Not All Atheists Are Rational

Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
reply to post by Wyn Hawks

 

Tell me something.

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
Who is going to control you?

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
God?

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
Don't be an idiot.

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
Having God in our awareness is essential specially in this time of age. If we want to survive any sort of scientific dictatorship that anyone wants to impose upon us.

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
Understand God.

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Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
People such as yourself are the brainwashed mindless sheep, and spiritual ill morons that will be begging for an RFID chip.

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reply to post by traditionaldrummer

I don't see where you've told anything that could be deemed truth so far. At best you've conveyed an unusual and often contradictory set of opinions

That's because an Atheist society will be a s***hole. There will be no development except for machines. Because you Atheists want to replace human morals with science.
I'm against it.
Human beings are not like ants. Only with GOD in our lives we can be completely free. God is not a dogma. God is Love.
I stand with God always.
That's why atheism must be exposed and fight against.

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


I find this more andeore often. Really there is another class of athiest called antitheist I think... an athiesm is just a lack of belief about anything... which really isn't anyting and you can't really be a member of... it'd be like making a group for toothfairy athiests... antitheists are actively against any belief in the supernatural... although this is becoming more skewed with technology...

Most atheists are quite all right with the concept of artificial intelligence. Once this is explained as a simulation of human level intelligence then it is likely that this machine, just like us, will be able to improve itself in a process known as recursive self improvement. This concept obviously works because it evolved us... fortunately for the machine it can use simulation whereas the universe must retain the last best copy in case the new one has a fatal flaw..

In any case, this machine will eventually (or quite quickly) become a superintellect... that will be able to simulate a human level intelligence- or many of them and even the environment they will perceive... quite frankly this superintelligent machine may as well be god. Atheism is obsolete. :-)

reply to post by miragezero

I find this more andeore often. Really there is another class of athiest called antitheist I think... an athiesm is just a lack of belief about anything... which really isn't anyting and you can't really be a member of... it'd be like making a group for toothfairy athiests... antitheists are actively against any belief in the supernatural... although this is becoming more skewed with technology... Most atheists are quite all right with the concept of artificial intelligence. Once this is explained as a simulation of human level intelligence then it is likely that this machine, just like us, will be able to improve itself in a process known as recursive self improvement. This concept obviously works because it evolved us... fortunately for the machine it can use simulation whereas the universe must retain the last best copy in case the new one has a fatal flaw.. In any case, this machine will eventually (or quite quickly) become a superintellect... that will be able to simulate a human level intelligence- or many of them and even the environment they will perceive... quite frankly this superintelligent machine may as well be god. Atheism is obsolete. :-)

Can you tell me what the opposite of Love is?

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks
...good op... it is a common error to presume we're all alike...

I would say that is a trait of people in general, working with any label (and atheists do it all the time too). Some of the best, deepest, and most amazing discussions this one has ever had was with atheists. Simply different quantifications and conceptualizations for the exact same universe anyway.

Though surely, i have yet to have what i would call a "productive" discussion with an atheist on this forum. It all devolves from arguing (at best), to semantic superiority (or wankery, however one wishes to call it ) to insults. Or just zero response at all, which is, by far, the least entertaining! That goes for both the religious AND the atheist. Of course though, while atheists here proclaim they are all different, it seems their view on those who "believe" in God is that they are all the same, and can all fit within whatever conceptualization one has made for others. I am interested to see the separation from science in this thread though, as that is generally a cornerstone in the.. "discussions" around here. Yet, i come to find that very few (if any) of the people who claim such things, have even explored basic newtonian experiments. Not to prove anything... at all.... whatsoever... but to simply understand and further explore the concepts for oneself. Which, goes right back into the same psychological jumps that atheists criticize "religionists" for. Neither one seems to be doing any sort of personal search beyond what established sources are saying. It does seem "that which we speak most fervently against tends to be directed towards ourselves."

