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reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 02:35 AM by Lucifer777

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes

Boy oh boy, here is where my expertise comes into play...

Boy oh boy; I just love Jesus experts. I have some questions Oh great Jesus expert.

turning water into wine?
Water= common people
Wine= Essenes

John 2:1-11 - ..... there was a wedding in the Galilean village of Cana. Jesus' mother was there and he and his disciples were invited to the festivities. Then it happened that the supply of wine gave out, and Jesus' mother told him, "They have no more wine.".....In the room six very large stone water-jars stood on the floor, each holding about twenty gallons.

Tell me oh expert, if the "water" refers to the common people, why were they hiding in the water jars?
Also what is the meaning of "20 gallons" of common people? How many gallons is a common person?

Jesus gave instructions for these jars to be filled with water, and the servants filled them to the brim. Then he said to them, "Now draw some water out and take it to the master of ceremonies", which they did. When this man tasted the water, which had now become wine,

So oh great expert, if the wine was the Essenes, how did the master of ceremonies "taste" the Essenes. How could he tell the difference between the taste of an Essene and a common person? Can only Master Masons tell the difference between the taste of Essenes and common persons or can anyone taste the difference?

without knowing where it came from, though naturally the servants who had drawn the water knew,

Well if drawing water refers to drawing water from a well, and if water refers to the common persons, why were the common persons hiding in the well? Were they homeless perhaps?

he called out to the bridegroom and said to him, "Everybody I know puts his good wine on first and then when men have had plenty to drink, he brings out the poor stuff. But you have kept back your good wine till now!"

Now the Bridegrom did not just taste the Essenes (i.e., the wine), he actually drank them and they tasted good.

In your expert opinion, how did he manage to "drink" the Essenes? Perhaps Jesus performed a miracle and produced an electric liquidiser to liquidise the Essenes?

Also, in your expert opinion, what is the difference between the taste of a poor Essene (i.e., the poor wine) and a good Essene (i.e., the good wine) and why is a "poor" Essene not a good Essene?

Can Master Masons tell the diffence when they drink poor Essenes and good Essenes?

The Essenes/Qumrans were a gated community, in other words, they saw outsiders in a literal sense of the word "Dead" and those that have been accepted into the Church, "Alive" so for Jesus to raise people from the Dead... Raise? Dead? hmm

When Jesus arrived in Bethany, Lazarus had already been dead and in the tomb for four days. When Martha discovered that Jesus was on his way, she went out to meet him. "Lord," she said, "if you had been here, my brother would not have died."Jesus told Martha, "Your brother will rise again." But Martha thought he was talking about the final resurrection of the dead.

So the dead are the outsiders. So when Lazarus died, since he had not been dead previously, why did he go and live in a Tomb? Was he homeless?

Jesus then went to the tomb of Lazarus with Mary, Martha and the rest of the mourners. There he asked them to remove the stone that covered the hillside burial place.

So if he was alive, and was just a living person (i.e., an Essene as you claim), and he became dead (i.e., an ex Essene who just became an outsider), why was there mourning at his tomb? Did they just bury him in the tomb because he became and ex Essene?

Jesus looked up to heaven and prayed to his Father, closing with these words: "Lazarus, come out!" When Lazarus came out of the tomb, Jesus told the people to remove his grave clothes.
As a result of this incredible miracle, many people put their faith in Jesus.

Why was he wearing burial clothes if he was not dead, but just an apostate Essene who became an outsider?

Also Lucy, there is a huge difference between a Blue Lodge and the York Rite...anyone that knows Masonry would know that the Highest Degree anyone can achieve would be the 3rd Degree, that of a Master Mason, any degree after that would be considered just extra curricular

I am so impressed with your Masonic knowledge and your "expertise" on the religous fanatic and fake miracle worker, Jesus. Truly all those pompous Masonic degrees and titles which you have purchased from your Masonic franchise have worked wonders for you. DId you glean all your expert knowledge of Jesus from Masonry? I am so impressed.

It is so wonderful to be surrounded by so many experts on Jesus.

And whatever you ask in my name, I will do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything of me in my name, I will do it. (John 14:13-14)

Dear Jesus.

I am so impressed by Masonic experts on this forum that I wish to prove to all humankind your miraculous powers and that you did not lie when you said that your followers could miraculously cure leprosy, blindness, drink deadly poison, cast out demons and move mountains into the seas. I would like you to move mount Everest slightly to the left, say 100 meters, or alternatively just throw it into the Indian Ocean.

I pray all this in the name of the Master Mason Jesus, that the father may be glorified by the sun.

P.S. I'd like two Cappuccinos delivered to my door within the next five minutes.

Holy, holy holy. Praise you; praise you.

