is jesus, god?

reply to post by jmdewey60


So are you effectively denying that there are different Greek manuscripts? That there are Mss from Alexandria and Antioch and that they are not alike?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by jmdewey60

 

So are you effectively denying that there are different Greek manuscripts? That there are Mss from Alexandria and Antioch and that they are not alike?

Can you look? Please. You are just repeating blogs and stuff that is biased.
I'm saying, if you look at the different Greek texts, side by side, like I suggested, you will notice that almost all the time, they are the same. There are some differences but not that often.
I don't rely on any one thing, in the English, or the Greek. Like I said, the Bible commentaries I read were written before westcott hort were born, so they do not influence them.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Can you look? Please.

I will when you've let me know you've watched Missler's video series on the NT. Especially pts. 3-5.

reply to post by NOTurTypical
I'm not just trying to win an argument for argument's sake.
I am trying to give some advice on how to deal with this issue that you seem to be so troubled over.
If you want to remain in this state of turmoil, that is your business and no skin off my teeth.
I am very much aware of the ideology of KJV only advocates and have a cousin who has inundated me in all their propaganda for a long time and have many a discussion so none of this is new to me.
KJV is always the best to look at first, before reading any other version, that is true and I will not dispute that.
My point is stopping there is not good and the realization that it was originally written in Greek is something that is overlooked at your own peril. You can avoid that peril easily if you take steps to deal with it. The resources are readily available and I recommend making use of them. You can download free mp3 files of the NT read in the old Greek way to pick up another way of getting the meaning. That is very helpful.
Getting weird about KJV is not exactly healthy. Read some biographies of Erasmus to help you understand the KJV and read biographies of the Venerable Bede to understand what the Bible in general is.

reply to post by monkcaw


Ok, If Jesus is God, then is it God (Jesus) inspiring the scriptures? Is it He who is speaking throughout? Jesus words in the NT are in red. If Jesus is God, why the distinction of words in red, is He not God, one in the same?

reply to post by jmdewey60


Gotcha, so I'm supposed to buy AND READ several books and take a college level course on Koine Greek but you can't take the time to watch a couple videos on YouTube?

The fact of the matter is Westcott and Hort were not believers, and any Bible that doesn't include the last 12 verses of Mark, or casts doubt to their authenticity is from a corrupt manuscript. The Alexandrian Codecies were rejected by the early church as corrupted by the Gnostics.

Originally posted by aero56
reply to post by monkcaw

 

Ok, If Jesus is God, then is it God (Jesus) inspiring the scriptures? Is it He who is speaking throughout? Jesus words in the NT are in red. If Jesus is God, why the distinction of words in red, is He not God, one in the same?

The red verses are His words after incarnation. Hope that helps.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


YouTube? A reliable educational source

LOL

Originally posted by ExistentialNightmare
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

YouTube? A reliable educational source

LOL

No, the "reliable source" would be Irenaeus quoting from the last 12 verses of Mark in his commentary in 150 A.D. Or Hippolytus quoting from the last 12 verses of Mark in the 3rd century. Thus showing that either these men were clairvoyant, or the last 12 verses of Mark were expurgated from the texts by those Gnostics at Alexandria in their Codecies.

(This information is in the videos)

Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and shall bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel, which translated means, "God with us."

Matthew 1:23

And fear gripped them all, and they began glorifying God, saying, "A great prophet has arisen among us!" and, "God has visited His people!"

Luke 7:16

In the beginning was the Word...and the Word was God.

John 1:1

No man has seen God at any time; the only begotten God, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.

John 1:18

He [Jesus]... was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.

John 5:18

I and the Father are one.

John 10:30

The Jews answered Him [Jesus], "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."

John 10:33

You call Me Teacher and Lord; and you are right, for so I am.

John 13:13

Jesus said to him, "...He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how do you say, `Show us the Father?'"

John 14:9

And now, glorify Thou Me together with Thyself, Father, with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was.

John 17:5

Thomas answered and said to Him [Jesus], "My Lord and my God!"

