(Video) Victim of alleged police brutality still in custody: family

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


Anytime.. Thanks for allowing me to rant in yout threads

That part of the video, where he was kicked, is the part that is off frame. When the lady recording it gets out of her car, we loose frames, and it comes back up after the kick occured. I know people wont agree with my reasons, and thats fine. I prefer to see how the ivnetigation goes, and to see if any other witnesses or video can show a different angle as to what occured. Either it will support the victems argument, or the Officers.

The inconsistency in reporting though, in terms of why he had a shotgun, his employment, and a domestic violence charge hace me wondering if there is not a missed wire somewhere in terms of the call that came into Police dispatch.

To anyone who saw what occured and is not familiar with his job at the golf course could easily call and say some guy is shooting a shotgun, and has a lady in the truck. I look at it form the point of view the officers have absolutely no idea what the hell is going on, so its being treated as a potentially eadly force encounter.

In the end if the officers actions are not justified, then by all means, take him to task as Canadaian Law allows. Iknow here in the states the standard is what did the officer perceive at the exact moment the use of force occured. Hindsight is not allowed.

I am not sure what the Canadian standard is. Do we have any Canadian Leos around who can asnwer this?

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

 

If you actually did some research you woul have your answer, which is to say NO the RCMP is not investigating the incident. The Abbotsford Police Department is the lead agency investigating the Kelowna RCMP detachment member. They have setup phone numbers and have asked for any person who was present, driving through the area etc to contact them to be interviewed.

Oh, the oh so fair Abbotsford City cops are investigating? Abbotsford is the top gang city in BC, with a high rate of police corruption. City cops are a step lower than RCMP, and while they make more money than RCMP, they lack a lot of the discipline.

Internal investigations of police affairs are a big issue in Canada, because police generally investigate themselves unless a public rights group raises an issue about it. This is usually only possible with independent filming of police actions, like with the Kelowna incident, but this was more of a lucky coincidence.

There should be a federal investigation team for these matters, that is what the public has requested. However, the top RCMP brass are close with Harper's government and command a lot of play among their own investigations.

Considering I am from this very region, and have been to Kelowna and Abbotsford several times, and I can tell you that police have little credibility around here, especially when they beat up restrained civilians instead of hunting down gangs and hard drug dealers. This very Kelowna incident is big news here and has been a common discussion topic concerning security policies.

reply to post by Xcathdra

There have been people arrested in Maryland for filming cops.

Citizens Arrested for Filming Police

Are Cameras the New Guns?

In at least three states, it is now illegal to record any on-duty police officer.

Film a cop in Maryland and get arrested

reply to post by SeenMyShare


Just because you get arrested for something does not make it illegal. You're innocent untill proven guilty. Police quite often arrest people for filming but it never sticks.

reply to post by PsykoOps

I answered his statement.

Did the person who filmed this scene in Canada get arrested? Every state in the US with the current exception of Illinois allows for the recording of LEO's in action.

His emphasis was on "arrested" and he went on to say that only Illinois does not allow recording. I showed him that Maryland does indeed arrest those filming LEOs.

They do that everywhere. It's not just in few they try to do that with the wiretapping laws. There is things like disturbance and resisting without violence they can also use. One guy was actually arrested for illegal photography when a cop stepped into his house uninvited and the guy took a photo of him as proof. Needless to say such a crime doesn't excist and it had to be dropped.

reply to post by PsykoOps

That's insane! I live in a good area with good LEOs. I wish everyone did!

reply to post by Xcathdra


too true. . . as it turns out, I usually overreact to situations like this. Then again, is there anything the "subject" could have done that justifies this? We've all seen videos where a subject was KNOWN to have tried to kill a cop or anyone for that matter, get pulled over, and not kicked in the face.

I don't anymore information could possibly sway my feelings about this. Yet, I am always open to someone saying "what if", and then sort of go "oh yeah, I can see that."

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


it's about time these MF'ers start going to prison...they are a bunch of jackbooted thugs, they are simply another violent, gun-toteing gang, but with judicial protection. what is wrong with people, why aren't they calling for the immediate arrest and indictment of the "law" officer that did this punk-ass crap.

reply to post by Xcathdra


It does show the entire story. The story of the officer kicking the man in the head when he has given up and is laying down is a separate story to what led him to be chased or arrested. It doesn't matter if he just robbed a bank, he was surrendering and the kick was not necessary.

reply to post by SeenMyShare


We had a few threads on ATS talking about what you posted. The Courts threw the charges out and affirmed there is no expectation of privacy in public. Illinois is the only state left where a person has been charged for violating a state wiretap / recording law, and the ACLU has taken that guys case. If Illinos does not have the charges chucked, then a Federal judge will do it based on precedent.

Wrongful Charges Dropped Against Motorcyclist Prosecuted for Videotaping Encounter with Police

BALTIMORE, MD – Vindicating the First Amendment right to document what public officials say and do, the American Civil Liberties Union of Maryland applauded Harford County Circuit Judge Emory A. Plitt Jr's decision today to dismiss all of the wiretapping charges against Anthony Graber. The Maryland State Police had charged Graber with violating Maryland's wiretap statute, a felony, after he posted on YouTube a video and audio recording of his encounter with a state trooper in plain clothes who stopped him for a traffic violation with his gun drawn.

In today's decision, Judge Plitt ruled: "Those of us who are public officials and are entrusted with the power of the state are ultimately accountable to the public. When we exercise that power in public fora, we should not expect our actions to be shielded from public observation. "Sed quis custodiet ipsos cutodes" ("Who watches the watchmen?").

