MUFON Director's being replaced...Why?

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posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 01:10 PM
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I have listened to the Jerry Pippin Show for sometime now, and have relished in some of the articulate and in-depth conversations that have taken place. Last Winter there was an incident that had taken place where rumor had it that the US Government might be over throwing the current higher places of people in office of the MUFON program, Low and behold, seems as if this may be a factual assumption by the PTB. Jerry's last interview's were subject to this "Over throwing the MUFON Expert's" that have had been placed in their offices for as long as 40+ years, Now they are doing this with the explanation from such "Star Groups" as nothing more than an improvement for the preexisting MUFON organization!
I have heard the entirety of the three interviews that were held this past week, and it is spooky how it seems more covert other than transparent by way of how they will "Resume Business as usual" with more strict and possible cover-ups to be expanded on.


Disenchantment with the world's number one UFO investigation unit. Some State Directors are changed, Allegations that US Government may be causing "dirty tricks." to listen to our interview with former International Director James Carrion. He tells details of agreement for investigations between Robert Bigelow and MUFON and hints at possible government attempts at infiltration of the organization. This program tells how MUFON works from the inside and discusses personalities involved.


Jerry Pippins Interviews in full

During the interviews, there were caller's that seemed to be in the "Know" and try to explain away as this event was nothing more than an "Improvement" for the current number one UFO researcher's and Reporter's. Guess the reason why I bring this to our attention is of all the possible implications this could have with the MUFON organization as a whole without very much public disclosure? Why would this be a good thing? I understand that when a UFO report has to be investigated, it is better left unsaid before the investigation is completed, even Leslie Varnicle, 40+ year veteran agrees with these ideologies of the importance of properly investigating UFO report's before they are made to be public, but it seems as if there was a mole of sort's to thwart the image of the current heads of office to be able to take further control of UFO sighting's and the like and release of pertinent UFO sighting's for open discussion's.
So, "Is this a possible over throw for cover up to public awareness or is it something that actually has to take place to better the current procedure of the existing program?"
The money talk is another issue, whether there is any factually based truth to there being any kind of embezzling charges that are tangible, I would beg to differ, but when the rubber hits the road, so too speak, it would actually make really no difference whether they used the annual financing to it's limits, or as the case currently is, which they actually only used approximately half of the monies granted them for such UFO research opportunities. I truly feel that one should be rewarded for their attempt's to only investigate the most intriguing and tangible cases, saving both the investor's and the public from financial and eluding facts of such cases.
They have already cut the finances for MUFON by half because of the "Truthful" acknowledgments of the current heads of offices for MUFON, so why not readjust the future financial availability, leaving what they currently have in the bank, if there should ever be such a need for such a financial circumstance?
Guess it makes no sense to me. There are enough thing's that are taking place by way of big Government interferences, the MUFON program should remain as a public domain that can be accessed by personal request or report for that matter..
If I am wrong about these influences by a rather hostile take over by new blood initiations for the MUFON program, and we are left to believe it is all for the greater good of the program, then why take such experienced and field tested individuals out of the picture totally?
I don't know what else to say...
After hearing the interviews, please post your thoughts....But listen to the interviews first, this way you will be able to listen for yourselves of how this action seems to go deeper than just an improvement, or so they say....
What do you guy's think?




posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:04 PM
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Hal Puthoff's name pops up a lot in my research. Hal Puthoff was part of the Aviary...he was the Owl. Jacque Vallee was the Partridge

Robert Bigelow - through NIDS - also bought the 'Skinwalker Ranch' in Utah

Hal Puthoff works for Robert as was recently shown here at ATS

Look in search many threads on all this

I consider Hal Puthoff to be my 'Smoking Man" because where ever I look he is always there...

Smoking man



Hal Puthoff



I would say Dang good casting job


What person currently is controlling the alien situation?
www.abovetopsecret.com...


As I recall, did he not appear at Pegasus group at yahoo? I seem to remember Matyas telling me he stopped by. Not sure if you were there then. I will have to go through the archives



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:07 PM
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MUFON used to jave a great website... no nonsense full of real data

Seen it lately?

www.mufon.com...

:shk:

There will be no Disclosure
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This post...
www.abovetopsecret.com...