John 20:28

...the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

2 Corinthians 4:4

...Christ Jesus, who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,

Philippians 2:6

...to Christ. For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,

Colossians 2:9

God was manifest in the flesh...

1 Timothy 3:16

...our Lord Jesus Christ, which He will bring about at the proper time-- He who is the blessed and only Sovereign, the King of kings and Lord of lords;

1 Timothy 6:15

God...in these last days has spoken to us in His Son...And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature...

Hebrews 1:2-3

But of the Son He says, "Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever...

Hebrews 1:8

...the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus;

Titus 2:13

Simon Peter ... by the righteousness of our God and Savior, Jesus Christ:

2 Peter 1:1

And on His robe and on His thigh He [Jesus] has a name written, "KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS."

Revelation 19:16



I believe they are two seperate beings , but have one mind meaning Jesus is God in the flesh. As God cant be looked upon. God gave us a link through his son Jesus. This does not mean Jesus does not have his own personality.

I know this is hard to understand to some

reply to post by milkyway12


Don't (many) Christians believe in the Holy Trinity? (The Father, Son and Spirit)

Obviously, some denominations or reformations believe Jesus was a God.

reply to post by ExistentialNightmare


As i just said , they are one in the same in the mind , but different enities.

reply to post by milkyway12


It's YOUR belief that they are different entities. Do you believe other religious doctrine is incorrect? What about God's gone by; Zeus; Wotan, Thor, Ra, Horus?

They are pagans

I believe other Gods are very real , but they are not Gods at all , but Demons that call themselves Gods and work Miracles that convience people they are there as the Bible tells of this. Even in the last days the Anti Christ will work Miracles in front of the whole world that only Jesus has done when he walked the Earth.

It is irrelevant either way.

The Jesus (Yah-Zeus) Myth was created by Jewish/Greek/Roman co-conspirators to create a one world government. This made sense at the time to the power hungry conspirators because religion was man’s first real government. The Jesus Myth is an infusion of Egyptian, Jewish, Greek, Roman and Pagan myths, combined and embellished to “satisfy” anyone living in the known world. But it’s all fake.

Evenso, it almost worked. After Constantine, the Christian religion did become the “world” government, certainly as perceived by those living in Europe. And today, like many of the people posting on this site, it still fools people.

Unfortunately, the thing that keeps this religion alive is fear. The founders made sure to put in plenty of fear in this religion, no doubt having witnessed many religions that had not survived the passage of time. So, they invented Hell and blasphemy against the “Holy Spirit” to keep people very, very afraid. Those fears are still working on all Christians now, every day of their lives. For them, this is kept in the back of their minds, but it serves its purpose – to keep the delusions alive.

reply to post by DoctorHouseMD
Not to dispute your post but there was a small lapse of time before the total co opting of the Christian religion. Though most of the legacy had been extinguished, it must be assumed that if there was a special truth to it, that truth would be able to show itself through, despite all the covering over that had been applied.

reply to post by milkyway12

He [Jesus]... was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.

Incorrect... He never claimed to be equal with God...

13Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am.
14If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet.
15For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you.
16Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him
-------------
Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.


You should reexamine those quotes you used in your previous post.... Many if not all are taken out of context...

Unless you are quoting paul of course, which in my humble opinon is irrelevant most times anyways

Jesus Is God

Consider this link in the words of Edmund Spencer:

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all argument, and which cannot fail to keep man in everlasting ignorance. That principle is condemnation before investigation."

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Jesus Is God

Consider this link in the words of Edmund Spencer:

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all argument, and which cannot fail to keep man in everlasting ignorance. That principle is condemnation before investigation."

Considered...

I agree with some of what he says...

quoting paul does not impress me in most cases...

i like this...
The soul is a spiritual being, it is the mind, the heart, the control center of a person, the personality, it is the person.

but then he strays a bit.... promoting the trinity i see, which i do not agree with.

Interesting artical, though i'd prefer to hear from you instead of websites you read. That mearly shows you can be led by others when you can easily just read it for yourself. And make your own mind up, as opposed to others doing it for you...