Lux

edit on 23-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: addition to text

Addendum.

Dear Jesus

More than 5 minutes has passed and the cappuccios I ordered have not been delivered.
You promised to do anything that I asked in your name, that the Father may be glorified by the son.
Also I am watching CNN and so far there is no news about Mount Everest?
OK I'll give you another 5 minutes, just to be fair.

Regards
Lucifer.

More fun with Jesus on: www.evilbible.com...

edit on 23-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: Addendum

reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 07:54 AM by Tamahu

Scriptures have many levels of meaning. One of the main symbols of the Wedding of Cana is Sexual Transmutation or Sexual Alchemy.

This is why יהשוה transmutes the Water into Wine at a Wedding. It is symbolic (see the above link). Kabbalistically, we could say that Water is Mayim, and that Wine (Vayin, or Yayin) is Schamayim; and that a Essene (Gnostic) is the outcome of Transmutation.

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes
oh and extra points for anyone that knows of who and what Barabas was

The Gnostic Jesus

"The people of Israel were chosen in order to surround the Master and thus to redeem the world. Now we comprehend why so many prophets and so many saints where born amongst the people of Israel. Upon the unconquered walls of Zion, the glory of Solomon, son of David the King of Zion, resplendently shone. This is why the face of Jehovah resplendently shone upon the unconquered walls of Jerusalem. Likewise, Isaiah, Samuel, Jeremiah, Ezekiel and many other prophets shone filled with Light upon the streets of Jerusalem. These were the prophets chosen to accompany the Lord.

"Regrettably, at the supreme hour of the final test, their Sanhedrin liberated Barrabas (Javhe) and sent their Christ, their promised Messiah, to be crucified. Thus, when their people had to choose between Christ and Javhe, they crucified the Christ and adored Javhe, who is the chief of the black lodge. Javhe is a fallen angel, the genie of evil. Javhe is a terribly perverse demon.

"This is how the people of the Prophets of Judah crucified their promised Messiah - Christ; this is how their people, the nation of Israel, failed. This is how the people that had been chosen by the Prophets of Judah in order to spread the Christic wisdom upon the entire face of the earth chose the abyss. Now, that nation follows Javhe and totally failed its Prophets, because such a nation betrayed its Master and crucified him. If the Lord had not been crucified, the destiny of the Western world would have been another; we would now have sublime enlightened Rabbis everywhere, preaching the Christic Esotericism.

"Christic Esotericism, the secret Jewish Kabbalah, and the Holy Alchemy united would have completely illuminated and transformed the entire world. Yes, the mysteries of Levi would have shone with the Light of Christ. Gnosis (Daath) would have magnificently shone everywhere. Then, the world would not have fallen into the dead Christianity of Roman Catholicism."

- Samael Aun Weor

Therefore many Jewish people decided to follow the chief of demons (Jahveh) instead of Christ (Jehovah).

Jehovah is of Christus-Lucifer, the White Lodge; whereas demons like Javhe are the outcome of Satan-Lucifer, Klipoth, the Black Lodge which can be represented by the numbers 56 and 777.

"The Kabbalistic value of the ego is fifty-six; this is the number of Typhon, the mind without spirituality." - Samael Aun Weor

Chakra Meditation and the Middle Pillar (Golden Dawn)

"777 is the official number of the Black Lodge, since 7 + 7 + 7 = 21: The Fool."

"Javhe called the Jewish people “my chosen people”. Kabbalist Jews have intentionally intermingled Javhe with the Lord Jehovah.

"Even conventional Christians ignorantly and fanatically follow Javhe. Nevertheless, they all hide behind the cross.

"All Religious organizations which are presently known in this physical world that do not teach the path of Scientific Chastity are controlled by the Black Lodge. When they know about Scientific Chastity and they do not teach it, it is because such organizations fell into the hands of Javhe."

edit on 23-2-2011 by Tamahu because: punctuation

reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 10:01 AM by TheForgottenOnes

reply to post by Tamahu

ooh, close Barabas actually means Son of God, so here we are, Jesus and Barabas, two sons of God being picked to go to crucificion. sounds like a popularity contest to me, in my opinion, Pilate did this to prevent an uprising and revolt. because at that time there was more than a thousand messiahs running around

reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 10:08 AM by thisisnotaname

Here's an interview i think is a good listen in relation to this topic:
The discussion about Jesus being a mason start at the 4:00 mark

YouTube Link

edit on 23-2-2011 by thisisnotaname because: grammar

reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 10:08 AM by TheForgottenOnes

reply to post by Lucifer777

oh lucy, never did I claim to be a Jesus expert, just someone who tries to learn something new every day, instead of having a closed mind. surely someone as "edumacated" as you knows the difference between a literal and quizical sense of the word, even the bible will be like that, every book back in the day spoke in riddles. and I'm curious, what version of the bible did you use?

