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FN P90 Replacing MP-5 anywhere?

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posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 12:06 AM
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When I first heard of the FN P90 I thought this gun was design and created to compete with the MP-5s Dominance of the sub machinegun market.I mean if you are anywhere near a good equiped SWAT team or Army in the world the MP-5 is somewhere in your inventory. The MP-5 spreads across country after country as one of the best choices in close combat weapons. I wanted to know If anyone has heard of the FN P90 replacing the MP-5 anywhere as its has been around for enough time to be test against the MP-5. I have found the P90 for sale at a cost of $1,378 for police or military personal only of course. I have yet to find the price of a MP-5 as you would buy it new from the factory yet. The pre ban versions are up around $5000 but thats not a fair comparsion as the price is gouged for pre ban guns.













posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 12:43 AM
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Why would it be replacing the MP-5 series ? it doesn't have as much stopping power as 9x19mm does. Besides, it can over penetrate your target pretty easy, meaning that it's not as good in the Hostage/CQB situations.


The MP-5 spreads across country after country as one of the best choices in close combat weapons.

Actually, the Russian AS/VSS (9x39mm) series are considered to be ones of the best CQB weapons.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 12:47 AM
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I don't know much about that russian weapon, but I dare say you ask anyone on a swat team or something like a SEAL team their choice of weapons, and 9 out of 10 times its going to be a HK weapon, they have cornered the market, and are even now churning out a M4 variant of their own that will no dobut be a successful weapon. Something about the way the p90 loads seems like it would be a little odd during cramps situations and under fire, but maybe thats just my perception as I havent had a chance to hold either a mp5 or p90 yet.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 01:00 AM
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The over penetration issue of the 5.7x28mm can be handled with the type of ammunition you use.Damage depends on ammunition. SS190 standard ball: 4d. SB193 subsonic ball: 3d or hollow point which are the only type of this round civilians can buy have no such problem. The 9mm round has never been really known for its stopping power. Some Swat/police forces find themselves comming across criminals that are using body armour as was the case in the north hollywood shootout the 9mm rd was far from powerful enough to deal with good body armour.

I never heard of the russian weapon you talk about do you have any info on it.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 01:13 AM
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found some nice info on sound suppressor of the p90 compared to some othe guns

Sound pressure levels (SPLs) of FN P90 personal defense weapon with and without Gemtech SP90 sound suppressor using SS190 supersonic and SB193 subsonic rounds. SBLs and first-round pop (FRP) are recorded as decibels.
Gun Caliber Suppressor Supersonic FRP Subsonic FRP
FN P90 5.7x28mm None 161g n/a 153h n/a
FN P90 5.7x28 Gemtech SP90 134g +0.2 120h +0.2
M4A1 5.56x45mm None 165e n/a 151f n/a
M1A1 5.56x45 Gemtech M4-96D 135e +0.8 119f +2.3
HK MP5 9x19mm None 157a n/a 155a n/a
HK MP5SD 9x19mm HK integral 127b +11.1 126b +13.0
Marlin 780 .22 LR None 143c n/a 140c n/a
Marlin 780 .22 LR Ciener Integral 124d +0.5 121d +0.8
a Winchester USA 115gr supersonic FMJ
b Samson 158gr subsonic FMJ
c Federal high velocity LR
d Hanson standard velocity LR
e 62gr M855 ball
f 55gr subsonic; Engel Ballistics Research, Rt. 2
Box 177C, Smithville, TX 78957
g SS190 supersonic ball
h SS193 subsonic ball

It is much quieter than the mp5 silenced and that is pretty amazing if you ever heard a mp-5 sd. It is even queiter than some surppressed .22 rimfire

P90



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 01:31 AM
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The thing about the MP5 is that it doesn't just come in 9mm but 10mm and .40 S&W as well. And while the MP5 is a tried-and true if the need for an even larger caliber is needed there is always the UMP in .45 ACP I wouldn't think it would be necessary to go past that caliber for a SMG and to the best of my knowledge thats as high a caliber as you can aquire in a SMG.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 06:27 AM
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I haven't heard of or, or would see why you'd prefer a P90 for CQB over an MP5 (what I would assume most SWAT scenarios play out as...).

Have you seen the MP7? That thing is all that comes to mind as an MP5 PDW replacement.


E_T

posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 08:31 AM
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Design of FN P90 is really quite different from others.
world.guns.ru...
...new round with enhanced penetration - the SS190. This round looks like scaled downt 5.56mm NATO round and forces the pointed, steel core bullet to the 600-700 meters per second at the muzzle, thus being capable to defeat standart CRISAT helmets and armour vests at reasonable distances (50-100 meters).

But comparing it directly to MP5 is like comparing apples to oranges, it's design goal is different than what was goal with MP5 at the time of its designing.

