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A New Definition Of Greed

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posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:24 PM
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I propose the following is a better definition of greed:

The desire to take the fruit of other people's labor without having to work for it.

With this definition, we can say the Wall Street power brokers who use Government to suppress interest rates and bail out their failed corporations are greedy.

This seems to be a much better fit than the current definition, which is simply:

Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for one's self.

Which seems utterly ridiculous to me, since this defines working toward a goal as evil behavior.

Economist Milton Friedman explains why our current notions of greed are wrong.







edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:51 PM
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can't resist.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 01:51 PM
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reply to post by mnemeth1
 


Well I think you are right!

Lets redefine a moral trait and definition in order to suit your political ideology!

I got the next one

Hunger - a complaint lazy people have when they do not work hard enough.

God Bless America

(your thread has been bumped, use to be called charity)


edit on 17-1-2011 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-1-2011 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:02 PM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


I would consider the desire to take other people's property without working for it wrong.

I would not consider the desire to work toward a goal to be wrong.

Therefore our current definition of greed is wrong, unless you think my moral judgments are in error somehow.




edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:03 PM
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I have to agree wholeheartedly!
greed is far more destructive than the current definition describes.
S&f



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:05 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1


Greed is an excessive desire to possess wealth or goods with the intention to keep it for one's self.


Keyword: excessive.


Originally posted by mnemeth1Economist Milton Friedman explains why our current notions of greed are wrong.


Milton Friedman is an arse. How can one distance economics from ecology?

He is part of the problem, not part of the solution.

Silver-tongued devil and all.

I prefer Herve Kempfs : "Why the Rich are Destroying the Earth". Obviously many aren't going to like his thesis as it involves redistribution, compassion, empathy and ecology, but hey, we're all in it for ourselves, right? We can still have more than enough to be comfortable and look after those who are downtrodden through no fault of their own, due to location, ethnicity, education, health etc.

Yes, I dream of when the rich are no longer worshipped. There is nothing great and glorious about #ting on people.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:06 PM
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reply to post by aorAki
 


Excessive is subjective.

Excessive to who - you?

And what should his punishment be for "excessively" desiring to keep his own property?


edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:21 PM
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Greed - The desire to take the fruit of other people's labor without having to work for it.


the government is the greediest animal of all

edit on 17-1-2011 by quantum_flux because:




posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:24 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by aorAki
 


Excessive is subjective.

Excessive to who - you?

And what should his punishment be for "excessively" desiring to keep his own property?


edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)


Greed is a word used to describe a subjective action

One man having a half a trillion dollars is excessive, just as using a nuke to kill one man is also

You tell me, if one man on a space ship bought all the food and did not share it would he be greedy ?

It is funny that your are moaning about such a concept considering their are people out there with about that much. French Elite theory is alive and well!



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:27 PM
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Originally posted by quantum_flux
the government is the greediest animal of all


Well, if the government is supposedly a reflection of the "people's will" - then I think we can say those who believe in the State are the greediest animals of them all.

The Wall Street CEO that uses government to bailout his failed corporation is just as greedy as the public union worker who wants government to steal to fund his pension.


edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


If greed is purely subjective, then it is not wrong.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:34 PM
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Originally posted by aorAkiquote]Originally posted by mnemeth1

Yes, I dream of when the rich are no longer worshipped. There is nothing great and glorious about #ting on people.


You are free to s#!$ on people, there is nothing wrong with it, they shouldn't have been sitting under the butt
in the first place


Actually wealth worship was an old puritanical belief which has just mutated here in America over the years...

In its initial form, your Wealth reflected upon how god "FELT" about you, how god 'felt about you
indicated how good you were as a person. This also is the genesis of why many Americans believe
poor people are lazy are worthless, this is all older than gun culture and will never be outgrown, it is cultural.
At some point you see people equate this with the laws of nature, which is just an extension of god -

If you are good, nature or god will treat you well, your wealth will reflect such...



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:39 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by Janky Red
 


If greed is purely subjective, then it is not wrong.


