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Another Disturbing thing to hear about

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posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:03 PM
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I had no idea 30% of all puppies sold in the US came from Missouri??!! And to hear that now some state lawmakers want to overturn the new law, saying it would restrict a growth industry and do more harm than good. Really? WTF is wrong with these guys wanting to overturn the vote????!!! As an animal owner I think they should all be shut down personally!

Should Missouri ban puppy mills?

Last November, Missouri voters passed a law to regulate the state's massive puppy mill industry. Now, some lawmakers want to overturn the vote.



An estimated 30 percent of all puppies sold in America come from Missouri — a whopping 750,000 dogs each year — earning the Show Me State a new unwanted, unofficial title: The "Puppy Mill State." In November, Missouri voters narrowly passed the "Puppy Mill Cruelty Prevention Act," heralded as a "huge paw print forward." This move to improve both the state's reputation and the "deplorable" conditions of some of its breeding facilities would bar breeders from housing more than 50 dogs and require that those animals receive sufficient food, water, space, vet care, and time off between breeding cycles. But now some state lawmakers want to overturn the new law, saying it would restrict a growth industry and do more harm than good. Really?


ASPCA Stepped in on this one.




posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:13 PM
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Originally posted by sugarcookie1
As an animal owner I think they should all be shut down personally!

Should Missouri ban puppy mills?

Its the damn buyers fault.
They are so cheap.
They wanted to trade me a tablecloth for my puppy, which was one of the rarest
puppies in the world.
And they dont want male kittens either.
I quit.
If your making money breeding animals
you are doing something wrong.


edit on 7-2-2011 by RRokkyy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:15 PM
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reply to post by RRokkyy
 


Did you mean to say something?



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:17 PM
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off-topic post removed to prevent thread-drift


 



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by BeverHunter
 


Funny. But this is about puppy mills not the lifestyles of the people in Missouri.



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:22 PM
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Wow. I don't much about this whole puppy mills issue, but they at least shouldn't have all of their cages exposed to the outside like that in the video. That looked a little odd. The dogs in the video looked pretty much healthy to me, and for as all the poop in the cages go, around where I live that looks pretty much the norm in all of the animal rescue shelters.I am completely against any cruelty to animals, especially dogs 100%, so don't get me wrong here. I just don't understand what puppy mills are exactly, but if they are contemptuous or mistreating of dogs in any way, I am completely with you on this.



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by FoJAk
Wow. I don't much about this whole puppy mills issue, but they at least shouldn't have all of their cages exposed to the outside like that in the video. That looked a little odd. The dogs in the video looked pretty much healthy to me, and for as all the poop in the cages go, around where I live that looks pretty much the norm in all of the animal rescue shelters.I am completely against any cruelty to animals, especially dogs 100%, so don't get me wrong here. I just don't understand what puppy mills are exactly, but if they are contemptuous or mistreating of dogs in any way, I am completely with you on this.

What is a puppy mill?


What Is a Puppy Mill? A puppy mill is a large-scale commercial dog breeding operation where profit is given priority over the well-being of the dogs. Unlike responsible breeders, who place the utmost importance on producing the healthiest puppies possible, breeding at puppy mills is performed without consideration of genetic quality. This results in generations of dogs with unchecked hereditary defects.

edit on 7-2-2011 by sugarcookie1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 10:56 PM
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reply to post by sugarcookie1
 

I honestly don't get it.
Aren't there children and entire families who are homeless and hungry? Before anyone invests one minute or one dollar on animals they should consider diverting those resources to humans.
As for the puppy mills, they are quite nice compared to the accomodations your chicken sandwich or hamburger endured.



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 11:11 PM
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Originally posted by Trublbrwing
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 

I honestly don't get it.
Aren't there children and entire families who are homeless and hungry? Before anyone invests one minute or one dollar on animals they should consider diverting those resources to humans.
As for the puppy mills, they are quite nice compared to the accomodations your chicken sandwich or hamburger endured.


