Change your PAST, and you will change your FUTURE!

Oh what a cause.

With the unlimited power to create our concept of self.
The ability to use science to enable knowledge of an unbridled self.
To change our past - hence our present paradigm, and,
Regrow ourselves past to present, to past and present infinitum.

What shall it boil down..?
Oneness with unity...
The human paradigm...
Ever growing in the plane of material.

Now, is all that's left,
but what do we do with it?
In knowing now we embrace everything.
So now is mixed was eternity as we know.

Jesus is a funny bugger because he cared.
I don't know why he cared, but he did.
Why care about our short comings?
Was he playing the same game we do?

reply to post by squandered

If you knew that you were eternal and are a cog in the wheel that, we / you / they call God, would you feel the same way?

I have no idea, really, except that I doubt I would be posting my perceptions on an internet forum.

There seems to be a constant shifting in your point of reference, so I find it difficult to follow the points you are trying to make.

reply to post by Gseven


I agree with all of this!!!....Thing is UNTIL we release the beliefs in our subconscious WE can not create the GOOD we imagine......What i do not get is we are POWERFUL and have a higher consciousness which is GOD so why does our GOD self allow us to hang on to all the negative stuff/history????...If we are truly seeking and wanting to heal why are we NOT,or if we are why is it taking so LONG??...Oh there's no time, the illusion seems like it is long...lol....Or its all a illusion...omg im confused!!...LOL.

The past has to be sorted is why we can't let go of it. History has scars. History has old wounds that did not heal.

Originally posted by mysticnoon
reply to post by squandered

 

If you knew that you were eternal and are a cog in the wheel that, we / you / they call God, would you feel the same way?

I have no idea, really, except that I doubt I would be posting my perceptions on an internet forum.

There seems to be a constant shifting in your point of reference, so I find it difficult to follow the points you are trying to make.

1. Me either, I suppose, but I don't know ( so I don't care). I get the sense that what we leave of ourselves when we reach enlightenment is what we know about this plane and subsequently go by when we instruct others. U.G. KRISHNAMURTI made that clear to me. All he could see was the here-and-now, yet he didn't care about our failings.

2. Yeah I've gone on a tangent, but it all resounds the same to me. As far as I go, I did pretty good just make sense... if I did. I went miles off topic, but I can bring it back to base.

The ideas I've spoken about are fairly simple.
Time isn't something I can readily encapsulate because it's timeless..
I understand the premise in my way, which is that all things are already known through "GOD" = timeless ideas.
We create new ideas by taking on new ideas and experiencing them in our - plane of existence.

If you die, you can be in other dimensions or come back here.
You may chose this place based on your current soul matter.
You may have worldly attachment that won't subside.
There are levels of heaven based on how you interpreted things, this time.

I just read "The white book"
It's channelled from Ramtha.
Not all of it is his work...
You be the judge.

Most of it resonates in me like a prayer I never had.
That's my tangent, here... so you know

It's not like I always make sense.
The first attempt at writing my ideology (at age 10),
started with "everything there is to know already, and
everything I will know, I knew already"

I hold to that when I approach 40 y/old.

Karma and me aren't twins.
Extrapolate what you've read here...
There are no laws of nature binding us.
Plus, Ramtha told me so...

If we can manipulate the past,
NOW is what we make of it.
Every moment is YOURS.
Who cares what came before, really...?

I like you but I think you need to find your own path.
What makes sense to you MUST be different to me,
I'm sure the answer is unfolding onto time.
We reflect our base - which is everything we know.

If someone is truly wishing to change something of the past...no matter how bad it is...this is a unhealthy sign of inability to cope or adapt or accept.

Its more healthy to learn how to cope and adjust...then to live in regret.

The past has purpose to teach us and test us.

I consider this whole thought to be very unhealthy.

