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outer-theism for servants, inner-theism for leaders

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posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 11:56 AM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware

Toaism for example, is a great communal understanding of ways of life and ethical/moral philosophy.


With a great method of Divination and interesting Gods and a solid and ancient system of alchemy for mystical transformation into the Diamond Body.

Nice talking to you.


edit on 29-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 11:58 AM
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reply to post by lowki
 



Atheists have few qualms about making oaths to satan


Lies and nonsense, reported to mods. Atheism isn't responsible for individual Atheist's actions, nor is it the cause for it. Atheism is simply a lack of belief in a God. This applies to any deity, including Satan.

Please stop spreading nonsense. For the sake of truth.



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:00 PM
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reply to post by Student X
 


Yup, like i've said, it would be better without the metaphysical deception.

"I can talk to dead people"
"I know the future"
"I know God's thoughts and desires"

That's my only argument. For man to stop dealing in the unknown and fooling gullible people.

Nice talking to you too.



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:03 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware

Yup, like i've said, it would be better without the metaphysical deception.


Armchair skeptics and atheists with no mystical experiences and no understanding of what mysticism is, are not qualified to make any determinations about metaphysics. But they are qualified to be anti-religious activists and scientism apologists.

The problem is, its hard to be a truth-seeker and an activist-apologist at the same time.

Nice talking to you too.


edit on 29-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:07 PM
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reply to post by Student X
 


That is very true. I'm waiting for a scientific theory to come out regarding God. It seems so far, no scientist is willing to present a theory.

Again, i'm happy to renounce my Atheism when evidence is presented. I'm not blinded by pride or arrogance. I'm willing to accept truth, I am willing to keep an open-mind.

I'm still not sure what to make of this "respected foe" feature. Can't decide whether it's a compliment or an attack. LOL.

I'm sure we'll meet again, laters.



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:15 PM
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Originally posted by krzyspmac

Originally posted by lowki
The reason no Buddhist can surpass Gautama is because he founded Buddhism,
and no Buddhist can do so, thereby will always be inferior.


Never heard that from my teachers but I guess it depends on the person.

As I know it, he didn't found buddism. His followers did. As with Jesus and almost any other big figure.


Lol, you don't even know the Story of Guatama Buddha?
He was a prince, that became a monk,
and got lots of followers.

Precepts and other rules for followers,
were begun during his lifetime.

Thereby he founded a whole order of being.



And, in buddism, you don't have to surpass anything. If you are trying to do so - you are not a Buddist
Trying to surpass anything is attachment. This leads to suffering and further gets you away from elightenment.

Actually in Buddhism everyone is seeking enlightenment,
but practically no one is allowed to achieve it,
as that would negate the seeking aspect.

Also Buddhism believe everyone is suffering,
and refuse to believe that people can be happy.

For instance at the monostary I told someone I was happy,
They looked at be baffled and said "No you must be suffering!"
And for at least half an hour they were attempting to cite various ways I should be suffering.
Eventually we agreed to disagree, or just dropped the topic entirely.




What you said is kind of a buddist philosopy wrapped in western dualism as in: x is either true or false, since you cannot surpass budda, he is better and therefore buddism must be outer-theistic because you are trying to be like him, and cannot.

That's at least part of it,
though the other part is the rules and regulations,
which are external and limit any serious adherents.

Monks aren't allowed to do much anything,
other than sit around and meditate.

no creation, no exploration.

Also they typically aren't allowed to have spiritual experiences,
since any kind of mental experience, is a flaw in the meditation,
"oh you had a mind-sensation?
let it go, forget about it, non-attachment.
you weren't meditating hard enough,
just note it in your mind,
and forget about it,
Vipassana"



Buddist philosophy is non-dualistic. You cannot wrap it around aristotelian logic.

You're the one that mentioned dualism.

However another things that Buddhists are discouraged from is personal abilities,
for instance I was told a story about a high monk who had a student,
and that student while meditating began to levitate.
The monk told them they were meditating wrong.

Yet in other stories, there are adept Buddhist which not only levitate,
but fly to other worlds, like Shamballah.

