Mubarak stepping down tonight/transfers power didn't step down/Steps down Feb 11,

reply to post by kroms33

What ever the Egyptains do - why should you, or even I have any input into it? It is their country, they are autonomous are they not?

Agreed...which is why I'm not telling them they should march on the Palace...or other non-sense. Plus, none of what is said here matters anyway...no one care what a few people on ATS says.


Doesn't mean I still don't think the people on here that THINK they know what is best for the Egyptians are trying to live vicariously through them.

Originally posted by lestweforget
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I starred your previous post cause i agree in principle, but isnt America a republic?

America is the world's oldest Constitutional Republic, where the rights of the minority are protected by the constitution. The majority cannot overrun the minority. Civil rights and freedoms are constitutionally protected.

Originally posted by worlds_away
reply to post by MindSpin

 

I’m sorry, but I see Egyptians doing that all on their own... And I support them.

You can disagree if you like, I’m not going to argue with you, or an Egyptian on this matter.

edit on 10-2-2011 by worlds_away because: (no reason given)

That is fine...you are free to support whatever you like.

But will you still support that action if they get shot down by the hundreds?

In the future...will you think the best course of action is for a group of unarmed protestors to force the hand of an armed military? Or would you rather urge them to use caution...even if their plan is to "storm the castle"???

reply to post by MindSpin


Now you want me to tell them what to do?

I am thoroughly confused....

Obama makes 2nd statement
wireupdate.com...

Obama: "to many Egyptians remain unconvinced" govt serious about "genuine transition to democracy", responsibility of govt to speak clearly

Obama urges the Egyptian government "to spell out in clear and unambiguous language the step by step process that will lead to democracy"

President Obama says "Egypt has changed, and its future is in the hands of the people."

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by Skewed

 

Well lets just play out an possible scenario here. Let's say I a mad dictator took power over the Egyptian country in the absence of leadership, or even better yet. Let's say that I am a member of the Muslim Brotherhood who have there own supporters in Muslim extremists that are similar to the Taliban and usually armed.

Either scenario works. So say I take power and the military comes in and says we are not loyal to you and will not support you. I shoot the guy in the head, or have my cronies hold him down and behead him. I continue this method after awhile people will stop wanting to die and they will begin to be loyal. Eventually I will weed out the non-loyal and then next I have a loyal army on my side.

Now I am not saying it would play out exactly like that but it could happen and fear does funny things to people even those that are "Men"

From what you have seen of the Egyptian people, do you think they are afraid, sure they do have fear, but it is not stopping them, it is empowering them. But first, do you think you would have enough cronies to defeat the established Egyptian army versus your extremists with less than adequate training? Your cronies would be no match for the Egyptian army.

Originally posted by Skewed

Originally posted by lestweforget
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I starred your previous post cause i agree in principle, but isnt America a republic?

No, it is not, but that is what our founding fathers had in mind though.

Not true. Our Constitution states we are a "Republic". The terminology began to change during the FDR years, but the fact of the matter is the Constitution guarantees the citizens a "Republican form of government". The fact that we have a Constitution makes us a Constitutional Republic.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


I understand what our Constitution says, but in reality that is not the case, if you compare the way our government works compared to what a republic is, you will see the difference. Our government picks and chooses which pieces of the Constitution they want to adhere to. A lot of times, to our government, our Constitution is also just words on a piece of paper.

reply to post by Skewed


The Egyptian Army couldn't even successfully invade Israel with 2 Allies, and that is about all I have to say on that one.

Secondly have you even looked at the war on terror in Afghanistan? The Taliban is exactly the kind of Islamic fundamentalists that could easily take over a country. It took our military to drive them out and we are still fighting them, so yes I do think it is possible.

I am not saying the Egyptians are not doing the right thing by fighting for there rights. I actually fully support there revolution. I am just saying that it is dangerous territory to demand your government step down without having someone to take there place. Even in the Revolutionary War in America we had a power system pre-ordained.

Originally posted by Skewed
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I understand what our Constitution says, but in reality that is not the case, if you compare the way our government works compared to what a republic is, you will see the difference. Our government picks and chooses which pieces of the Constitution they want to adhere to. A lot of times, to our government, our Constitution is also just words on a piece of paper.