reply posted on 23-2-2011 @ 10:34 AM by Tamahu

reply to post by TheForgottenOnes

Arcanum 8 - (Transcription)

There are other Scriptures there, other phrases, where Abbas is related with the Father, and it is coming into my mind now the word Bar-Abbas. Bar in Aramaic means son, abbas father, the son of the father Barabbas. Now you say, “How come? So the son of the father is Barabbas?” Yes, and Jesus of Nazareth is the son of the Father, too, but behold the duality. Didn't you understand or you forgot, that the ego is inside of us, and within the ego is Tiphereth, the soul, the consciousness, bottled up, so this is Barabbas.

Is not Barabbas the son of the Father, too? Yes, of course, but Barabbas has to be annihilated, the ego has to be annihilated in order to liberate the particles of the Father hidden within, which are part of the Son. Who is the Son? The Son is Tiphereth, but when you reach the initiation, when you reach the fifth initiation of major mysteries, you discover that part of your soul, Tiphereth, beauty, is hidden within Barabbas, and that is why you see in the Bible, when it says, "Who do you want me to liberate, Jesus, who is the Son of the Father, or Barabbas, who is also the Son of the Father?" Who of the two, and then the people said, “Oh, oh, the ego of course, because we like fornication, we like anger, we like all of that, all of the crimes of Barabbas.”

Liberate Barabbas and leave Jesus who is without a sin, united there in the sixth dimension with Tiphereth, crucify him, and this is how we always say. We are always in favor of the ego, which is the Son of the Father too, because everything that comes from above, from the forces that we are explaining here, is from the Father.

That is why the Master Samael says that the ninth sphere, sex, is the source of gods, angels, human beings, animals, beasts, and demons. That force creates all of that, or you might say good and evil. No, it is just a variety of beings. Demons of course inhabited Klipoth, hell, inferno. That is their habitat, so we belong to Klipoth.

We want to go out of Klipoth. We want to be saved from the second death, which is the annihilation of Barabbas by the forces of nature. When the people say to liberate Barabbas and crucify Jesus, they are saying, "Let us go into hell, into Klipoth, because nature will disintegrate us in hell anyhow. We choose the Lunar Path,” but we the Gnostic say no, we do not want to choose the Lunar Path, death to Barabbas, or as we said in Egypt, “death to Seth and his red demons.” We want the death of Seth. (We want between quotations to state that this “Seth” here is not the third son of Adam and Eve. But what in Egyptian terms, is Barabbas.)

We want the death of Barabbas, the son of Abbas, but Jesus also is the son of Abbas, but in the positive way, you know, because there are two ways, the solar way and the lunar way. The solar way is the way of the initiation in which we take advantage of the two witnesses in order for the Son of God to appear within us, and that is the Son of Abbas in the positive way. This is why you have to understand, because there are many people that talk about how come Barabbas is the Son of the Father, and Jesus is the Son of the Father, too, but they have to understand the duality of the forces of the consciousness. One is free, and the other is bottled up into the sins of the initiate. Or as the Master Hilarion, which is Paul of Tarsus, stated, the heavenly man is Jesus. And Barabbas, the son of Abbas, is the terrestrial man, sin is Barabbas; behold the two forces, but one has to die and the other has to go up.

reply posted on 26-2-2011 @ 07:01 PM by ThePolishedKnob

This is some really instrestingsv stuff, this could be true but more likwey false

reply posted on 26-2-2011 @ 07:02 PM by ThePolishedKnob

This stuff is really intresting stuff, it could be true or most likely false

reply posted on 26-2-2011 @ 07:15 PM by TheForgottenOnes

Originally posted by ThePolishedKnob
This is some really instrestingsv stuff, this could be true but more likwey false

The book mentioned above, The Hiram Key, is probably one of the best put together books I have ever read, I suggest you read it, it details everything in a good timeline form, from ancient Egypt, to the Exodus of the Hebrews, from that to Jesus times, and from then to the Templars and finally Masonry, it is a very convincing book

reply posted on 27-2-2011 @ 11:38 PM by Lucifer777

Originally posted by TheForgottenOnes

.... The Hiram Key, is probably one of the best put together books I have ever read, I suggest you read it, it details everything in a good timeline form, from ancient Egypt, to the Exodus of the Hebrews, from that to Jesus times, and from then to the Templars and finally Masonry, it is a very convincing book

On historical methodology in the study of ancient and modern religions.

