It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by illuminatuscadabra
Complete and utter delusional madness. You shall not prevail.
If you only knew, the amount of true dissociation from that which you speak, you actually are.
The breadth of your irrational venerability would enlighten you to the fact that amongst those who are them, are your true enemy, and that you fine sir have undoubtedly fallen at the feet of those with hooves.
To stand upon an idea which at the base is confusion. Is like dancing to a George W. Bush speech.
" Listen not to a man who rides in on another mans coattails". me
Originally posted by illuminatuscadabra
Complete and utter delusional madness. You shall not prevail.
Originally posted by emsed1
I don't think I've seen you at any of the meetings or hanging around the bunker.
National Socialism –noun the principles and practices of the Nazi party in Germany.
fascism (ˈfæʃɪzəm) [Click for IPA pronunciation guide] —n 1. any ideology or movement inspired by Italian Fascism, such as German National Socialism; any right-wing nationalist ideology or movement with an authoritarian and hierarchical structure that is fundamentally opposed to democracy and liberalism 2. any ideology, movement, programme, tendency, etc, that may be characterized as right-wing, chauvinist, authoritarian, etc 3. prejudice in relation to the subject specified: body fascism
Not only do you suffer from religous psychosis, but you seek to spread your mind virus to others, much like some Hollywood zombie movie; you are not content to be infected yourself, but you seek to spread your mind virus to others; this is part of the "Trolls for Jesus" Internet phenomenon which I and many others of my ilk are attempting to combat; unfortunately your disease is both lethal and genocidal, and I suspect that eventually the only "cure" will also be that of genocide.
Originally posted by network dude
reply to post by Lucifer777
I almost wrote a thread on Blasphemy, as seen in the eyes of a zealot.
. But upon further discussion, one might find out that your beliefs may not be all that different than other religious beliefs.
Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by Lucifer777
You know, it is rather easy to make apologies for the idealists of the 18th and 19th centuries (Marx, Weisshaupt, Nietzche) because they had very nice intentions. However, and I hope you will forgive me for using the old addage, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions". As Ya'hshuah (Jesus) said "you will know them by their fruit" and the fruit of these idealists is not in their fancy, benevolent sounding manifestos but in the genocidal implementation of their ideals
However, and I hope you will forgive me for.......
One can easily trace Illuminist philosophy to the French Revolution and resulting Reign of Terror. It is also not too much of a stretch to link Illuminism to Communism, Socialism, and National Socialism, because they were all founded on similar ideals and from similar sources.
Illuminism has evolved, or if it was truly stamped out in the 18th century, has most certainly influenced the splintered progressive, utopian philosophies of Communism, Socialism, and National Socialism. These three camps of progressives have been attempting global domination for the past hundred years. The Socialist camp has been operating in incremental stages under formerly capitalist nations in Europe (look up Fabian Socialists) and the United States.
The Communist camp has largely failed since the collapse of the Soviet Union and their blunt, conspicuous modus operandi, but enjoys moderate popularity in Central America (which is the only place where it is truly implemented, I'll get to China in a bit).
National Socialism, which is generally thought to be a dormant progressive camp, has learned subtlety from the Fabians and effective implementation from the Communists while eschewing it's formerly communistic bluntness and the ineffective "use of the system" by the Fabians. You say that most people believe that the NWO is a Capitalist police state? Not so, most people believe it to be a communist or progressive movement, however I believe the future is a Fascist Illuminist state. Everyone thinks that National Socialism has disappeared since WWII, which is so obviously untrue if you actually understand how Fascist countries operated, a fact that is blatantly covered up by loaded language.
National Socialism –noun the principles and practices of the Nazi party in Germany.
. It is ultra-nationalistic Socialism that allows some private property, but all industry and business is controlled by a very centralized power. Sound familiar? Yup, that would be China, which is not Communist in the least anymore.
Meanwhile here in America, we hear all about this great State Capitalism (see what they did there?) that's working so well for China, while the not-so-subtle message that "China is the future" is bashed over our heads. If you believe America to be a truly capitalist country, you are also wrong. The centralized government regulates everything and in case you hadn't noticed, is pretty nationalistic. It's not all the way there, but the Socialists and TPTB in our country are moving us in that direction.
So now that we know the NWO future, we know two things 1. it is not capitalist 2. of the three camps bent on world domination, it looks like Fascism is going to win.
Now, back to Weisshaupt and a major mistake you made. Weisshaupt believed that the Empires of the World ran on a five stage life cycle of chaos, discord, confusion, bureaucracy, and aftermath. He believed that by infiltrating the existing establishment or starting a revolution and implementing his strategy, he could break this cycle and establish a global rule of enlightened, benevolent kings/rulers who would rule forever if they kept his stratagem.
Never in the history of Illuminist or post-Illuminist thought have these ideals been implemented in a "stateless" manner and have been notoriously genocidal.
You can make all the apologies you want, but in the end you are just playing devil's advocate (which, judging from your name is your favorite activity.