So in this sense there is certainly a double-standard,
stories about monk people with supernatural-abilities,
but you're heavily discouraged from getting any.
-----

With inner-theism, you can do whatever you set out to do,
any limits are set solely by yourself.

you can consult external sources of guidance,
but ultimately as a free willed being the choice is yours.
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: inner-theism free-will

edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by lowki
 


Oh, good luck with that one. Trying to convince a Bhuddist that they are really a Christian.

inb4 ****storm.

edit on 29/1/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Student X
 


That is very true. I'm waiting for a scientific theory to come out regarding God. It seems so far, no scientist is willing to present a theory.

you have yet to try my scientific experiment with the meditation on nothing, to be embraced by total-darkness and numbness or zero-mother.
can also do concentration meditation, meditating on a point, to be filled with light and energy or becoming one with ever-father,




Again, i'm happy to renounce my Atheism when evidence is presented. I'm not blinded by pride or arrogance. I'm willing to accept truth, I am willing to keep an open-mind.

Yet you have not replied or evaluated the logical evidence,
of how before something there is nothing.
thereby nothing gave birth to all else.

edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: dark, light



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:30 PM
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reply to post by lowki
 


Without the minds of other men, you are an Atheist by birth.

Every follower of religion is an atheist towards every other religion.

If God exists, he is an Atheist.

You can't logically prove whether a creator is necessary for our existence to take place for the same reason i can't prove a creator IS NOT necessary.

When you understand that rationale. You will understand why i won't renounce my Atheism until this is confirmed.

You don't know than infinity isn't the "reason" for our existence, you ASSUME a CREATOR. It's a pressumption. And not a rational pressumption.

Me saying infinity is true is the same as you saying God is true, neither is logically correct. It's unprovable.

You going to respond to all of my arguments here?
edit on 29/1/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by lowki
 


Without the minds of other men, you are an Atheist by birth.

Anthropological evidence actually would lead us to believe
that people are Animists in tribal settings.

With cave painting of animals and people,
magic spells for successful hunts.



Every follower of religion is an atheist towards every other religion.

?
if they already believe in a deity,
they are some kind of pro-theist.


If God exists, he is an Atheist.

Then they would be denying their own existence.
You probably mean they would be someone with a solipsist God complex.



You can't logically prove whether a creator is necessary for our existence to take place for the same reason i can't prove a creator IS NOT necessary.

necessary is a higher-order function,
things you need are air, water, food, sleep, social relations.

I'm saying that before 1, there is 0.
do you agree?



When you understand that rationale. You will understand why i won't renounce my Atheism until this is confirmed.

You don't know than infinity isn't the "reason" for our existence, you ASSUME a CREATOR. It's a pressumption. And not a rational pressumption.

perhaps that's your belief,
but I've not mentioned "presumptions"



Me sayinng infinity is true is the same as you saying God is true, neither is logically correct. It's unprovable.

Infinity is a valid concept in mathematics.

Also in terms of computer programming.
Can have infinite loops, and infinite functions.

An example in biology is reproduction,
when something is reproducible you can have infinite amounts of it,
or rather the quantity you have is not finite, but can be changed thereby infinite.



You going to respond to all of my arguments here?

where else? lol
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: additional responses



Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by lowki
 



Atheists have few qualms about making oaths to satan


Lies and nonsense, reported to mods. Atheism isn't responsible for individual Atheist's actions, nor is it the cause for it. Atheism is simply a lack of belief in a God. This applies to any deity, including Satan.

Yes exactly, they are a non-deity, just like a name or a piece of paper, having no value.



Please stop spreading nonsense. For the sake of truth.

I provided evidence,
of a mass of people partaking in ceremony,
in the video a man speaking to a crowd at an awards show,
raised their hands with the pinky and index extended as "horns"
then he prayed to satan for the continued success of music celebrities.

An atheist, having zero fear of any deity, due to their non-existance,
could easily believe it's just yet another cool thing to do,
for generating audience involvement at a concert,
thereby logically would be okay with participating.

I'm fairly certain most people of faith would not.
unless their beliefs were compliant.
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: added response



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:45 PM
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Originally posted by lowki
However another things that Buddhists are discouraged from is personal abilities,
for instance I was told a story about a high monk who had a student,
and that student while meditating began to levitate.
The monk told them they were meditating wrong.