Lucifer

I do have a copy of the "Hiram Key" and it is a fasciating read and a glimpse into the minds of two Freemasons. It must be borne in mind that the two authors, Knight and Lomas are both Freemasons themselves, and that the last time I checked out the Masonic regalia (rather expensive customised fancy dress for their pantomime rites) shop across the road from the Grand Lodge in London, the book had pride of place in the window.

Many of Knight and Lomas' claims are ahistorical, fantastical, speculative and "special pleadings;" however some of the claims are just downright silly; for example the authors had come across the description of an Egyptian mummy with it's skull smashed in (how unsurprising), and they leap to the conclusion that this must be the body of the mythical Phonecian Hiram Abiff (lit. "king secret" or "secret king"), with the fantastical claim "We had intentified Hiram Abif, and what's more his body still exists (Page 176. of the 1997 Third edition)."

The book really deserves it's place in the "conspiracy theory" sections of bookshops rather than in the history section, and can be found alongside other religious conspiracy titles where authors have "discovered" that "Joshua" was a common name in ancient Israel (how unsurprising), and have written numerous conspiracy titles alleging that a such and such a person called Johsua was the real Jesus on the basis of texts referring some person with this name.

That an American Shriner Mason, "TheForgottenOnes," considers a fantastical conspiracy theory book to be "convincing," but is unconvinced by the numerous press allegations concerning the Shriners, would seem to indicate a certain attraction to the conpiracy theory method of discovering truth, where the more ahistorical a claim is, the more likely it is to be true, and the more historical an allegation is against his religion, the less likely it is to be true; this is really "National Enquirer" type historical methdology, where all fantastic claims made by the Enquirer must be true and all claims against them must be false.
______________

Above: page from a Masonic catalogue showing that the Masons are the inheritors of the sacred ancient Egyptian tradition of the Hula Hula Bull Dance.

Evidence that the ancient Egyptians did not perform the Hula Hula Bull Dance and many other Masonic rituals (such as the application of sacred whipped cream, holy strawberries and divine electric shocks to the genitalia during the intitiation rites of US Masons) will be either be discovered in the near or distant future, or has been destroyed to preserve the secrecy of such a sacred and holy act.

For anyone whose eyesight prohibits them from reading the text, musical bells which play different notes are attached between the crotch of each intiate of this sacred and holy Egyptian rite; the "operator" then prods the bells with a stick in order to play various tunes such as the ancient Egyptian classic "How dry am I;" "dry" being American slang for sober, indicating that that candidate has not reached the desired state of drunken stupor.
________________

It is certianly the case that modern esoteric societies have more in common with the mystery cults of the ancient world, where initation and sex magick were entwined and where priests and priestesses fulfilled the role of what the Biblical authors derogatorily referred to as sacred prostitutes, than the relatively modern and more boring and desexualised use of temples by the Muslims and Chistians. While I thoroughly approve of sexual initiation, Freemasonry on the other hand seems to be rather devoid of this in it's male only rites.

It is entirely commonplace for esoteric societies to claim to represent the mystery cults of the ancient world, just as many US college fraternities claim to be the inheritors of the Eleusian (Greek) mysteries, when they beat up their neophytes in drunken stupidity and force all manner of silly humiliating rituals upon them, just as numerous sects of the multi-billion dollar Jesus business claim to be the "true" representatives of a fictional first century religious schizophrenic, Jesus.

Simlarly with the "regular" Masonic franchises; they claim to represent the mystery traditions of the ancient world, and go to great lengths to clam that their product is a superior product, which offers better value for money in the esoteric marketplace, where fake degrees of knowledge are bought and sold, in comparison to all other "irregular" esoteric societies, and that their product is more "ancient."

I have listened to the almost endless debates between the adherents of regular and irregular esoteric sects over whose product is more ancient, and I have concluded that such claims are no more based on historical evidence than the hypothetical debate between a Gnostic Christian, a Catholic Christian and a Jimmy Swaggart acolyte over who best represents a fictional ahistorical character.

Only I, the eternal enemy of God, in all of human history represent the one true ancient, genuine and diabolical orthodox faith, and I offer to beat any price on salvation or your money back in the afterlife, plus 144 virgins (twice what the Muslims are offering).

If anyone is offered "more" than 144 virgins by any other enemy of God, please bear in mind that the offer is negotiable and can be increased if you get a better offer.

Lux.
Advocatus diaboli

edit on 27-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: The text was not diabolical enough. I seem not to be in a diabolical enough mood today. Not enough Christian Flesh and Blood to devour.

edit on 28-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: The text was "still" not diabolical enough.

Addendum

On the cult of the Secret King

Lucifer

It has occurred to me that I should address a central claim of Knight and Lomas' "Hiram Key" which is that "Hiram Abiff" was not a person's name but a title.

