To those of us that at least think its credible that we are being visited by ET. We are all off our

I'm new here, hello, its good to be here with you all.

about the scientists...was it Stephen Hawking who said recently humanity's only chance for survival was to move into outer space? if it was maybe he does know something, but in my opinion science as most understand it is still confounded as to the nature of what is really happening. The best explanation I've heard is the spiritual phenomenon/ interdimensional one...the interdimensional side explaining the behavior of the craft, but the spiritual explanation, especially in connection with the Gray/abduction phenonenon, makes a lot more sense when you consider that they could be fallen angels or demons, which would explain why people don't sight vampires or ghouls etc.....its not that they are not seen anymore by people who consider that they live in a more scientifically-enlightened era than previous times, but that they don't yet recognize the modern manifestation of these forces in their own age. there are many similarities... mists, sexual molestation, paralysis, marks left on the body... Theres a really good lecture by Guy Malone on YouTube from this point of view where he cites scientists like Jaque Vallee and Hynek among others to support his testimony.

However, taking into account the spiritual aspect of UFOs is an obvious problem for scientific atheists (like Hawking perhaps), I don't think they can understand the true nature of the phenonmenon from a pure materialist mindset. in short, Hawking and other 'Boffins' ( funny term) or even people behind the scenes in government might think they know something, like that ETs are planning on taking people off-world, but might not have the whole story or consider what is coming to be any kind of deception on the part of the supposed 'ETs' or think there is any religious or spiritual truth behind it. From my personal experience I believe it does.

also, i'm fascinated by the jellyfish-like description of the underbellies of the UFOs earlier in the thread. The NASA footage examined by David Sereda shows discs exhibiting behavior that looks very biological...they look like they have a heartbeat or a kind color-flash to them like certain squid do.

anyway, just some thoughts. this is the Guy Malone vid
www.youtube.com...

reply to post by applesthateatpeople


Dear applesthateatpeople

Well it will most likely be made off topic here but anyway.

Perhaps Jackie actually loved him you never know there have been stranger things.

From applesthateatpeople “Would you keep driving if the guy in the backseat just exploded?”

Two things one I would have been driving a whole lot faster. Two he would have been Secret Service, training you know.

From applesthateatpeople “Who is this Zapruder guy, anyway?”

Where did this come from???

reply to post by JamesMayorOfJerusalem


Dear JamesMayorOfJerusalem

From JamesMayorOfJerusalem “about the scientists...was it Stephen Hawking who said recently humanity's only chance for survival was to move into outer space?

It most likely was but quite apart from the ET issue this is obvious. You sure as hell do not need to be the top astrophysics to figure that out.

Oh dear I wish you had not gone down the religious spiritual side of this.

I say this because there is nothing that makes my eye glazes over more quickly.

If Demons ever existed they are ET not from here from somewhere else therefore ET.

If Jesus Christ was the son of GOD then he was a Hybrid. And if there is a GOD then guess what he is ET.

Sorry but I just do not see why GOD has to come into a discussion about what the Boffins know about ET.

Try and tell that to thousands of eye witnesses myself included I did not realise there was so many delusional people around the word?
.

reply to post by Bob Down Under


Dear Bob Down Under

That is my whole point Bob, either we are all off our trolleys or the Boffins know a lot more than they are letting on.

When I saw what I saw then there where 20 other delusional people there at the same time.

It is just a point that has bothered me for a long time.

Originally posted by MAC269
reply to post by Bob Down Under

 

Dear Bob Down Under

That is my whole point Bob, either we are all off our trolleys or the Boffins know a lot more than they are letting on.

When I saw what I saw then there where 20 other delusional people there at the same time.

It is just a point that has bothered me for a long time.

Yeh that was just my dry whit I no where your coming from

reply to post by Bob Down Under


Dear Bob Down Under

Yes I have a few Ausie mates I know what your like.

I honestly think that people like Stephen Hawking have no idea whether extraterrestrials are real or not, they just hypothesise that IF they were, they might be radically different to us due to different atmospheres and surroundings wherever they may be, possibly even primitive (if you saw Stephen Hawking's Universe on one of the Discovery channels last year)

However that doesn't mean they don't exist, I just believe that perhaps if they do then those in the know in high level government would work scientists and other leading figures in philosophy and theology like a machine. In other words, they'd speak to one person about one thing, go to someone else for another thing and build up a larger picture of knowledge without the "boffins" knowing what they're truly being asked about.