How odd. To discourage psi is one thing, but to have it and be distracted by it is something else. Ideally, the manifestation of psi is used a marker; an indication that one is becoming liberated from the Wheel.

There can be no liberation without psi. I find it odd that any Buddhists would discourage its development, as opposed to encouraging its development but cautioning against being distracted by it.


edit on 29-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 12:54 PM
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reply to post by lowki
 



Anthropological evidence actually would lead us to believe that people are Animists in tribal settings.


Again, this is more metaphysical speculation, spirituality is the amalgamation of human inputs and emotion, it's what separates us from animals, what makes us "human".

This doesn't imply God. There is no logic-path to assert that it does.


With cave painting of animals and people,
magic spells for successful hunts.


There's always been myth throughout history, whether it be Neptune the God of the Ocean, or Mars the God of War; man has always personified what he does not understand, even volcanoes.

We now know better, we have a greater understanding of how the Earth functions, people have since dropped superstitions (well most of us)


if they already believe in a deity,
they are some kind of pro-theist.


Believing in a Deity (Deism)

Believing you know the correct thoughts and desires of the Deity is completely diffferent (Theism).

Agnostic Atheists admit they cannot prove whether God exists, but no man can go further and claim to know the desires of the deity.(What the Theist claims)

Atheists are therefore against this, no one knows the "colour" of a God they cannot prove to exist.

Every member of religion thinks that other religion's descriptions of God are wrong. They do not believe in other religions. Vague christians, sometimes say they ONLY believe in a God(Deism) then why label yourself with a dogmatic religion?(Theism)

I have a few points here, take your time with each.

Peace
edit on 29/1/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 01:07 PM
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Originally posted by Student X

Originally posted by lowki
However another things that Buddhists are discouraged from is personal abilities,
for instance I was told a story about a high monk who had a student,
and that student while meditating began to levitate.
The monk told them they were meditating wrong.


How odd. To discourage psi is one thing, but to have it and be distracted by it is something else.

It was a major motivator for abandoning Buddhism.



Ideally, the manifestation of psi is used a marker; an indication that one is becoming liberated from the Wheel.
There can be no liberation without psi.

Aye, I agree.



I find it odd that any Buddhists would discourage its development,

This is also a prominent belief in Hinduism.



as opposed to encouraging its development

I do encourage development.
As does the Orion Priesthood.

however many fear others being more developed than themselves,
just as many a peer group prefers to hold-back members,
so that they stay with the group,
much like crabs in a bucket.

Also in Hinduism, there are some stories of people with abilities,
used their abilities playfully, to the annoyance of others,
so the others forced them to forget their abilities,
only remembering when they were reminded.

I'm not sure the name of the deity,
but they had many abilities,
like changing size.



but cautioning against being distracted by it.

In Hinduism for Siddhu's the fear is distraction from moksha, liberation, or death.
Since they believe life is suffering, they just want to escape reincarnation.

Any kind of abilities, might make it more entertaining to live.
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: abilities

edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: Orion Priesthood



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 01:24 PM
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Originally posted by lowki

It was a major motivator for abandoning Buddhism.


I don't blame you. So now you wing it as a free-lance mystic?


however many fear others being more developed than themselves,
just as many a peer group prefers to hold-back members,
so that they stay with the group,
much like crabs in a bucket.


I guess those kinds of social distractions could make true liberation in this day and age a rare thing in Buddhism.


Also in Hinduism, there are some stories of people with abilities,
used their abilities playfully, to the annoyance of others,
so the others forced them to forget their abilities,
only remembering when they were reminded.


Fools! You can't have psi without a little bit of the trickster archetype manifesting. It comes with the territory. I guess liberation is rare in Hinduism nowadays too, if they let themselves be annoyed by that? I don't run in any Buddhist or Hindu social circles so I can't say how they fare. I'm a loner.


edit on 29-1-2011 by Student X because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 01:39 PM
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reply to post by lowki
 



My version of the myth was that the Buddha met a student at the bank of a river. The student demonstrated the ability to levitate and crossed the river. The Buddha asked why didn’t he use a boat. There was no right or wrong but the comment indicates it was better to focus on achieving true enlightenment.
I believe that these siddhis are important signposts on the way to enlightenment.