This is not a sensational "discovery," but it is merely an etymological (the root meanings of words) observation; since Hiram simply means "king" and Abiff simply means, approximately "secret, hidden from view, disgused, obscure, veiled, covert" etc.

Clearly, since the designation of the fabricated fraud of Christianity, as the official state religion of the alleged deocidal (god killer) Italians (who allegedly crucified the fictional Jesus), at the end of the 4th century A.D., all enemies of this vile religion have had, by necessity, become the part of counterculture, whose opposition to state religion threatened their very survival.

Organisations such as the medieval Knight's Templars had to be overtly Christian, and to covertly disguise their utter contempt for Christianity. The confessions extracted under unspeakable cruelty and torture from the Templars include confessions that they spat upon the cross and that they practiced ritual homosexuality. Any sane person would probably confess to sodomising the Holy Virgin under such hideous tortures; nevertheless I would have a much higher opinion of the Templars, were it established to be true that they really did spit upon the cross and engage in orgiastic sex, where their love for other men was less or more or equal to their love for women; for such is human nature.

The 16th century Jewish medical doctor Nostradamus, for example, who was almost certainly a Kabbalist and esotericist, was hounded by the Inquistition for referring to a statue of the Virgin Mary as a devil; such persons in ancient times had to be overtly Christian. Nostradamus clearly entertained a blasphemous and heretical belief, and an abomibinable heresy, that plague was not caused by the Jews and by the Devil himself, and that it could be treated by drinking boiled water, sleeping on clean sheets and fleeing from disease ridden towns. Clearly such matters are better left in the hands of religious fanatics than medical professionals (some of whom are Masons) who are obviously dangerous heretics, but only until the point where the reigious fanatic falls ill and calls an ambulance instead of a Christian exorcist.

It is a statement of the obvious to say that in the ancient world there were many kings, and that such kings were often subservient to other kings, and that there were various persons who considered themselves to be "kings of kings" and that all kings were susceptible to being poisoned, murdered, assassinated,etc.

Thus it make perfect sense to have a "HIram Abiff (Secret King);" a covert king who stood beind a puppet king. The puppet king could always be disposed of, poisoned, or he could just have an accident or fall down dead for numerous reasons. Another king would take his place and the secret king would continute to rule.

In Masonry we have the Duke of Kent as an overt Masoc king, and I wish him no harm and I pray to that he and his cousin lives a long and happy life, but I know that he and his cousin are intellectual imbeciles who do not appear in the sky (the Internet) to debate such trivial matters as to who their secret king is.

Part of the problem of joining a "secret king" cult is that one is unable to know who the real king is and to scrutinise him and to engage him in philosophical debate or observe him in the way that we can observe Christ's representative on earth (Jospeh Ratzinger) to all Catholics or the Anglican's representative on earth of Christ (HRH Elizabeth Windsor).

Lux

edit on 28-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: The text was not diabolical enough. I seem not to be in a diabolical enough mood today. Not enough Christian Flesh and Blood to devour.

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 02:41 AM by Lucifer777

reply to post by Lucifer777

Form and Content

Lucifer

My spelling, grammar and sentence construction is atrocious and an abomination against the English language, and I offer my sincere apologies.

In common with George W. Bush and Einstein, we so happen to have been dyslexics who have graduate and post graduate degrees from respected academic institutions. My non-dyslexia allows me to speed read books in a relatively short period of time, which take other people a lifetime; I do not suffer from reading dyslexia; I just type very fast. Don't confuse my impeccable spoken English with my typing dyslexia or my inability to miscomprehend the unbearable sophistry of religious fanatics, or the power of my invisible and invincible collegiate.

Lux

Advocatus diaboli

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 10:05 AM by KSigMason

reply to post by Lucifer777

The Hiram Key is a good read. I do enjoy both Christopher Knights and Robert Lomas. I first read "Uriel's Machine" by those two and I'm on my way to reading all of their books. I don't agree with all that they write, but its definitely a glimpse into a different point of view.

I've been in the Masons for a while and I've never seen the "Hula Hula Bull Dance". Plus that image doesn't mention anything about the Masons.

Except that the "confessions" pulled from the Templars were attained through torture which results in unreliable and often the inquisitors would lead the victim into what they wanted to hear. With the release of the "Processus Contra Templarios" the Vatican cleared the Templars of the charges held against them in the early 14th century. As far as I stand they were Knights of Christ.

The Grand Master of the UGLE is not a king nor is that his title in the Masons.

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 05:49 PM by Lucifer777

Originally posted by KSigMason
reply to post by Lucifer777

I've been in the Masons for a while and I've never seen the "Hula Hula Bull Dance".