Originally posted by fedges
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

Very well put this time around and much easier to grasp the concept (for me anyway). Two things I'd like to raise. Firstly, is there not a huge generalisation that one's first thought/recollection will be a negative? Much as I've tried I can't think of anything other than happy, positive occasions - how does that fit into the model? Secondly, you make a very bold statement "..since we can longer change ourselves..." !! I can only fundamentally disagree with this and surely this is what the whole post is about? CHANGING

The purpose of the excercise is self discovery, and to explore the various mechanisms of compensation and of reaction/response which have formed much of our personality or what I'm calling the "strong suit", and there are various points along the way where we decided on a certain style, approach and way of being, thinking and acting, in response and reaction to the percieved occurances of life, not that our own interpretation of the event as our "story" has any correlation with the event itself, which of course is just something that happened...

They need not be formed in reaction to percieved negative events (of course events are just things that happened and may be interpreted in any number of ways..), although I have yet to encounter anyone who does not carry around at least some baggage or pain from the past which operates as a constraint on their freedom and power.

So something happened and then there's what we made it mean for us, and the decision or conclusion we drew from that meaning or interpretation - although what happened is just what happened, and could have had an almost infinite number of causes, with a whole miriad of different interpretations from different perspectives, and an occurance or an event in time, just is, and doesn't have any real intrinsic meaning in its own right, whereby we are the ones who assign those meanings... (starting to get the picture?)

Re: "change". Change is something different from, or better than, what went before, in response to, so as to make something right or good, so I have to disagree that it's not "change" per se that we're wanting to realize, but the transformative realization made available in complete acceptance, making what was inauthentic and robotic, wholly authentic and real, and empowered, or freely chosen, for the right reasons simply because it inspires, not compells for unconcious reasons outside of our awareness. Ie: The more we try to change the more we only stay the same! "That which we resist, persists." (Carl Jung)

And in truth, from the new perspective, POV, or frame of reference - we are already perfect whole and complete. All these things are just interpretations of things we cannot even have entire certainty about, where "what happened" needn't neccessarily mean what we made it to mean... but since all there is is the meaning, as it's recorded in the present, the past then dissolves, in tears and laughter and childlike giggles.. but there's no there there as in a "real past" not any more, that's not the way it really works, as the OP has made very clear.

Thus we begin to stand in the "omegapoint" of no-time, and in turning back and examining our life's "story" we come to realize that it's just a story ABOUT a bunch of things that happened, which of themselves didn't even necessarily mean what we made them to mean or how we interpreted those things.

And so, having recognized all of that, and having fully re-integrated it, with a smile, or some tears, and some laughter at the absurdity of it all - we are then 100% FREE to turn around (reverse the arrow of time) and move forward into the future space of wholeness and perfection based simply on what inspires us, and on what and WHO we choose to be of our own free will with awareness and full self expression, knowing ourselves and accepting ourselves, as we truly are. There is nothing that needs changing don't you see?

Now if that doesn't make you smile, those who do the work and the excercises as described, then I do not know what will..

Best Regards,

NAM

Originally posted by StarLightStarBright2
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

I want to be your first patient!!....You should be writing books to!Your blessed at writing and comprehension.

Thank you very much! ("client" not patient though)

And just for the record, the purpose of the excercise I outlined, wasn't or isn't to try to air any "dirty laundry" or to take anyone else's inventory, but simply to help people get present to the presence of the present in eternity, and from that novel and lofty POV, shed light on our blind spot, as we observe, with astonishment and a newfound sense of humor, the past completely dissolve in a radical, transformative love, which is all that's left in the space of nothing that is everything already always now and forever.

If the therapy is a success, it ought to generate a newfound sense of unbridled enthusiasm and inspired action in relation to our family of origin, to heal the wounds that have been festering for countless generations, and there, within the framework of the "relativity of human being" is the OmegaPoint "detonated" if you will..

The point I'm also trying to make with this is that it's perfectly ok to conduct an in-between life review (by the standard of love), in the midst of our present life, and in so doing, re-discover our timeless, spaceless, changless and eternal self - perfect, whole and complete, which in all truth is the gateway of eternal life and freedom, our joy and happiness made complete, and I don't think Jesus cares if we believe in him or not, provided we get to where he was pointing and going, although his prayer was that we might become so one that we would recognize his sent calling by a God who is love itself and the spirit of life, and truth.