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by tiger5
reply to post by lowki
 



My version of the myth was that the Buddha met a student at the bank of a river. The student demonstrated the ability to levitate and crossed the river. The Buddha asked why didn’t he use a boat. There was no right or wrong but the comment indicates it was better to focus on achieving true enlightenment.

Actually that story makes no mention of enlightenment.
It does imply that using a boat is better than levitating.
Since Buddha clearly ignored the accomplishment.

Though if people don't carry around a boat with them,
it would certainly be faster to levitate over a river.



I believe that these siddhis are important signposts on the way to enlightenment.

Unfortunately Buddhists have no clear definition of enlightenment,
and thereby no way of verifying it has been achieved.
it is usally defined as the negation of feelings.
So any rock is by that definition enlightened.
As is any statue of Buddha.
Since statues have no desires.

I see Buddhism as fundamentalist Hinduism.
Simply with mildly different terminology.

Nirvana's description is the same as Moksha.
The halting of reincarnation, and all other sensations.
Much like the embrace of Ying or zero-mother.
Sometimes it is described as being one with an all-force,
much like being filled with Yang or ever-father.

When I say I was enlightened,
I mean that I reconnected with my soul,
and my soul memories began to pour in.


I'm not presently aware of having any overt supernatural physical abilities,
though that's mainly since I haven't magic spell cast for them.
Though I do have covert abilities, which are easy to hide.
Things that can't be "proved" are generally safe,
such as remote-viewing, akashic-records.

In north america, people with overt supernatural abilities,
frequently get abducted by intelligence agencies.
There are movies to demonstrate that point.
As well as whistle-blower documents.

Hence my plan is neo-tribalist seasteading,
in a group of supportive peoples,
at a safe location.

We can develop abilities and technologies,
such as hydrogen power and tele-abilities.
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: covert supernatural abilities safe



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 02:47 PM
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Hehe I will not comment on your expierences with buddism in Thailand. I have some experience with zen buddism in context of Japan and I can speak for that. I will not become a monk since I believe I can do all that without that one thing. Time will tell if I change my mind.

And many dogmas and ceremonies as well as "schools" which are the basis of monasteries have evolved during time and are prone to interpreteations. If you say you know all about buddism and yet you say buddists are forbidden or discouraged from attaining enlightenment - I will not comment since it's of no use. I, my friends, my sangha and my teachers disagree and it's not my place to tell anyone what to think.



posted on Jan, 29 2011 @ 03:00 PM
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Originally posted by Student X

Originally posted by lowki

It was a major motivator for abandoning Buddhism.


I don't blame you. So now you wing it as a free-lance mystic?


Well actually after Thailand,
where I saw total environmental devastation,
they have no more pristine jungles, the monkeys and tigers are gone.
all the valleys are filled with little western style towns,
where Thai people dress up like Americans.

So I got back to Toronto, Canada, where we have lots of nature,
and I started to take more walks to the park,
focusing on forest-gardening,
and living in co-operation with nature.

I continued doing meditation daily for a while,
but eventually my mind was blank,
and that was really boring,
my Psi was gone.

I went back to being a Eclectic Wiccan, doing magic spell casting.
Performing meditation whenever it be beneficial,
but otherwise following a "middle path",
little bits from many different systems.

To help maintain this balance,
I live by a hexadecimal calendar,
where each day focuses on a different chakra.
www.scribd.com...

that way I have days for being calm,
for making choices,
for gardening,
for technology,
for meetings,
and so on.




however many fear others being more developed than themselves,
just as many a peer group prefers to hold-back members,
so that they stay with the group,
much like crabs in a bucket.


I guess those kinds of social distractions could make true liberation in this day and age a rare thing in Buddhism.
I don't run in any Buddhist or Hindu social circles so I can't say how they fare.

I was referring to just about any peer-group,
typically attempts to keep members at like vibrations.

my geeky friends from high-school are still geeky,
and we don't have much ways of relating,
though we still attend parties together,
and they are amazed by my talks,
but don't contribute much,
other than open-minds.
*shrugs*
I have many other groups of friends.
Though it's pretty similar.

Perhaps it's my fault,
for not talking about their interests,
however frivolous they may seem to me.