It seems that the lid is about to be screwed on very tight again



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:09 PM
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Can we find a quote from Dan Akroyd on this? He's pretty honest about his position.
Could be interesting how he responds. I know he's not the leader of the Canadien Mufon,just a member.
But still..
www.unexplained-mysteries.com...



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:10 PM
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Which way Zargon? Too break it apart as a creidible reporting adgency? With documentation?
Or to make it more credible... sorry...confused.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:17 PM
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I was a member of Mufon for many years in the Walt Andrus years. I remember talking to Walt and encouraging him to put up a web site. He begged off because he was too busy. Obviously Mufon has changed since those days, but the underlying structure remains the same, a rather rigid one with a heirarchy of directors and agents in the field. Back then you could not simply join Mufon, you had to be appointed to a position for which you applied. I was appointed a "Research Specialist in Library Science" though in reality I kind of received a subscription to Mufon Journal and that was about it.

On the one hand you have to admit that Mufon tried hard to do a good job. They tried to bring some semblance of investigatory prowess to the members, sponsored classes and meetings, and generally tried to be more than a magazine subscription. This also led to some rather unfortunate issues where local chapters would sometimes be dominated by, say, Billy Meier enthusiasts, which circumvented the organization's attenpts at being scientific in its approach.

Mufon kind of reminds me of a cartoon I saw years ago in Car & Driver or Motor Trend. In th distance is a cliff with cars falling off it. A couple of guys in laboratory coats are watching this spectacle with clipboards in their hands. In the foreground there are two guys. One says to the other, "Oh, that's Consumer's Reports testing cars again." So when someone says Mufon is cleaning house, I really think that is a good thing. No conspiracy required.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:20 PM
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From personal and relative experience, I've never trusted MUFON. I wouldn't be surprised to find it a government front or very infiltrated.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:28 PM
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Originally posted by niceguybob
Which way Zargon? Too break it apart as a creidible reporting adgency?


Seems that way yes... though I need to watch it closely because with the money they got it complicates the issue.

It is just that with watching the happenings all over the UFO circuit lately it seems there is a definite and deliberate push to knock out any credibility UFOlogy has left.

When I first heard the money came from Bigelow I thought GREAT! Now we are getting somewhere... now I am not so sure... I need to do some digging. My attention has been elsewhere



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:43 PM
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reply to post by zorgon
 


Quite a bit of reading there Zorgon!! Have to quit for a bit to quench the enormous headache I now sport!!

But for the most part, I do agree there has been some indications aired for food for thought processes before it actually took place.
I haven't been to the MUFON website other than trying to research this incident. I have been on the fence with why this "Should" take place and for what apparent reason it would be beneficial to the program as an entity of information for UFO and other such events as they are being reported or investigated/resolved as too what they may or may not be.
As always, Enjoy your input and the reading you supplied was detrimental to this discussion. There aren't very many thing's left in this controlled world left for us out of the box thinker's, as they like to call us. Soon the mainstream academics of such matters will be similar to a lost civilization with refuting without irrefutable explanations. Guess as long as the PTB's are in control, we may never know it all...Not for facts sake anyway..
As for the Pegasus interview with Hal Puthoff, I don't recall. Getting logged on to the PC is still an event I cherish, provided there is enough time to get through a thorough research of such topics. Seems as if everything has to be taken with a grain of salt when getting the truth any more. You know what I mean, I'm sure.
One thing I did notice in the ATS thread you had provided was how some individuals write the true believer's of such thing's of importance to ones personal ideologies can get thwarted with arrogance and cracked pot ideological responses and input. Makes me a bit perturbed sometimes, but understand it is not the views of all for the sake of argument.
Suppose, it is all in a day of living!!



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 02:57 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 



So when someone says Mufon is cleaning house, I really think that is a good thing. No conspiracy required.


I guess you as a member of the MUFON team does give it some credence, but I still don't think that the efforts in desolation of the current administration is a proper method of dealing with your so called "Cleaning house" theory. Why in the world would anyone want to take such people out of the picture that have literally had decades of research/investigation and reporting to be taken out of the "BIG" picture? Other than to start a "NEW" process to waver in the facts for release and disclosure?
You had even said yourself that your membership amounted to nothing more than being a subscriber to the MUFON group, I guess the only question I have for that statement is "Did you have anything to investigate or anything at all to bring to the chopping block for discussion or possible investigatory applications?" I am sure as a member of the research/Library detail you spoke of was much to do with investigations of either earlier report's or possible consideration to such events? Where you stand on your point of view is fine by me, but it still doesn't explain why there should be such a dramatic take over with such knowledgeable people in place already.
I value your input, and people that are personally involved with MUFON are more than welcomed for their point's of views and understanding, just gets a bit annoying with me knowing that MUFON is on of the "BEST" UFO research groups on the planet, and now they are being dismantled such as in a government during a hostile take over. Your opinions hold true to your scenario, but it doesn't really explain the "WHY" I am searching for.
Hope you post some more on your input thus far, I am only looking for "Truth" to the outcomes of this happening.
Thanks for your participation...