"The unexamined life is not worth living."
~ Socrates (he obviously had a sense of humor)


Although I've posted this short video on a number of occassions at different "times" in different places, I think it deserves reposting



And of course our strong suit will remain for this life A strong suit (since we're not free to choose who we are and are becoming), and while we can now fully accept every single part of ourselves, reintegrating all of it, making it "functional", at the same time, relative to the unconditioned ground of being that is the timeless domain of all possibility, in many ways we our "self" also can dissolve in eternity, whereby our self expressed authentic person at any given time, isn't who we think we are or were, but simply who we are choosing to be, like a role we're playing to the hilt! However, in this new framework we ought to be able to switch and try on new roles at will depending on the circumstance, while remaining wholly authentic and fully self expressed (know that it's just a role our true self is playing), and also, having access to the full breadth and depth of our personality "storehouse", be in control of our emotional or subtle body, and thus have access to energies and resources we never dreamed we had access to, yet balanced with the ability to say, this is the time for joy, this for sorrow, this even for anger (controlled appropriate anger), this for love, this the time for seriousness, and now, playfullness.

The no-self self isn't nobody and nothing at all, and who we are being at any given moment, provided we do not identify our "self" with that "role" and recognize that it's only a role we're playing, is still who we really are, and if we're having trouble being authentic in any situation, we can immediately get authentic again by being authentic about our own inauthenticity, which people find to be very endearing and charming, even encouraging.

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
If someone is truly wishing to change something of the past...no matter how bad it is...this is a unhealthy sign of inability to cope or adapt or accept.

Its more healthy to learn how to cope and adjust...then to live in regret.

The past has purpose to teach us and test us.

I consider this whole thought to be very unhealthy.

You've brought up a good point, but also one that is a conditioned thought. What if we aren't meant to "accept" what we create for ourselves? What if we have the ability to change those things we don't like? Because by simply coping, adapting and accepting some terrible drama that has befallen us, the very tone of those words prevents us from looking through different eyes. No one is suggesting that we deny or live in a fairy tale, but rather VIEW our dramas with a different attitude.

Analogy: Let's say that I hate ball sports, and anything to do with crowds and yelling people. (For the sake of conversation, of course! LOL!) If someone forces me to go to a game and I don't want to go, I will have a miserable time for sure, and I will resent that I wasted several hours of my life enduring hell. Forever after, unless I change my view, I will always remember that with disdain and recall the story, reliving the irritation and angst I felt toward the people who forced me to go and all the screaming fans who annoyed me in the process.

BUT...let's say I realized the err in my ways, and I change my tune after the fact. Let's say I decided to be thankful for that opportunity. How in the world could I be thankful for something I hated so much??? Well, for one, I could be thankful that someone loved me enough to want me to experience their joy with them. That, in and of itself, is quite enough, and is selfless. As I continue with this line of thinking, the resentment and anger goes away, and I no longer have a negative emotional reaction when I talk about the incident. In fact, I have love and gratitude.

Herein lies the the big quantum mystery, masquerading as a bunch of new age, lovey dubby, tree hugging hooey. But it's NOT new age!! It's as old as time and new agers didn't invent this. When science can physically measure the energy of our thoughts and emotions, that's some serious power we've got happening in us! And when science can physically witness HOW these thought energies (i.e., expectations, intentions, etc.), control the actions of subatomic particles that make up EVERYTHING in our physical existence....wow, how can it NOT sit you back in your chair and gasp in wonder and amazement?!? And if that isn't enough, the fact that these subatomic particles have also been proven to be inter-dimensional, and not bound by our linear perception of time...I mean, we're treading on new ground here, and it IS forcing us to adopt new ways of thinking.

So we no longer, I believe, have to "settle" for accepting things that happen. What we DO have to do, is take responsibility for EVERYTHING that happens to us, and actively change it. Why on earth would we want to settle with our mistakes? That makes no sense, unless we blame others for our mistakes? If we can swallow that pill and stop playing the victim, there will be no limits to what man can do. But for now, humans very much enjoy pointing the blame finger, and categorizing everyone into victim/perpetrator and innocent/guilty categories. If we go through sh*t, we most certainly caused it in some way by our past actions. In God's eyes, we're ALL sinners, but we're all also innocent. We have done EVERYTHING to ourselves, both on an individual level and a planetary one.