Otherwise we'd have had some sort of disclosure from a respected figure instead of just theory and hypothesis.

It doesn't have to be kept secret.

You remember peer pressure back in school? Well that's what's going on. That and fear of being ridiculed or isolated. People don't want to lose their reputations or credibility. I feel that the government in the late 1940's and/or early 1950's decided to wage a campaign to discredit UFO reports and witnesses. This initial program set in motion a sequence of events that has made it virtually impossible to approach this phenomena without being ridiculed. This happens automatically. They don't have to actively discredit. It has had enough momentum to go on its own.

So some scientists/officials will talk about UFOs but only privately. You have to understand the nature of this. It's not all or nothing like you say. I think the public knows far more than they're given credit for, while at the same time, the fear and ridicule factor are equally pervasive. And there're also many scientists/officials who're part of the ridiculing and discrediting crowd. Birds of a feather flock together. I think this phrase applies aptly to how this works. It's almost like self-organization.

I think that most UFO reports are bogus but a small minority are real and these are the cases the people behind hte scenes are trying to keep hush hush. I feel that it's a matter of national security and they wnat to understand it better and perhaps the aliens or visitors are malevolent even. If they know that the visitors are doing bad things to us or abusing us they may not want to tell us about it because of the needless hysteria that would result. But there're plenty of reasons to keep it secret even if the visitors are relatively indifferent to us.

And another thing... Even non-scientists and non-officials but people who happen to be famous for some reason will also keep quiet. There're many actors and well known people that have abduction claims, for example. Budd hopkins and others have stated this numerous times but they're not allowed to say who. I believe he and others are truthfully when they say that there's a lot the're not telling us because they don't want to ruin the reputations of these people. And I know from my own research when I was younger that sightings are very common among random people you pick off the street. It's not unexpected that some who have seen are also famous.

reply to post by MAC269



disregard the 'religious/spiritual' terminology then and replace it with the more modern words like psychic or psychological if you like, and then consider what the boffins have to say about abductions...they dismiss them as nightmares, yet abductees develop Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder like soldiers in Iraq do. the truth is a lot of good scientists have observed and documented a connection that you could describe as 'quantum' between the two, psychic dispositions and ETs/UFOs, which is why I posted that link... its just that the majority of scientists are either afraid of ridicule or are just crap scientists. either way I'm more inclined to trust a scientist confident enough in his own empirical conclusions to state his case than one who is unsure of it or one who won't consider an alternative possibility, and whether you call them demons or archetypes, its still a better explanation than nightmares or swamp gas, or as you've suggested, that God and Jesus are in on this capture and torture bit. the psychic reality is a part of this mystery, therefore as much as the boffins deny the psychic reality, they deny themselves proper understanding of whats happening, thats all I'm trying to say

Originally posted by curious7
I honestly think that people like Stephen Hawking have no idea whether extraterrestrials are real or not, they just hypothesise that IF they were, they might be radically different to us due to different atmospheres and surroundings wherever they may be, possibly even primitive (if you saw Stephen Hawking's Universe on one of the Discovery channels last year)

However that doesn't mean they don't exist, I just believe that perhaps if they do then those in the know in high level government would work scientists and other leading figures in philosophy and theology like a machine. In other words, they'd speak to one person about one thing, go to someone else for another thing and build up a larger picture of knowledge without the "boffins" knowing what they're truly being asked about.

Otherwise we'd have had some sort of disclosure from a respected figure instead of just theory and hypothesis.

It's my opinion that people like him keep the UFO topic to themselves and a few friends. No, they don't entertain ufology and wild claims, but behind all the rhetoric and the public things they say they aren't nearly as certain about it as they appear to be. I think we'd be surprised if the ridicule and discrediting factors weren't involved.

I've known many people who do not talk about UFOs for fear of reprisal. And these are normal everyday people. If you bring up the UFO subject in a normal PUBLIC conversation they'll laugh or you'll not hear a peep from them. But in private or in a centered relaxed place where they're comfortable they suddenly unload on you. This is very common and really you're making it far more complicated than it's.

No one wants to be associated with wackos and nutjobs and cons.

Many directions one can go with this and I respect and understand most peoples' veiw/opinion on this.


