America Going Stupid

reply to post by EssenSieMich


One of the reasons why I filter and let my drinking water rest overnight before drinking.

Danke für die Verbindung. Sehr informativ.

Originally posted by bluemirage5
Obama says the USA is 9th in the world. They are not; try 14th:

www.guardian.co.uk...

If you follow the lines, 14th at reading, 25th at math, 17th at science.

I saw on a news show, the news anchor talking to a teacher addressing the math rankings, and she kept saying they were concentrating on reading to build the math skills WTF?!?? He couldn't even get her to say "math".

I can read very well, and my math skills are horrible. On the other hand, my son is a math whiz, top of his classes in maths and sciences, and his reading and writing skills are horrible. A person cannot learn math, by reading :shk:

Canadian kids probably watch as much TV as American kids, yet we scored high on all three subjects. I blame the education system. I've heard teachers down there argue about science courses about evolution and creationism. To the point that it's on the news. Up here, they say both are just theories. If a teacher teaches either of these as "fact", it's going to bring down the science ratings.

Educational requirements for teachers should be stricter.

reply to post by snowspirit


The TV is definitely not to blame here. Other countries proficient in math and science have TVs as well. Parents have the power to turn it off. The problem is that here they don't.

In any major evolutionary process, the majority will not benefit; they will be sick and die out early. If we're sensitive enough, we see this all across the board out in the real world ... right NOW.

One of the ways we see this is via educational/intellectual potential. While I would agree the majority are performing at a sickening level, there are some who have made huge evolutionary leaps and are quite beyond the standards.

I'm in a high-middle class area, and there's still a bunch of morons around, but I've met some individuals, adults and children, who are pretty much off the charts as far as any standardized test could measure. They are processing very deep, very quickly, and see nothing but potential out there right now.

Sometimes you just gotta let it roll and push on through. Is this fair? What is?! It's only as fair as you choose to perceive. We're all setting the parameters by choice, so basically ... wtf ever.

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
reply to post by snowspirit

 

The TV is definitely not to blame here. Other countries proficient in math and science have TVs as well. Parents have the power to turn it off. The problem is that here they don't.

I think it was Homer Simpson, that said "how can TV be bad, it's raised so many kids".
Time limits are good, plus making sure the kids do their homework before TV.

Although, my son's grade school teacher told us parents to not monitor the homework for grade 4, because he wanted to teach the kids responsibility for themselves, and if homework wasn't done, he wanted to have the option of talking to them, in front of the class about them not doing their homework. He was a great teacher and a real good parent himself. He motivated the kids very well, and got involved with them and their families, to the point that he would do halloween and Xmas parties for parents and kids at his home to get to know everyone. His lessons stuck with the kids, I'm sure.

Teachers need to really care about teaching, and not look at it as "just a job".

TPB do not want smart kids. The ones that are smart are ignored.

My daughter is in gifted. I do not believe she is gifted, I just took time with her.

She was reading before she went into kinder garden. She is in 4th grade now.

When I was a kid, gifted class was academics. NOW, the gifted do nothing of the sort.

They watch movies, they watch commercials and are taught to see the deception in them. NOTHING academic.

Here is AZ they are saying, well if they are gifted, they do not need more education.

YET the schools here in AZ are SOOO behind. Where I live at least a quarter of the school kids are illegal.

A lot can not read, so the class is WAY behind. So it is up to ME to supplement my daughters education.

Its not hard to be a gifted kid in this state! If I took my daughter to a school back East she would probably be average. Then again, that was years ago so do not know if that has changed back East.

They do NOT want our kids to learn. Kids that get good grades are rewarded by not having to do any homework.
The homework keeps you learning! I make my daughter do it anyway!

It is sad what has happened to the schools here. All the home taxes we pay , a large portion is supposed to go to education, but I do not see. it. 44 to 50 students in a classroom, with one teacher, and some of the kids do not speak English. Yeah, that is learning.

Originally posted by snowspirit

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
reply to post by snowspirit

 

The TV is definitely not to blame here. Other countries proficient in math and science have TVs as well. Parents have the power to turn it off. The problem is that here they don't.

I think it was Homer Simpson, that said "how can TV be bad, it's raised so many kids".
Time limits are good, plus making sure the kids do their homework before TV.

