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Whats happening to our forum?

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posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 04:48 PM
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Simple question really , but I guess there will be more flaming than attempts to answer it .
First off I believe that UFO's exist , I also believe that SOME UFO's are the craft of Extraterrestrial or maybe even Extra-dimensional beings , so I am not a skeptic or debunker .

Now that's out the way on to the point , over the last few months there seems to have been an influx of members who hold such a firm belief in all things UFO related that any attempt to give a logical explanation for the latest "OMG it's a UFO" video is met with allegations of being a dis-info agent or even hostility .
I have also noticed the loss of some good contributors to this forum , which I feel is due to the hostility that some members display when their view is challenged .

I am not having a go at newer members , they are the life blood of any forum , but what I would ask is that people don't just accept something as 100% proof of aliens without asking questions of what is presented , or listening to the opinions of other members , after all we're all searching for the same thing .

I think this is a great forum , but I fear that if we can't be civilized with people who hold a counter view to our own we risk turning this board into a believers love in , and what would be the point of that .
Belief is good but blind faith helps no one




posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 04:53 PM
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Well said Sir!
And to put it another way as someone said "It's good to have an open mind, but not so open that your brain falls out!"



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:05 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


Divide us... then conquer us, seems outrageous, happens to work.

Reptilian brain is reactionary and always defensive and/or on the attack.
Higher brain function & reasoning takes a few moments to ponder all the information, then forms an independent thought based on all the neutral facts presented.
Anyone not within this method of thinking isn't doing anything progressive or construction, best way to handle that is to ignore them all.

~ Please Do Not Feed The Darkside ~



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:09 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


It's a common problem for many to believe everything they see, read, or hear. A lot of forums have become ridiculous due to that. Finding a logical reason for these sightings should be the focus of anyone who wants the truth. There are things that defy logic, which places those sort of things into the "unexplained" catagory which warrants further surveillance of events and information gathering being placed on the witnesses. Those who see events of unexplained phenomena need to keep their composure about them, and set out to try to document as much information as they can. Then, perhaps when it reaches these forums the members can discuss the events instead of having so many "duh" moments.

Viva la ATS!



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:10 PM
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As a newer member I can't really offer you much hope other than to say that I agree with you, I came to the forums looking for a place where intelligent discussion was held regarding UFO sightings, photographs and videos but so far all I've seen is massive arguments over one image and almost zero debate on others...

I've seen many a thread that's been beaten to death while others have gone unnoticed, I've put this down to a lack of open mindedness, some people set their camp in one field or another and never the twain shall meet.

I have to add that it doesn't help that there are so many threads which contain totally indecipherable videos of a light in the sky which could be anything, the threads I mean are the ones that contain a light in the sky for maybe 3 mins at most and no reference points and no daytime shots of the same image.



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:10 PM
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Originally posted by gortex
Simple question really , but I guess there will be more flaming than attempts to answer it .
First off I believe that UFO's exist , I also believe that SOME UFO's are the craft of Extraterrestrial or maybe even Extra-dimensional beings , so I am not a skeptic or debunker .

Now that's out the way on to the point , over the last few months there seems to have been an influx of members who hold such a firm belief in all things UFO related that any attempt to give a logical explanation for the latest "OMG it's a UFO" video is met with allegations of being a dis-info agent or even hostility .
I have also noticed the loss of some good contributors to this forum , which I feel is due to the hostility that some members display when their view is challenged .

I am not having a go at newer members , they are the life blood of any forum , but what I would ask is that people don't just accept something as 100% proof of aliens without asking questions of what is presented , or listening to the opinions of other members , after all we're all searching for the same thing .

I think this is a great forum , but I fear that if we can't be civilized with people who hold a counter view to our own we risk turning this board into a believers love in , and what would be the point of that .
Belief is good but blind faith helps no one


I agree with most of what you have said however there is a flip side to your post.

You basically said that the UFO/ET believers are the trouble makers on this forum which I disagree. I have seen more attacks on believers by debunkers.

There are several members on this forum who do not believe in UFOs and ETs which is possible due to their work, their religion etc. And it appears they have no intention of believing in UFOs and ETs so the question must be asked, why are they frequenting the Alien and UFO forum?