To me its not wanting/hoping they are real but my own conclusion that they are,,

Maybe not the solid proof some of us want but whats strange is just to much is unexplainable,,,way to much..

reliable witness's,photos.locked on radar,military reports,ufo's over washington years back with footage,military brass leaks,,,,,this works for me to raise my eyebrows,,,,...why would anyone be off their rocker to think its very quite possible,,,

i bet we are proto typing UFO craft now maybe in secret military places,,

I also starting to think some of these craft are interdimensional,,like ghosts maybe?,,,or a split second behind in our time continuium..

Kona

reply to post by MAC269


Anybody that blieves in little green aliens are visiting us are not content with their lives and are looking for a way to escape. The truth is the universe does revolve around us and there is no credible evidence in the public arena that says otherwise.

In response to the OP, I must point out one small inadequacy with the idea that either scientists know more than they are telling, or we are all stark raving, pants on head mad. For a start , you have to consider some points that you may have missed when arriving at your conclusion.
First and foremost, when a person is approached and offered work by a government, which may involve access to classified information, they are of course asked to sign a declaration, a vow of secrecy. The name of the document varies according to nation, but the principles are largely similar no matter where you are.
Some scientists will sign happily away thinking about all the research they will be able to do, and ignoring the moral implications of keeping the secrets of a possibly corrupt government body. Others will refuse. However, governments are canny in the ways of leverage and persuasion. Say the scientist they want on the team has prior for hacking, or for cooking meth in his student days, or even deep seated sociopathic tendancies and a degree in particle physics which he achieved by creating a particle beam weapon capable of cutting a tank in half using a power source the size of a 9v battery. In those situations the government have leverage, with the hacker , the chemist, the physicist, and can exert pressures of silence upon them, which would be more than capable of keeping their lips sealed.
Meanwhile, there will be your regular run of the mill geniuses, working on less contraversial projects in entirely seperate premises , and with an entirely different command chain in terms of the people they report to , and crucialy no real idea that there are other brains at work , on deeply disturbing projects.
Like in any societal demographic there are bright and beautiful thinkers in the ranks of the worlds geniuses and scientists, and as a counterpoint to that there will be those who pursue thier intellectual work in such a manner as to put it above the considerations of morality and compassion. In all things, in all peoples, no matter how you fractionalise a society, there is light, and there is dark. Intellectualy advanced persons are no different.
When governments , agencies of those governments, or the supposed black book agencies that opperate in total silence on behalf of various interests globaly, approach someone for a contract or as a consultant on a matter, they first do detailed psychological profiling of several candidates for a position. From these they pick the person who most suits the intellectual and moral aims of the project, and approach them. They take into consideration before hand, any special knowledge they may hold about the targeted thinker, like the previously alluded to possibility of prior offences and other leverage that can be applied, and assuming they find themselves in a position to be able to exert the required level of control over the subject, the target of thier researches will likely as not be approached , and set to whatever task is asked of him.
In some cases specific minds will be targeted because they have had ideas which could not be expanded upon because in doing so they would be in contravention of laws and regulations either nationaly or internationaly . A good example would be the red tape trip wire web that is the feild of gene research, navigation through which is hard enough when your research has benevolent aims. Assuming that agencies un-named/unknown with an interest in contraversial projects came upon an expert with a black past and a total disregard for morality, they would have thier perfect brain.
If the one single thing being requested of the scientist, is silence, and he or she is profiled and understood to be receptive to less than ideal moral circumstances in their work, then why should a government not employ them? Also, do not forget that the secret services tend to aquire thier people in terms of knowing of thier prowess,well before thier usefulness has been properly determined. They pick up on thier skills and intellect early (by having recruiters installed in universities, colleges, and military training establishments) and follow it to see what the talent does. Dependant on need, approaches are made, you get the picture.
We make to much of the difficulties surrounding the issue of how the governments of the world keep thier secrets, how thier shadowy tendrils lock firmly about thier agents and employees. The methodology of silence is perfectly simple when one knows that although not every man has his price, some certainly dont need thier arms broken to do unjust things. Just because a person is incredibly smart, does not mean they are moraly sound

reply to post by MAC269

We are all off our rockers.