I postulate that it's quite unhealthy to be apathetic to our mistakes by NOT actively seeking to change the the things that caused these circumstances to happen in the first place. Not doing so is cause for regret, not the other way around. IMHO.

reply to post by Gseven


Absolutely absolutely i agree 100%. It's amazing, too good to be true but true, incredible yet scientfically founded, hard to grasp but at the same time comprehensible in some strange way, as if from some sort of supra or ultra-rational POV, yet not new no - timeless, spaceless or placeless, without particulars. A mere shift in our POV and our frame of reference, which makes everything old, new again.

“We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring shall be, to return to the place where we started, and know it for the first time.”
~ T.S. Elliot


I'll have to assume Gseven that your reference to "new age" wasn't a side shot at me, But you're right, this can't be tainted by lumping it into what most people traditionally think of when they hear the term "new age". This is very old science, the very wisdom of the ages, now verified by modern science. It's not new but very very old, and, already always everywhere all the time, now.

It's neither old or new but something BOTH.

"The kingdom of heaven, is like a storekeeper, who brings forth from his storehouse, both something old and something new." (JC)

I share your enthusiasm and passion for this topic. It's quite literally, the greatest thing since sliced bread, even better!

Regards,

NAM

Originally posted by NewAgeManAnd of course our strong suit will remain for this life A strong suit (since we're not free to choose who we are and are becoming), and while we can now fully accept every single part of ourselves, reintegrating all of it, making it "functional", at the same time, relative to the unconditioned ground of being that is the timeless domain of all possibility

since we're NOW free - correction!

Can't let that get by now.. not when we're so CLOSE!

reply to post by NewAgeMan

I'll have to assume Gseven that your reference to "new age" wasn't a side shot at me, But you're right, this can't be tainted by lumping it into what most people traditionally think of when they hear the term "new age". This is very old science, the very wisdom of the ages, now verified by modern science. It's not new but very very old, and, already always everywhere all the time, now.

Oh jeez...NO WAY did I mean it as a jab at you or anyone! Sorry about that. Actually, I should have worded it better. There's nothing wrong with new age, but folks who aren't "new age", tend to look at them and lump all their beliefs into the kooky pot without ever taking a second glance. (I'm using the term "new age" generically, by the way.) I don't agree with this one bit, but it does happen. I think new agers tend to be more open minded about new ideas, and so they are generally the first to spread these ideas....unfortunately, a lot of people associate new ideas with a face rather than it's true source and the information then gets discredited if someone doesn't by into the new age stuff. I just noticed a "tone" developing in the thread that was suggesting a lot of folks were disregarding this on that basis. I should have been more careful about how I worded that.

Even though I'm a former Marine, I have quite a few hippie friends....related to a few too! It's all good!

Okay, do you want to know something? Impossible! I've not read the threads and jumped right in. Why? For example, if I wanted to be, say, less HAIRY, then shouldn't I have foreseen how unpopular HAIRY women in today's standard for beauty? Poo! Get real, people! This is reality. With that said, there is no PAST or FUTURE: This thought occurred a few seconds ago! This has to be the truth. It was staring at our faces all this TIME!

reply to post by Gseven


I'm worse than that - I'm a new age Christian mystic, who believes in both a participative eschatology (what Jesus had in mind) AND what I like to call the non-local, holographic, quantum cosmological Christ! Put that in your hippie friend's pipes and tell them to smoke it!

Originally posted by pikypiky
Okay, do you want to know something? Impossible! I've not read the threads and jumped right in. Why? For example, if I wanted to be, say, less HAIRY, then shouldn't I have foreseen how unpopular HAIRY women in today's standard for beauty? Poo! Get real, people! This is reality. With that said, there is no PAST or FUTURE: This thought occurred a few seconds ago! This has to be the truth. It was staring at our faces all this TIME!

You see, half way through your post, you were pulled into the strange attractor..