"Sub rosa"

Perhaps you have not reached the level in Masonry where you are sufficiently trusted and valued to allow you to participate in the sacred and ancient Egyptian rite of the Hula Hula Bull Dance, the whipped cream and strawberries covered genitalia rite, or the mild electric shocks applied to the genitalia rite. Obviously such sacred and holy rituals have been preserved in secrecy since the age of Seqenenre Tao and are not revealed "willy nilly" to the rif raff.

The kind of argument which states "I have never seen a Catholic priest molest a child, therefore no Catholic priest has ever molested a child," can be extended to "I have never participated in the Holy and Sacred Hula Hula Bull Dance ritual, therefore the Holy and Sacred Hula Hula Bull Dance ritual does not exist." The "Shriners and Jesters" thread here is already littered with such "ad absurdum" arguments by the Masons.

Plus that image doesn't mention anything about the Masons.

The image is from the Masonic Internet site www.phoenixmasonry.org... .

The 1930 DeMoulin Bros. & Co.

Fraternal Supply Catalog No. 439

Burlesque and Side Degree Specialties;

Paraphenalia and Costumes

Pictured above is the cover of the 1930 edition of the DeMoulin Bros. & Co. catalog titled "Burlesque and Side Degree Specialties, Paraphernalia and Costumes." We believe that this was the best and last "side degree" catalog the DeMoulin Bros. produced, as this company suffered the same fate that many businesses did with the onset of the Great Depression. Today, they are one of the largest suppliers of marching band uniforms in the country. In the broken economy of the 1930's, the fraternalism items this company produced and sold were not considered a high priority on the "need or necessity" list of many Lodges. Yet, the side degree specialties that they sold were the very items that increased Lodge membership, their donations to charities and interest in "Lodge Life" itself. These side degrees added to the "degree of laughter" early Lodge Brethren engaged in when initiating new members! We have reproduced the DeMoulin Catalog here in its entirety. Pay particular attention to the various testimonials at the bottom on some of the below catalog pages. These testimonials were sent in by the Woodmen and Odd Fellow Lodges who purchased this paraphernalia and they described how it worked for them. (Note: Although Freemasons joke about "Riding the Goat" with their new initiates they never engaged in this activity inside of any Masonic Lodge.) In the end you'll see that the wholesome fun... "light hazing," endured by the candidates made them feel more apart of the Lodge and fostered Brotherly Love and Affection.

(Legal Notice: Be advised that Phoenixmasonry, Inc. will not be held responsible for any accidental property damage, injury or loss of life due to any irresponsible manufacture or use of the items listed in or made as a replica shown in this catalog or pictured on this website.)

www.phoenixmasonry.org...

Except that the "confessions" pulled from the Templars were attained through torture which results in unreliable and often the inquisitors would lead the victim into what they wanted to hear. With the release of the "Processus Contra Templarios" the Vatican cleared the Templars of the charges held against them in the early 14th century. As far as I stand they were Knights of Christ.

"Doublespeak"

When it is alleged that the Freemasons consider themselves to be "Christian Knights," this allegation that the Masons are part of the vile and hideous Christian religion is often denied, and then when the Freemasons are accused of being devotees of his "Satanic Majesty," it is often alleged that they are "Christian Knights."

The Grand Master of the UGLE is not a king nor is that his title in the Masons.

The current Masonic cult leader: "Grand Master Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, President of The Scout Association."

I did not in any way imply or state that the Duke of York is the Messianic King of Masonry; in the context of the claim by Knight and Lomas that "Hiram Abiff" is not a name but a title (i.e., "Secret King"), the Duke of Kent obviously could not be the Masonic Messiah, since clearly the Masonic King of Kings would be a "secret" king and therefore not a public figure.

Of course, I expect the usual denials along the lines of "I have never met His Satanic Majesty, therefore His Satanic Majesty does not exist."

The problem, in my judgement, is not that the Masons are a "Satanic," club, but rather that they are not Satanic enough, and are rather a cult of boring, silly old men who are giving me a rather bad reputation.

Lux
Advocatus diaboli horriblis

edit on 28-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: The text was not diabolical enough. I seem not to be in a diabolical enough mood today. Not enough Christian Flesh and Blood to devour.

edit on 28-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: Diabolus fecit, ut id facerem (The devil made me do it).

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 05:57 PM by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Lucifer777
The image is from the Masonic Internet site www.phoenixmasonry.org... ."

It would appear that they are cataloging various paraphenalia without regard to which fraternal orginization may have employed the props. I may be mistaken but it does not seem to offer any statement one way or the other on which group may have used the 'hula' costumes.

edit on 28-2-2011 by AugustusMasonicus because: Networkdude has no beer

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 06:18 PM by Lucifer777

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by Lucifer777
The image is from the Masonic Internet site www.phoenixmasonry.org... ."