Really, i never much made the mistake that all atheists were rational I always just wanted to have a discussion, but it seems such a thing is impossible. Both sides do nothing more than argue their perspective as "right" on something neither (and no one) understands in its totality.

Poor poor me.. i am called a blasphemer by the religious, and irrational and unscientific by the atheist. Ohhh well... *skulks back into the shadows*



However, from a bystanders viewpoint, it is incredibly fascinating to witness! So carry on, friends! I shall always pick your conversations over Maury or Ricki every time!

Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
Can you tell me what the opposite of Love is?

...your behavior on this thread...

...heres a theme song for ya...

Originally posted by sinohptik
i have yet to have what i would call a "productive" discussion with an atheist on this forum. It all devolves from arguing (at best), to semantic superiority (or wankery, however one wishes to call it

) to insults. Or just zero response at all, which is, by far, the least entertaining! That goes for both the religious AND the atheist.

...maybe it has something to do with syntax... sentence structure is kind of like art... what the artist thinks they're projecting isnt always what the viewer sees...

Originally posted by sinohptik
Of course though, while atheists here proclaim they are all different,

...we're not all alike... that does not mean the same as we are all different...

Originally posted by sinohptik
it seems their view on those who "believe" in God is that they are all the same, and can all fit within whatever conceptualization one has made for others.

...you wouldve had a valid statement if you had used the qualifier "some"...

Originally posted by sinohptik
the same psychological jumps that atheists criticize "religionists" for.

...generalizations cause confusion... use of the qualifier "some" helps lessen that... its a little word but its very powerful because it can change a false statement into a truthful one...

Originally posted by sinohptik
It does seem "that which we speak most fervently against tends to be directed towards ourselves."

...projecting one's own flaws on others is fairly common... sometimes the person the projecter is projecting on is just as screwed up as the projector and sometimes not...

Originally posted by sinohptik
I always just wanted to have a discussion, but it seems such a thing is impossible.

...not true... this is the second discussion i've attempted with you and, on that other thread, there were others who attempted to have a discussion with you too...

Originally posted by sinohptik
Both sides do nothing more than argue their perspective as "right" on something neither (and no one) understands in its totality.

...imo, theres no such thing as both sides - and - "no one understands in its totality" is arrogant...

Originally posted by sinohptik
However, from a bystanders viewpoint, it is incredibly fascinating to witness!

...takes all kinds... some folks like to gawk at wrecks... some like to jump out of perfectly good airplanes... some like to swim with sharks... one of my father-in-laws enjoyed cock fighting in his younger days, even raised his own gallo del cielos - which cannot be posted without the appropriate song...
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Cool post. Fun to think about. It would be entirely boring to be entirely rational. Humans aren't designed to be rational. So that leaves us with levels of rationality.

You really shouldnt have

Thanks for the video though!

Originally posted by Wyn Hawks
...imo, theres no such thing as both sides - and - "no one understands in its totality" is arrogant...

Sides are created in perspectives, most certainly. A single coin in others. How is "no one understands in its totality" arrogant? I view it as the exact opposite.

i suppose i am rather elitist when it comes to what constitutes a discussion, instead of an argument. perhaps it is syntax, and it is most certainly partially this ones fault, as i was inevitably involved. but really, ive had many discussions elsewhere on the board that proved more enjoyable as a discourse. ATS is a "big" place, and im just one valid perspective amongst many valid perspectives. There are simply other things i would rather be discussing than that whole atheist vs religionist debate on God. No sweat off my brow, and im sure none off of yours either

I just calls em likes i sees em

have fun!

Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
reply to post by traditionaldrummer

 

If understanding god turns someone into an arrogant and conceited bigot then what use is this understanding or this god? You claimed god was love. This is the manner in which you employ love (god) for others?

Then don't. Be screwed if you like.

Be screwed by whom?
By this god-who-is-love?

If that's the case, I've known atheists who could teach your god a thing or two about love.

Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_

I stand with God always.

I asked him about that and he said no, that thing you're standing near is not god.
But he doesn't mind. He's quite happy to be suitably distanced from you.