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by pikypiky
Okay, do you want to know something? Impossible! I've not read the threads and jumped right in. Why? For example, if I wanted to be, say, less HAIRY, then shouldn't I have foreseen how unpopular HAIRY women in today's standard for beauty? Poo! Get real, people! This is reality. With that said, there is no PAST or FUTURE: This thought occurred a few seconds ago! This has to be the truth. It was staring at our faces all this TIME!

You see, half way through your post, you were pulled into the strange attractor..

And I don't mean hairy women. Been there done that got the t-shirt.

Here is a real world for ya.

Last year, my wife died from complications resulting from the treatment she underwent as a result of her previous diagnosis of pancreatic cancer. I know now, that if her treatment was different, or if we had consulted other medical advise for her condition at that time, she may still be alive today. I will not go into details, but I am sure there are many out there that have a similar story to tell

If it is possible to change the past, I would give everything I own to make that happen, but the ramifications of changing such a timeline would cause so much disruption of future events, that tree off into so many different situations and lives of those who she interacted with.... How could that possibly be contained, if we could indeed change our past?

This is not a debunk, but a serious query.... Please shed some light, anyone, on the way I am presenting this.

Regards,

Charlyv

if i could change my past i would have never stumbled across ats...

the threads ran away without me.....
oh, well, the last thing I remember was someone asking me to give an example of why I believe...don't believe I ever claimed to know much of anything...that the future can come back in time, to change their present...near future...
okay, I'll try to give the story in as brief of a way as possible....
I have always, as far as I can remember had what I am gonna call an imaginary friend....not visible, not even to me, but there was always this other voice in my head. There's been times in my life where I had determined that the voice was just my imagination, me, or my subconscious talking to me, and there have been times when I actually believed that the voice was coming from somewhere outside of me, was god, was something trying to impersonate god, and on and on.
I also have had dreams of this dark haired girl with blank eyes that would look out of the fence that enclosed here, and internment camp. I've had these kinds of dreams for so long, I have no idea when the girl first came into my conscious mind.
In high school, I took a creative writing class and began drawing from the experience I had with the voice, and the dreams, which consisted of much more than the girl and writing short stories. But the time I graduated I had three notebooks full of those stories, about the girl, about the life that she was living, had lived, will live, whatever...time is such a headache to work around, And, from time to time, throughout my life, I would pick up the story writing and added to the number of the notebooks.
Well, in one dream, I saw the girl, and there was a long line of people, in chains, being led into the camp. And well, I kind of joined the line, and went in, just to give that girl a hug.
Haven't dreamed of her since.
The voice is still there, and we do still chat from time to time, but well, it's like the work has been done.
And, the notebooks of stories have been thrown away, the story has changed, I know it has been changed.

the girl could have been a past life. One of the stories I wrote was very similar to something I read about one of the Nazi camps and the setting was similar to what I dreamed in my last dream.
Or she could be a future self....or just a representation of my inner child....
But, I am kind of convinced that someone, or something is messing with time, and knows what they are doing. Just had too many experiences where trips that should have taken so much time, have only taken half or less of the time required. And, well, there's been too many times, when I would just see or know something so clearly, that there was just no way that I knew!!
But, I think the girl in my dream is me, a past me, a future me, whatever, and I think that the voice is that super soul, or whatever you want to refer to it, and both the girl and me are but mere fragments of her. Or that is at least one possiblity....

ya see, some of yas, at least one of yas, seem to be thinking on a short term basis. but this can be extended outward, and if you can tap into your past self, you can change you (can screw you up too really). and if you can tap into your future self, you can sometimes see ways to change you, to benefit that other you of the future.
On a short term basis, well, the problem is pinpointing a time....you are looking at all creation, all times, and well, you're trying to find a needle in a haystack. At least when you deal with your other selves, you have something, someone, to help you pinpoint your attention to something a little more specific. A time and place that will be relevant to you!

Originally posted by Gseven

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
If someone is truly wishing to change something of the past...no matter how bad it is...this is a unhealthy sign of inability to cope or adapt or accept.

Its more healthy to learn how to cope and adjust...then to live in regret.

The past has purpose to teach us and test us.

I consider this whole thought to be very unhealthy.

