A question for all the "2012" non-believers

i have a 2 1/2 week old daughter which was planned with my girl . if 2012 is real i would have thought maybe i shouldn't but since 2012 is B.S i'll be getting ready for Christmas 2012 with my daughter for the 2nd time .. i can't believe someone actually thinks something will happen ..

To be perfectly honest, I have no idea what will happen. So many believe that SOMETHING will, so maybe it will be a self fulfilling prophecy. I do know that there are things going on that are out of the ordinary. The floods in Australia, mass animal deaths, winter storms that are much worse than normal, many more things we here at ATS have noticed. Maybe it will take a world wide cataclysmic event to get man back to where he needs to be. Maybe if we had to start over, we would try harder to get it right. I wish we could get our governments to do what is right for the people, and not for who ever has the most money. But, you know that old saying: wish in one hand... I think we all know that if something were going to happen, they would keep it from us as long as possible, save their own asses and hope to rule over whatever was left. But who would listen to the very people who sacrificed us to save themselves? If it does come about, it will be the worst event we have ever, as a race, had to go through. There will be billions dead and toxins released that could ruin this planet for thousands, if not millions of years. The people of this planet ARE waking up to the fact that their elected leaders are nothing but crooks in nice suits, and in many cases are doing something about it. But is it too late? If it's an asteroid or comet, we're out of luck, no way to stop it. The sun, a giant flare, same thing. No where to hide. We have less than 2 years to wait and then we will know.

reply to post by ThreeDeuce


i wasnt because i onl y learnt about 2012 three years ago.
a reason why alot of other people didnt is because this story only really started to gain interest in this in the past few years

More Verses From The Quran -

"055.037
YUSUFALI: When the sky is rent asunder, and it becomes red like ointment:
PICKTHAL: And when the heaven splitteth asunder and becometh rosy like red hide -
SHAKIR: And when the heaven is rent asunder, and then becomes red like red hide.

055.038
YUSUFALI: Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
PICKTHAL: Which is it, of the favours of your Lord, that ye deny? -
SHAKIR: Which then of the bounties of your Lord will you deny?"

Source - www.usc.edu...


Seems Like Nemesis To Me........

reply to post by CuteAngel


I really hope you realize scriptures are written by man and those "predictions" are nothing but pure speculation. There's not a shred of evidence backing up scripture...you'd have to be a completely blind sheep to believe that nonsense

Originally posted by ThreeDeuce
Why weren't you attempting to disprove 2012 BEFORE the Y2K scare?

Oh, I did.

Answer: There seems to have been a global shift in conciousness that drove people to research ancient civilizations, and 2012 prophecy is part that has been uncovered.

I disagree. The first efforts to research ancient civilizations came in the 1700's when Napoleon started bringing back things from Egypt and British collectors began acquiring antiquities from Greece and Rome. It reached its height at the end of the 1800's and early 1900's with Cayce and Blavatsky and hundreds of books of (easily disproved) "channeled prophecies and revelations from ancient civilizations" which were spectacularly wrong.

Sumerian Texts also talk about about 2012 as "Changing of the World, as we know it"

I'm sure others have pointed out that this isn't true.

Also, Hopi Indian prophecy points to 2012. Even though they do not believe the world will end, they say that people who are unable to adapt to change will be doomed.

Only prophets speaking since 2001 have been saying this. The famous "Blue Star Kachina" prophecy dates from 1910 and the others that most know about are more recent than that. Hopis traditionally didn't go in for prophecy -- future foretelling was sorcery and (to them as a culture) evil.

QUESTION: So, why do you blatantly disregard the only major date that all three of these ancient and wise civilizations warn us about?

a) they didn't.
b) they failed to correctly predict major disasters for their own civilizations including conquest, war, famine, earthquakes, and so forth.

So, you want to discredit all of 2012 theory because of your own personal theory that the end of their calendar means NOTHING...........

Well, no. I can also (to some extent) read some of the original texts and I'm pretty familiar with the legends and stories of all three cultures -- so I didn't rely on some website to tell me this. I went back to the things they wrote.

Fist is the Tzolkin, which is 260 days. So, does this calendar mean anything?
Mayan Shamans say that this 260 days is the gestation period of a Human.

Actually, they don't. In the first place there are no traditional Mayan shamans. They started showing up after "New Age" tourists came to the area and started looking for mystical experiences and shamans. Being no fools, some of the people realized how much money there was in this and set up shops as shamans. They do, however have "Keepers" of time but they don't do shamanic things.

This means the Tzolkin calendar counts the time from fertilization to birth, roughly.

Human gestational period is roughly 280 days (about another month from what you're counting) from last menstrual period... and they didn't track this in traditional medicine:
yucatantoday.com...