Oh, as a special favour, he'd like from now on for only atheists to speak about him,
- because they do less harm to his reputation than arrogant, bigotted, tough-talking "Christians."

I think many atheists, including myself, would find the idea of banding together with a group to form an organised belief system against the very notion of being athiest, or agnostic.

Where those have said an atheist world would be a loveless world, just ask my kids if they feel unloved. I do not subscribe to any ritualistic belief systems and yet I have plenty of time and attention for other people, where they need and deserve it. Just because I believe in one less God than you, does not make me an ogre.

When it comes to the 'worship' of, perhaps, 'higher beings' who seeded life on this planet - be they aliens or Gods, you could call this religious. I don't, however, think that true atheism can be classified as religious. I don't think science or technological advancement can be in the pursuit of religious gratification, being that mostly everything gained from this study and advancement is tangible.

Finally, in a universe in which our planet harbours the only known life, amongst 200 billion stars in the galaxy, surrounded by hundreds of billions of galaxies, I think to beleive there are not lifeforms out there more advanced than ourselves is irrational. Not saying you should beleive these manufactured life on Earth. But the odds are wildly in favour of their existence.

Originally posted by _SilentAssassin_
That's because an Atheist society will be a s***hole. There will be no development except for machines. Because you Atheists want to replace human morals with science.
I'm against it.

Nobody is suggesting an atheist society, nor that development will only come from machines. No atheist wants to replace human morals with science. And, quite frankly, humans morals come from humans, not deities.

Human beings are not like ants. Only with GOD in our lives we can be completely free. God is not a dogma. God is Love.
I stand with God always.
That's why atheism must be exposed and fight against.

Love is love. Not god. Atheists believe in love and practice it just as everyone else does. Also, true freedom comes when one is free of the shackles of the supernatural, not when one is constantly subjected to it.

Originally posted by miragezero
I find this more andeore often. Really there is another class of athiest called antitheist I think... an athiesm is just a lack of belief about anything...

No. Nihilism is the lack of belief about anything. Atheism is the lack of belief about gods. Antitheists tend to be active iconoclasts.

Originally posted by sinohptik
Really, i never much made the mistake that all atheists were rational

I always just wanted to have a discussion, but it seems such a thing is impossible.

It's certainly possible. It seems you have a fair amount of preconceptions about the nature of atheists and this could be discoloring your experiences. There are some irrational atheists on this board and yet others who are a bit more level-headed.

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


"Not All Atheists Are Rational"

That is certainly true. However, it is equally true that ALL evangelicals, by definition, are irrational.

reply to post by Pr0t0


Hear, hear! That the religious see athiests as ammoral and loveless speaks to their supreme irrationality and ignorance (and dangerous arrogance). If fact, I would argue that athiests are in general MORE moral than the religious, simply because we choose to live by standards of conduct on our own honor, not out of fear of retribution by some diety once we die. Further, by virtue of the fact that I do not waste a major portion of my time worshiping a creation of the human imagination, I have far more time to spend with actual living humans. Finally, because I do not have a diety as a crutch, I know I am responsible for my life, my wellbeing and of those minors who depend on me.

Originally posted by pajoly
However, it is equally true that ALL evangelicals, by definition, are irrational.

Hmm. It's possible I suppose, though I don't know if they ALL are. I would definitely say that I believe their premise to be irrational.

Hmm. It's possible I suppose, though I don't know if they ALL are. I would definitely say that I believe their premise to be irrational.

Exactly, and because they BELIEVE that premise, they are irrational. Let's not forget that an evangelical believes in biblical literalism. In my book, few things are more irrational than that and that includes ALL the belief systems of indigenous peoples whose lives were keenly balanced with the world around them.

Originally posted by pajoly
If fact, I would argue that athiests are in general MORE moral than the religious

Often this is the case. Theists who source human morality to the divine tend to be unable to support their position with any evidence: they simply declare it by fiat.