Your entire existence is subjective, so is mine

The concept of money is subjective too, it is an artificial construct...

The basis of your entire free market is subjective, you believe that the market acts as a subjective force to regulate itself based upon how consumers feel about the product and pricing.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:41 PM
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reply to post by Janky Red
 


I think the fact that theft impoverishes a society is empirical, not subjective.

Therefore the desire to commit theft can be empirically demonstrated to be "bad".

God is not required to prove that theft or the desire to commit theft is bad, if we can all agree that living in a depressed economic state is bad.




edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
reply to post by Janky Red
 


I think the fact that theft impoverishes a society is empirical, not subjective.

Therefore the desire to commit theft can be empirically demonstrated to be "bad".

God is not required to prove that theft or the desire to commit theft is bad.



Well you stating that taxation is theft is your subjective opinion -

Taxation is far more prevalent in the world than not, empirically so.

Detecting desire in another or supplanting motive in another is also subjective - the inquisition was based upon this methodology.

You see I think it is empirically bad that individuals can own finite resources on this planet and then control
everyone based upon this subjective view of right and wrong. This says some are more entitled to the Earth than
one who was born later. I have no say as to the system I live under, the concepts I live with do I?

Our war in Iraq, born of the desire to control more of this resource produced countless deaths AND robbed people of their money via taxes(your subjective view) - the result of this exploitation is death. The theft of that oil from a nation cannot be questioned, the profiteers of this would be protected under the umbrella of your views because you do not question the validity of business. Yet the taxation they under go is theft??? Even though
they were enriched with the public money which created the war

Based on your views, one man could own the ocean and be victimized if the rest of the world protests this ownership. I own a bottle of water, why can I not own all the water? you gonna outlaw water?
edit on 17-1-2011 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-1-2011 by Janky Red because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 02:56 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1
The desire to take the fruit of other people's labor without having to work for it.

It's called covetous (more or less). Greedy implies unbalanced desire of acquiring things to the point it'll do harm to the person and even to others.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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Originally posted by Jazzyguy

Originally posted by mnemeth1
The desire to take the fruit of other people's labor without having to work for it.

It's called covetous (more or less). Greedy implies unbalanced desire of acquiring things to the point it'll do harm to the person and even to others.


Covet is a desire for the property.

Greed, by my definition, is a desire to take the property by force.

It is impossible to do harm to others by acquiring things through voluntary exchange, since the person giving you the property must be benefiting from the transaction himself.

By voluntarily exchanging things with others, you are actually doing the community a service.


edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 03:59 PM
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Well, President Obama would disagree with you. Like he said, when is enough, enough?

I think he is working on that. Once everyone except those in government hierachy or cronies of government are living in public huts, eating public meals and working at government jobs, everything will be great!

I like your definition.

But what am I to judge, I am a Proud Member of the Bitter Clingers Club you know.

What I think he meant when he said bitter clingers, besides the Guns and Bibles was personal property. Once everyone realizes that everyone should own nothing, except the cronies and party apparatchik, we will have UTOPIA. Not really, just a distopia.



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 04:03 PM
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Originally posted by mnemeth1


By voluntarily exchanging things with others, you are actually doing the community a service.


edit on 17-1-2011 by mnemeth1 because: (no reason given)


I can agree with this until we get to the meta economy where the externalities have become too costly IMO

The view above is the very basis of the Puritanical monetary sense, except it is "... you are actually promoting gods will."

interesting historical piece to the cultural genesis

www.apuritansmind.com...



posted on Jan, 17 2011 @ 04:05 PM
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Originally posted by aorAkiit involves redistribution


Taking something by force, fraud or manipulation from one person and giving it to another is theft by another name.

That is wihout regard to the method used behind the force; at the point of a gun, implication of guilt through pictures of hungy babies or any such other atempt at manipulation, or the tax man via statutes with the threat of incarceration.

The relative wealth of the victim in any crime is just as irrelevant as the need of the beneficiary of the fruits of the same crime.

Woot! Everyone drink-up!





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