Although, my son's grade school teacher told us parents to not monitor the homework for grade 4, because he wanted to teach the kids responsibility for themselves, and if homework wasn't done, he wanted to have the option of talking to them, in front of the class about them not doing their homework. He was a great teacher and a real good parent himself. He motivated the kids very well, and got involved with them and their families, to the point that he would do halloween and Xmas parties for parents and kids at his home to get to know everyone. His lessons stuck with the kids, I'm sure.

Teachers need to really care about teaching, and not look at it as "just a job".

You just made me flash-back to my math class in High School. I had a teacher who presented the subject in such a boring way, that I was struggling to stay awake in class. It was difficult enough to grasp the mathematical problems, but to battle sleepiness at the same time was quite the challenge. She had absolutely no passion for the subject. If she did, she certainly didn't show it. I can still hear her monotone voice as she scribbled slowly on the chalk board. It's not that she was a bad person, but I don't believe she knew how to teach in such a way that it would involve the students and get them thinking. Your son was lucky to have such an engaging teacher. There are very few of those. I came across some during my educational years, but I'm sad to say that most of my teachers were "doing their jobs" only well enough to stay employed.

We recently moved from one school district to another. In the first my second grader was the smartest kid in the class and at the top in the gifted program. This was among a population that I would call blue collar (rural working people). In the new district he had to work to prove that he belonged in the gifted program, and he barely qualified. This district's population are mostly more affluent professionals, and their children are simply brilliant.

The hard reality is that genetics matters the most, and the culture of the family is second. The problem is that the higher class people are not breeding and the lower class people are. I believe that as a country we are beginning to separate into two genetic stocks, the rulers and the underclass, and the underclass are growing in numbers rapidly. In essence, Idiocracy is the direction we are headed.

Let's give the kids a break. I see what my fourth grader brings home and it is far advanced from the same concepts that i was taught at that level. He is still able to learn it, but not without a large investment of my time. I think there is so much more to be taught than there was 20 years ago. The education system has failed to acknowledge this and thus most kids can't achieve what is expected. We need longer school hours or more grade levels. I think entering college at age 22 would be beneficial as whole.

Originally posted by amatrine
TPB do not want smart kids. The ones that are smart are ignored.

The dumber they are, the easier they are to control. I think history is proof of that.

My daughter is in gifted. I do not believe she is gifted, I just took time with her.

She was reading before she went into kinder garden. She is in 4th grade now.

When I was a kid, gifted class was academics. NOW, the gifted do nothing of the sort.

In some areas of the U.S. they've had to reconsider their standards based on a curve. If your daughter speaks English and is able to read, sadly she's already considered ahead of that curve. The standards and expectations have dropped beyond belief. Frankly, if we're going to take in illegal children who don't speak English, maybe it's time to separate them into different classrooms so that the English-speaking students can progress while the others go at their own pace as they learn the language. To hold back the entire class for the sake of a few is unacceptable.

They watch movies, they watch commercials and are taught to see the deception in them. NOTHING academic.

Well, I guess it's good to be exposed to the deception of commercials and to recognize double speak, but I wouldn't consider that too academic. It's important, but certainly shouldn't be the only focus.

Here is AZ they are saying, well if they are gifted, they do not need more education.

YET the schools here in AZ are SOOO behind. Where I live at least a quarter of the school kids are illegal.

A lot can not read, so the class is WAY behind. So it is up to ME to supplement my daughters education.

It seems like you don't have a lot of options in Arizona. It must be difficult knowing that her school is nothing more than a babysitting service. Sometimes you have to take matters into your own hands if you want them to be done right. The only other option is to move to an area where schools are better, but I know that's not always an easy thing to do.

Its not hard to be a gifted kid in this state! If I took my daughter to a school back East she would probably be average. Then again, that was years ago so do not know if that has changed back East.

They do NOT want our kids to learn. Kids that get good grades are rewarded by not having to do any homework.
The homework keeps you learning! I make my daughter do it anyway!

It is sad what has happened to the schools here. All the home taxes we pay , a large portion is supposed to go to education, but I do not see. it. 44 to 50 students in a classroom, with one teacher, and some of the kids do not speak English. Yeah, that is learning.

Sometimes I think that American society is becoming much too selfish and short-sighted. Everyone is concerned with only their own problems, and they don't look at the big picture. Maybe the teacher is thinking "I just need to get through this day. It's a job that pays the bills" when what she/he should be thinking is "I have to get these kids to learn algebra or biology so that they have at least some understanding of this world that will prepare them for the future". The superintendent, the school board, politicians and all the rest of them in charge probably go through life the same way. They're concerned with their image and the here and now instead of caring about the futures of these kids. Of course if parents don't put in the work, the school has less to work with.