Yes I agree with you about the families but big places like the ASPCA are not going to stop what they are doing in concern for humans that are starving or homeless they figure thats what Wellfare is for. Yes the chickens and cattle are a concern for the ASPCA too but its such an ovewhelming job for them im quite positive there is alot of that going on all over the world. I did a thread on chickens and beef just a bit ago. here is the link.
I posted a section in that thread about "Mechanically Seperated Chicken" check it out!
Ill have my burger on a petri-dish bred



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by sugarcookie1
 


Seems like a poopy business to me (not to make a pun). Do they disguise themselves as animal shelters? Otherwise, who would put up with them having, or even selling mal-treated animals? Simply disgusting. Being as we treat humans the same in sweatshops/etc., I guess I can't be too much surprised. Every day humans surprise me more and more with their contempt for life.
edit on 2/7/2011 by FoJAk because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 11:20 PM
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Originally posted by FoJAk
reply to post by sugarcookie1
 


Seems like a poopy business to me (not to make a pun). Do they disguise themselves as animal shelters? Otherwise, who would put up with them having, or even selling mal-treated animals? Simply disgusting. Being as we treat humans the same in sweatshops/etc., I guess I can't be too much surprised.


Well their state has allowed this to happen for some time but as you can see yes Poop is a large factor along with disease and malnutrition to the animals and just plain old abuse to them too. A majority of the animals are shipped to stores to sell and the others im sure are put to sleep or left to die or sold to individual families. Its sad but true.



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 11:36 PM
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First the facts…

Puppy Mill Cruelty Prevention Act


The proposed law, sponsored by the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), would toughen current legislation that already requires large-scale dog breeders to provide animals with sufficient food, clean water, housing and space; necessary veterinary care; regular exercise and adequate rest between breeding cycles.


I doubt many people would argue that this is overly burdensome to a breeder; it's likely what is required by regular law anyway.

Same Source as Above:


What local opponents dislike about the initiative petition is language that would prohibit any breeder from having more than 50 dogs for the purpose of selling their puppies as pets.


This is the part I have an issue with; see if the breeder can keep 10000 dogs under the conditions of the above requirements why limit them at all. The local farmers here see this as the beginning of the end as it will open the way for other restrictions on herd size for other livestock.

My thoughts:

I live in NW Missouri and within a 10 mile radius of our farm I would estimate there are about 5-6 puppy mills.

Two of them are managed by the Amish and are the rough equivalent of doggie hell on earth IMO – a third one finally got shut down by the Sherriff because he got so many complaints about the conditions. It happened to be our Amish neighbor and they were pretty close to the main road.

On the up side one of the local breeders; we don’t refer to his operation as a mill runs a first class operation, clean healthy well taken care of dogs with indoor/outdoor access type shelter. That is not the standard around here though.

When we moved here we didn’t really know about the issue; however, now that we see it I am frankly torn. I have a working farm with my own animals and the anti-government side of me says that we already have animal cruelty laws to cover all the things the bad puppy mills do and feel that further intrusion just opens the slippery slope to them limiting the way I do business. That happens to be the view of both of our veterinarians – the small animal and large animal ones.

However, I realize that in this day of constrained budgets and such animal welfare and cruelty complaints are right up there with getting kittens down off roofs on the priority list for the county and therefore the laws go unenforced.

The truth is I think this legislation will be more of the same – no one will really enforce it unless people complain.

The bad part will be when they use this as a bridge to limit the size of my herds or mandate I do X and Y with my stock because of what the humane society wants the precedent will be set.

I have basically 10% profit margin in my dairy operation and if I had to call a vet for euthanasia every time I need to put down a sick calf or older cow it would eat that up pretty fast. I know how to end it humanely for them and it tears me up inside to have to do so. I love my working girls!

I do think there is a difference between dogs which are pets and ( I have never shot a dog/cat except in Afghanistan and I didn’t want to there but had no choice.) livestock; however, I have to remind myself that to the breeders they are livestock not pets. In America people should be able to conduct business as they choose within the animal cruelty laws of course.

With the dogs I think the issue is with the middle men – the Amish guy who would talk about it told me he gets $75.00 a puppy from the dealer (he has beagles and I think #-zus). I have seen them in the shops in Kansas City Malls for 500.00 and up. So someone is making a huge profit there.

If they paid more for them their margin wouldn’t be so hard to make and give their breeding dogs a better quality lifestyle. (Then again they might just make more money themselves...) Besides, like with drugs it’s the demand that is the main culprit – I have had probably 20 dogs in my lifetime and every one was a rescue from a shelter or a stray.

I wish everyone would take care of their animals better but they don’t which is why I am torn.

Here is a site for some information about the law – of course they put their spin on it.

Missourians for the Protection of Dogs

Here is an opposing view.