As I already pointed out, Illinois is the last state with pending charges for recording police in public in violation of their wiretap laws. The case will be dismissed, and if its not, the Federal Appeals court will overturn any conviction for the exact same reasons the Maryland judge cited.

Originally posted by PsykoOps
They do that everywhere. It's not just in few they try to do that with the wiretapping laws. There is things like disturbance and resisting without violence they can also use. One guy was actually arrested for illegal photography when a cop stepped into his house uninvited and the guy took a photo of him as proof. Needless to say such a crime doesn't excist and it had to be dropped.

Proof please..

Originally posted by jimmyx
reply to post by DimensionalDetective

 

it's about time these MF'ers start going to prison...they are a bunch of jackbooted thugs, they are simply another violent, gun-toteing gang, but with judicial protection. what is wrong with people, why aren't they calling for the immediate arrest and indictment of the "law" officer that did this punk-ass crap.

edit on 23-1-2011 by jimmyx because: grammer

You might want to either brush up on your civics, or clarify which countrys officers you are referring to. Here in the states, Law Enforcement does not work for the Judicial branch. We arent even part of it.

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

It does show the entire story. The story of the officer kicking the man in the head when he has given up and is laying down is a separate story to what led him to be chased or arrested. It doesn't matter if he just robbed a bank, he was surrendering and the kick was not necessary.

Well it does matter. If you watch the video you see the guy sitting in the drivers seat. You see the RCMP Officer start to walk back towards the backup unit that just arrived. During that frame, the lady recording gets out of her car, and we loose a few frames. However, if you look closely, the driver is still in the drivers seat. When she brings it all back in frame, the guy is out of the truck.

Without the audio, or a police report to verify, we dont know if he was ordered out of the truck, or if the guy got out on his own. If he got out on his own, then its a different story.

This is why the cops were asking for any and all witnesses to come forward and let the cops know what they saw. The mountie is on leave pending the investigation, and as with any investigation, he will either be charged, or he wont. We will wait and see.

reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi


Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the Royal Canadian Mounted Police were a Federal Entity (like our FBI here). If they are, then why would people demand the Feds investigate it, if the feds are the ones who are under investigation? The incident occured within the jurisdiction of the city, so why would it not be ok for them to run the investigation as an independant agency?

Do you guys have any other Federal entities that are like the RCMP who could investigate?

Disturbing.

This is entirely common however. Of course, blind cop supporters come out and try to claim EVERYTHING is a 'deadly force situation'.

Why then, wasn't deadly force used?

If it was a deadly force situation, why isn't this guy dead like many others who have had unfortunate encounters with the police?

I would like to see lengthy prison sentences in all brutality cases. Perhaps some horror stories about ex-cops exposed to lengthy bouts of non-consensual 'prison love' will serve as a proper deterrent.

I was a member of Officer.com for a long time (still am, just don't go anymore because the novelty wore off and it's just a sick place to be). You can hear some real crazy things there if you have the nerve to stomach it. I suggest anyone do it. Remember these are the huma... ...people that "protect and serve".

I suggest everyone not involved in law enforcement buy some guns and hope criminals and cops never make their way to your neck of the woods.

But, that's just my opinion.

reply to post by Tharsis


You guys are awesome.. You guys go nuts because a RCMP Officer kicks a guy in the face while critiquiing the officers actions, how they were not justified for the call, or justified by actions.

In the very next breath, you guys give details about what you would like to do to cops.

The term is hypocrite by the way. Just as people dont like to be sterotyped by cops, the same holds true for us. We are not any more perfect than you and as such, like you guys, we make mistakes and we will pay for those.

I just find it Ironic that you guys advocate the very same behavior you condem.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the Royal Canadian Mounted Police were a Federal Entity (like our FBI here). If they are, then why would people demand the Feds investigate it, if the feds are the ones who are under investigation? The incident occured within the jurisdiction of the city, so why would it not be ok for them to run the investigation as an independant agency?

Do you guys have any other Federal entities that are like the RCMP who could investigate?

You said it yourself that the investigation team would be city cops from Abbotsford. Abbotsford is about 5 hours away from Kelowna, and in completely different regions.

Why should the Feds investigate? Because that's the job of the Ministry of Public Safety, which is a federal institution. Instead the RCMP basically controls this ministry, along with the mainstream media.

Like I said, Canadian policies are populist in nature. Nothing is going to be done unless incidents like this are exposed and there is a significant and democratic movement among the civilian population to figuratively rip apart RCMP actions. Otherwise the RCMP justifies their own actions and do what they can to silence witnesses and victims.

If you don't understand this, then come to Canada and speak your mind against an RCMP officer. Usually they will work you over, regardless of your constitutional rights, and unless you're part of the Canadian elite, then nobody will give a sh!t unless it is on video.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by PsykoOps
They do that everywhere. It's not just in few they try to do that with the wiretapping laws. There is things like disturbance and resisting without violence they can also use. One guy was actually arrested for illegal photography when a cop stepped into his house uninvited and the guy took a photo of him as proof. Needless to say such a crime doesn't excist and it had to be dropped.

Proof please..

Seriously??? You can start from PINAC. Or you can just google or whatever. Let me know when you're done.

reply to post by Xcathdra


If he got out on his own it's not a different story because we see him begin to lie down the kick wasn't needed.
You can clearly see that, you know it as well. He was laying down, even if the cop didn't want him to and was angry, he shouldn't have kicked him due to his own emotional weakness.
It was wrong.

Edit: after watching the video again you can tell the cop is facing the man the whole time, he doesn't turn to go to the back up he backs up facing the man and looks to have his gun drawn on him. So it is most probable that he is ordering the man out and then kicks him.

Watch the video again, the cops never turns his back on the suspect.