I can tell you right now that money is not the issue. They have plenty of money, but it is misplaced. It goes to bloated salaries, bloated pensions of all who are involved, and not enough of it reaches the actual classroom. Also, money isn't going to solve disciplinary problems. If kids were raised/disciplined properly and responsibly, they could be sitting in a wooden shed on the floor, and they'd still be able to learn algebra! Why? Because they would be motivated to pay attention in class and do what is expected of them. If they don't want to be punished, they will do as they are told. Unfortunately they have no fear of their parents or teachers, because they know you can't or won't touch them. There are no consequences to their misbehavior, or at least not significant enough to make them stop misbehaving. That's the problem. Of course they love to scream about the lack of money. They love to blame money problems for the poor performance of students. This is nothing but bull.

Originally posted by Grumble
We recently moved from one school district to another. In the first my second grader was the smartest kid in the class and at the top in the gifted program. This was among a population that I would call blue collar (rural working people). In the new district he had to work to prove that he belonged in the gifted program, and he barely qualified. This district's population are mostly more affluent professionals, and their children are simply brilliant.

The hard reality is that genetics matters the most, and the culture of the family is second. The problem is that the higher class people are not breeding and the lower class people are. I believe that as a country we are beginning to separate into two genetic stocks, the rulers and the underclass, and the underclass are growing in numbers rapidly. In essence, Idiocracy is the direction we are headed.

I'm sure genetics has a bit to do with it, but it may also have something to do with the fact that the people from the upper class are highly driven achievers and expect the same from their children. If the family has earned success over a couple of generations, it's expected that their children will attend the same schools and keep the family business going. Their expectations are higher, therefore their achievement must meet those expectations. Not everyone in the upper class can live up to those high expectations, but they sure do try. They have the money to hire the best tutors and go to the best schools. For them that's what it's all about.

Originally posted by sligtlyskeptical
Let's give the kids a break. I see what my fourth grader brings home and it is far advanced from the same concepts that i was taught at that level. He is still able to learn it, but not without a large investment of my time. I think there is so much more to be taught than there was 20 years ago. The education system has failed to acknowledge this and thus most kids can't achieve what is expected. We need longer school hours or more grade levels. I think entering college at age 22 would be beneficial as whole.

A break is the last thing kids in some parts of the U.S. need. They've had too much of a break, and that's why the results came back the way they did. When I was in fourth grade in Germany, I was expected to learn physics! Are fourth-graders in the U.S. learning physics? I don't think so. We're lucky if they can read at that age, much less calculate the expansion of rail road tracks when it's 90 degrees outside. We have five basic subjects; Math, Science, English, History and maybe Art. We're not pushing quantum mechanics down their throats, it's just Algebra! We don't expect them to invent a new chemical substance, we'd just like them to know about some basic elements! We don't expect them to write a dissertation on the English language, we'd just like them to be able to read! I know some adults who still don't know how to read fluently in their own language. Sometimes I hear them read out loud, and it's painful to listen. It takes them 10 minutes to get through one page.

What exactly is your kid having trouble with, that you must spend so much time teaching him? Some kids are going to excel in one subject and fall behind in another. Nobody is perfect. I've had my share of problems. Hell, until I came to the U.S. I was an inch from failing English class. Look at me now! Sometimes it's not the subject that's the problem, sometimes it's the way the subject is being taught to your kid. A good teacher will always find a way to teach so the student understands. Some of our brains are wired differently, and a different approach must be taken to achieve understanding.

Its because of all the brainwashing and inbreeding going on in america, most americans are sheep, they do owhat they are told by their government , they have lost their will to think freely and over the years have become mindless drones while getting fvcked up the ass by their own leaders

reply to post by 2manyquestions


Our society has been intentionally trying to be "DUMBED" down. Looks like it might be working. And I'm with you guys on this fluoride subject! This is one of the worst toxins they could ever have put in our EVERYTHING.

And I understand Teachers get monitary incentive to put the children on ADHA disorder drugs. Which is a crying shame!

here is the problem in a nutshell


we have a broken society with double standards and broken policies . We have these half ass parents teaching there kids half ass morals , values , education , principals etc . These half ass kids grow up and have there own children. Now you have the half ass kids having more half ass children . and the vicious cycle continues till they get dumber and dumber



We need a licence or a test to see if one should be able to pass there genes on and taint the earth more. Or would that just be social darwinism ? Dammit now i feel like hitler





case closed lol

reply to post by 2manyquestions


There are lots of factors that contribute to the overall decline of intellectual and educational advancement in our society right now, but for my money -- the biggest factor is the endemic anti-intellectualism in our media and social structures. Even on this site, it is not uncommon to read poorly constructed arguments which lack elementary sentence structure, and the usage of proper grammatical forms, never mind logic or clear thinking.