You've brought up a good point, but also one that is a conditioned thought. What if we aren't meant to "accept" what we create for ourselves? What if we have the ability to change those things we don't like? Because by simply coping, adapting and accepting some terrible drama that has befallen us, the very tone of those words prevents us from looking through different eyes. No one is suggesting that we deny or live in a fairy tale, but rather VIEW our dramas with a different attitude.

Analogy: Let's say that I hate ball sports, and anything to do with crowds and yelling people. (For the sake of conversation, of course! LOL!) If someone forces me to go to a game and I don't want to go, I will have a miserable time for sure, and I will resent that I wasted several hours of my life enduring hell. Forever after, unless I change my view, I will always remember that with disdain and recall the story, reliving the irritation and angst I felt toward the people who forced me to go and all the screaming fans who annoyed me in the process.

BUT...let's say I realized the err in my ways, and I change my tune after the fact. Let's say I decided to be thankful for that opportunity. How in the world could I be thankful for something I hated so much??? Well, for one, I could be thankful that someone loved me enough to want me to experience their joy with them. That, in and of itself, is quite enough, and is selfless. As I continue with this line of thinking, the resentment and anger goes away, and I no longer have a negative emotional reaction when I talk about the incident. In fact, I have love and gratitude.

Herein lies the the big quantum mystery, masquerading as a bunch of new age, lovey dubby, tree hugging hooey. But it's NOT new age!! It's as old as time and new agers didn't invent this. When science can physically measure the energy of our thoughts and emotions, that's some serious power we've got happening in us! And when science can physically witness HOW these thought energies (i.e., expectations, intentions, etc.), control the actions of subatomic particles that make up EVERYTHING in our physical existence....wow, how can it NOT sit you back in your chair and gasp in wonder and amazement?!? And if that isn't enough, the fact that these subatomic particles have also been proven to be inter-dimensional, and not bound by our linear perception of time...I mean, we're treading on new ground here, and it IS forcing us to adopt new ways of thinking.

So we no longer, I believe, have to "settle" for accepting things that happen. What we DO have to do, is take responsibility for EVERYTHING that happens to us, and actively change it. Why on earth would we want to settle with our mistakes? That makes no sense, unless we blame others for our mistakes? If we can swallow that pill and stop playing the victim, there will be no limits to what man can do. But for now, humans very much enjoy pointing the blame finger, and categorizing everyone into victim/perpetrator and innocent/guilty categories. If we go through sh*t, we most certainly caused it in some way by our past actions. In God's eyes, we're ALL sinners, but we're all also innocent. We have done EVERYTHING to ourselves, both on an individual level and a planetary one.

I postulate that it's quite unhealthy to be apathetic to our mistakes by NOT actively seeking to change the the things that caused these circumstances to happen in the first place. Not doing so is cause for regret, not the other way around. IMHO.

First I would say...that as you 'do ' things that you dont like...you learn something about yourself and others. Im not sure why you would be forced to go to something that you hate so much...but someone that you were with must of enjoyed it? What ever the situation...there was something of that event that was to show you something about yourself or another person.

My point to all of this is that I dont believe in happenstances...I believe that all things are meant to be. If we dont like something, we can focus on the dislike or we can be mature and learn from that opportunity. This may be very hard and may not seem natural to most that are used to having a narrow perspective...but as you shown...you did not choose to change your past experience of going to a game....but you chose to see it from a more mature way that could help you grow. Which in reality...is not changing your past...only your view of what it had to provide you with...which is always a opportunity for learning about ourselves or accepting others and sometimes even, accepting natures cycles that go hand in hand with cause and effect.

I think embracing the past...helps us respect natures perpetual motion that moves to and fro with 'cause and effect'. This can help us as we mature...know that all that we do, is a cause to something that will bring about 'effect'. Being more aware of this...is a good thing.

Our perspective of things (our thoughts) surely effects our present and future. Its not really changing the past...even if you birth a new perspective of the past...the perspective is something in the present and does not change the past itself. So I think some assumptions are being thrown around a bit here that just are not true.

Changing our perspective of the past...is a present 'thing'....and it doesnt change the past...just because we presently 'see' the past in a different light. The past still had to be all that it was...to offer the change of perspective in the present.

Do you see what Im saying?