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HUGE: you'll finally be able to use your iphone 5 and ipad 2 as wallets

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posted on Feb, 4 2011 @ 08:22 PM
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HUGE: you'll finally be able to use your iphone 5 and ipad 2 as wallets


gizmodo.com

Apple is planning to add near-field communications (NFC) chips to its next generation iPhone and iPad, allowing you to use them to pay for stuff just by waving your device in front of a receptor.
Unlike workarounds using bar codes like Starbucks or dongles like Square, with NFC the payment would just happen wirelessly and automagically once you approve it.
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Feb, 4 2011 @ 08:22 PM
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If they can't chip us they will do the next best thing... make our phone our virtual chip.

The dangers are extensive both on the NFC chip and the Iphone itself. There have been repeated ways to hack previous Iphones. Here is an example with just a SMS.

NFC is a type of RFID and can can be hacked just by walking through a doorway, by people driving past you on the street or even a hand held unit easily purchased off Ebay.


Notice the hacker on the second video "In theory they could put in more protections, they won't, and they won't last long if they do."

These videos show that just because there might be technologies to block them, there are always people who don't know, understand or use them. Many of you have new cards with this technology already but you don't know they are in your wallet. Same will go for these new phones. Your identity and your credit card and your phone number... all they need to steal your identity and run un thousands of dollars in your name.

Not to mention the Big Brother aspect of all this...

This is way to big-brotherish.

I do not approve of this future.

gizmodo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Feb, 4 2011 @ 08:32 PM
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DO NOT WANT



(link screaming cat picture here)



posted on Feb, 4 2011 @ 08:33 PM
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They should make them the size of wallets and foldable like a wallet.

Maybe even put a leather case on them.

If you think this is bad, wait until they also become your keys to your car and home too.



posted on Feb, 4 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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uhm japan did this and is still curently doing this witht here cell phone like 7 years ago



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 12:05 AM
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reply to post by tamenie
 


Has it been 7 years already? I've only had mine for ... 4 or 5 years, I guess. No security issues so far. Used it today to pick up a pack of cigs (forgot my wallet). On mine, I have to select the program, scan at the counter and then verify the purchase. Takes a couple of seconds. I can't think of any way to hijack it without stealing my phone - and even then, it would run up against the limit I've set for it. Thieves would get more by stealing my wallet...



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 12:13 AM
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piano, you might be interested in this related thread if you haven't already seen it. It discusses this topic from a slightly different perspective—doing away with credit cards and currency. I don't see this as a great thing. It opens the door to a lot of potential for abuse, particularly when there are already such privacy issues already:

www.privacyrights.org...
40,000 violations of the law' in FBI snooping: report
Police should get warrants for mobile data

But I'm not super freaking out about it either. I just think we need to proceed with caution.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 12:29 AM
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reply to post by ~Lucidity
 


I've seen some of those threads, not the first one though...

It fits with the control they are trying to force on us. I do not approve. They have not even begun to address the problems with the credit cards which will be even worse with the phones. The hacker explains it well at the end of the second video.

Considering they are allowing police to access the info on your phone now without a warrant... it gets very sticky very fast.

Our elected officials and our Judges are selling us out wholesale and setting us up for worse abuses to come when technology like this is implemented.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 12:44 AM
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reply to post by pianopraze
 

Exactly. Abuse and control. That can make a person sick just thinking about it. I heard a cop here very haughtily say (jokingly, allegedly) the other day here that he could get your info from your cell "just like that." With no cause? Just cuz? Really? And if that info's on a phone I don't think encryption's going to bye us a damn thing because the banks, telecoms, ISPs, you name it are all in cahoots.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 05:49 AM
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Good now If i steal your phone, I can take your identy, SS card, your money, your wifes dirty pictures, your home address, kidnap your pets and hold your left testicle for ransom.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 10:17 AM
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reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL
 

You forgot passport, entrance badge to work, key to your door, and pictures of your kids...



Then they will make the phone as small as a chip and.....



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 05:19 PM
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Originally posted by THE_PROFESSIONAL
Good now If i steal your phone, I can take your identy, SS card, your money, your wifes dirty pictures, your home address, kidnap your pets and hold your left testicle for ransom.


Almost as bad as getting your wallet stolen.

Oh, wait, it's not.

If you steal my phone, I can contact the my mobile provider, give them my password and have them (a) lock the phone remotely and (b) give them my permission to give the exact GPS co-ordinates of the phone to the police. Or to me, if I'm feeling lucky.

Conversely, if you steal my wallet, I'll never see the cash again, my license and other ID will be sold off to the Russian Mafia and I'll wake up one day to find my identity has been stolen and I'm on a no-fly list and wanted for mortgage fraud. Furthermore, my credit cards will be maxed out in a heartbeat (and I'll have to fight to get the charges canceled), and I'll get to spend the next three weeks trying to get all my ID replaced.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 05:32 PM
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reply to post by vox2442
 


The problem is that all this gets stollen and you still have the phone in your hand. Watch the videos.

Someone driving by can just remotely scan your phone by either: 1. having a mobile scanner. 2. Have a semi-perminate and higher power scanner such as the hacker in the van. or 3. Having devices put in the wall... a doorway with scanners on each side imbedded in the wall works great as you will have no idea they are there.

It is being done with credit cards and passports daily.