Structurally, I am not sure what to blame. I was raised on heavy metal and punk rock, so I hesitate to blame popular or rap music, text messaging or MTV (we had that too). What I didn't see much of as a child were people who openly declared their own stupidity, and seem to be "proud" of it somehow. I'm sure it existed, of course, but it wasn't celebrated or applauded, let alone institutionalized like it is today.

I'm at a loss, to be perfectly honest. One thing is certain: The distance between "have's" and "have not's" is increasing all the time, and I believe a big part of the problem is that many of us hate to "learn" anything, and demand the right to be "heard," even when their thoughts and opinions are nonsensical, poorly reasoned or explained, or just plain gibberish.

It's frightening.

Originally posted by 0zzymand0s
reply to post by 2manyquestions

 

I believe a big part of the problem is that many of us hate to "learn" anything, and demand the right to be "heard," even when their thoughts and opinions are nonsensical, poorly reasoned or explained, or just plain gibberish.

It's frightening.

It's strange that we in the "western" countries have such an aversion to learning, and when we see on the news, kids from other developing countries, that are now being "allowed" to go to school, they are sitting in makeshift classrooms, eager to learn anything they can.

Sometimes I think that American society is becoming much too selfish and short-sighted. Everyone is concerned with only their own problems, and they don't look at the big picture. Maybe the teacher is thinking "I just need to get through this day. It's a job that pays the bills" when what she/he should be thinking is "I have to get these kids to learn algebra or biology so that they have at least some understanding of this world that will prepare them for the future". The superintendent, the school board, politicians and all the rest of them in charge probably go through life the same way. They're concerned with their image and the here and now instead of caring about the futures of these kids. Of course if parents don't put in the work, the school has less to work with.

I can tell you right now that money is not the issue. They have plenty of money, but it is misplaced. It goes to bloated salaries, bloated pensions of all who are involved, and not enough of it reaches the actual classroom. Also, money isn't going to solve disciplinary problems. If kids were raised/disciplined properly and responsibly, they could be sitting in a wooden shed on the floor, and they'd still be able to learn algebra! Why? Because they would be motivated to pay attention in class and do what is expected of them. If they don't want to be punished, they will do as they are told. Unfortunately they have no fear of their parents or teachers, because they know you can't or won't touch them. There are no consequences to their misbehavior, or at least not significant enough to make them stop misbehaving. That's the problem. Of course they love to scream about the lack of money. They love to blame money problems for the poor performance of students. This is nothing but bull.

It is true. If you read the Arizona forums here, teachers are complaining about how unruly the kids are. No respect. Impossible to teach. You have kids that threaten the teachers and their families . I see it all the time, parents who let their kids do what they want. They do not correct them. When they get in trouble the parents defend the kids instead of correcting them. This "my family can do what they want" mentality. It is an epidemic.

My neighbors next door moved here from Apache Junction where one of their kids was a target on a day 15 kids brought guns to class in a high school there. Now they home school. I think when my daughter hits Junior High I will as well. The HS here is full of gangs and drugs. White kids are beaten up bad there just for being white.
No way I am sending here to that. They are not schools, they are juvie detention centers!

Originally posted by sligtlyskeptical
Let's give the kids a break. I see what my fourth grader brings home and it is far advanced from the same concepts that i was taught at that level. He is still able to learn it, but not without a large investment of my time. I think there is so much more to be taught than there was 20 years ago. The education system has failed to acknowledge this and thus most kids can't achieve what is expected. We need longer school hours or more grade levels. I think entering college at age 22 would be beneficial as whole.

What kind of school does he go to?

reply to post by EssenSieMich


Meant 47? FFFF...or...TY versus FFFF...if...TY. Slip of the tongue? It's a small difference in sound. Not quite as drastic as "putting food on your family" though along those lines. Of course, the teleprompters do put people on automode...hense the ridiculous comment I heard on Fox about the "Rouge Nation" (instead of Rogue) of North Korea...unless they were making a quip about rouge > red > communist...though far be it for Fox to use a peppering of witty French words in their dialogue