Weisshaupt's roots look nice on paper, but the followers of this and similar ideals learned long ago that this type of society can only be forced on the general public by a centralized state. So, I would venture to say with most certainty that Weisshaupts fruit is moldy and will give you a lethal infection of E. Coli.
I think your ideals are impossible, destructive, and dishonest. I've even caught bits of genocidal rhetoric in your Christian bashing thread:
Not only do you suffer from religous psychosis, but you seek to spread your mind virus to others, much like some Hollywood zombie movie; you are not content to be infected yourself, but you seek to spread your mind virus to others; this is part of the "Trolls for Jesus" Internet phenomenon which I and many others of my ilk are attempting to combat; unfortunately your disease is both lethal and genocidal, and I suspect that eventually the only "cure" will also be that of genocide.
You are a tremendous hypocrite. You get up on your moral high horse as a tactical feint to discredit Christianity and objective morality,
then turn around and make apologies for amoralists like Weisshaupt and Crowley.
You pick ambiguous aspects of the religion of Abraham (Judeo-Christian, I am not an Islamic apologist) as a means to discredit it and ignore the moral principals at it's core.
Meanwhile the Thelemic philosophy you hold so dear has "Do what thou wilt shalt be the whole of law" at it's core. This is total moral relitivism in which power and hedonism are exalted and altruism and objective morality are debased. Oh, and don't give me that "Love is the law, love under will" crap, "love" does not have a universal meaning. You will find tremendous differences between the altruistic love of Ya'hshuah's sermons and Paul's epistles and Crowley's concept of "love" (passion).
You even go so far as calling Ya'hshuah a religious dictator as though being under the rule of an all-loving God is a bad thing.
Democracy fails when the moral majority is wicked and a Monarchy prevails when the Monarch is good and vice versa. If God is omni-benevolent and is the whole reason why you exist, why not serve him? If you take issue with a being that is all-good then you are on the wrong side.
As for the Masons in this thread... I am at a loss for words. You realize that you just came in on the side of Illuminism, moral relitivism, Thelema, globalism, anti-Christianity, and above all a guy who identifies with Lucifer? Isn't this the kind of stuff you guys have been trying to distance yourselves from?
Originally posted by illuminatuscadabra
Complete and utter delusional madness. You shall not prevail.
If you only knew, the amount of true dissociation from that which you speak, you actually are.
The breadth of your irrational venerability would enlighten you to the fact that amongst those who are them, are your true enemy, and that you fine sir have undoubtedly fallen at the feet of those with hooves.
To stand upon an idea which at the base is confusion. Is like dancing to a George W. Bush speech.
" Listen not to a man who rides in on another mans coattails". me
Originally posted by korathin
reply to post by kallisti36
You have to go back to Psychology 101.
These people that want a communist, all powerful central government tend to be sociopaths.
If you have to understand these last 200 hundred years normal/empathic people marginalized, criminalized and effectively broken the chains of slavery that the sociopaths had fastened on humanity for thousands of years.
Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by korathin
So they were sociopaths who implemented Illuminist philosophy with their own innovations. How is this relavent?
Thomas Jefferson on Adam Weishaupt
Wishaupt [sic] seems to be an enthusiastic Philanthropist. He is among those (as you know the excellent [Richard] Price and [Joseph] Priestley also are) who believe in the indefinite perfectibility of man. He thinks he may in time be rendered so perfect that he will be able to govern himself in every circumstance so as to injure none, to do all the good he can, to leave government no occasion to exercise their powers over him, & of course to render political government useless....
.... Wishaupt [sic] lived under the tyranny of a despot & priests, he knew that caution was necessary even in spreading information, & the principles of pure morality. He proposed therefore to lead the Free masons to adopt this object & to make the objects of their institution the diffusion of science & virtue. He proposed to initiate new members into his body by gradations proportioned to his fears of the thunderbolts of tyranny. This has given an air of mystery to his views, was the foundation of his banishment, the subversion of the masonic order, & is the colour for the ravings against him of Robinson, Barruel & Morse, whose real fears are that the craft would be endangered by the spreading of information, reason, & natural morality among men. This subject being new to me, I have imagined that if it be so to you also, you may receive the same satisfaction in seeing, which I have had in forming the analysis of it: & I believe you will think with me that if Wishaupt [sic] had written here (i.e., in America), where no secrecy is necessary in our endeavors to render men wise & virtuous, he would not have thought of any secret machinery for that purpose."
Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by Lateralussicksicksick
I have read his OP and I know all about the benign intent of the Illuminati. I was pointing out that their philosophy requires world domination and once it was put into practice it got real ugly, real quick. I'm not going off on a conspiracy tangent about reptilians, so you can put away your appeal to ridicule, thank you
I've pointed out that nice intent doesn't mean anything and some of the worst dictators in the history of the world thought they were doing the right thing. Hitler was positive up until the end that what he was doing was right for Germany. "You will know them by their fruits" and Illuminist fruit is rotten.