It would appear that they are cataloging various paraphenalia without regard to which fraternal orginization may have employed the props. I may be mistaken but it does not seem to offer any statement one way or the other on which group may have used the 'hula' costumes.

Well of course, since Masons are sworn to secrecy, the Holiness and Sacredness of the ancient Egyptian rite of the Hula Hula Hoop Dance, and the playing of the most sacred hymn "How Dry Am I" on the bells attached to the crotches of candidates, is not to be discussed with the profane, worldly rif raf, on the penalty of the usual throat cutting, tongue removal and disembowelment.

Nb., The above cartoon is purely satirical and is for illustration purposes only to portray the kind of horrible and diabolical fate which awaits anyone who dares to speak of the holy and sacred Hula Hula Hoop Dance ritual.

Lux
Diabolus horriblus

edit on 28-2-2011 by Lucifer777 because: The text was not diabolical enough.

reply posted on 28-2-2011 @ 06:50 PM by WarmSun

What is a high level mason?

I thought jesus was a righteous man?

I don't get it.

reply posted on 1-3-2011 @ 10:49 AM by KSigMason

reply to post by WarmSun

The highest level is the 3rd degree and this thread is just a hypothetical.

reply posted on 2-3-2011 @ 10:35 AM by inregardstoo

If Christ where with us today would he turn water into wine at another wedding? During the time period when water was turned to wine there was a reason for such. Who would draw from the river Jordan to entertain their guest? I cant name one single person. Where those who married in that time period those who had some education and prestige? Why did they drink wine at a wedding or at a dinner table. Was the wine prefered over the the local tasty water works? of course it was and it was men of education and good works who made the wine. So for Christ to turn water into wine he would obviously had the knowledge of the process in making wine. The local water works where typically that of undereducated populous majority. So men of integrity distilled the wine as christ did on that day. The alcohol content in the wine nullified the germs in the water, which gave longer life to those classy folk of good taste in the time.

The reason the wine was distilled was for health in those times, and the larger popular preception of its consumption sadly was its side effects. This truth unfortunately holds true even in these times of high technology and widespread education unavailable in ancient times. So as the story of the celebration at the wedding tells of great consumption of wine which invites the idea of intoxication. For almost every miracle Christ performed there was a great misinterpretation of its intent on a the larger populace scale. Was not the blind man told not to tell of who healed him and so inevitably praised Christ. Did the Messiah know all these things during his ministry on Earth? Of course he did. For every miracle, no matter how good or great, there was the reaction of the overwhelmingly undereducated populace. If not for this, his fame would have only remained with that of the men who wanted all the power coupled with material to themselves.

In ancient times as well as our own, the children of classed individuals livelyhood depended upon the education received from their parents first and foremost. Without such teaching of such profound taste all the wonderful riches and sultries would wither away on the vine and become worthless as the larger perception of water to wine and what purpose it served. Are the young among merely the analogy of the blind man chasing after fruitless pleasures praise in intoxication without articulation in the true words Christ offered them. It is just as true today as it was then. Those who studied the meaning of what Christ performed are educated Masters. Those drunk in their simple pleasures praise what they dont understand as riches wither on the vine.

Who do you call Master? The disciples called him such. Did they become Masters themselves? If they did not, then you would not be reading this.

Touche, Love You All

reply posted on 5-3-2011 @ 10:23 AM by Lucifer777

Originally posted by inregardstoo
Who do you call Master? The disciples called him such. Did they become Masters themselves? If they did not, then you would not be reading this.

There is no evidence that anyone has ever had the "Seven Signs;" anyone who has ever claimed to have the Seven Signs has a been a charlatan and a fraud, just like the numerous modern day proponents of the multi-billion dollar Jesus business. Any person who "does" claim to have the Seven Signs, should consider applying for the James' Randi Institute's (Randi is a professional stage magician) one million dollar challenge, for proof of a miracle or psychic powers; so far none of the world's Messianic cult leaders nor the hundreds of millions of Christians have been able to provide scientific proof of being miraculaously able to cure leprosy, blindness, etc.

The Seven Signs (of a Christian Charlatan).

Lucifer

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
Mark 16.

Consider the 7 Signs of those who are allegedly "not" condemned according to the Gospel of Mark

1: You must believe.
2: You must be baptised.
3: You must be able to perform exorcisms.
4: You must be able to speak in New Tongues.
5: You must be able to pick up serpents.
6: You must be able to safely drink any deadly poison.
7: You must be able to lay hands on the sick and miraculously cure them.

If you do not have the 7 signs, you are allegedly condemned by the first century religious fanatic and fake healer Jesus and you won't get to spend all eternity with other fake healers and religious charlatans.