The Jerusalem UFO threads are prime examples of personal attacks by debunkers because some do not agree with them.

Which leads me on to the two negative points about this forum. Firstly is the personal attacks on members just because they disagree with their opinion. And secondly is the lack of action taken by some mods and owners for personal attacks, which goes against their own rules. Its as if to say 'oh you can call him/her names because I disagree with them'.

A forum is for debate, learning and sharing our beliefs and opinions. We all have our own beliefs and opinions. Unfortunately not everyone sees it that way.



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:10 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


I think you have two types of ufo believers though tbf

you have the faith believers who just know they are real and will believe it if it fits there own personal criteria

then there is the analyticals who also believe but are more scientific in there approach and aren't easily swayed without valid reasoning

neither is particularly wrong, just two different sides of the same coin and both are essential to each other
edit on 12/2/2011 by constant_thought because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:13 PM
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Originally posted by gortex
I think this is a great forum , but I fear that if we can't be civilized with people who hold a counter view to our own we risk turning this board into a believers love in , and what would be the point of that .


Hi gortex,

I thought it worth reinforcing your comments by posting a link to the following sticky thread at the top of the UFO & Aliens Forum here on ATS:

Civility, decorum and the Aliens and UFO Forum


Originally posted by neformore
Sadly, the staff have noticed that recently claims of the unusual are being met with scorn, overt sarcasm, hostility and personal attacks

Such methods are not the ATS way. ATS is all about civility. ATS is about denying ignorance, not promoting it.

Sarcasm, scorn, hostility and personal attacks are the tools of the socially inept. They are not welcome on ATS. ATS is not the comments section of Youtube.

If you feel the need to belittle people then frankly you are better off elsewhere.

Not everything is a hoax - people do see genuinely unusual things in the sky that they cannot explain. Sometimes it may be a case of mistaken identity - if so then education on a subject matter will help. Sometimes what is seen is so baffling it defies explanation.

Yes, we are all aware that there are hoaxers and charlatans out there who want to grab attention and maybe make a quick buck off the back of their claims. BUT - and its an important but - by making a hostile environment for people to post in the genuine and unusual cases may get lost, as people will most likely not post them for fear of derision.

This is not a new message - this is the cornerstone of ATS. Rational, civil discussion. Debate backed up with sources and information. If you suspect a hoax, prove its a hoax in a civil manner, with relevant information as to why you think it is.

Debate the post and not the poster

If you make a case for a hoax that the staff agrees with, the thread will be moved to the Hoax forum.



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:15 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


some people want tobelieve. they want every ufo video to be the proof they are waiting for. it seems that they believe if they find one video that cant be debunked it means all the others were real too, even though they were debunked. many times it does seem that they want to believe sooo much that when someone comes on and points how it could be a fake, they think that it is so important that the mib has gotten onto ats to specifically attack them when they are just being gullible

in two years if we are still functioning as a coutry cgi will be indistinguishable from real life unless you are trained to use it.
imagine the mindless followers a "ufo" poster will have then. if you think it is hard to get people to think for themselves now....i dont want to think about that



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:29 PM
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Ive come to see there are apparent hostilities...(in a well-meaning way) of folks here at times expressing their opinions. Not all by any means, but some definitely want to argue. Ive come to see that its perfectly fine because all thoughts and opinions should never be stifled or censored.

Initially I was kinda thrown off by those folks. Still, its supposed to be that way, and Im more comfortable understanding some have their opinions and beliefs and versions of reality just like you do...and me. And its all ok, you know? Its what makes ATS what it is.

You can comment or report on just about anything. Wait...no. You can report on EVERYTHING. And thats what makes this place what it is. And Im glad we can discuss, disagree, inform, learn and even un-learn...from friends and arguers alike. This is what we are all here for: Information..and ideas. Sometime contrary to our own...but never-the-less...the reason we even are members....



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:39 PM
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Ufology has turned into a sudo-religious entity. The lack of proof means nothing and any attempts to critique a picture or video results in argument.

The sudo-religion has even produced its own version of Armageddon with 'DISCLOSURE'
edit on 12-2-2011 by Versa because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:43 PM
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Posted by planetzog
The Jerusalem UFO threads are prime examples of personal attacks by debunkers because some do not agree with them.