So if you see a speed limit on the highway that says 70 mph and everyone is going 90 does that mean the speed limit automatically becomes 90? No, because people call us a Democracy doesn't change the Constitution which plainly states we the people are guaranteed a Republic.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Skewed
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

I understand what our Constitution says, but in reality that is not the case, if you compare the way our government works compared to what a republic is, you will see the difference. Our government picks and chooses which pieces of the Constitution they want to adhere to. A lot of times, to our government, our Constitution is also just words on a piece of paper.

So if you see a speed limit on the highway that says 70 mph and everyone is going 90 does that mean the speed limit automatically becomes 90? No, because people call us a Democracy doesn't change the Constitution which plainly states we the people are guaranteed a Republic.

We are also guaranteed no taxation without representation also.

Mubarak didn't transfer power. He transferred the presidency which means nothing in a dictatorship. Earlier today he was both the president and the dictator, now hes just the dictator.. The president can't change anything significant without his consultation.

reply to post by Skewed

We are also guaranteed no taxation without representation also.

You do have representation...they are called Representatives (ironically) and Senators.

You elect them...the represent you...that is how a REPUBLIC works.

Has anyone seen this?

Latest reports from Egypt in light of the deteriorating security situation after the shocking revelations from President Mubarak:
* Coup against Mubarak and Suleiman eminent
* US Embassy in Cairo to be targeted
* El Baradei calls out to army for support “save Egypt
* Crowds are moving on the Presidential Palace. Gunfire has erupted. Among the crowds are members of organized paramilitary units. Something is going on, something more than a public response.
* President Obama has expressed shock to his close advisors, in the belief that Mubaraks attempts to retain power will result in large scale violence.
* Embassies, particularly those of Egypt’s neighbors, are evacuating.
* The power struggle between Vice President Suleiman and Defense Minister Tantawi, with Suleiman backed by Israel, is likely to turn bloody.

Reports received from senior intelligence officials in the Middle East indicate that President Mubarak of Egypt will leave the country within 48 hours though he just denied this in an announcement. We can wait and see. Indications are that he has been packing and saying his “goodbyes.” Diplomats from embassies throughout the region have been notified as has the United States, Israel and Russia. It is said, that Mubarak will claim to be suffering from an illness requiring medical care. We are told that “care” will be given in Germany.

www.veteranstoday.com...

Hopefully this will spread to Saudi Arabia! Oil at 300 $ a barrel is just what the NWO needs right now. YAY! We're all gonna die.

reply to post by Flatfish


It will take a Team of Wild Horses to drag him out of there.
There is only one way to end this, but somebody in Egypt must have a Bullet.

Second thought, their going to need to Bullets, only then will the White House not be able to Influence the Government.

This is what I've managed to find out......

Mubarak won't resign but is now powerless; Supreme Military Court IS very much in charge.

The military chiefs are not all in agreement as to how a transitional authority is best played out and is buying more time; possibly between after Friday prayers and Monday morning.

There is also disagreement between Egypt's homeland security forces and military forces and are still deliberating.

Mubarak's speech was pre-recorded but Suleiman's was'nt.

The Military chiefs are now weighing their options.

reply to post by Flatfish

From one US supported dictator, Mubarak, to another, the Muslim Brotherhood...

TPTB have decided that the Middle East is never allowed to be free. The West has waged constant war in that region beginning as far back as 1953 with Operation Ajax and in the process is creating generation after generation of people who hate and resentment us.

Brotherhood collaboration with Western intelligence continued with an alliance between the Brotherhood and the CIA that began around 1955. The power elite officially endorsed the Muslim Brotherhood in May of 1979 at the Bilderberg meeting held in Austria (Engdahl 171).

www.conspiracyarchive.com...

Miles Axe Copeland, Jr. -a prominent U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) operative who was one of the founding members of the Office of Strategic Services (OSS) under William Donovan- divulges the confessions of numerous members of the Muslim brotherhood that the organization had been thoroughly penetrated, at the top, by the British, American, French and Soviet intelligence services, any one of which could either make active use of it or blow it up, whichever best suited its purposes.

en.wikipedia.org...

This is great news !!!

Elections are far cheaper to buy than dictators.

Yeah democracy!

reply to post by SeeingBlue


Haven't seen any reports on twitter about gunfire by the palace. And there are some people there.

There have been reports of gun fights in the border town by Gaza. (starts with an R)

Some of that other stuff seems legit and has happened.