It was also stated by the Jesus of the Gospels that you would do even "greater things than he."

I think that the modern "belief only" and "Gnostic" positions on Jesus were probably developed because the professional Christian hypocrites realised that many of the teachings of Jesus were either too hard or impossible to follow, and that promoting the "actual" teachings of Jesus would make their non-product (the promise of eternal salvation essentially) hard to market..

We know that Christians cannot safely drink poison or miraculously cure leprosy and blindness, and since the professional Christian hypnotists know this also, they have just developed this much easier "belief only" theology, where you just become a rambling religious fanatic, talk incessantly about the teachings of Jesus, and yet reject the teachings of Jesus, apart from a few ethical maxims about love and so forth, which were common to that era; it seems to be just all about "believing" and about acting like a total hypocrite and being eternally rewarded for that.

Unfortunately many professional hypnotists of the multi-billion dollar Jesus business do claim to be able to perform miracles and simply prey on the sick, the elderly, the disabled and the vulnerable. In the competitive market place of Christian non products, often when a person is accused of being a fake healer and charlatan, other Christians will often say "Oh but that person is not a true Christian like me" however a true Christian "would" be a fake healer, a charlatan and an exorcist, since that is exactly what the Jesus of the Gospels told his followers to do.

Literary and Historical Criticism of the Bible.

A common response to the 7 signs is to argue that this text is a later addition to the Gospel of Mark; however this is generally just a "selective" argument which ignores the overall conclusions of Biblical historical and literary criticism; if such an argument is accepted, one may as well discard the entiretly of the Bible as an edited, re-edited and fabricated document. More on "Is the New Testament Fabricated & Fraudulent? on: www.davidicke.com...

The Dialogue Fallacy

The "dialogue" fallacy is a common fallacy used by Christians who simply selectively "cherry pick" and "quote mine" the Gospels for statements which they agree with and statements which they reject; those statements which they reject (such as no shoe wearing, no money carrying, no more than one robe, obey the (Mosaic) Law and the Prophets) are often responded to with the "dialogue fallacy," which is essentially the position that "some" of the unpopular teachings of the allegedly unchanging, perfect Jesus (whose teachings will allegedly last till the end of time) are not relevant today, and were only relevant to his contemporaries to whom he was referring; the "dialogue fallacy is a "fallacy" of course, because "all" of Jesus's teachings are in the form of dialogues where he was addressing other persons; thus one might as well reject the entirety of his teachings on this basis

Lux

"The criticism of religion is the premise of all criticism." Marx

edit on 5-3-2011 by Lucifer777 because: Image added

reply posted on 5-3-2011 @ 07:47 PM by KSigMason

reply to post by Lucifer777

You realize you just see the world in black and white. You take everything at literal value not looking at symbolic meanings.

God will not answer someone who is mocking Him in an attempt to cover some insecurities up. Just because your prayers haven't been answered in the way you want them doesn't mean God doesn't exist.

reply to post by TheForgottenOnes

If I've read right, Barabas is just a title to a man who was also said to have been called Jesus. So now we have two Jesus', one known as the Christ (the Savior, the Messiah) and Barabas (the Son of God). One was said to have been a peaceful protester against the establishment and one was said to be more violent in his rebellion.

reply to post by Lucifer777

Where does this dance occur then? In what body do I find the path to seeing this dance performed? The Shriners? And how is it you have come across this hazing ritual? Masonic rituals are solemn occasions not some stereotype of what college fraternities do.

That's great it came from Phoenix Masonry's site, but what context is it used in. Were they discussing silly conspiracies against them and had that picture as a display of absurdity.

Can you find me a modern catalog that has this stuff in it? I mean they would need a source to buy this stuff from as stuff does break and needs replacing.

So earlier you said I hadn't moved up far enough to see this ritual, but now you refer to it being used in the Lodge. How is that? Please stay consistent and use proper terms as not all bodies in Freemasonry are refereed to as Lodge. Oh, and Woodmen and Odd Fellows are not organizations under the Masonic umbrella.

Why is it everytime I lay down the cold hard truth you call it "doublespeak" and just pass it off. Rebut with actual evidence of your allegations of go away.

Only the Chivalric Orders have any Christian connotations in it, but we do not tie ourselves to a Christian denomination or an organized church, and that is only one body in the York Rite. It is still up to the individual to go to church. Not all Freemasons are a part of this organization. You can say that most members of the York Rite are a part of the Christian religion.

The Duke of Kent, the Grand Master of the UGLE, has no authority over me in any way as you have indeed inferred. He has an impressive list of orders he belongs to, but none of them put authority over Masons around the world as that would be a most grievous intrusion on the sovereignty of other Grand Masters around the world.

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