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by Dendro
From personal and relative experience, I've never trusted MUFON. I wouldn't be surprised to find it a government front or very infiltrated.


NASA being disbanded, ISS being resupplied in a vigorous manner by countries all over the planet, and the introduction to new space technology that is so hush-hush nobody knows what the reason is for all the secrecy around the X37B those are thing's of a government take over, why should it have anything to do with the MUFON as a public domain, not a political chess piece to call all the shots in the MUFON project?
If they are transforming it to be a place of disinformation and rhetorical argumentative for the bases of UFO's being a tangible and provable anomaly, they would surely have in their power to completely discredit and exploit anything they see fit when it comes to the UFO phenomenon.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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reply to post by niceguybob
 



MUFON’s credentials and summaries of MUFON activities were continuously presented to hundreds of writers, newspaper reporters, radio and television program representatives, television producers, independent researchers and MUFON members.


Very appropriate in their investigations to the point where they unintentionally became the "WOrld Authority" of such matters.

A Brief History on MUFON



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 03:58 PM
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reply to post by Allred5923
 


I must admit I'm not completely sure of what you said here, but I would challenge the idea that Mufon was one of the BEST UFO organizations on the planet. It's "organized," but I would stop right there. What Andrus managed to instill into Mufon was a stodginess that it has never overcome. I think you need to ask yourself, given Mufon's long history, what has it ever accomplished? While the rest of the UFO "Community" has been engaged in everything from disclosure politics to abduction research to some truly marvelous pictures and incidents to esposing faudsters, Mufon is still interested in precise measurements of depressions in the ground allegedly made by tripod landing gears. That's why I used the Consumer Reports analogy. Just maybe that's not the way to test cars. Just maybe the Mufon investigatory model--and its heirarchy--are flawed. Beyond the organization, there's not much there.

It's boring. Mufon is so into the faux-organization thing that it forgets to look up. Assigning me as a "Research Specialist in Library Science," just as an example, is a complete joke. There's no such thing. Walt made it up on the spot. It's making up a title with no duties. Mufon is supposed to be this vast interconnected network capable of funneling reports continent wide to a center for analysis, but it has no status. Do you get a Mufon badge so you can cross police lines? No. Do you say, "I'm from Mufon and I'm here to help."? No. Does anyone say, "You saw a light in the sky. Quick! Call Mufon!" No. The UFO Clearinghouse, a one-man operation in Washington state, has better information.

Meanwhile, at a local level, you're as likely to find a group of people enamored with Billy Meier and his time travel puctures as you are people interested in serious research. In short, there's no quality control in the organization and no one, apparently, capable of exerting it.

So when I hear that Mufon is cleaning house, I don't have to postulate a government conspiracy because if there is government interest in making sure Mufon is an ineffectual and marginal organization, it would be best to leave it alone and as is because it already is those things.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 06:26 PM
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schuyler

Nice analysis. Kinda IN....kinda OUT.... No real definition of rank and file. Thanks for that.....
. and I found the spellcheck button..so I'll spell better too. Which will be nice.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 06:54 PM
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Originally posted by niceguybob
schuyler

Nice analysis. Kinda IN....kinda OUT.... No real definition of rank and file. Thanks for that.....
. and I found the spellcheck button..so I'll spell better too. Which will be nice.


There's a spell check button? Where? Obviously I need it along with new glasses, which is part of the problem. I can't see the screen very well. Sorry, a bit off topic, but the spell check button got me excited!



posted on Feb, 10 2011 @ 01:36 PM
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Hey guys....Does this have any merit or validity?
www.sacred-texts.com...

If Mufon got too close,could they use this law against them?
Has this already been debunked?
Thanks.



posted on Feb, 10 2011 @ 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by niceguybob
Hey guys....Does this have any merit or validity?
www.sacred-texts.com...