They rely on signs and dreams to tell them about the birth:
en.wikipedia.org...

This means the Haab is what Mayan civilization depended on to determine when to plant, when to harvest, and many many other aspects of their life. They lived by the Haab.

I think you may be interpreting things here. They lived by signs and dreams. They didn't need a calendar to tell them when to plant and harvest since they live at the equator and almost any day is good for planting or harvesting.

I contend that the Mayans thought this was a very important calendar.

Why would they have a third calendar that counted nothing?

To make it easier to count dates farther than 52 years in the future (I'm serious.)
en.wikipedia.org...

Most civilizations counted by the date of the ruler's term in office (25th year of H'aab'in'stuff) rather than from "the beginning of time" or a "beginning of our city/civilization". The calendar gave them a better way to record history.

Is it pure coincidence that astral projectionists can not see past this date during meditation?

Well, if you tell yourself you can't, then you can't. And frankly, I have yet to see a projectionist who was even 80% accurate on anything, from remote viewing to future events (with a hard and fast date.) I've seen them backdate claims. I have never seen any of them step up and say something like "on March 22, 2011, Congress will pass the health care reform act with 78 senators voting in favor of it."

Generally they get away with "Around the middle of March, an important bill will pass in Congress. I have a feeling that it will be sometime around the 20th and it will be hugely important."

I dont post to often in these 2012 thread, but I'm going to toss out a question in this one.

Most everyone that believes this is going on the basis of the Mayan calendar ending. So here is my question. What happens when our Gregorian calendar ends?

Granted that is more of a rhetorical question because as we all know, the calendar starts over with minor adjustments to account for an imperfect time keeping process. It is my belief that while the Mayan calendar is more than likely the most advanced time keeping process ever invented by man, it is still just a calendar. Wouldn't it seem logical that it would also just start over?

Honestly, the first time I ever heard anything about 12/21/2012, was on the History Channel. I actually know nothing about the Mayan calendar, Im just relying on other people to tell me what it means. However - that said - I do believe something big is on its way to humankind. I base that solely on my own feelings.

Originally posted by ThreeDeuce

Why weren't you attempting to disprove 2012 BEFORE the Y2K scare?

Well, not attempting to disprove, but refuting, yes I was. What makes you think I wasn't?

Of course, in those days, most of those who now make money our of predicting the end of the world in 2012 were predicting it would end in 1999, 2000, 2001 or 2003 (for some reason, 2002 was safe).

I am already refuting those who, in 2013, will start predicting the end of the world in 2029 or 2036.

I hate scam artists.

QUESTION: So, why do you blatantly disregard the only major date that all three of these ancient and wise civilizations warn us about?

Because it's not true? Although I do have a potion that'll make you live forever. Only $28 ......

Or, its just easier to believe that everything means nothing, and you can stick your ostrich head back in its hole. That is easier after-all.

Okay then, only $38 .......

I'm always baffled at the fact that a lot of people don't bother with objective evidence. Comon', at least do some proper research (aka not at 2012 pseudo-science websites) before believing that nonsense like a blind sheep

Nibiru => would have been found by now if it were to arrive by 2012 (or within the next few dozen years)
Galactic alignment => happens every year
Pole shifts => A complete pole reversal takes time...a LOT of time. It doesn't happen instantly!
Timewave Zero => complete and utter nonsense because it randomly assigns events

People have always said "something big's about to happen"...like the rapture fear mongering crap that's been going around for 2000+ years. And guess what, every single time they say it'll happen "soon" (TM).

It's laughable...but also kinda sad because it shows that parts of the population simply don't bother looking at facts. They are hoping/wishing or blindly believing "something" will happen, but they have ZERO evidence to back up that claim...and the fact that people have been doing that for thousands of years should tell them how ridiculous this all is.

reply to post by MrXYZ


Dude, you have really NO SAY about Timewave Zero. Its based on math and patterns, not on casual choice...
Keep denying to yourself, if this makes you happy.

The mathematical formula of Timewave Zero has been created by physics and has been shown lots of times on ATS.

With this said, I'm on the way out of this topic.

All other theories are a joke but Timewave is the real thing.

Originally posted by Zagari
reply to post by MrXYZ

 

Dude, you have really NO SAY about Timewave Zero. Its based on math and patterns, not on casual choice...
Keep denying to yourself, if this makes you happy.

The mathematical formula of Timewave Zero has been created by physics and has been shown lots of times on ATS.

With this said, I'm on the way out of this topic.

All other theories are a joke but Timewave is the real thing.

They assign RANDOM events to the graph!! Just look at it for crying out loud, just look at the graph, it makes on sense whatsoever because the events are so random. And funny enough, some rate stronger than others even though rationally, they don't...