The way they encrypt this data currently is miniscule. Worse yet they send you credit cards with this technology imbedded in them and you don't even know you have it. Many of those reading this post will have credit cards that have been broadcasting their account information and they didn't even know it. Credit card companies have not been alerting customers, or it comes in a notice with the new credit card that people don't read. The same will be true for these phones.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 05:59 PM
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reply to post by pianopraze
 


I don't think you understand how this tech works.

The videos you posted involves an RFID chip. The tech in my phone - which is exactly what apple will be using - cannot be remotely read by that method, because it doesn't contain the same kind of RfiD chip.

When I make a purchase, I must (a) run the software and (b) place the phone directly on the terminal. If there is no contact, the data transmission can't go through - and if you remove your phone too quickly, the transaction is disrupted. It's quite a bit different than the chip on a prepaid long distance card.

This tech has been in use in Japan for years. Millions of people use it every day. To my knowledge there has never been a case of a phone being hacked or otherwise electronically hijacked to drain the cash.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 06:04 PM
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Well I am clearly one of the few who doesn't feel the need to carry round a 'phone. But if it ever gets made compulsory, I look forward to our esteemed government buying me one.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 07:43 PM
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What worries me is not the people who will get scammed using this method of payment but rather myself who refuses to use these types of devices for paying with. What happens when our country decides to start using electronic devices to pay for everything and then there are people like me left behind who still want to use old ways of payment like actual coins and notes?

I can just see in the future methods like this taking over and only people who have lots of money will be able to spend their money because they need to buy some special electronic device to even be able to purchase anything at a store.
People like me who can't afford or want a stupid iphone/ipad will be left behind not able to work with society.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 08:14 PM
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Originally posted by vox2442
reply to post by pianopraze
 


I don't think you understand how this tech works.

The videos you posted involves an RFID chip. The tech in my phone - which is exactly what apple will be using - cannot be remotely read by that method, because it doesn't contain the same kind of RfiD chip.

When I make a purchase, I must (a) run the software and (b) place the phone directly on the terminal. If there is no contact, the data transmission can't go through - and if you remove your phone too quickly, the transaction is disrupted. It's quite a bit different than the chip on a prepaid long distance card.

This tech has been in use in Japan for years. Millions of people use it every day. To my knowledge there has never been a case of a phone being hacked or otherwise electronically hijacked to drain the cash.


Here is how it works per the NFC Forum.

NFC-compatible devices occurs when they are brought within four centimeters of one another: a simple wave or touch can establish an NFC connection, which is then compatible with other known wireless technologies such as Bluetooth or Wi-Fi. The underlying layers of NFC technology follow universally implemented ISO, ECMA, and ETSI standards. Because the transmission range is so short, NFC-enabled transactions are inherently secure. Also, physical proximity of the device to the reader gives users the reassurance of being in control of the process.


With signal strengthing technology shown in the second video, or per the article above Wi-Fi, or Bluetooth you can access the phone per their own admission.

Your assertins are absolutely incorrect. NFC has been hacked. Here is an article describeing howNFC has already been hacked.

This tech is in it's infancy and they are failing to put the proper security measures in place. And what is worse is the directions they intend to take this technology.People have resisted the National ID cards with RFID but they will sneak this through the back door as a good thing. Just like they did with the Social Security number. When they rolled it out they said it would NOT be used as a identification number. Look at it now.

See this Wired Magazine article and they all intersect: Lawmakers Eyeing National ID Card.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 11:03 PM
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Originally posted by pianopraze

which is then compatible with other known wireless technologies such as Bluetooth or Wi-Fi. The underlying layers of NFC technology follow universally implemented ISO, ECMA, and ETSI standards. Because the transmission range is so short, NFC-enabled transactions are inherently secure. Also, physical proximity of the device to the reader gives users the reassurance of being in control of the process.


With signal strengthing technology shown in the second video, or per the article above Wi-Fi, or Bluetooth you can access the phone per their own admission.



Access and hacking are two different things. I can't access my phone from my computer via bluetooth because bluetooth is only active when the application specifies it. Right now, there is no active application requiring bluetooth, so there is no signal to connect to and thus no way to hack. If you know of a way, post it, and I'll try it.



Your assertins are absolutely incorrect. NFC has been hacked. Here is an article describeing howNFC has already been hacked.


None of that article describes the type of identity theft you propose in the OP.

None of that article describes critical faults with the phone tech - the most dangerous involves switching physical tags on smart posters (never even seen one of those in real life). The "hacks" are simple re-directs - and the article even goes so far as to say they're "not the fault of the NFC standard."

Finally, none of that article deals with a current problem - they are exploits designed in the lab to get Nokia to plug holes in their security.



This tech is in it's infancy and they are failing to put the proper security measures in place.


You just posted an article outlining the security testing done by a researcher at the "Fraunhofer Institute for Secure Information Technology". The point of which was to identify potential security holes, for which he is paid by Nokia.

That qualifies as failing to put proper security measures in place? Strikes me as the opposite - especially since there have been no real-world exploits of these hacks since the article appeared in 2008.



posted on Feb, 5 2011 @ 11:49 PM
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reply to post by vox2442
 


I'm not going to go back and forth. There are flaws. The videos show them. The bigger issue is the privacy. So I will not respond any more with back and forth.

This IS RFID and it operates in the same frequencies and can be hacked. If you want to deny it in your mind feel free. Here is a video that breaks down the specs in detail as well as how to hack it:



posted on Feb, 6 2011 @ 01:13 AM
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Originally posted by pianopraze
So I will not respond any more with back and forth.




Three year old tech video and the debate is over?

Whatever. Eat a peach.



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