banks, manufacturers, governments, the "green" movement, environmentalists, researchers, academia, and the news media. The big losers will be the taxpayers and electric bill payers.




...About the Author: Charles S. Opalek is a registered Professional Engineer with a Bachelor of Science degree in Mechanical Engineering. He has been practicing engineering since 1965, and has been in private practice since 1987. Much of his background was in power generation. He is an active consulting engineer to architects, designing heating, ventilating, and air conditioning, plumbing and electrical systems for industrial, commercial and residential projects.

windpowerfraud.com...



posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 04:57 PM
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reply to post by Surfrat
 


It's damned close right now... Look for yourselves...

usdebtclock.org...

Your share of the US national debt now is nearly $130,000

It is all going to crash soon, and all anyone in Washington is worried about is collecting votes for their own elections or for their party's candidates... In the end they will all blame the other party and the president.

Have you thought about how YOU will survive this?




posted on Feb, 14 2011 @ 05:01 PM
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reply to post by crimvelvet
 



Ah...right....silly me ...I should have realised that there is no actual "up" side to wind power at all and it's all just part of the military-industrial complex ripping off the taxpayer.......


by all means substitute any othe kind of electrical generation you like - including nuclear - which I am personally fine with - my point was "simply" that wind power gets generated at times when it is inconvenient to actually use it.....which is, I think, one of the points you quoted....so you are agreeing with me
....and that ustilising such generation would be a good thing, since hte wind farms are there already.

Or do you think that is not a good thing?



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