HKs answer/weapon designed with same goal is MP-7 PDW:
world.guns.ru...
The 4.6x30mm ammunition is loaded with spitzer-pointed, all-steel bullet with brass jacket. Bullet weight is 1.6 gramm (25 grains) and the muzzle velocity is 725 m/s (ca. 2400 fps). Manufacturer claims the 100% penetration of the CRISAT body armour (1.6mm of Titanium plus 20 layers of Kevlar) at the distance of 200 meters.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 08:40 AM
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Yeah the MP-5 might not have been the best comparison to the FN-P90 as the P90 is more of a mix of a submachinegun and a rifle. But I dont know of any police forces that use the MP-7. since they are targeting the FN-P90 toward police just as much as military I thought MP-5 but MP-7 is a better comparsion when police start to get them . Think it might replace M-16/M-4 that are used by some police force like LosAngels.



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 06:41 PM
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Originally posted by ShadowXIX
The 9mm round has never been really known for its stopping power.

That is why there is a 3rd burst mode on most of the Police/SWAT issued MP-5's.
Also, there are different 9mm rounds available (mainly the Swedish M39B), that have more penetration and/or stopping power than the standard 9mm, and even the .45 ACP


Some Swat/police forces find themselves comming across criminals that are using body armour as was the case in the north hollywood shootout the 9mm rd was far from powerful enough to deal with good body armour.

If I remember correctly, they were using their standard issue 9mm handguns (Glock, Beretta), and 12G shotguns, that didn't have enough range, nor power, to penetrate those armored targets.
If they wanted their rounds to go through the armor at those ranges, they shoudl've been using 7,62 or 5,56 AP/FMJ rounds (and yes, I do know that they didn't have any of that), not 9mm.


I never heard of the russian weapon you talk about do you have any info on it.

AS (Pic)
VSS



posted on Jul, 13 2004 @ 11:48 PM
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Cool gun Kaskad But it really seems to be more of a assualt rifle then submachine gun. Its seems to have more then a little influnce of AK design in it a good gun to copy parts from in the reliablity department.

The AS is optimized for high performance armor piercing 9x39mm thats a pretty nice size round the AK-47 only used a 7.62x39mm before they went with the AK-74 rd.

About the 9mm stopping power I think a seal put it best. "Some people complain about the 9mm lack of stopping power, After I put two in your chest and one in your head you wont be complaining''



posted on Jul, 14 2004 @ 03:16 AM
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Yeah, I fully agree with that, if you shoot some basta** in the eye with a .22, he won't be complaining either. It all depends on how you use it.



posted on Jul, 14 2004 @ 04:42 PM
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Originally posted by kaskad
Why would it be replacing the MP-5 series ? it doesn't have as much stopping power as 9x19mm does. Besides, it can over penetrate your target pretty easy, meaning that it's not as good in the Hostage/CQB situations.


The MP-5 spreads across country after country as one of the best choices in close combat weapons.

Actually, the Russian AS/VSS (9x39mm) series are considered to be ones of the best CQB weapons.


I don't get this over pentration concept, especially with a pistol round. Plus in 80% of close up fire fights the first round misses.



posted on Jul, 14 2004 @ 05:09 PM
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This pistol round (5,7x28mm) is pretty close in size to our 5,45x39mm assault rifle cartrige.



posted on Jul, 14 2004 @ 10:52 PM
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Yeah look at the clip for that thing. I seen a couple of them in the gun store they are expensive $1,300 bucks is a little much for a hand gun. Plus you need to be a law enforcement or a FFL holder.



posted on Jul, 16 2004 @ 08:29 AM
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MP5's are pretty much the anti terror weaspons now adays and frankly the guy who devolped it must of had one big bonus after releaseing it.
the MP7 looks nice doesnt it? wonder what it will hold up to in combat.



posted on Jul, 16 2004 @ 08:35 AM
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My favorite hand gun the glock 10mm handgun and the Colt 1911 .45 caliber the berretta 9mm is a toy gun it wont stop a man with one shot.



posted on Jul, 16 2004 @ 08:54 AM
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We digress...

A fairly recent article in World Guns mentions a few customers, but the information is still out of date.


Until recently, no concrete information was available as to sales and users of the FN subgun, except for vague reports of its acquisition bydi Arabia. But during the re-taking of the Japanese Embassy in Lima, Peru, on 22 April 1997, at least one silenced P90 was clearly seen in use by Peruvian forces.

The Tennessee State Police had a few that were issued to Emergency Response Teams, but I have not heard anyone mention them in two years. The MP5 in 9x19 (with 115gr JHP) is still the workhorse SMG.

FN was hawking them to law enforcement at last year's Shoot-Out at Blackwater, so they have not given up.



posted on Jul, 16 2004 @ 08:55 AM
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Ahh the FN P90, my favorite gun. It's about time more people started useing it. And most people thought it was a made up weapon on stargate SG1!



posted on Jul, 17 2004 @ 10:14 PM
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Thanks for the info Spectre thats what I was looking for. Ive seen that they been pushing the FN hard at law enforcement and wanted to know if they were buying them and if the officers were liking them.

thanks again




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