Proposition B opposition



edit on 7/2/2011 by Golf66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 7 2011 @ 11:53 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 

Thank you for writing such a good post about this and the amish getting involved in it must be a bad situation or there is money for them involved in it. But 75 bucks isnt much for operational costs per dog so i can see why they are in a doggie Hel* for them. I wouldnt think amish would treat animals like that because thats kind of what they are all about. So its tough either way. I have bought all my dogs from the humane society as well. Thats crazy what they sell them at the pet store 500+ bucks each that is alot and I personally cannot afford it myself and if I could I would not do it. And I feel you about the cattle we have several here that we have and they are beef cattle and we hate to lose them but it happens and we deal with it by our state guidelines too. Thank you for posting.



posted on Feb, 8 2011 @ 08:08 AM
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People need to educate themselves about puppy mills and STOP buying animals from pet shops!

Many times in puppy mills, breeding pairs are kept in a cage their entire lives! Some can hardly walk because they've never had the opportunity. The cages are stacked several high, with the urine and feces of one dripping down into the cage below. They spend as LITTLE as possible keeping the breeding pairs alive so they can keep reproducing. It's terrible!

Buy From Reputable Breeders,
NOT Pet Shops or BackYard Breeders!



Pet shops get their puppies from Puppy Mills and Back Yard Breeders. These 'breeders' don't health-test their animals and many of the pups carry disease and genetic faults.

Back Yard Breeders

Good vs Bad Breeders



Good breeder will always provide proof of claims they make, this might be in the form of a pedigree, test results, contracts, etc. Breeders will provide you with proof of genetic testing on the puppy, the parents or most likely both. Some of the common tests breeder do are the OFA (for hips), CERF (for eyes), PennHIP (for hips), and BAER (for hearing) just to name a few. These will also be up to date, the CERF testing, for example, has to be done every year. Probably the most distinguishable aspect of a good breeder is that they stay in contact with those that they have sold their puppies to. They are more than willing to provide grooming, training, and medical advice if needed. They will also take the dog back no matter how old, if the owner can no longer take care of him.


.
edit on 2/8/2011 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 8 2011 @ 12:42 PM
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I totally agree Buy From Reputable Breeders, NOT Pet Shops or BackYard Breeders..I just don't think alot of people understand just how bad the puppy mills are alot of these poor dogs never leave there cage there put there to breed till they die ..when you buy one of the pups you have no idea what your getting health wise..the whole situation just makes me just want to cry..I wish i could save all those animals..those mills need to be shut down... and thank you for takeing the time to post



posted on Feb, 8 2011 @ 05:31 PM
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Originally posted by sugarcookie1
I totally agree Buy From Reputable Breeders, NOT Pet Shops or BackYard Breeders..


Back yard breeders,in other words, home breeders
are the only ones who give their animals a
normal life without cages. The reason there are
not enough of them is people want to pay $75 for
an animal and that is really not enough to make
the trouble worthwhile. It is the middlemen, mall
stores,etc who charge up to $1500 that make the
money and like Walmart force the breeders to
produce quantity instead of quality by paying them so little. See my first post above. Thats how capitalism works. Supply and demand. It takes
a socialist govt to sort it out with regulations.
edit on 8-2-2011 by RRokkyy because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 12:59 PM
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reply to post by RRokkyy
 


Yes Ive noticed the malls price on animals are crazy i could never afford to buy one of there animals..my dogs i got from shelters ..but your right its all about Supply and demand and that's a shame..



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by RRokkyyIt takes
a socialist govt to sort it out with regulations


Well, I guess that's one way to do it; however, people could also just not buy 1000.00 dogs at the mall.

If people didn't do that the issue would solve itself. I am not an advocate of government intervention.



posted on Feb, 9 2011 @ 01:37 PM
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reply to post by Golf66
 


I agree 100% if people stopped buying the dogs at the mall for that kinda money it would end but we know that wont happen..but with the economy the way it is i don't see how anyone can afford to pay out that kind of money its all i can do to put food on the table ..thanks for the reply



posted on Feb, 27 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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Hello cookie.We meet again in a more serious venue.
.We operate a private cat rescue sancturary in Southwestern Pa.
While cats are our primary focus, we have 7 dogs that we rescued
from deplorable situation, two of the recent rescues were from a dog fighting ring.
We have seen over the past 30 + years the most inhumane and despicable atrocities
commited on these defenseless creatures. The plight of homeless domestic pets is a disgrace
to this country, many european countries are far more advanced.

If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who will deal likewise with their fellow men. ~St. Francis of Assisi



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