I think that thread was a prime example , there was way too much mud slinging on both sides .
Maybe fatigue played a part as some members did seem to spend a lot of time on that one




Posted by Versa
I've seen many a thread that's been beaten to death while others have gone unnoticed, I've put this down to a lack of open mindedness, some people set their camp in one field or another and never the twain shall meet.

Agreed

It seems it's easier to get into a thread that's just a youtube video than an in-depth piece of research
edit on 12-2-2011 by gortex because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:49 PM
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There seems to be a growing trend of people being allowed to ridicule OP's without any reprisals.
These people offer no arguments to support their rebuffs , just bold as brass ridicule and this has got to stop .


Regards



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:51 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


Would you say the quality of content in the A&U forum has changed over the last 6 months? In my opinion this place is going down the toilet - fast.



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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Originally posted by cripmeister
reply to post by gortex
 


Would you say the quality of content in the A&U forum has changed over the last 6 months? In my opinion this place is going down the toilet - fast.


As I said in the reply above it seems that quick hit posts of youtube video's with a brief descriptions seem to be popular at the moment , a reflection of our short attention span society ?...... maybe .



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by gortex

Originally posted by cripmeister
reply to post by gortex
 


Would you say the quality of content in the A&U forum has changed over the last 6 months? In my opinion this place is going down the toilet - fast.


As I said in the reply above it seems that quick hit posts of youtube video's with a brief descriptions seem to be popular at the moment , a reflection of our short attention span society ?...... maybe .


Or people desperate to find the next big thing and collect those precious stars and flags?



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 06:27 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 
Friend, it is indeed a simple question you pose, but there is no simple answer... many want to believe so intensely and passionately that oft times passion over-rides logical thought; this in turn leads to attack and counters that are not driven by well thought out reasoning but by the heat of emotion...

It is all a part of becoming awake and more aware, the dawning realization for most that there is, indeed, far more to research and explore than the standard issue information plugged into each in school or university...

on the flip side, many do not put much thought into caustic or belittling debunking posts, and at times come across as being very obnoxious and at times downright anal...

for those stating the mods or the three amigos allow certain things to slide, I suggest you consider and contemplate just how many threads are active at any given moment, how many staff are available at any time to police the at times literally thousands of posts; i also suggest you follow the protocol posted repeatedly By SO, Springer, and the staff to help them out by alerting them to any that violate the T&C...

We all should use due process in our research and document anything that substantiates or helps to clear up our stated point of view or conclusions...

Good thread, my friend, excellent food for thought.





seeker



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 06:47 PM
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reply to post by gortex
 


I agree with what you said 100%. I had to leave for awhile because it was basically became an ignorant hangout. Every single time someone posts a rational thought or an educated statement they were met with attacks. So much for Deny Ignorance.



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 06:58 PM
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Well you inspired me to revisit the past, so that I may become a better presenter of ideas. I just made a thread to celebrate some of our veteran members and the outstanding ufo threads they created.
Stop on by for a visit: HERE
I think simple threads will remain welcome, just to get a glimpse of something new maybe, but AT THE SAME TIME, I hope some members take it upon themselves to dig in, and bring there findings onboard.
We can't all be scholarly in our presentations, but more than 2 sentences should be mandatory!


Peace,
spec



posted on Feb, 12 2011 @ 07:18 PM
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Look no matter what side of the fence you are on we all sort of like new crap. 99.9999% however turns out to be crap.
But still we look at it, because it's embedded in our human DNA.
How we interpret things is individual.
and next and most important is when to let sleeping dogs lye.
and that is up to the debunker, skeptic or believer that is still in touch with normalcy.
The far out one's stationed on Pluto that believe anything and everything. They are doing their part.
They are consistent and predictable.
now If you aren't in the 100% everything is ET line then why argue?
If you think a case has no merit then say it once and move on.
But too many times a debunker or a skeptic wants to prove his case as much as the 100% believer
so the merry go round spins.

100% believers way is to convince everyone ET is 100% real and will not stop at any cost.
There goal in life is to say I told you so.
If you keep on listening you feed them. If you state your case once or just plan not even respond their case is dead and the thread dies. Because their mission is to convince because they are already convinced.



for the one's that leave the forum so be it, like everything life goes on.
If they decide to return if and when they get rejuvenated they will come back.



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