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cut n paste from fox news 'report'
Bush administration officials told Fox News that mustard gas (search) was also recently discovered.
quote: Originally posted by Muaddib
I also guess that democrats were lying in 1998 when they were saying, along with Clinton that Saddam had wmd.
Clinton: Iraq must comply 'one way or the other'
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President Bill Clinton said Wednesday that while the United States still prefers a diplomatic solution to the current standoff with Iraq, "one way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction."
"That is our bottom line," Clinton said, while attending a White House event on education.
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Hmmmm interesting choice of words deny Iraq the capacity to develop
deny : - to curb, to control, to restrain
capacity:- the ability to perform or produce
develop:- make something new
Yes I see where you came from on that one NEXT...
Clinton Faces Rocky Path In Iraq Crisis
"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear," Clinton said. "We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program. We want to seriously reduce his capacity to threaten his neighbors."
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Sorry nope don't see where this one is going, I tried to find your smoking gun but all I found was
Should the U.S. merely try to punish Hussein for his latest intransigence over U.N. weapons inspections? Should it try to seriously diminish his ability to develop weapons of mass destruction? Should it actually try to topple his regime?
So lets look at the situation, you're the ruler of a sovereign state, in an unstable region of the world, wouldn't you want the weapons capabilties of neighbouring countries? it'd be all well and good having a drilled army, and a limited airforce, but when the guys around you can launch a missile attack from anywhere in their country and take out precision targets wouldn't you want a piece of that action? But then you're told by some bigger countries, with bigger and badder weapons that you have to submit your country to weapon inspections, wouldn't you find that embarrassing? a humiliation infront of your subjects and infront of your neighbouring nations who will then know your defensive capabilities. Wouldn't you try to prove that you were still in control of your country by playing games with where the inspectors could go, or preventing entry into your country? (Note : I'm not saying what happened in Iraq in the 1990's was right, but using reports of inspectors not being allowed into Iraq you have to look at it from Sadams side or you're getting the equivilent of a US/UK government press release and taking it a face value).
The following is a link to a letter from 23 senators in 1998 to president Clinton on their concern of iraq's wmd program.
CONCERN OVER RECENT DEVELOPMENTS IN IRAQ
(Senate - October 09, 1998)
Hmmmmm nice peice, can't really find any holes in it, so won't contest this UNSCOM has uncovered significant undeclared proscribed weapons programmes, destroyed elements of those programmes so far identified, including equipment, facilities and materials, and has been attempting to map out and verify the full extent of these programmes in the face of serious efforts to deceive and conceal.
I do find it interesting however that the report states "destroyed elements of those programmes so far identified, including equipment, facilities and materials" but doesn't describe how these peices of evidence were destroyed, remember this is after the UN coalition had pretty much precision bombed every thing in Iraq that may of concealed WMD or been used to produce, so were they reminents of projects though not declare that had still been bombed, or were they being dismantled etc by the Iraqis? Note:I know it says in the face of serious efforts to deceive and conceal. but as recent events with the dossier tsi topic is about, selecting your wording carefully can create impressions of granduer than the subject actually deserves)
John McCain associates the Bush Iraq policy with the Clinton administration on PBS's NewsHour by saying:
"I do not and I believe that President Clinton in 1998 stated unequivocally that we needed a regime change because of Saddam Hussein's continued pursuit of weapons of mass destruction, nor do I believe this president of the United States, or vice president would either.
This is a serious charge and I categorically reject it. Yes, I believe that mistakes were made and yes we need to have a review of it, but somehow to believe that two administrations intentionally misled the American people, I think is a leap of imagination ..."
Excerpted from.
www.alternet.org...
weird you chose an article that gets contradicted by the earlier choices,
I believe that President Clinton in 1998 stated unequivocally that we needed a regime change because of Saddam Hussein's continued pursuit of weapons of mass destruction but from your first link Clinton doesn't say anything about regime change (clintons line has already been quoted by myself in this post) Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott and House Speaker Newt Gingrich, both made statements in that post saying they hoped saddam would be removed or replaced, but ut Defense Secretary William Cohen is quoted as saying "It is not our goal to remove Saddam Hussein," which I believe would be the official line on the matter.
The closest thing I could find in the 2nd link to Clintion saying about a regime change was Clinton laid out a modest goal: diminish the Iraqi threat. not particularly exciting, though this next quote may point to the quote John McCain was refering to (continues on from last quote) it's less ambitious than some earlier administration pronouncements.
Not only that but even in 2004 Clinton was still saying that Saddam/Iraq had wmd, he was in fact convinced of this.
Portuguese Prime Minister Jose Manuel Durao Barroso said.
"When Clinton was here recently he told me he was absolutely convinced, given his years in the White House and the access to privileged information which he had, that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction until the end of the Saddam regime," he said in an interview with Portuguese cable news channel SIC Noticias.
Excerpted from.
www.theage.com.au...
Sorry couldn't be bothered with registering to the site just to read the article, but remember it was Clintons opinion there were WMD in Iraq, and with the evidence recently released concerning the quality of inteligence gathering in Iraq in both the US and UK is it inconcievable that Clinton saw the same poor quality of intelligence to lead him to that conclussion?
What about the link between iraq and Al Qaeda, was the Bush administration the only one to think there was a link?
The Clinton View of Iraq-al Qaeda Ties
ARE AL QAEDA'S links to Saddam Hussein's Iraq just a fantasy of the Bush administration? Hardly. The Clinton administration also warned the American public about those ties and defended its response to al Qaeda terror by citing an Iraqi connection.