Also in Hinduism, there are some stories of people with abilities,
used their abilities playfully, to the annoyance of others,
so the others forced them to forget their abilities,
only remembering when they were reminded.


Fools! You can't have psi without a little bit of the trickster archetype manifesting. It comes with the territory. I guess liberation is rare in Hinduism nowadays too, if they let themselves be annoyed by that?

Dieing didn't take much skill last time I checked lol.

based on Michael Newton's hypnoregression research,
a soul can opt to stay in the spirit realm for a long time.
If they really don't want to incarnate.

Also some higher-dimensional beings,
such as Ra, don't have bodies,
opting to float around,
and influence people.



I'm a loner.

This is a fairly common nowadays,
many are too busy with wage-slavery.
or passive forms of entertainment.

At least you socialize on forums,
it requires some brain power.
:-)
On this thread you are my ally,
I appreciate by starring your posts
and I added you to my ATS friends list.
edit on 29/1/11 by lowki because: open minds



posted on Jan, 30 2011 @ 07:57 AM
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reply to post by lowki
 



Also some higher-dimensional beings,
such as Ra, don't have bodies,
opting to float around,
and influence people.


Seriously? You don't mind saying these things? You're happy just to tell people these things without verifying yourself?

higher dimensional beings.... While there is much science doesn't understand and maybe cannot comprehend, this is just nonsense. You can't prove what your talking about.

I came to this thread to correct your idiotic propaganda regarding Atheists.

Stating that we don't have a problem making an oath to Satan. What a load of nonsense you talk, most Atheists i know are left-wing liberal humanists. Lets get this straight, Atheists lack a belief in a deity, this includes Satan.

I hope you sleep well at night with what you spread around these forums.

By the way, don't claim my ignorance, the nonsense you talk would not be repeated by any thinking person. Or any person who cares for academia.
edit on 30/1/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 30 2011 @ 11:14 AM
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Originally posted by krzyspmac
If you say you know all about buddism

not all, but I have experience being a buddhist monk in a buddhist country.
Theraveda Buddhism, the kind practiced in Thailand,
is supposed to be the closest to Buddha's teachings.
Being the only surviving ancient strain,
from 250 B.C.E.
en.wikipedia.org...



and yet you say buddists are forbidden or discouraged from attaining enlightenment - I will not comment since it's of no use. I, my friends, my sangha and my teachers disagree and it's not my place to tell anyone what to think.

Are they enlightened?
Do they know anyone personally who is?

Hey there are different flavors of Buddhism,
who knows, maybe a newer one is more open.

Even the Dalai Lama is "seeking enlightenment",
or has not achieved it in it's entirety.
uk.answers.yahoo.com...


Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by lowki
 



Also some higher-dimensional beings,
such as Ra, don't have bodies,
opting to float around,
and influence people.


Seriously? You don't mind saying these things? You're happy just to tell people these things without verifying yourself?

I have verified,
by personally communing with Ra.

You have not verified any of the experiments,
nor have you replied to any of the logical arguments.



higher dimensional beings.... While there is much science doesn't understand and maybe cannot comprehend, this is just nonsense. You can't prove what your talking about.


Actually there are documented channellings or "proof".

From the Law Of One


14.25 Questioner: How do you normally perform your service of giving the Law of One? How have you done this over the last 2,300 years? How have you normally given this to Earth people?

Ra: I am Ra. We have used channels such as this one, but in most cases the channels feel inspired by dreams and visions without being aware, consciously, of our identity or existence. This particular group has been accentuatedly trained to recognize such contact. This makes this group able to be aware of a focal or vibrational source of information.

source lawofone.info...




I came to this thread to correct your idiotic propaganda.

I hope you sleep well at night with what you spread around these forums.

Hey, same goes to you, my friend.
I am here empowering people.
I sleep very well thank you.
I am loved and cherished.



By the way, don't claim my ignorance, the nonsense you talk would not be repeated by any thinking person.

Wow, so now you're dehumanizing me. *sighs*



Or any person who cares for academia.

If you believed in academia or science,
you would have done the scientific experiments,
and responded to the logical arguments.
edit on 30/1/11 by lowki because: empowering people

edit on 30/1/11 by lowki because: englightenement?

edit on 30/1/11 by lowki because: more sources



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