Or the Boffins are all in on it.

mostly its just about being gullible or wanting to believe something is true. Not necessarily being mentally ill or insane ( but some belivers are no doubt)

most of the time pro ETH websites present selected facts about any given "ufo incident". Alot of the time they miss out information that points to a mundane or prosaic explanation. Believers tend to only read that 1 sided version of events & conlcude it must be an et spaceship, most of the time beleivers dont dig for more information theyr satisfied their belief system has been confirmed and leave it at that,

Experiments have been done on why people believe strange things with no good evidence. Scientists studied the brain while they talked to the subjects about their beliefs. Some cases it was religion other ghosts, psychic ability or ufos. They found that when someone is talking about the subject matter they believe in it stimulates a "pleasure" part of their brain. The result is if someone gets pleasure from the idea of it being true they are far more likely to actually think it is true.

The question isn't 'are there aliens out there', the only unanswered question is if they have been here. I personally think they have, how, why for what, I have no idea but the small number of non answered sighting and credible witnesses make me believe we have been visited.

There is no way a secret that BIG could be held by that many people, without one of them blabbing.

They blab all the time. The problem is, who is lying, and who is telling the truth? That's the beauty of it...by establishing an aura of ridicule around the subject, and some character assassination, even if a top scientist comes forward, it's doubtful he'd be able to smuggle out any physical evidence to prove his claims. (and then he'd be lambasted publicly, and never work again in that line of work).

And for those who think this would be easy (smuggling out evidence), you obviously have no idea of how security works with SCI projects. Heck, my father worked on a known plane (modifications to the Raptor), and there's no way he'd even be able to smuggle out a note on a small piece of paper, let alone any kind of physical component with the security measures he was subjected to. So, I imagine it would be similar with this kind of project and UFOs.

Think about it. If you were in on the biggest secret in human history, something that would blow our reality wide open, would you be able to keep schtum? Are you sure you would not share it with your wife/husband? Best friend? Kids? Colleagues?

And risk your future, your family, your safety, and everything just to share the knowledge? No, you'll keep quiet. You think I know what my father worked on? I've got only a vague idea, and I'm pretty sure it's not even that classified. Folks are chosen for this kind of thing BECAUSE they can keep a secret.

I think it would be apropraite at this juncture, to take a momernt and in silence, contemplate the many people who have died, or had their lives destroyed, their crdibility stolen or smeared, their families threatened.
The fear of what the gov boys can do to you and yours without hardly strainig,is plenty enough juice for keeping the most of those in the know, in line.
The brave and loyal(to humanity) people who have given everything they have to give to bring you this information.
I think of guys like Phil Schnieder and others whose lives were forfitted because they talked.
There are probably myriad others too who we will never know, or even hear about.
The receent murder of the govt consultant (Wheeler) is a blatant example of the terror that is seeded among those in the know, to keep their mouths shut.
Britain also mudered one of its top experts because he disagreed with the PTB reason for the Iraq invasion..
The truth is out, the" free" goverments of the world, are just as guilty of trampling their subjects human rights in the name of national security, as the totalitarian ones.
We all know this in our hearts, but yet we go along with the scam, out of fear of reprisals.
I do think that ET has begun to take the disclosure initiative out of our goverments hands, and initiated contact with us directly.
This may prove to be a spur to the goverments to counter these efforts, and reprisals may be swift and deadly at first.
With contiued explosure of the ET ships above us, it will become irrefutable that we have visitors,and there will have to be goverment disclosure or they will loose all their credibility.
Already we fear greatly that the PTB have usurped the alien technology for the purpose of enslaving us themselves!
This fear is totally rational in my estimation, and it is founded on the very secrecy which they have engendered.

...

Originally posted by Versa
reply to post by MAC269

 

you forgot to add all the amateur astronomers that have telescopes that watch the sky night in and night out... They all have to be in on it too

Put yourself in their position, so you see a UFO using a telescope, so what, we need HARD evidence.

When is everybody going to realise that sightings go nowhere, they happen everyday all over the world.

The only way this issue is going to come out is by "someone" putting up REAL evidence, such as secret government films (gun camers etc), or a piece of a crashed craft.

See my signature below, nuff said................

reply to post by MAC269
i see it like this;
when America used the U2 to spy on Russia to see what kind of threat they imposed America kept tabs on them even though America was more advanced than them.
we are being closely monitored to see if we pose a threat but i can't see how we can because we don't no where these things come from or maybe we do and thats why were a threat