For nearly two years, starting in 1996, the CIA monitored the al Shifa pharmaceutical plant in Khartoum, Sudan. The plant was known to have deep connections to Sudan's Military Industrial Corporation, and the CIA had gathered intelligence on the budding relationship between Iraqi chemical weapons experts and the plant's top officials. The intelligence included information that several top chemical weapons specialists from Iraq had attended ceremonies to celebrate the plant's opening in 1996. And, more compelling, the National Security Agency had intercepted telephone calls between Iraqi scientists and the plant's general manager.
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
We also got reports from Russian defectors that in 2002 Russia, along with other countries, had sold weapons and other banned materials to Saddam.
I will post a link when i find it, but it has been posted before in these forums.
No evidence of Iraq-Al Qaeda ties: 9/11 commission undermines another Bush war lie
The staff report of the 9/11 commission released June 16 further discredits one of the main lies employed by the Bush administration to justify its invasion and conquest of Iraq. It confirms that there was no Iraqi role in the September 11 terrorist attacks in New York and Washington and no �collaborative relationship� between Al Qaeda and former Iraqi president Saddam Hussein.
Please visit the link provided for the complete story.
Google can be used to find for and against arguements, to just about anything, a lot about this was is subject to contraversy.
Originally posted by zcheng
US was even trying to smuggle Nuclear material from Kuwait to Iraq, but was stopped by Kuwait.
Originally posted by shanti23
So both the Senate Committee and the Butler Report are wrong then are they?
Along with both the American and British army, who both say they haven't found any WMD.
Why don't you contact the White House with your world changing discovery of WMD?
The FACT is they HAD WMD, but those stocks were destroyed during the Gulf War of 1991 and subsequent weapon inspections had kept them under control.
Iraq and WMDs before the war
Even now it would be premature to reach conclusions about Iraq's prohibited weapons. Much potential evidence may have been destroyed in the looting and disorder that followed the cessation of hostilities. Other material may be hidden in the sand, including stocks of agent or weapons. We believe that it would be a rash person who asserted at this stage that evidence of Iraqi possession of stocks of biological or chemical agents, or even of banned missiles, does not exist or will never be found. But as a result of our review, and taking into account the evidence which has been found by the ISG and debriefing of Iraqi personnel, we have reached the conclusion that prior to the war the Iraqi regime:
a) Had the strategic intention of resuming the pursuit of prohibited weapons programmes, including if possible its nuclear weapons programme, when UN inspection regimes were relaxed and sanctions were eroded or lifted.
b) In support of that goal, was carrying out illicit research and development, and procurement, activities, to seek to sustain its indigenous capabilities.
c) Was developing ballistic missiles with a range longer than permitted under relevant United Nations security council resolutions, but did not have significant - if any - stocks of chemical or biological weapons in a state fit for deployment, or developed plans for using them.
Uranium from Africa We conclude that, on the basis of the intelligence assessments at the time, covering both Niger and the Democratic Republic of Congo, the statements on Iraqi attempts to buy uranium from Africa in the government's dossier, and by extension the prime minister in the House of Commons, were well founded. By extension, we conclude also that the statement in President Bush's state of the union address of 2003 that "the British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa" was well founded.
Originally posted by shanti23
People here were shouting 'White Wash' when Butler stepped out the car for a reason.
People here want Tony Blair OUT of government after this shameful episode.
Post till your blue in the face, it's not going to change the facts.
Originally posted by Muaddib
Nowadays i am seeing some people even in these boards saying everyone, mostly the U.S. and UK... were involved in 9/11 and 3/11 and everything else that is wrong in the world....
People talk, and sometimes it is a lot of trash, and that is the fact.
A lot of Europeans, including British people, are against "any war"
You really need back up information before you claim something like that shanti, otherwise it is slander and lies
Originally posted by Variable
Here is the sentence that says the most from the report.
*There is no evidence of "deliberate distortion" of the intelligence material or of "culpable negligence"
Blows away the lie argument doesn't it? It's amazing how people can read an article, gloss over relevent facts and take slices of what they read to bolster their point. If they didn't do it deliberately then they made an error. That's not lieing- Bush and Blair hater's- that's would be a mistake.
We have seen one element - intelligence about some WMD being ready for use in 45 minutes - elevated into virtually the one fact that persuaded the nation into war.
...
In other words, they disagreed then and disagree now fundamentally with the characterisation of the threat. We were saying this is urgent; we have to act; the opponents of war thought it wasn't. And I accept, incidentally, that however abhorrent and foul the regime and however relevant that was for the reasons I set out before the war, for example in Glasgow in February 2003, regime change alone could not be and was not our justification for war. Our primary purpose was to enforce UN resolutions over Iraq and WMD.
Tony Blair, Prime Minister UK, 5 March 2004
Saddam Hussein emerged from his hiding place "very much bewildered" and said "hardly anything at first", according to Major-General Odierno.
news.bbc.co.uk...
Originally by Variable
It's amazing how people can read an article, gloss over relevent facts and take slices of what they read to bolster their point.
Originally posted by Muaddib
Just face it, you don't want to admit it, no matter what evidence is presented, you obviously think that everyone, the UN, the UK, the US, the Russians all orchestrated 9/11 and 3/11.....
...
BTW, you must be a really good psychic to say that you know that "everyone in the UK knows...."
Originally by shanti23
*Please note that I am not a conspiracy theorist who thinks that a secret government plot caused 9/11.