If Mufon got too close,could they use this law against them?
Has this already been debunked?
Thanks.


Not exactly debunked, but repealed. Here's the information



posted on Feb, 10 2011 @ 05:45 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 



must admit I'm not completely sure of what you said here, but I would challenge the idea that MUFON was one of the BEST UFO organizations on the planet


I will submit to this statement. I have never been affiliated at the level you have been involved with them. It just seems frustrating that being's you, an apparently dissatisfied and rather let down member, has taken all that I currently thought of MUFON and threw it in the crapper as a reputable and respected institution for like minds such as ourselves. Allows me to be a little perturbed myself, even as a Non-affiliated member.
But on the other hand, even though you think MUFON is a "One Man Band" type of show, and that the organization is great but the resulting analogies and investigation's are not fit for a third grader of some intelligence, that somehow leaves me feeling rather flux again to what they can and cannot reiterate on by way of the government already?
I guess "Distinguishing" the truth's from the falsies of such a group can be left as trivial. So, if I were to ask you "What do you personally think the best thing to do or happen to the MUFON program would be as far as Gov. regulated organization? Or a private citizen operated program? Which would be better in your opinion?"

And thank you for the very cordial and considerate response Schuyler.

As I have said before "I have only submitted report's of a sighting, I am not by any means a member of their coordinated team."



posted on Feb, 10 2011 @ 05:56 PM
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reply to post by schuyler
 



Not exactly debunked, but repealed. Here's the information


Yes, seems it was implemented to thwart the possibility of contamination that would have been possibly brought from the moons surface by the astronauts.


On the basis of this analysis [of quarantine information from Apollo 14], as well as the results from the Apollo 11 and 12 flights, we have concluded there is no hazard to man, animals or plants in the lunar material... the interagency committee has recommended that further lunar missions need not be subject to quarantine"[4]

The rule was formally removed from the Code of Federal Regulations in 1991


Thanks for being here Schuyler!! You are a great contributor my friend..



posted on Feb, 11 2011 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by Allred5923
reply to post by schuyler
 


So, if I were to ask you "What do you personally think the best thing to do or happen to the MUFON program would be as far as Gov. regulated organization? Or a private citizen operated program? Which would be better in your opinion?"


Well, I'm going to assume that the government has its own program in place. I think we all suspect the government knows more than it is telling, but whether this is because they made treaties with aliens, just found a crashed saucer, or are as confused as we are is unknown, though there are plenty of people with opinions on the matter.

In terms of private organizations the history of them is pretty dismal. They amount to clubs. NICAP was probably the most effective organization, and it fell apart. If you believe someone like Richard Dolan, it's because the government infiltrated it and killed it off. If you believe some other people who were actually there, it was because of inept mismanagement. In the case of Mufon, it is still in transition from the Old Guard (Andrus & Co.) and whatever will come out of it. If you believe Carrion, there are some objectivity issues related to money. Any way you look at it, this older structure is still in place, and it may be they need to change it because it may very well be just a skeleton with no substance. For example, my State Mufon Director operates out of a P.O. Box in an obscure part of the state.

With any volunteer interest group, whether it is collecting stamps or HAM radio, it's only as strong as the energy and intelligence the membership brings to it. Mufon was an attempt to be sober in the midst of crazy claims. Although it started in 1969, it came out of the fifties and sixties, and APRO. Its mission is " the systematic collection and analysis of UFO data." I think originally the idea was that we didn't know much, so we'd better collect the data first and analyze later. Well, we've collected a whole lot of data, most of it meaningless, analysis still eludes us, and a whole new group of crazies are with us.

Meanwhile other organizations have mastered the publicity game, so we have Exopolitics, abduction research, and several personalities who have stolen the thunder, if you will, from serious UFO research. I think that's a sad trend, myself, because some of these guys are nuts, but if you look at the luminaries in the field, you have a lot more Stephen Greers than you do Jaques Valles. What this means is that no organziation really speaks for UFO aficionados. In any case, "Ufology" is not an established, recognized field of study. There are no degrees, no recognized body of professional literature, no academic standing, no peer review. Anybody can "join" and claim to be an expert.

I guess that begs the question. Do we need an organization? I'm thinking they are kind of ineffectual myself, but, of course, it's up to the membership.





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