Complete and utter nonsense!

Just like the 2012 people, the TZ people really should look up OBJECTIVE EVIDENCE

1) Why was this not an issue 10 or 15 years ago?

Because this is 2011 and people bring it up too much and throw their life away in the process?

2) Why am I non-believer even though there's lots of evidence for this?

There's a lot of evidence for Jesus Christ and Atlantis too.

Bottom line, it's not science. The closest thing it's comparable to is pseudo-science or religion.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
I'm always baffled at the fact that a lot of people don't bother with objective evidence. Comon', at least do some proper research (aka not at 2012 pseudo-science websites) before believing that nonsense like a blind sheep

Nibiru => would have been found by now if it were to arrive by 2012 (or within the next few dozen years)
Galactic alignment => happens every year
Pole shifts => A complete pole reversal takes time...a LOT of time. It doesn't happen instantly!
Timewave Zero => complete and utter nonsense because it randomly assigns events

People have always said "something big's about to happen"...like the rapture fear mongering crap that's been going around for 2000+ years. And guess what, every single time they say it'll happen "soon" (TM).

It's laughable...but also kinda sad because it shows that parts of the population simply don't bother looking at facts. They are hoping/wishing or blindly believing "something" will happen, but they have ZERO evidence to back up that claim...and the fact that people have been doing that for thousands of years should tell them how ridiculous this all is.

It's natural to be irrational. There was study not too long ago about this. It's not just bible thumpers or the 2012 doomsdayers that have problems with irrational thoughts, it's scientists and engineers and everyone else. We all have it, but scientists spend their lives fighting it and attempting to be rationale. They may not always succeed, and will probably become victims themselves of their own irrational thoughts, but at least they try. It's an uphill battle fighting our own evolution.

Althought not the research i reference here is a nice read:
www.timesonline.co.uk...

reply to post by jonnywhite


Nice read...

In ancient times, people believed god is responsible for fire, lightning, comets, storms, disease, famine, and all sorts of other things because they couldn't explain it. Nowadays we have 2012 and TZ hogwash to add to the list. Why is it so hard for some people to admit we don't have all the answers?? It's not just coming up with hogwash irrational ideas, it's also the fact that some people seem to be uncomfortable not knowing...

Of course by making up hogwash they still don't know anything, but in their fantasy world they can at least pretend they do...which I guess gives them comfort. Doesn't change the fact that it's irrational and holding us as a species back imo.

The only reason why no one was trying to disprove the 2012 theory before Y2K is due to the fact that the popularity of the "theory" was not even a blip on the mainstream radar at the time.

Now there's specials on the History Channel every week; they just released a multi-million dollar blockbuster movie and everyone who has ever loved to preach doomsday has jumped on the bandwagon with some inane "smoking gun" link like a vague Hopi prophecy created in the 60's; a calendar that doesn't actually say anything about the end of the world (on top of the fact that we can't even be sure if it names 12/21/12 as the so called "end date" due to the fact we're not sure how the dates translate to our calendar) and some crap about the "galatic alignment"; which has happened numerous times in human history and has never caused an issue.

There is ZERO even semi-credible proof for anything bad happening in 2012. However the cult of fear and paranoia has caused all the conspiracy theorists to start buying silos in the wilderness and go all survivalist. Here's a protip: that convereted nuclear weapons silo you bought to save yourselves from the coming global pole shift/economic collapse/NWO instigated nuclear war will probably not be too market friendly in 2013.

reply to post by zcflint05

some crap about the "galatic alignment"; which has happened numerous times in human history

It happens EVERY SINGLE YEAR!!

reply to post by MrXYZ


Of course they were written down by a man. Who else do you expect would write them, a Jinn....? Or would you believe it if a Jinn were to write it down. The point is that it was written down 1500 years ago, before this whole concept of Nemesis began...
The Quran begins with the following "I have been sent to thee as a warner and messenger unto mankind, to warn of thee of the impending disaster"

This is what he was warning about...

Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by zcflint05

 

some crap about the "galatic alignment"; which has happened numerous times in human history

It happens EVERY SINGLE YEAR!!

That's even better.

2nd

reply to post by doubledutch

I think it would be silly to think the myans knew nothing, and I think it's stupid to think that science has all the answers, it doesn't, it has some answers for some of the questions, and most of those answers are wrong, as has been proven by science every day...science is about a best guess...asking for proof is futile, there is no such thing as scientific fact...fact!

The problem here is quite clear. You do not understand what science is about. You don't understand the difference between evidence and proof. You don't understand what a fact is.

The fact is that the Mayans had no prophecies associated with the end of the long count calendar. If you have evidence to the contrary please provide it.